Done with all flight sims

[Cazzie]

MSFS gave me two BSODs and then when I did get in and got started flying, it gave me a "MSFS has stopped working" and a Close program button. I've had enough frustration in my lifetime and my health has been going south for 8 years. It's been good, but I cannot deal with the crap MSFS gives me lately, the price one pays for having such a good program on an Xbox platform! All that money wasted over the past three years.

Done and dusted,
Cazzie

[Brytskiva]

MSFS gave me two BSODs and then when I did get in and got started flying, it gave me a "MSFS has stopped working" and a Close program button. I've had enough frustration in my lifetime and my health has been going south for 8 years. It's been good, but I cannot deal with the crap MSFS gives me lately, the price one pays for having such a good program on an Xbox platform! All that money wasted over the past three years.

Done and dusted,
Cazzie

It could be on your side , i myself have no problems , empty your cache and try without addons , use cable not WiFi ~


HB

[DennyA]

Sorry, Cazzie. I know how frustrating these kinds of issues are.

If you decide to take another plunge, I'd suggest these as troubleshooting:
1) Back up your data and do a complete wipe and fresh reinstall of Windows, then install the newest drivers and finally reinstall MSFS. When I've had unfixable problems like stuttering, etc. in MSFS and other sims like DCS, this has (glaring at the Windows team) fixed things.

2) BSODs could be a hardware issue, if your power supply is failing. MSFS pushes your system harder than anything other than video editing/encoding, so if the power supply is weakening, MSFS is likely to be the first app to trigger the crashes.

Hope you're able to get it sorted and rejoin!

[K5083]

I sympathize, and have no mansplaining to offer. It is an unstable and often frustrating video game. Often when it hangs mid-flight, I am tempted to chuck it as well. I do often quit for the day and turn to older, more stable sims.

I'm sure that many, more casual players, who are not willing to reset their systems or dedicate their entire PC configuration to try to satisfy one game among many that they may play, have quit and not looked back.

Hope we still see you here!

August

[collensr]

very sorry to here this especially as this is a hobby that can be a real solace in times of stress or ill health.

hopefully you will get your MoJo back soon

best

Richard

[JohnC]

Complex simulators like this can be quite the conundrum. They work well for bouts of relaxation, inquiry/appreciation, or contrastingly, as a training tool for high-stress/information dense environments. For either of these uses to work well, control and predictability need to be robust. Having a unstable setup, whether it hardware or software (or a combination of both), is a recipe for a bad time.

I am in the middle of rebuilding my sim-rig after purchasing an expensive graphics card that did not perform to spec. Why? Because my motherboard only had PCIe v3.0 and the GPU needs a PCIe v4.0, otherwise it's throttle. I of course learned this after an hour of searching for potential performance issues, and was informed in the traditional way of the internet thread that "only a fool would make such a mistake". But I am grateful for a solution.

In the down-time I can go out to my shop and have carbide meet aluminum with the unwavering repeatability of Physics 101. Hope to see you around to chat Caz!

[Wing_Z]

After decades of tinkering "under the hood" I graduated to the status of "User".
I bought a PC designed for MSFS 2020 (which in truth will run anything).
I did a Steam install of the sim: I have not the foggiest idea of where it resides or how, updates come to Steam and MSFS as and when.
The sim has never once spluttered crashed or died.
I love the ability within a few clicks, to install something interesting and it's just there in the next session.
I will not touch so much as a graphics setting in this sim: it sometimes surprises me after an update, with how it all looks.
It is a product of its time, I enjoy the fact that it is constantly tweaked with producer content.
Being a User is just great, do try it.

Of course, of the 12 million users, there are 3 million who will insist on messing with the guts of the sim.
You are necessary and admirable, please don't leave.

[FrankPilot]

I am always amazed, and sad, that so many people have the opposite experience to me on MSFS which for me has been fantastic and so addictive. I hope you can get to the bottom of your problems and come to love the Sim. Cheers.

[K5083]

I'm sure many of us would have a more trouble-free experience if we bought a "sim rig" or a PC configured especially for MSFS2020.

That's fine if MSFS is your only game, or the only thing you do on a PC, or if you can afford a dedicated PC for it.

But if MSFS requires that, it is broken. A proper game should be able to run on a PC with 20 or 30 other games installed, and whatever personal, productivity, and work tools the user needs - each with an equal claim to priority in terms of having the PC optimized for it.

"Throw thousands of dollars at dedicated hardware for it and it will work fine" is just not helpful advice, I'm sorry. That puts the responsibility on the wrong party for it being unstable and a resource hog.

August

[collensr]

If not done so already check out the MS/ASOBO presentation from the Houston EXPO last night. It's on U-Tube.

The new features coming to the sim in terms of scenery fidelity and object animations are extraordinary compared where we were 3 years ago.

Of more relevance to this thread is their articulation of the efforts they are making with MSFS2024 to make it "as thin" as they can for the customer. They want to lighten the load on customer HD's and put as much of the sim on the Cloud as they can. In theory this will achieve their aim to have the best sim out there but with no impact on the minimum PC spec of their current users.

[jmig]

I have been where Caz is many a time. I can identify and empathize with his frustrations. Experience and a fu%$ you attitude have gotten me through the turbulent flight sim times. I know that I will eventually solve the issue. However, it is frustrating as all get out. Google is your friend in these situations. While sim forums can offer lots of advice, you have to dig through the chafe to find the wheat, but often someone writes something that helps.

My advice is to curse, if it releases the frustrations (think popoff valve). Damn Microsoft and all their programmers to the lowest level of Dante’s hell. But keep working the problem. Eventually you will solve it, even if it means nuking your drive and starting over with a fresh windows install. I have done all the above. Nothing is unsolvable.

[Priller]

Words of wisdom indeed!

Priller

[MZee1960]

If not done so already check out the MS/ASOBO presentation from the Houston EXPO last night. It's on U-Tube.

The new features coming to the sim in terms of scenery fidelity and object animations are extraordinary compared where we were 3 years ago.

Of more relevance to this thread is their articulation of the efforts they are making with MSFS2024 to make it "as thin" as they can for the customer. They want to lighten the load on customer HD's and put as much of the sim on the Cloud as they can. In theory this will achieve their aim to have the best sim out there but with no impact on the minimum PC spec of their current users.

Yes, @collensr, you 'hit the nail on the head', so to speak.

MS has redesigned the sim engine, made it multi-thread capable, made it capable of more complex animations, and improved overall sim performance. It looks like vehicle, AI air traffic, and ship traffic will also be enhanced and more added. All in all, MS says, 2024 will be essentially a leaner, faster and more visually appealing sim which will occupy less drive space on the user pc - putting more components from the user's drive into the MS cloud will undoubtedly streamline the sim, reducing likelihood for issues to occur even further :

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforum...88#post1315888

[Cazzie]

Please. I do not want anyone coming on here telling me my PC is not up to spec: I7, 8-core, 4.2 GB/core, RTX 3060 GPU, 32 GB DDR5 RAM, etc. or that I am unfamiliar with MSFS 202. I've had the beast since its inception, I create liveries and sceneries. I know MSFS 2020. Except how to get a clean install. I have done it all I am now officially through with it all. Unless M$ can come up with a more stable platform, fini. John, I tried three more times this morning after doing it all, Terminate, Repair, Reset,cleaned all the cache. Went back each time after doing sdo, two BSODs, then the Close Program after about 18% downloaded. I just let the screen set on that while I shaved and showered figuring it would again give me a BSOD and a Lock Screen when I came back. Well, I got neither, it was still stuck at 18% Download and I had to do an End Task through the Task Manager. I have had all I can take of the BS M$ has given me the past week trying to get there bloatware back.

Cazzie

PS: If you are an agent at M$ and are reading this, please for God's sake fix this mess!

[ColoKent]

I'm with John...curse M$, and maybe even have an adult beverage or three...but keep working the issue...it will get resolved....We like having you around here.

Best,

Kent

[Brytskiva]

Sometimes it´s the Line to the Servers who is struggling , very often at "Holidays" , not MSFS it self i think , but it seems be too sensitive with handling of it all ~


HB

[JohnC]

I would advise caution on giving unsolicited solution tips; Caz has said several times he is experiencing BSODs (serious errors) and not looking here for technical help. If we as a forum would like him to stay, then we should be supporting him in the way he needs. My experience with hard problems in general is that it's best to solve them, and then ask "was it worth it?" and use that reflection to decide whether or not to continue. However, home-built PCs are a different animal since they are all effectively one-off prototypes with unique combinations of hardware, firmware, and drivers.


I can simply say; Caz it has been great having your personality and contributions to the community the last decade and more. Best of luck, and whatever the outcome, please stop by once in a while and say hello

[collensr]

Maybe best to lock this thread now Tom

[Tom Clayton]

Nobody's getting angry or insulting, so I don't see a need to just shut it down - yet.

Caz, one question... When you get the BSOD, there should be a code a the bottom of the screen telling the reason. Do you remember what that was?

Also consider popping the heat sink off of the CPU to clean and reapply fresh thermal paste. Heat can play some pretty mean tricks on a computer. Also take a look at the Event Viewer and scroll to the times you got the BSOD's to see if anything was logged there.

[StormILM]

Cazzie, I hate to see you go. The community has dwindled a good bit from age and other attritions. You've been a very positive member of the entire community and I want to say THANK YOU for all. I had a good many issues with FS2020 since it came out, I think those of us who do have some minor to moderate file/program discontinuities that may not jibe with FS2020 and/or the bugs in the sim mix in the worst possible way at times and the errors are a show stopper. It certainly was for me at great frustration.

I tend to agree with our folks here, let us try and help you get things sorted. There has to be a way.

[FlameOut]

I'm leaning towards something has gone "tit's up" with your hardware/ internet ISP equipment. It's probably time to take her into the shop if you can't find anything wrong.

[jmig]

Nobody's getting angry or insulting, so I don't see a need to just shut it down - yet.

Caz, one question... When you get the BSOD, there should be a code a the bottom of the screen telling the reason. Do you remember what that was?

Also consider popping the heat sink off of the CPU to clean and reapply fresh thermal paste. Heat can play some pretty mean tricks on a computer. Also take a look at the Event Viewer and scroll to the times you got the BSOD's to see if anything was logged there.

I have built over 20 computers, most of them for flight sims. I have suffered many a "baffling mysteries" over the years. One item often overlooked and which will cause BSODs is a weakened power supply. I am not saying this is Brother Caz's problem. However, I know that power supplies don't always fail overnight. Sometimes they slowly cease to put out the clean volts and wattage they are rated for. Under hard operation, such as MSFS, they can cause BOSD.

The more I read of Brother Cas's issues, I suspect it is a hardware issue, especially since MSFS was running fine before.

One other issue causing thing I have observed in my years of banging my head against the MS wall, is addon software. Many a time creating new empty Community folder has solved the problem. Then it is adding programs back until you find the one conflicting with another. I once had a problem in P3D that was caused by my own scenery. Talk about aggravation.

Okay Cas, my friend. I will now shut up and say no more. Like John Cagle, I hope you say. You have always been a credit to SOH and someone I have enjoyed getting to know forumwise. I consider you a friend.

[DennyA]

Yep, I suggested the power supply uptopic. I literally had an Antec power supply that was failing and only (at the time) Prepar3D and Vegas Video would BSOD — because those were the only things I ran that pushed the system to its limits. Word, browsing, etc. were all stable because they were only using 20% of the CPU, etc.

If it was my system, I’d look at a power supply replacement and Windows “reset” (full wipe option). Odds are very good that would bring the joy back to simming.

But I also 100% empathize with Cazzie on how frustrating this is, and just wanting to spend time doing other things than cursing the consequences of a poor CPU/operating system decision PC users made in the 1980s that we’re all stuck with now.

[Wing_Z]

The sim has never once spluttered crashed or died.

Haha I knew should not have written that!
Thrustmaster throttle has gone beserk, flaps won't retract on the ground - the sim has gone bonkers.
I am outta here.

[cavaricooper]

Agree. Clean power is the first culprit here and in so many cases… a PS swap is plug and play…C