RCS B-25 Additional Variants, Airtankers?

[Scorch00]

This is a possible pitch and/or ask for permission type of thread. I've been talking to a few of my fellow tanker companions over the last several months. And the topic has come up several times of doing tanker conversion(s) of a B-25. The only viable option that's been presented, and in my opinion the highest quality one has been the one posted here on SOH. I have several other vintage tanker conversions in progress, but the B-25 has become a very popular option, if a possible conversion in our community became available. If it was deemed viable. I know there were a number of SOH members that took part in the FSX native conversion of Roy Chaffin's B-25, so I was curious if anyone that was part of that project could possibly reach out to me and/or Mr. Chaffin (as the readme stated that was provided said it may be hard to get in contact with Roy). It would be a fun project if permission was granted to modify it into a few of the popular tanker versions. I'm already working a P-61/F-15 tanker conversion with another person, as we recently got permission from DC Designs (Dean Crawford) to mod his aircraft recently. But, any info, support, permissions, etc would be greatly appreciated. I do a lot of these conversions (some may know) so I aim to get permissions prior to undertaking these types of modifications. The proposed modifications would be simple, just removal of the guns, turrets, and reconfiguring of some windows (maybe) and the addition of a "nose capped" variant. As seen in some of the images below. Some also have external tank fairings added for the retardant tanks. Those could also warrant different possible variations. Depending on the popularity/want of that version. I have a rough prototype of a capped nose variant I can post as well. If there's interest or other questions. Thank you in advance.

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[Subwofer2]

Excited to see this moving forward; many very fine examples exist of Scorch's efforts to expand the love of these work horses in in aerial firefighting. It's hard not to see the excitement growing for this aircraft as more and more people are witnessing the use of more modern aircraft in use today. Scorch aims to bring back the memories of many birds long since retirement; I truly believe this project will earn great appreciation from all who have an opportunity to enjoy the efforts.

[normb]

Any chance these mods could allow a TB-25 (without turret & guns)? For us "nifty fifties" air force enthusiasts.

Normb

[Scorch00]

I appreciate the support, thank you!

Any chance these mods could allow a TB-25 (without turret & guns)? For us "nifty fifties" air force enthusiasts.

Normb

In theory I wouldn't have an issue in doing that modification as well. Assuming of course there's a permission granted to do these. I'm not really that familiar with the TB-25's configurations, but I think there's a few different ones. Some with the glass noses and some with the "capped" noses. I'd also consider doing the capped nose "Strafer" versions with the machine guns in the nose. The RCS B-25 is by far the best around in my opinion. It would make a great donor aircraft.

This is the rough prototype I have for the tanker version. The other versions really wouldn't be that difficult to do.
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[normb]

Looking good! The TB-25 is just like you have there. The TB-25 without the turret or guns.

NormB

[zswobbie1]

Roy has been very ill. I dropped a mail a few weeks ago, with no reply as yet.
I hope all is good with him and his family.

[Scorch00]

Roy has been very ill. I dropped a mail a few weeks ago, with no reply as yet.
I hope all is good with him and his family.

I'm sorry to hear that, hopefully he is doing well, as is his family.

[jeansy]

I'm sorry to hear that, hopefully he is doing well, as is his family.

Roy passed away over 12mths ago, just before he passed he finally permitted the posting of some approved 3rd party paints only after a few yrs of requests and the 64bit conversion, other than that he was very clear on the limited use of his files

search for through the b25 threads you will see how strict he was with his work.

I think this one is best left alone out of respect of Roy

[Scorch00]

Roy passed away over 12mths ago, just before he passed he finally permitted the posting of some approved 3rd party paints only after a few yrs of requests and the 64bit conversion, other than that he was very clear on the limited use of his files

search for through the b25 threads you will see how strict he was with his work.

I think this one is best left alone out of respect of Roy

I've read through a number of them over the years, and touched on that in the original post. After it was converted by 3rd parties from here. I thought maybe he had given permission for further modifications to someone. But I see I must have been mistaken. I'm sorry to hear about his passing. It's a shame any time we lose someone in the community.

If the community agrees, I'll just leave this prospect as it is and look for another possible option in the future.

[zswobbie1]

Roy passed away over 12mths ago, just before he passed he finally permitted the posting of some approved 3rd party paints only after a few yrs of requests and the 64bit conversion, other than that he was very clear on the limited use of his files

search for through the b25 threads you will see how strict he was with his work.

I think this one is best left alone out of respect of Roy

Ahh, I obviously did not realise that. I lost track before I fell ill with Covid. So sorry to hear that news.

[Scorch00]

After coming back to this prospective project it looks pretty bleak. Sadly, upon much further research. Roy's B-25 is the only aircraft that would be a viable option. There are no other B-25s available that aren't CFS2 relics, that honestly, wouldn't be worth converting to try and make work in P3Dv4+.

I know in the conversion thread prior to Roy's passing, he had started letting people convert it firstly, and secondly allowed publishing of repaints. Although I did not know him personally, I was like many, a great appreciator of his work. It's a shame to let this beauty slowly fade away with interested parties interested in possible additional variants to keep it alive. But it's in this community here on SOH he seemed to have entrusted his work to before he departed us. And if it's the community's overall input that I leave the aircraft be, then that's what I'll do. So far we have interest of the TB-25 and B-25 fire bombers.

[Javis]

Goodday gentlemen,

In the context of 'screenies of the old days' here's a little trivia about a B-25J model that actually has been flying around in FS9 properly dressed as a firefighter, i.e. without armament and bombbay arranged as retardant or water container. It was just because i happend to be the Maam-Sim B-25 model designer and loved the idea of releasing it as a civilan version on the side, as a firefighter or any other civilian job.

The project never came to fruitation because we could not find a way to actually kill the fire.... ;-)

So just for old times 'firefighting' sake :



Ok, the quality is not exactly of todays standard (i am strictly MSFS only myself..;-), it's just something i dug up from my own FS history vault. These particular screenies were clicked in FS9 about 17 years ago... Maybe some of you might find some interest in it.

I am very sorry to hear about Roy's passing. R.I.P. Roy

[Scorch00]

Goodday gentlemen,

In the context of 'screenies of the old days' here's a little trivia about a B-25J model that actually has been flying around in FS9 properly dressed as a firefighter, i.e. without armament and bombbay arranged as retardant or water container. It was just because i happend to be the Maam-Sim B-25 model designer and loved the idea of releasing it as a civilan version on the side, as a firefighter or any other civilian job.

The project never came to fruitation because we could not find a way to actually kill the fire.... ;-)

So just for old times 'firefighting' sake :



Ok, the quality is not exactly of todays standard (i am strictly MSFS only myself..;-), it's just something i dug up from my own FS history vault. These particular screenies were clicked in FS9 about 17 years ago... Maybe some of you might find some interest in it.

I am very sorry to hear about Roy's passing. R.I.P. Roy

That would have been amazing. Too bad you had the idea ahead of it's time in terms of knocking the physical fire out with it. And it still looks very nice for being in FS9. Good thing now days we have FireFighterX to put those fires out. I really cut my teeth doing aerial firefighting in FS9.

[AudixDude]

I've read through a number of them over the years, and touched on that in the original post. After it was converted by 3rd parties from here. I thought maybe he had given permission for further modifications to someone. But I see I must have been mistaken. I'm sorry to hear about his passing. It's a shame any time we lose someone in the community. If the community agrees, I'll just leave this prospect as it is and look for another possible option in the future.

Hi Guys. My name is Steven Wayne, and I was/am part of RCS Panels. (I did the 3D model (based on the original model by Brian Withers), internal/external textures and the gauge graphics on the B25.) I assure you, Roy has NOT passed away so whoever said he has, is wrong! I spoke with him a couple of days ago about the interest here at SOH for new textures (FSX and CFS2) as well as the desire for different/modified models etc. As you all know Roy is no longer able to be involved with any FS development work due to his health, however, I have his full permission to continue development on the B25. So, if there is a big enough interest for it, I can turn out more textures and do development on the model - within limits (only because I do not have much spare time for FS work due to another project which I will be busy with for the nest 5 or 6 months.) New textures are not too much of a problem as I have all the templates I created and I can turn out a new set of textures in a day or so. Something I did do a number of years back, but never released it, was a "paint kit" (PSD format) for the "nose art" of the B25 which would enable you to create your own nose art on the existing texture sets. Roy and I had also been working on a wide screen(1920x1080) version of the 2D cockpit, which we did not get finished. I will be starting a new thread on the forum about the RCS B25 in the not too distant future and will give more details then.

[manfredc3]

Hi Guys. I assure you, Roy has NOT passed away so whoever said he has, is wrong!

...I have his full permission to continue development on the B25. So, if there is a big enough interest for it, I can turn out more textures and do development on the model - within limits (only because I do not have much spare time for FS work due to another project which I will be busy with for the nest 5 or 6 months.) New textures are not too much of a problem as I have all the templates I created and I can turn out a new set of textures in a day or so. Something I did do a number of years back, but never released it, was a "paint kit" (PSD format) for the "nose art" of the B25 which would enable you to create your own nose art on the existing texture sets. Roy and I had also been working on a wide screen(1920x1080) version of the 2D cockpit, which we did not get finished. I will be starting a new thread on the forum about the RCS B25 in the not too distant future and will give more details then.

Glad to hear Roy is still with us. I know he has been dealing with health issues for a long time.

Great news that we can look forward to additional textures. And as soon as the paint kit is released, I am sure some of the great artists here will be on this beauty as well.
Amazing that, after all these years, RCS B-25 is still being enjoyed by so many flight simmers, including me

[Scorch00]

Hi Guys. My name is Steven Wayne, and I was/am part of RCS Panels. (I did the 3D model (based on the original model by Brian Withers), internal/external textures and the gauge graphics on the B25.) I assure you, Roy has NOT passed away so whoever said he has, is wrong! I spoke with him a couple of days ago about the interest here at SOH for new textures (FSX and CFS2) as well as the desire for different/modified models etc. As you all know Roy is no longer able to be involved with any FS development work due to his health, however, I have his full permission to continue development on the B25. So, if there is a big enough interest for it, I can turn out more textures and do development on the model - within limits (only because I do not have much spare time for FS work due to another project which I will be busy with for the nest 5 or 6 months.) New textures are not too much of a problem as I have all the templates I created and I can turn out a new set of textures in a day or so. Something I did do a number of years back, but never released it, was a "paint kit" (PSD format) for the "nose art" of the B25 which would enable you to create your own nose art on the existing texture sets. Roy and I had also been working on a wide screen(1920x1080) version of the 2D cockpit, which we did not get finished. I will be starting a new thread on the forum about the RCS B25 in the not too distant future and will give more details then.

This is amazing news on multiple levels! I'm glad Roy is still with us firstly! Secondly, I'm glad that there's still active planning to keep this beauty around in the sim! If I may suggest. I think the 3 most popular versions of the B-25 will likely be the ones mentioned in this thread. The capped strafer nose, TB-25 Trainer (B-25 with the guns removed from aircraft), and the gunless and turretless B-25 fire bomber with the capped nose shown at the beginning of the thread. Not sure of any other versions specifically. I think those would be the most wanted without hopefully asking for too much. I'm also excited for a paintkit!

[zswobbie1]

OMG ---- YES PLEASE!

Such exciting news!!

Where can we find fire fighting type missions/add-ons etc for FS2004? I do have a collection of fire fighting aircraft, & a bunch of fire engines, but no fires to put out..

[Scorch00]

OMG ---- YES PLEASE!

Such exciting news!!

Where can we find fire fighting type missions/add-ons etc for FS2004? I do have a collection of fire fighting aircraft, & a bunch of fire engines, but no fires to put out..

For FS2004 you'd be pretty limited in what you'd be able to find, likely just static fire scenery. Lorby's FireFighterX actually places fires and allows you to drop either water or fire retardant onto the fire to put out the spawned fire. It will turn any aircraft into a firefighting platform. But that only works for FSX and P3D. FS9 isn't compatible. FSX did have some Firefighting missions you could download. FS2004, I believe you'd be set with static forest fire scenery. Which is better than nothing. Specifically though, I'm not sure where to find any for FS9. I could be mistaken, but FS9 wasn't dynamic enough for those types of missions. You could find a fire and fly around it, but never extinguish it. There are some FS9 fire bombers around as well, but scattered between SOH, Simviation, Avsim, and a handful of other places. You just have to find them. Wish I could be more helpful in that regard. Unfortunately, all my work has been for FSX and/or P3Dv4+.

[zswobbie1]

Thanks, I'm mainly Fs2004, but also have P3D4.5, I do have a collection of fire fighting aircraft, but have not really spent time with them.. I'm getting very motivated to broaden by simming horizons.

Thanks again.

[AudixDude]

This is amazing news on multiple levels! I'm glad Roy is still with us firstly! Secondly, I'm glad that there's still active planning to keep this beauty around in the sim! If I may suggest. I think the 3 most popular versions of the B-25 will likely be the ones mentioned in this thread. The capped strafer nose, TB-25 Trainer (B-25 with the guns removed from aircraft), and the gunless and turretless B-25 fire bomber with the capped nose shown at the beginning of the thread. Not sure of any other versions specifically. I think those would be the most wanted without hopefully asking for too much. I'm also excited for a paintkit!

Alrightee then Just a bit more information and a questions. 1. RCS B25 version information. The development of the B25 was originally for FS 2002 (FS8) using Gmax. Before it was released, FS 2004 (FS9) hit the shelves. Whilst there were numerous new features available within FS9 as far as Gmax/model/textures were concerned, due to the urgency of getting the B25 released and not delay it even further to convert/modify model/textures to take full advantage of the new FS9 features, virtually none of these were explored or utilised. We also realised that the FS8 model would run in FS9 but a "full FS9" version would not run in FS8, so to keep it simple, we used the FS8 model/compiler which would allow completion/development on one model our end but would run in both versions of FS at the time. The same basically held true when FSX was released. When it was announced that MS was dropping FS entirely, all new development plans (better VC, FSX native model etc.) were put on hold and only "upgrades" to the model (addition of a rudimentary VC, changes to wings, nacelles, intakes/exhausts, vertical/horizontal stabilisers, mid/rear turret, undercarriage, wheels, addition of side gun pods and a few new texture sets were done, but it was (and still is) essentially a FS8 model. The reason for the lengthy details about the model is to say this. Any new development is going to have to be done for ONE version of FS only. The question is, which version? I do not even have FS 2020 so whilst I am not ruling out the possibility of doing a version for FS 2020, that is something that will definitely not happen in the near future,and maybe not at all, as I have not even looked into what it would require. For now, development will be restricted to either a native FSX model which will only work in FSX or a FS8 native model which will run on FS8/9 & FSX. Whilst it is possible to make a new FSX native model backwards compatible, I simply do not have the time to do the same level of development as I did "back in the day" or have my system setup/running to produce 3 different "versions" because I am "stuck" in South Africa at the moment due to the "pandemic". I only have my PC with me because I came across from the UK for a work project with my PC "flatpacked" in 2 of my suitcases. All of my other "stuff" is in storage in the UK - so there is that too. Soooooooo .... within these constraints, I can only focus on either an FSX version OR a the FS8/9 version, NOT both. Secondly, as I have previously mentioned, I am busy with another project, which has to take precedence, so I can only spare at the most, a couple of hours each day to do any FS development work. This brings me to the QUESTION: Which version of FS? This needs to be determined at the outset. I will not be back online again until the same time tomorrow and will respond to any replies then. My internet access is going to be paused in 10 minutes. Thanks guys. Regards, Steve

[zswobbie1]

I hope you are enjoying South Africa, I'm in Cape Town.

Anyway, I'm putting up my hand for FS2004...

[Scorch00]

Given the fact we have an FSX native version of the aircraft currently. I'd say to stay that route, as the overwhelming majority of FS users that aren't using FS2020 are either using P3D or FSX as their fallback simulator, I've seen polls across several other forums the past few years that basically dictate that something to the tune of roughly 95% of simmers that use the MS based sims fly on FSX or above (FSX, P3D, FS2020). FS9 or earlier sims are largely not used but by a very small amount of people. I feel the time spent on updating the features of the aircraft only to release it on a lower and honestly very outdated platform at this time (sorry to FS2004 users) would be a large disservice not only to the majority of the community, but the time put in by the developer(s) as well. Making the updated aircraft FSX native overall gives it the obvious ability to be used in FSX, P3D, and even FS2020 (granted that's something an individual can do to import it themselves through the converter, but still possible). Biggest bang for the buck in terms of an FSX native approach, in my opinion.

[zswobbie1]

Given the fact we have an FSX native version of the aircraft currently. I'd say to stay that route, as the overwhelming majority of FS users that aren't using FS2020 are either using P3D or FSX as their fallback simulator, I've seen polls across several other forums the past few years that basically dictate that something to the tune of roughly 95% of simmers that use the MS based sims fly on FSX or above (FSX, P3D, FS2020). FS9 or earlier sims are largely not used but by a very small amount of people. I feel the time spent on updating the features of the aircraft only to release it on a lower and honestly very outdated platform at this time (sorry to FS2004 users) would be a large disservice not only to the majority of the community, but the time put in by the developer(s) as well. Making the updated aircraft FSX native overall gives it the obvious ability to be used in FSX, P3D, and even FS2020 (granted that's something an individual can do to import it themselves through the converter, but still possible). Biggest bang for the buck in terms of an FSX native approach, in my opinion.

I'll revise, thanks to the above argument, & go with FSX native, then I can use it in my P3Dv4.5

[AudixDude]

Given the fact we have an FSX native version of the aircraft currently. I'd say to stay that route, as the overwhelming majority of FS users that aren't using FS2020 are either using P3D or FSX as their fallback simulator, I've seen polls across several other forums the past few years that basically dictate that something to the tune of roughly 95% of simmers that use the MS based sims fly on FSX or above (FSX, P3D, FS2020). FS9 or earlier sims are largely not used but by a very small amount of people. I feel the time spent on updating the features of the aircraft only to release it on a lower and honestly very outdated platform at this time (sorry to FS2004 users) would be a large disservice not only to the majority of the community, but the time put in by the developer(s) as well. Making the updated aircraft FSX native overall gives it the obvious ability to be used in FSX, P3D, and even FS2020 (granted that's something an individual can do to import it themselves through the converter, but still possible). Biggest bang for the buck in terms of an FSX native approach, in my opinion.

The RCS B25 is not FSX "native" it is FS2002 - I know, I did it :-) Roy and I had many hours of discussions about which model "format" to use, and we stayed with the FS8 (FS 2002) because it works in all versions of FS (with the exception of FS2020 obviously). FSX native models will not run in earlier versions. In case you do not know, there are different compilers in Gmax for each version of FS. FSX "native" just means that the model was created using the FSX SDK/ FSX features in Gmax and compilng for FSX using the FSX compiler. I never used the FSX compiler nor did I create the textures to take advantage of the bump mapping and other improvements on FS 2004. As it stands, Gmax does not like the latest version of Windows 10 (H2/1). I fired it up earlier for the first time in many years and spent over an hour getting it to just run and not crash to desktop. Whatever I do, the model will run in FSX like it does now. If I am unable to get Gmax to behave in Win 10, the discussion about what model format to use might be academic. The question was should I do a proper FSX "native" model or use the existing "format" (which runs in FSX)

[AudixDude]

I hope you are enjoying South Africa, I'm in Cape Town. Anyway, I'm putting up my hand for FS2004...

Sick and tired of the damn power outages!! I lived in SA (Alberton, just South of JHB) for over 40 years, moved back to the UK in 2010. I am up in Johannesburg (Germiston to be more precise) at the moment.