Swingman's GRUMMAN DUCK is the real thing

[fxsttcb]

Speaking of class (or lack thereof) guess who has replied in the post over at Flightsim?
I wonder how long that thread will last...

is right! Locked...Don

[Roger]

is right! Locked...Don

I guess they've has left the truth over politics to to a site that's prepared to face it head on.

[OleBoy]

Hands down, ModelConverterX tells the truth. The models are night and day different. PERIOD!!

[pfflyers]

It seems that Mr Icarus is doing all he can to brand us as a nest of pirates. It was a nice touch on his part to post a screenshot of Prowler's angry post over on FlightSim. On the face of it, it's pretty compelling and seems to back up Icarus' claim that he is not our only victim. A close read of the post shows that Prowler, while outraged, was posting to bring this to the attention of the admins because he KNOWS that SOH does not condone piracey. It's also clear his anger is directed at the individual theives and not at SOH.

[napamule]

Found 'North American T-28 Soundset for FS2004/02/CFS2/CFS3 by Aaron R. Swindle' at FltSimCom. File name 't28snz.zip', 7 mb, 07-19-2004.
Chuck B
Napamule
PS: I would join in the 'discussion' except I am too busy flying it and ain't got no time for 'chit chat' (hehe).

[gigabyte]

It seems that Mr Icarus is doing all he can to brand us as a nest of pirates. It was a nice touch on his part to post a screenshot of Prowler's angry post over on FlightSim. On the face of it, it's pretty compelling and seems to back up Icarus' claim that he is not our only victim. A close read of the post shows that Prowler, while outraged, was posting to bring this to the attention of the admins because he KNOWS that SOH does not condone piracey. It's also clear his anger is directed at the individual theives and not at SOH.

The other VERY important points he leaves out are 1) Prowler provided evidence, Icarusgold refused to provide any, and 2) based on Prowlers evidence three members that were involved in trading links to pirated planes were banned - but if he admitted any of that he really would not have anything to rant about...

[Dangerousdave26]

The other VERY important points he leaves out are 1) Prowler provided evidence.... SNIP

Over whelming evidence that I will not go into deals on how he got all of it. The bottom line is with what he gave us and what we found in our own database allowed us to clearly say that Yes this user was in fact an Admin at a pirate site. He was banned as well as two others one of which refers to the SOH Admins as the Payware Mafia.

The other incident he has up on his site right now is slightly different. He listens to DeanWitman's claim (notice it is the user name and may not be his real name and if it is then it is by his choice) of exposing the biggest pirate on the net but he fails to mention that Dean himself was outed also as a pirate. Apparently Dean's outing of that Pirate was in retaliation for him being banned from two the biggest pirate sites at the time. That Pirate then goes on to out Dean as a member...

See this post for details http://www.flightsim.com/vbfs/showth...23#post1332723

Further research also points to the fact Sarge has long been gone here from SOH. His account was deleted a long time ago. Action that he claims never happened on his site did in fact occur. Keep in mind just because someone points a finger and says Pirate does not mean we jump to the Ban Button. There must be research done and that takes time and effort. Accurate research takes a little longer.

If your going to ban members and start crying Pirate then you better have concrete evidence otherwise you might regret it in court.

If you are going to accuse another site of being pirates then again you better have concrete evidence...

Note I am officially done with this discussion...

That is until I change my mind. :mixedsmi:

[N2056]

Wow...what a surprise!

His ability to pick and chose what he wants to argue is astounding. Note that he seems to have shifted gears after his attempt to be a lawyer were brought to light. All he could do was say it was not worth answering to. That says a lot.

[norab]

To get back to the Duck, the wireframes prove Swingman did his own research and work because his aircraft has no lower wing flaps, neither did the real Duck, except on the upper wing on one test J2F-1,, but Icarus felt the need to have them to his model even when they didn't exist in real life

[fxsttcb]

I guess they've has left the truth over politics to to a site that's prepared to face it head on.

I can't tell you how disappointed I am that that thread was locked at my "home" site.
Beyond my disappointment there, all I can say is, the SOH Staff has handled this fiasco admirably.

I am, and always will be, adamantly opposed to piracy, in any form.
I'm also appalled when I see claims of piracy with absolutely no basis in FACT, nor any evidence to support the piracy claim.

I sincerely hope that the entire FS community votes with their wallet when it comes to Icarus.
Possible Legal repurcusions aside, that is the only way I see to penalize him, for what are obviously false claims...Don

[oldwheat]

Has no one mentioned that Icarus Gold & Simnetwork are pretty much one & the same. There are a goodly number of downloads @ that particular site which were never approved by the originator including a few of mine. Oh BTW, I have been blocked from the Icarus site for quite a while :costum: .

[Lionheart]

I have only just caught this post. I havent read through all of the posts. I had heard about the mess. This is good news to me that everything is good.

Excellent model work Swingman. Nice looking mesh.





Bill

[bushpilot]

Oh BTW, I have been blocked from the Icarus site for quite a while :costum: .

Looks like half of the world is blocked from their site, in fact whole ip-ranges of some countries. Went and read through their forums. Pretty sad seeing the SuperAdmin ranting by himself. The whole "FSX general discussion" section is full of that, and one thread dedicated to SOH, which has some SOH members real names mentioned and insults. Seriously twisted stuff.

[fallenphoenix1986]

Oh' dear, looks like I'm on the grand masters ban list now as well... not that I would have paid for anything he's hocking but you do have to wonder how he plans on actually making any money when noone has access to his 5th rate wares.

Craig

[lazarus]

Bravo to SOH for taking a stand against the groundless claims of this troll. I would also urge all SOH members to express displeasure in icarus and simnetwork(the worst freeware piracy site!) forums so that superdupergodadmin can block off the IPs of the rest of the planet and open his own seacock. You will be branded a pirate and a nazi, but icaurus can isolate himself totaly and wither on the vine. I am pleased to report that there seems to be no access to icarus and simnetwork from British Columbia due to the efforts of a number of enthusiasts and myself. Of course, I am the worst human since Laverenti Beria, but I can live with that!

[Canelo]

I am the worst human since Laverenti Beria, but I can live with that!

I know what you mean........

[N2056]

Has no one mentioned that Icarus Gold & Simnetwork are pretty much one & the same. There are a goodly number of downloads @ that particular site which were never approved by the originator including a few of mine. Oh BTW, I have been blocked from the Icarus site for quite a while :costum: .

Yep...He has two of mine, and a boat load of planes done by Piglet, Put-Put, Milton, and other well-known names.
Hey! We could work this out - I'll take $10/month per model to allow him to put my planes on his site seems reasonable.
Or they could just remove them. That works too.

[Blaze]

What the heck would possess Icarus to do this? What...Is his Ego so big that when he saw a plane done much better then his, He couldn't live with it, so he through a childish TEMPER TANTRUM? I see ALOT! of planes ALL! over these sites that are of the same make, same model, same era, same kit, some payware, some freeware and you don't hear them CRYING!

[Blaze]

(TO THE SOH STAFF) I'm sorry that my first posts on your site have been of the nature above, I just can't help but give my opinions on such an injustice like this. BLAZE

[N2056]

On a more realistic note...

Having been involved at the staff level for the first round it became obvious that the individual in question was not one that you could hope to reason with. Look at his recent exploits. The "true" as he likes to call it is something that he figures you can edit like a model in Max to look like you want it to. Anybody that has been to his site will understand that. His site is essentially dead as he is the only person that seems to be posting there for a very long time. There was one guy that was following his Storch thread, but when he finally said something about being tired of waiting and that he would just buy the one already released that thread went away. He has done nothing in terms of creating product for at least a year that I have seen. At one point he complained on his site about how much a re-seller charged to sell his planes and that he would not do that, yet now he is selling at FS Pilotshop.

The Duck is back, and I doubt this issue will be revisited.

You really want to get to him?

Let's just go quiet and go about our usual business.

[lazarus]

I know what you mean........

Yes, I see that you have been branded, tarred and feathered too. At least we'll be warm this winter!

[Canelo]

I just want the community to know that SOH did not want to make this issue public and I take responsibility for showing the images and the email. I also want people to know SOH staff members provided the images, did investigations and wrote the 'An open message to the Flight Sim Community' announcement, it's been a team effort.

The Icarus model images came from a legally purchased Icarus Duck. If you go to icarusgold.com and look at the 'Satisfied Customers' section you will see SOH Staff members and SOH members dominate the comments who all purchased the Duck.

The complaint email to Craig is public record and speaks for itself. I would have never shown the personal information but it was from an Attorney stating a complaint and that makes it public record, it only shows the Attorney's Public information not Icarus's personal information.

I see Icarus is still slandering SOH and has continued to attack Staff Members, specially Canelo_Kid. I wish he would stop the name calling but that is out of my control. I still believe this issue has been a complete waste of time and just hope it doesn't damage Classic Wings, Full or Swingman's reputations.

As far as me being retired as an administrator and acting for SOH, I did it for the love of SOH and to help the SOH staff out with a very difficult issue I wish would end.

[N2056]

And that has indeed been a noble gesture. Thanks for the effort! :salute:

[Mickey D]

Hmm! I'm getting the 404 message now. All I've done is read this thread and his forum. Is he blocking ALL SOH members. I think he has a serious problem.

[Mick]

I just checked and found that Simnetwork is hosting a large number of files that David and I released with distribution limitations, often specifically denying permission for uploads to Simnetwork. I just wrote to the webmaster via their Contact link to demand that those files be removed, but when I did so a few years ago no action was taken. I would like to make a piracy complaint to Simnetwork's web hosting service. Does anyone know how to find out the identity of that service and how to contact them?