Cera-Sim UH-60L startup

[SSI01]

I'm attempting a start-up "by the book" in a cold & dark CS UH-60L I bought a while ago (within last 45 days). Two hexes I've run into are getting the parking brakes released, and moving the fuel control levers from their cut-off position to the rear where we can get the engines fired up. I've emailed them asking for some assistance, also to determine where I can find the 2014 patch they reference on their website. Bought the thing via PC Aviator, they say go to CeraSim; go to CeraSim, they say d/l the patch through your download site. Getting what looks like the runaround.

I am running FSX Gold Edition, with deluxe and acceleration expansion packs, so system (this thing more than meets all system requirements) and sim compatibility shouldn't be an issue here.

Anyone had any issues with CS, or with this helicopter?

[SeanTK]

You have to hold the toe brakes then click the parking brake lever to deactivate or reactivate the parking brake.

Can't help with the fuel flow levers - they work fine here.

[RaFi]

For the fuel levers, right mouse click will move them forward and left mouse click will move them back.

[Victory103]

The file should be: Cera_UH60L_DefaultGPSv2.0 for the service pack.

[StormILM]

I too bought the UH-60 on sale a while back and have flown it very little. I also noticed buggy behavior long the same lines. The engine power levers are a bit buggy but not unmanageable but the parking brake issue prompted me to disable it in the config file. Most of all, I found the FDE to be off (based on pilot reports) as the Blackhawk is very sensitive and responsive to control inputs plus when you dump the collective pitch it should drop like a rock but instead it descends way too slowly. I edited parts of the [Helicopter] settings in the config file to help but IMO it's far from perfect. Nice model just not as refined as it could be.

[Victory103]

The HTR file on Hovercontrol is a must have for FDE refinement, otherwise outstanding model that I wish I had the chance to beta prior to release (to provide pilot feedback). A loaded -60 is still very responsive.

[SSI01]

Thanks everyone for replying. I can improve control response by going to Hovercontrol? I wonder if they have anything there that could be used to upgrade or refine any of the issues noted in this thread?

Victory 103 - I found the HTR file you were talking about, and was wondering about installing it. What does it do for the aircraft - provide a more realistic set of flight parameters and control responses?

Also - if in your estimation this would improve the handling of the aircraft, where does one install the file?

[SSI01]

I too bought the UH-60 on sale a while back and have flown it very little. I also noticed buggy behavior long the same lines. The engine power levers are a bit buggy but not unmanageable but the parking brake issue prompted me to disable it in the config file. Most of all, I found the FDE to be off (based on pilot reports) as the Blackhawk is very sensitive and responsive to control inputs plus when you dump the collective pitch it should drop like a rock but instead it descends way too slowly. I edited parts of the [Helicopter] settings in the config file to help but IMO it's far from perfect. Nice model just not as refined as it could be.

I know it's Hollywood, nonetheless I've been told "Black Hawk Down" is pretty close to the real thing re: the entire incident. I noted both Black Hawks that went down literally lost their tail rotors, and from appearances were essentially out of control prior to their crash landings. I'd figure under those circumstances the most important thing is to get the bird down fairly quickly, as you've lost all directional control, can not perform a controlled autorotation, and the only thing you have some control over, apparently, is the vertical dimension of flight - hence setting it down quickly. Both landings looked to be pretty hard but the aircraft is supposed to be built with a bit of "crush" in the landing gear, seat mounts, and other things to take some of the lethality out of that circumstance. It didn't matter to the pilots in Wolcott's aircraft, although it did save the lives of the guys in the back. However, I digress.

I am interested in your opinion of this file before I install it.

[SSI01]

I wanted to "complete" this thread since it seems to have gone dormant.

I've tried a reinstall of the UH-60L in hopes that would fix these problems I've been experiencing. After using the first option in the auto-installer, and installing right over the existing installation, I still get everything just as it was before. Can't get the parking brake off no matter what I do, etc. Pressing on the left brake pedal gets all the right animations and sound (on the pedal), but nothing at all happens with the pull-up and turn parking brake handle on the pedestal.

Cera-Sim is an operation that seems to be greatly hit-or-miss, to say the least. VASTLY disappointing if you want to go by-the-book, if the book is written by Cera-sim.

Suspending any further stuff to do with this particular aircraft.

[Victory103]

Catching up on your thread and sorry to hear you can't get in touch with Cera. I offered to beta for them (19yrs with H-60s, crew and pilot), but only got a quick "thanks, maybe in the future" prior to the original model coming out a few years ago. HTR will run outside of FS and there are several profiles developed for other payware helos. Due to the limitations within FS, Fred's HTR program is a must have for true rotor flying. Payware developers are starting to use this program or similar on their models to "bypass" those FS limits. I only had an issue finding the click spot for the parking brake release, but now use CH pedals and no longer a factor. "kdfw" worked the HTR profile to get the roll/pitch rates closer to real world.

Yes, BHD was pretty accurate given what Hollywood normally does to aerial scenes, or what the general non-aviation minded movie going public knows about helo flight dynamics. If you lose the "anti-torque" effectiveness of your tailrotor, she is going to spin quick. In the slow flight phase, you are really limited on options for any kind of TR or engine malfunctions. In cruise flight, one might a tad bit longer to find a spot to land, the tail fairing is supposed to allow straight/level flight. Removing that torque (PCLs to off) and entering an auto might save the crew, but it's not going to be pretty. Yes, the bird is built to handle heavy "g" landings and the pilot seats will stroke (as the cyclic hits your face), but most SOAR MH-60s are flying close to max gross weight.

[RaFi]

Considering the parking brake, I use a desktop joystick with twist rudder, so I twist left and press the brake button on the joystick to disable the parking brake.

[SSI01]

My thanks to both of you for replying. That CeraSimAircraft.com "Account Suspended" response may be making this whole thing moot, anyway.

Maybe someone will acquire the franchise - if they've gone belly-up - and put out a fix for these things.

[kdfw]

these are some possible causes of the parking brake not releasing: 1) uh60 should not be loaded after a complex plane (like pmdg stuff) has been loaded--c172 or trike should be the default plane on fsx 'free flight' then pick the uh60, 2) HTR applet should be started prior to 'fly now' or will cause issues like this or landing gear not extracting on the cera as360, 3) controller assignment for pedals interfering with some other controller.

speaking of the -60, i uploaded a reworked vc gauge glass texture. the glass now looks like glass with antireflective coating, not the milky opaque ones with the stock texture set. pilot texture also updated to include the chinstrap.

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforum...4&linkid=17508

[SSI01]

Thanks, KDFW. I don't know why, but I'm willing to give this another shot, so I've downloaded that mod via the link you posted, and will install. Thanks.

The trike is the default aircraft for FSX and I always go from that to whatever aircraft I intend to fly, so that's in order with your suggestion.

I'm using the Logitech X3D joystick and have the twist-grip mapped to the rudder axis of all aircraft - twist the joystick, the pedals move, and properly (left twist - left pedal depressed, and vice versa). AFAIK it's not mapped to anything else, and I haven't reversed any axes.

I'll install that update, then give that suggestion about twisting the grip and then hitting button 1 a try.

PS. Cerasim site is back up.

[Wizard]

I bought the Cera Sim UH-60 probably 2 years ago. After my first (and only) flight I could not get the thing started from cold and dark. I uninstalled, reinstalled several times. Finally gave up on it. I won't buy another one of their products. I got all kinds of suggestions from folks here on SOH, but there was no joy.

[Sieggie]

The only way I have found to make the manual start up procedure work correctly it to start the flight in the AH-101 shut down all the systems then switch to the UH-60. I think the default 101 sets up stuff that the UH60 need for the startup process to work.

Dave

[papab]

My thanks to both of you for replying. That CeraSimAircraft.com "Account Suspended" response may be making this whole thing moot, anyway.

Maybe someone will acquire the franchise - if they've gone belly-up - and put out a fix for these things.

Here is a good link from their FB page:
http://www.cerasimaircraft.com/

[RaFi]

Are we talking about when you did everything correct, but the RPM is not picking up?

I noticed all the Cera Sim helicopters do that, you have to point into the wind. It is mildly irritating, however jumping into slew mode and back usually solves the problem.

[SSI01]

Rafi, your tip about "twist and tap" worked, I actually got the parking brake to give up. Interesting thing is, you can't use the "pull up" parking brake after that, just "ctrl- ." will work. Can't use the lever plus brake pedals in the sim, no matter what you do.

Next great discovery was to find using using the l and r mouse buttons DOES make the power levers move back and forth.

Next thing to discover is that I can use the checklist to get to the point where we put the fuel levers in crossfeed, pull the flight levers down into the first notch and hit the ignition button on either lever - and the rotors turn and turn and turn but the engines never fire up. I've used the buttons, buttons plus ctrl-shift-F3 to get them moving, tried the ignition buttons - no start, tried using "J" or "K" buttons (engines 1 and 2 engine start, on my keyboard - respectively) and still nothing. RW was making me jump in and out and there were just too many things going on this morning to make me devote strict attention to it.

I'll try pointing it into the wind next time and giving it a go. I hope someone from Cerasim is watching this thread, there is no reason for this thing to be this hard to start. I can take some comfort in knowing it's not just me, though.

[RaFi]

Unfortunately it happens with all the Cera Sim helicopters. I have the Bell 212 and 222, the UH-60 and the latest AS365 and they all have issues starting when not properly pointing into the wind. Your choices are to position the aircraft into the wind (not always possible, especially when you have gusts), use the outside view and see if you can point into the wind's direction, hopefully the RPM will then climb or as I lately found out, quickly switch between slew mode and back will also get the RPM climbing.

Its frustrating, but it hasn't stop me from using the helicopters.

[SSI01]

So what works for you is to switch from internal to external view, then back again - and keep cranking?

[RaFi]

Yes, at least 1 of the 3 methods I mentioned will work. Or sometimes even completing the whole sequence, the 2nd engine will spin the RPM up. I have no idea the idea behind this, hardly seems realistic. If you start the engine and the torque rises but the RPM stays low (sometimes the blades will spin one way, then the other...) you know its not going to start it self. I suggest just hit the slew key, normally "Y", twice and the the RPM will climb.

Since this is happening with all the models, I doubt Cera Sim is planning to fix it.

Maybe helicopters are very sensitive to wind direction, although we never worry about that on the flight line, the aircraft always point east and we never had any starting snags. Granted it is Oryx's(Super Puma) and 109s, but I doubt that makes a difference. The only issue we had was when a very junior pilot decided to reprimand the marshaller for not pointing him into the wind, all the other pilots laughed, then we laughed, the junior pilot did not laugh.

[kdfw]

odd, wind or not no problem getting it going from 'cold and dark' state. both apu and xbleed start work fine. all other cera models start up.