Flying Supersonic. Tu-144 'Charger' v3.5

[ce_zeta]

Hi All!

I'm trying to fly the Charger downloaded from here (http://www.avsimrus.com/f/fsx-aircrafts-79/tu-144d-v3-5-44272.html), but I cannot resolve the problem of wobbling and tipping over on initial load.

I change the fuel load under 75% but the woblling is still present.

Any help?

[SeanTK]

Ce_zeta,

I'm short on time due to some impending travel, but if you can give me a day or so to come back to this thread with a likely extremely lengthy response, I can help.
I fly this aircraft almost daily these days and it's become my preferred complex Russian airliner of choice over the PT Tu-154!

With that being said, the learning curve is just as steep, if not more so, than the 154, and there is quite a lot of initial setup to do to get this to fly properly (unless you start hacking the addon and removing significant functionality).

Among the things you need to do, which I'll go into much, much more detail later:

Download a few gauge update files from the Avsimrus/Avsim.su forums that fix aerodynamics error when crossing Mach 1. Check Black Friday November (https://www.ladysavings.com/publix-weekly-ad/?black-friday/) and Stater Bros Ad (https://www.ladysavings.com/publix-weekly-ad/?stater-bros/).
Properly adjust your weight and balance both in regard to fuel and in regard to payload.
Mandatory use of the rather user unfriendly joystick setup utility. You must program your hardware through this utility after "disabling" it in FSX proper.

I'll provide you with links to all files and further guidance when I have more time.


Very few people both in the English-speaking and in the Russian speaking community seem to be able to fly this increadibly complex and beautiful looking piece of freeware, but I've figured it out and do so routinely, so I'll get back you in about a day with extensive detail on what you have to do. Check King Soopers Ad (https://www.ladysavings.com/publix-weekly-ad/?king-soopers/) and Piggly Wiggly Ad (https://www.ladysavings.com/publix-weekly-ad/?piggly-wiggly/). I promise. :)

Here are some screenshots I posted on another forum of me flying the Tu-144D (at various locations) in the meantime:



http://i59.tinypic.com/2chmc80.jpg

http://i57.tinypic.com/slqvjd.jpg

http://i61.tinypic.com/258mg5w.jpg



Again...I'll get back to you with further info soon! This is a complex yet extremely rewarding addon, and it's possible to learn without needing to "hack" any gauges or remove any functionality as presented!

[ce_zeta]

Thank you very much, Sean!

I installed the v3.5 from the link posted and about the update, I downloaded the file posted in the post #2700 (http://www.avsim.su/forum/topic/31461-%D1%82%D1%83-144%D0%B4-%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B7%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%82%D 0%BA%D0%B0-%D1%82%D0%B5%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2%D 0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5/page-135#entry2556399)from this page of the avsim.ru/avsimrus forum.

I hope that in the future days I can start to learn to fly this beauty (without hacking of course)...But first of all... I need help to cope with the wobbling and tipping problem.
Thanks again. :ernaehrung004:


Fly supersonic is the real challenge :encouragement:

[SH427]

I will definitely be watching this. I've had a passing curiosity in the Concordeski and I'll take advantage of ce_zeta's predicament and glean as much knowledge as I can! :encouragement:

[An-225]

Do my eyes deceive me...are those 3D gauges in the VC, and is that self shadowing beneath the canard...? Is this now a native bird, Sean?

[SeanTK]

Ok, get ready for a long post...

This is for the Tupolev Tu-144D (NATO: "CHARGER") for FSX, created by Nikita Konstantinov, Mikhail Mitin, and others.
This addon is freeware, and is FSX-Native in its entirety. This latest version is 3.5 and is meant only for FSX. There are older versions "2.0/2.5 series" for FS2004.

Here's an extremely brief, partial-history of this aircraft which I posted on another forum where people were asking about it:

The aircraft itself represents what was to be the final edition of the Tu-144 prior to the fall of the USSR. Unlike earlier versions, and unlike the later flying laboratory version (I'll get to that in a minute), the D model was fitted with non-afterburning turbojet engines designed to boost the range of the Tu-144 so that it would be comparable to the Concorde. As far as I know there were six D models produced, plus one left incomplete (need to confirm this in my book). The Tu-144 concept itself proved to pretty much be a failure for the USSR, as a host of problems plagued the type throughout it's service life and evolutions. These problems were primarily mechanical in nature, and the the frequency of issues was high enough that Alexei Tupolev and two government aviation safety representatives had to personally inspect each aircraft and sign off on each flight leaving Moscow. For what it's worth, the Tu-144 could allegedly fly higher and faster than the Concorde due to how it was constructed (more titanium) but the amount of systems issues, as well as fatigue issues the aircraft had really negated any advantages. As far as I can tell, the only passenger route that it served was from Moscow (Domodedovo) to Almaty, Kazakhstan (known as Alma-Ata in Soviet times), though it did make appearances at other airports during flight testing, and for mail-runs.

The last iteration of the Tu-144 to fly was called the Tu-144LL, and was a joint project between NASA, Lockheed, a few other American companies, and Tupolev to support a "flying laboratory". This was a re-engined (with afterburners again!) converted Tu-144D that flew off and on until the mid-90s. There are videos on Youtube of this aircraft taking off and landing that you can find today.



Getting started with the addon:
You can download the model here...
http://www.avsim.su/f/fsx-originalnie-samoleti-79/tu-144d-v3-5-44272.html

Additionally, some XML guage logic updates are needed, as without them, you will always experience unrecoverable Mach tuck when approach Mach 1. They are available at the links below:

First download the "Hidro_Logik.zip" link to at the bottom of the first post here:
http://www.avsim.su/forum/topic/90090-%D1%82%D1%83-144%D0%B4-faq-%D0%B8-%D0%BD%D0%BE%D0%B2%D1%8B%D0%B5-%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%80%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%B8/

Then, download the "3.5" file linked to at the top of this page:
http://www.avsim.su/forum/topic/31461-%D1%82%D1%83-144%D0%B4-%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B7%D1%80%D0%B0%D0%B1%D0%BE%D1%82%D 0%BA%D0%B0-%D1%82%D0%B5%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8%D1%80%D0%BE%D0%B2%D 0%B0%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B5/page-137

I think that covers it for gauge updates, but I cannot recall precisely right now if I also downloaded that "saved Ivars" file in the first link as well.



Next, download this limited English documentation which was created by someone on the Project Tupolev forums. I have re-uploaded it to the link below (as the PT forums are being blocked by my web browser as an "attack" site right now.)
http://www.filedropper.com/tu-144documents

The documents contain an illustrated checklist/panel guide, as well as a narrative on how to use the addon's "joystick setup utility". Like the PT Tu-154, this Tu-144 requires that the user set's up their hardware to interface with the addon directly, rather than via FSX. This means that your controls should be "disabled" in FSX itself prior to using this addon. Please read through the joystick setup utility documetnation multiple times, as it will likely take multiple attempts to get everything configured. Unfortunately, the utility is only available in Russian, which makes things difficult. It is not transferable with the Tu-154's utility, which is easier to use. Please let me know if you need further assistance.
I use Saitek products, and with this addon, I employed the use of my X-52 joystick, and Saitek Rudder Pedals.

I mapped the following functions to my controls. Rudder, Toe Brakes (left/right), View Panning (hat switch), Autopilot Disconnect, Elevator, Ailerons, Throttle, Elevator Trim (make sure you map elevator trim!), and nose droop controls.






This addon requires that you start it up in "2D cockpit" mode. There is a setting you can adjust in the FSX menus to facilitate that. Then, when the aircraft loads, you can right click in an open spot on the 2D panel (one that's not part of the panel bitmap) and navigate to the VC cockpit view.

Additionally, when you select the aircraft, do so from the FSX menu, so you can configure fuel and payload prior to loading it into a flight session. This is required so that you don't get the wobbly/out of control issue. The addon comes with four versions. Wide panel with VC, 4:3 panel with VC, wide without VC, and 4:3 without VC. I always use wide with VC.

For your fuel, load it to no more than 75%.
For payload, I usually keep all values default WITH THE EXCEPTION OF payload stations 3 through 6. The stations are simply designated 3, 4, 5, and 6, and they should have zero (0) payload in them. There are additional stations designated in Russian. Leave those alone.


Now...you should be ready to load the addon into your actual flight session.

When you do so, you'll first be presented with the 2D view looking at the captains panel. The nose will be in supersonic mode, and the canards retracted.
When you try to switch views here, you WILL lose control of your view panning functionality. This is where the joystick setup utility comes in. You can bring it up using one of the Shift+# combinations. In the documents, you'll see how to select in the utility that you want to map views to your hatswitch. Documentation labels it as "headmovement". The documentation lists the functions in numerical order for the axis section as well as the buttons section, and since I don't know Russian, I count the entries I select until I get to the one I want. For example, the documentation lists head movement as the tenth entry, so I click through the Russian labels until I get to the tenth one.

So, program you're head movement first. Following this, program the rest of the controls that you wish to apply. Read further above to see what functions I have applied at a minimum.
Please note, you should be able to see immediate feedback with your toe brakes, throttle, elevator, and aileron controls. You will NOT see rudder pedal movement (outside of toe brake depressions) without hydraulic power to the aircraft.
As far as I can tell, the throttle can only be mapped to one axis (so any CH or Saitek throttle quads will only read one lever).
The utility seems to support multiple joysticks, but I know that you can have issues if you program functions across more than two. Again, I have only programmed by X-52 and Saitek rudder pedals, and everything works fine here.

The rudder pedal mapping is obviousl, but for the other controls on the X-52, I programmed the autopilot disconnect to the blue botton on the throttle next to the slider switch (kind of in the middle). For trim, I programmed the up/down movement on the upper hat switch (to the left of the "missile launch" button that has the protective guard you flip up).
For the canard movements, I programmed up/down onto buttons T1 and T2 at the base of the X-52 joystick (not the throttle).


So....work through setting up your aircraft with the guidance above. Please note that some axis controls through the utility may need to be reversed (for non-obvious reasons) while some can be left the same. The document "manualtest.pdf" in the zip file linked above should lead you through everything.


So, by this time, you should have a cold/dark aircraft sitting on the ramp, stabalized, with your view controls working.
Next up, there is a shift key (I think shift 6) which should enable a pop-up window with a bunch of green buttons. The green button to the lower right (just above the far end of the black box with numbers) is an electrical/navigation alignment "quickstart" that should get you batteries on and your nav instruments partially aligned.

Now, study those manuals, learn the 2D clickspots, and figure out the systems. I will follow this post up later on how to properly align your compasses (mainly the HSI) based on your lat/long and just using a couple of simple guages in the plane. Please note that I really have no idea at this point how to actually use that massive INS panel, but everything else is clear to me!

Also note that the aircraft is assisted in landing by a parachute system. It's not marked in the documents or explained how to enable it. It's on your Overhead Center panel, and is the set of two buttons, with a cover for one at a time, near the upper/middle/right, with a yellow light near it (two vertical buttons, located to the right of your overhead canard controls labelled "8" in the document). Ensure that the upper of the two bottons is not shielded. Then, when you tough down, press your spoiler key on your keyboard to activate the parachute. When you press it again, the parachutes are released, and cannot be re-activated until you reload the plane. I finally discovered this just a week or so ago.


FINAL IMPORTANT NOTE: After loading the plane for additional sessions, the joystick setup utility often doesn't "read" right away, leading to runaway views again. If that happens, press your shift+# key to bring up the utility, but don't manipulate it. When the utility is on your screen, simply try panning with your hat switch. This should cause the utility to start reading your inputs, and everything should go back to normal.


I will follow-up with additional details later, but this should keep the crowd busy for a while.


CLOSING REMARKS:
Very few people in the FS community 1) are aware of this, and 2) know how to fly this. That's what makes learning this high-quality bit of freeware so rewarding. I will be offering an online, real-time help session with this aircraft in late May via Teamspeak and an FS multiplayer session (shared-cockpit not supported, but you can follow along) with further details on that announcement to come in the next few weeks.
Side note: I am also offering a lesson on the Tu-154 on May 3rd, which I've announced here:
http://nzff.org/forum/index.php?showtopic=22140

EDIT:
This video helped me, so it'll likely help you. It's all in Russian, but you can watch in HD in full screen, and it goes through the start-up. The INS is still a mystery to me, but everything else is there!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mPZf1qeNvzI

Let me know if you need help. There's a lot of little quirks that you simply need to exeperience before you learn how to mitigate them. You know how to reach me.

[ce_zeta]

Wow,thanks for the info.

I hope i can start to learn to fly supersonic :biggrin-new: (in an airliner, of course).

[ce_zeta]

First Milestone achieved :encouragement:

Now the Wobbling and tipping dissapear. I could start the BCY (APU) and the powerful NK-144 engines and other systems with the checklist.

Now I will need work hard with the joy configuration. This utility still dont recognize the buttons of my joystick.

I will read your explain about how to align the PNP-72 and PKP-72 carefully:applause:

P.S. The INS as I can collect from the web is a systen called NPK-144 and is a basic FMS where the inputs are SVS, DISS, RSBN and VOR using dead reckoning navigation. I cant confirm if the system has an INS. It's a technology very very interesting (and obsolete of couse :biggrin-new: ). It's interesting because although its an evolution from NVU-B3 from Tu-154B2/M, is more advanced and sophisticated. The user interface is completety different, it looks simmilar to the most modern Pizhma-1 from Il-86.

[SeanTK]

Ce_zeta and others observing....

Here's a pictorial representation of what to press for the initial setup. It's a window that pops-up with Shift+7. That'll get the primary batteries on, and your navigation systems partially aligned.

http://i61.tinypic.com/in8n09.jpg


For full alignment, what you are about to see is available as a 2d pop-up by clicking on a certain portion of the 2d main panel, or is available in the VC (as shown), near the center.

http://i60.tinypic.com/24np3ew.jpg

After getting everything else running (engines, other systems, etc) click the silver switch you see pictured there into position A3P. The yellow light will light up. I haven't bothered to do the translation yet.
Then, set that black knob pictured to mode "MK1" (though MK2 or MK3 seems to be the same readout). The number above that (in this case 265) should always match your compass readout if you press "Shift-Z" and look at your mag heading. Compare the numbered readout (again, in this case 265) with what your HSI is showing. It is likely off by anywhere between 5 and 20 degrees. In this specific case, it was off by roughly 23 degrees, which is actually the most I've seen it off by, unfortunately. So, to correct for this and match your HSI heading with the numbered readout, rotate the circular knob with the "-" and "+" icons. You'll see the HSI card rotate, and you simply stop when the headings align. You may need to provide further correction in flight when you compare the HSI with the numbered readout due to compass drift.

This likely isn't really realistic, but it's the best way I know how at this point in time. The real key to this likely lies in navigating the flight computer, but that's still beyond me at this point, and this solution works right now.


Finally, here's a diagram of the autopilot functions on the yoke that someone else made and I am re-uploading here for the record. If you know the Tu-154, most of this should seem familiar, just not in the same organization format.

http://i59.tinypic.com/2l1c7b.jpg

Thanks.

[napamule]

These Russian airplanes have been around for a few years. And even today we are trying to figure out the PANEL in order to be able to fly them. Then there is the Russian words with no one able (or willing) to label the panel with English titles. And even then, the 'system' used is not for a MODERN panel, but for the panel used 'way back when'. Which is unacceptable due to the learning curve, and the meager rewards if you DO learn the 'in-n-outs'. To me it is a waste of time/effort just to satisfy some 'modeler' of (Russian) PANELS (as the model itself is Thomas Ruth's model on all counts). Homey don't play that game.

By using another panel, which has digital gauges and works (99.9%) perfect in FSX (mostly having COSMETIC issues-nothing serious) I am able to fly it at FL 350, at at least Mach 1.3, yet fly 240 kts for ATC on approach. I can hand fly it, hand land it, or shoot an ILS and grease the landing in any/all types of weather. I had it flying at Mach 3.5, but this thing is not meant to fly THAT fast. I just started flying the Tu-144D this week after reading 'ce_zeta' complaint of it 'hopping, etc'. Man, was I shocked and amazed. Who in heck could ever fly this thing the way it's set up, even with another panel, is beyound me. I had to re-do the aircraft cfg, and the air file in order to not stall (take off or landing). I downloaded the Tu-144D '77115' and it had the Auto Pilot disabled in aircraft.cfg. Cheesh. And you need to 'LEARN' what?
Chuck B
Napamule
PS: And here is a pic of your panel, as the one posted was too dim to read. Another thing you need to 'work on' and 'learn'? I guess.

[ncooper]

Hold on, I am observing this topic develop with great interest.
I have been a fan of the Tu154B for many years and I take pleasure in
its Russian character.
Isn't that the whole point, to learn how to operate a Russian aircraft, not how to change
it to suit an American idea of how it should be?
I hope that soon I will have time to apply the excellent and informed advice in this topic
to my newly downloaded Tu 144.

Nick.

[Naismith]

PS: And here is a pic of your panel, as the one posted was too dim to read. Another thing you need to 'work on' and 'learn'? I guess.

Woah there Tonto, what's with the aggression. :dizzy:

[An-225]

These Russian airplanes have been around for a few years. And even today we are trying to figure out the PANEL in order to be able to fly them. Then there is the Russian words with no one able (or willing) to label the panel with English titles.

Just learn Cyrillic, it takes five minutes. Add another ten minutes or so for mission critical Russian words specific to the plane you're trying to fly.


And even then, the 'system' used is not for a MODERN panel, but for the panel used 'way back when'. Which is unacceptable due to the learning curve, and the meager rewards if you DO learn the 'in-n-outs'.

Why not then just accept that systems depth is not your cup of tea, and give credit where it's due for the complexity of the programming involved? I personally find it *very* rewarding to have some proficiency on the systems of a pre-Byzantine Soviet heap of s***, but I do understand those who are more content with a CTRL+E affair.


To me it is a waste of time/effort just to satisfy some 'modeler' of (Russian) PANELS (as the model itself is Thomas Ruth's model on all counts). Homey don't play that game.

I think you have this the wrong way around, you're not putting in any effort to "satisfy" the modeler, the modeler has put in all this effort to satsify *you*, for free.

[napamule]

My name is not Tonto. That is a derogatory ethnic slur. You have no right to call me that. For any reason. So, calm down.

My point is that there are enough 'barriers' to being able to fly this 'Russian' airplane DUE TO THE PANEL 'PROBLEMS' already. And now the tutorial will be rife with MORE of the same? There is a 'standard' for taking a screenie and there is a (easily attained) standard when it comes to the quality of those pics. That's all I am saying.

That is POSITIVE. Not aggressive. The advice would be for anyone, not at/to anyone specific. If you profess to be an 'Instructor', or expert, then you should have your ducks lined up before you step 'into the deep'. And this is in reference to the fact that NO ONE is 'working' on the REAL problems/limitations, which you will find in the aircraft.cfg and air file. Not just the panel. I am just trying to help.

THERE is where the improvement are needed. Not on just learning to flip some 'foreign' type switches on some 'foreign' type panel. The switches are the same on Russian and American panels. Only the Language is different. I don't need to learn Russian so I can fly this ac. And if I DID learn to read Russian, when I go to switch on the AP, will it work? Or change radio frequencies. Will they work? Look again.
Chuck B
Napamule

[StormILM]

I for one do not mind the systems depth. I used to use this one in FS9 just fine and I rarely fly "soft" systems models anymore. My biggest issue with this model and the TU-154 is the controller setup which I have had issues with. That's a killer for me. I enjoy the older Russian hardware that doesn't use this kind of external control setup but hey, I grasp their logic in doing what they wanted this thing to do. If they ever develop a simplified controller version or patch, I'd be willing to get this model and the TU-154 and use them regularly.

[PHo17]

Just learn Cyrillic, it takes five minutes. Add another ten minutes or so for mission critical Russian words specific to the plane you're trying to fly.
...


I don't understand Russian but I learned the cyrillic letters and even that helps. I can assure that Russian is much nearer English than for example my own language Finnish. It is as far from English (and Russian) as let's say Chinese though we use same letters as all western countries here (besides we have some our own like å, ä, ö). Fortunatelly we are a tiny nation so you don't have to learn our language. :icon_lol: Most Finns (under 50 of age) speak three languages English, Swedish (which is our official second language teached for everyone in schools as practically English too) at least on some level of skills and of course Finnish - we have to - in order to manage in this nowadays global world.

Pekka

[An-225]

I don't understand Russian but I learned the cyrillic letters and even that helps. I can assure that Russian is much nearer English than for example my own language Finnish. It is as far from English (and Russian) as let's say Chinese though we use same letters as all western countries here (besides we have some our own like å, ä, ö). Fortunatelly we are a tiny nation so you don't have to learn our language. :icon_lol: Most Finns (under 50 of age) speak three languages English, Swedish (which is our official second language teached for everyone in schools as practically English too) at least on some level of skills and of course Finnish - we have to - in order to manage in this nowadays global world.

Yes, even just learning Cyrillic helps! You don't necessarily need a working knowledge of Russian. Especially if you can at least pronounce phonetically each step when it comes to flow-management in the cockpit. And some words are fundamentally similar to their English equivalent, e.g. БАТТЕРИЯ, batteriya, battery...

I'm not sure what language your MiG-21s were marked in, but I would be up for the challenge of learning the MiG-21 cockpit in Finnish. :) For me, that's part of what keeps this hobby from stagnating. The constant acquisition of new knowledge and learning of new skillsets.

[SeanTK]

Ok, I was hoping this wouldn't happen, but it's not surprising that it did based on my past experiences advocating Russian aircraft here. At least this time I haven't received rude PMs yet...

As I'm extensively traveling this week, I'm writing now on a mobile, so bear with me in terms of formatting and any unusual autocorrect errors.

First and foremost, this aircraft is a complex systems simulation of a 1970s Soviet airliner. The audience intended for it appreciates complex addons. If you are unwilling or incapable of learning a complex addon, this is not for you. This addon is not broken or problem prone in any way, and does not require mods to the aircraft config file, air file, or other hacks. As someone who uses it just the way it is, I can testify to that. A problem with comprehension is not indicative of a problem with the product.

Yes, there is a learning curve, which is steepened by not knowing Russian, but again, I do not know the language, and I can operate this and the Tu-154 just fine, following some reading and LEARNING.

Russian gauge logic does differ from "Western" designs significantly enough to warrant custom gauge logic for such things as the autopilot, just as one example.

I have noticed that quite a few of Napamule's posts emphasize hacking a well crafted addon to bits because some users are incapable or unwilling to engage in learning. Disparaging an addon maker, as well as someone just trying to help others, is unacceptable, especially as you are not in the target audience for this addon.

If you don't understand how an addon works and are incapable or unwilling to do so, that's your problem.

I now have to catch a real flight on a lovely 737, but I'd like to keep providing proper assistance to those in this thread that care to learn. I do NOT profess to be an expert, simply a somewhat knowledgeable enthusiast. I may expand on this post when I have more time later.

For those interested in learning, thanks for the interest and continued questions, as well as the appreciation for this high quality addon.

[mgchrist5]

Sean,
Even though I'm not the individual who started this thread, I've been lurking in the background...gleaning helpful bits of information here & there. I've learned a bit from your posts about this particular Russian monster. Thanks very much for the effort you've shown to help out your fellow enthusiasts.

As others have noted: for me personally the biggest obstacle with the PT planes & Tu-144 isn't deciphering the Cyrillic panels, but coming to terms with the rather user-unfriendly joystick utility tool.

Regardless, since the Tu-144 is a freeware plane, there's no harm in someone deleting the plane if it doesn't suit their personal tastes. Problem solved!

Thanks again.

[napamule]

Nowhere did I read that you CAN fly the Tu-144D without using the 'Russian' panel. Or that you CAN fly the Tu-144D without using the 'proprietary' controller setup utility. Nowhere. Why? Is it a 'pride' thing. My way or the highway? I appreciate that the xml gauges control everything if you use the Russian panel and the controller utility (a deal killer for me too). Can't we just get along? Can't we have a version that uses a 'friendly' panel and regular controller setup?

I can learn the Russian panel and do the controller utility. But for ONE AIRPLANE? Not worth it. Especially since I used my own 'friendly' panel and just a twist grip joystick (no pedals) and FDE tweaks as required and fly it very well, thank you. Which is what FS is all about. Not conforming to somebody's idea of what constitues a 'fun' package, of an (ab-normal) panel and (a buggy) utility.

BUT, you HAVE to 'hack' (?) the aircraft cfg and air file or it won't fly. That is the way Flight Simulator X works. They are not going to change the Flight Simulator just to accomodate the Tu-144D, now are they? Talk about non conformists. Cheesh. Will it work in P3D? X-Plane? Why? The panel and the utility? (Dah).
Chuck B
Napamule
I will make a video showing off the performance of the TU-144D in FSX using ANY panel, no controller 'Utility', and my FDEs. GET REAL!

[Roger]

This is a flightsim site not a high school debating society. Please play nice and napamule, please lose the temper tantrums, they don't become a gentleman of your age. This thread is being closely watched and will be closed if necessary.

[SeanTK]

Guys, just let me know if you have further questions. I'm done debating the merits of this addon. Thanks

[SH427]

Sean, or anyone who HAS flown this addon,

I'm having a devil of a time starting the engines. I can get the APU running, the bleed air configured, everything, but when I press the start button, the engine spools up and the number TWO needle jumps and then the number ONE needle (on the FE Panel) starts to creep up. the #2 needle hits 100, and the #1 creeps up to about 20-23% and hangs until the starter disengages. apparently I'm missing something, there's fuel, and everything else is good to go. What am I doing wrong?

PS. I reconfigured the Aircraft.CFG by removing the 3,4,5,6 stations, as for some crazy reason, I could not get the weight to go away and the a/c was doing backflips on the tarmac. But after deleting the stations, which are supposed to be empty anyway, it sits just fine. However, now she loads with no fuel. Even though I'm able to load it in when the sim starts, does that make a difference?
EDIT: She now loads with fuel, so thats not the problem

[stovall]

Looks like this thread is back on target. Reading the dialog about the Tu-144 in this thread is interesting and hopefully helpful to those who download her.

[SeanTK]

SH427,

Can you post a screen of your engineer's panel please?

I suspect the following;
1. Engine stop levers not pushed forward. Look in the far lower left corner of the engineers panel for the white and green levers.
2. Fuel flow control switches protected under covered panel near upper right(ish) of panel not flipped.

I may be able to narrow it down further with a picture.

When on the engine start sub-panel, does the green light turn on before hitting the starter, or does it stay red?

I won't be able to attend to this tomorrow exempt possibly in the very late evening my time, just FYI.

Also, are you loading the aircraft from the main fsx free flight menu, or are you switching to it from something else during your flight session? Should be loading fresh from the fsx menu right after you start up fsx before going into any actual flight scenarios.

[SH427]

1.The levers are pushed forward. I have the checklist printed out and I follow it to the number.
2.All 8 switches are flipped.

As far as I can tell the panel is all set. Engine 1 is starting, and that is the hang start I was talking about. it sits there without moving and then just shuts down. I've only had one engine start at all and I've tried this at least 10 times.
7205
I'm loading from the main FSX menu and not bringing the aircraft up from inside the sim

[ce_zeta]

Its strange...Like the real aircraft, this bird sometimes suffer system failures...The BCY of my Tu-144 sometimes doesnt start (Bleed air fail)...Its a mistery.
All pneumatic system ok?

Now....the wobbling and tipping appear again....When i move the throttle...I could taxiing with the Charger but when i move the throttle to take off...:banghead:
hahaha

P.S. The wobbling appear again due to a wrong configuration of the fuel system ( you can check the CdG in Gauge E43).

I made my first take off and landing :encouragement:

[SeanTK]

Sh427,

Lower middle of the screen, where those switches with the white squares are. Three per engine column. Flip all of those up.

[SH427]

I wondered if those had anything to do with it. I gotta work tonight so I'll let you know if that works.
Might have to make an addendum to the checklist.
:encouragement:

[Bjoern]

Is this a FSX native model or Tom's v2.0 model with a new panel and VC textures?

[ce_zeta]

Is this a FSX native model or Tom's v2.0 model with a new panel and VC textures?
It is a native for FSX.

The 3D model looks fantastic. This model have not the same level of detail of Tu-154, but have nice things. For example pushback, stairs, you can open the cockpit windows. This model have the first working cockpit fans (it works with right click when you hover with the mouse in the fan).

But only is good modeled the captain and first officer Cockpit, the engineer panel only work in 2D panel.

P.S. Before the last flight of the day...simply one word: Amazing.

http://i.imgur.com/0FumLsJ.jpg

Thank you very much Sean!!!!!

Now I can start to learn how to navigate with this beast.

[napamule]

I mistakenly said the model might be the Ruth model. It isn't. It is a FSX model by SamDim and company. Sorry about that.

That flap/wing droop in the pic tells me that PERHAPS the engines are not running. Are you saying the picture shows it after you took off and are FLYING it? Or did you slew it up in the air to take the picture? Sorry, but I have to ask. Perhaps you solve all the problems and can now fly it? It would be nice to know if you did.
Chuck B
Napamule

[SeanTK]

This aircraft, like the Concorde, has what's called "elevons", which automatically droop at lower airspeeds while in flight.

Ce_zeta has already made it clear earlier in this thread that he has been able to successfully fly this aircraft after following the guidance provided to him.

[SH427]

I'm still getting no luck starting the engines.
I tried uninstalling the addon, as well as the gauges I trusted from the FSX.cfg, then reinstalling it.
When I pulled it up in the menu I loaded it with 70% Fuel and emptied 3,4,5,6 stations. When it loaded it started flipping backwards on the runway. after I unloaded 3-6, it acted fine, but after it didn't start again I unloaded it and reloaded it from the menu, and it started doing the backflips with zero fuel.
I've deleted the stations before and that stops the behaviour.

The only corrupting factor I can think of now is the semi cold and dark setup I start in. I'll load up the a/c and set it up to be C&D, then save it as default and go from there.

EDIT: setting it as default seems to have done it. I'll try again though. I think I'm still getting the Mach tuck because around 670kias the a/c goes into a dive and will not recover.

[ce_zeta]

Videos from Nikita Konstantinov.

Take Off and climb

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcJE7ZTIyBE

SH427

Watch gauge E43....The needle need to be inside the yellow arrows. This complex fuel system and his moving CdG is the root of the wobbling.
The CdG (CAX in russian) of the Charger change with the speed.

P.S. I still suffer the APU Bug...sometimes doesnt work. I need reload FSX and works.

[TeiscoDelRay]

Does this come with a translated cockpit?

[ncooper]

No it does not.

[Bjoern]

It is a native for FSX.

Different model then, I see.

[SeanTK]

What I do to ensure it loads properly is the following:

1. My fsx default flight is a cold/dark Cessna 172 at an airport. With that being said, fsx also loads into the main free flight menu rather than the actual flight session as well.
2. Immediately when the fsx menu loads, I select the Tu-144 in the selection window.
3. I then adjust fuel and payload.
4. Following this, I do all the flightplan and weather stuff, then start the flight.
5. This aircraft MUST be initialized in the 2D cockpit first. There is a setting in FSX to start with the 2d or VC view as default.
6. Your joystick should also be disabled in FSX itself as well.

Take note if the startup video I posted I believe in my first response to this thread. That may help too.

Doing the above, I have never encountered APU or other issues.

Also, remember to download those gauge updates I linked in my first post. You can minimize the nose down tendency when crossing Mach 1 (which is still somewhat present but is easily manageable following patch implementation) through the use of nose-up trim, and through following the ascent/decent path guidance given on the chart/graph looking gauge in the cockpit. Just align your current airspeed (yellow triangle) with the recommended line, which moves depending on your altitude. X axis is airspeed, Y is altitude in meters.

[ce_zeta]

And for complete the info from Sean, we can read the NASA report titled: A Qualitative Piloted Evaluation of the Tupolev Tu-144 Supersonic Transport (http://dscb.larc.nasa.gov/DCBStaff/ebj/Papers/TM-2000-209850.pdf) (pdf).

[delta558]

I'd love to have a go at this - I spent pretty much 2 years just flying the FSLabs Concorde and it would be a great comparison. The gauges / language issue isn't a show-stopper by any means, and having followed the very clear and detailed commentary on how to get the aircraft up and running, it wouldn't be a problem to fly in my opinion. The one thing holding me back is the need to remove all joystick control settings within FSX - that would be a monumental pain in the rear considering the fact that I currently need to use several reasonably advanced aircraft which cope with the FSX-assigned control axes.

I really appreciate the work put into this, but I'm not going to be able to fly it until I have a good few months of clear schedule unfortunately.

[SeanTK]

Disabling the controls in FSX does not involve actually deleting assignments and axis settings. You are just unchecking a check box in FSX that activates/deactivates your controls.
I'm still on the road so I don't have FSX for reference, but perhaps someone else can post a shot of the fsx menu.

[ce_zeta]

I'd love to have a go at this - I spent pretty much 2 years just flying the FSLabs Concorde and it would be a great comparison. The gauges / language issue isn't a show-stopper by any means, and having followed the very clear and detailed commentary on how to get the aircraft up and running, it wouldn't be a problem to fly in my opinion. The one thing holding me back is the need to remove all joystick control settings within FSX - that would be a monumental pain in the rear considering the fact that I currently need to use several reasonably advanced aircraft which cope with the FSX-assigned control axes.

I really appreciate the work put into this, but I'm not going to be able to fly it until I have a good few months of clear schedule unfortunately.
You do not remove any command within FSX.

When the aircraft is loaded in the sim you use the command 'ctrl+k' to disable FSX joystick config. (disabled, not removed).

When you load another aircraft....again push 'ctrl+K' to enable your usual joystick configuration.

I will post in a few hours, a complete checklist for program the joy with the joystick utility, because the procedure in the manual have little gaps.

[SeanTK]

Thanks to ce_zeta and others for providing additional guidance and screens while I'm travelling and away from FSX. Your success reports and personal narratives on what you've learned/discovered are helpful and appreciated.

I will be providing a real-time training session on May 17th (a Saturday). I'll provide additional details in the coming weeks, but in short, it'll involve TeamSpeak and an FSX multiplayer connection.

Let me know if anyone's interested...

Keep the questions coming if you have them, and be sure to check the videos that both I and ce_zeta posted, which may help with learning the startup.
Also take note of my setup guidance for properly loading the aircraft in FSX.

[ce_zeta]

Following the VRI (chart/graph as Sean said, for know more about this gauge, read NASA report for know about it) and Sean advices, I made my first supersonic flight. Second Milestone was achieved :encouragement:

Well, about the joystick configuration utility, as I said before, the procedure showed in the manual have little gaps.

Checklist:

Start and detect your joystick:


load the Tu-144D with the tips provided by Sean.
push Shift+5 for view the joystick utility panel.
With the rotary switch [1] in one. move all axis. If in gauge [6] you see a movement of the needle...Dont move [1]. If you dont see movement of the needle, move [1] to the position labeled with two and try to move again.


Picture from the manual:
http://i.imgur.com/wuBN8mx.jpg

For the axis:


Move the wheel of [4] to select, with the help of the List A, the control to be configured
Select with [2] the axis of your joystick. To recognize the correct axis of your joystick, you need see move in the needle of [6].
With [12] you can center your axis with the needle of [6].
when you locate the axis to be configured, click in [10]. Your axis has been saved, a yellow light shine in [10].
Check in VC if the movement of the yoke is not reverted. If is reverted, click in the switch [8].
configure dead zone [13] , sensibility [14] and nonlinearity [15?].
Repeat step 1 to 6 with other axis.


Never click in [16], only if you like delete your setup.

LIST A

Axis (Traduced and in the correct order):


Elevator
Rudder
Ailerons
Throttles
Left brake
Right brake
Emergency brake
Turn handle (on autopilot)


From the manual

For the buttons.

Choose a command from the list b (below) to be mapped in your joystick moving [5]
Click in your joystick the selected button to be mapped and move the wheel [9]. When you move the wheel, the counter [3] moves.
When the light [7] is shining, you have been located what is the number of your button in the joystick utility.
Click in [11]. Your button has been mapped. A yellow light shine in [11].
Repeat step 1 to 4 with for other buttons.
Enjoy!


Switch [17] is to fly with a keyboard (Do not touch if you have a joystick/yoke).

LIST B


Buttons (Traduced and in the correct order):

AP off
AT off
ONF down (nose)
ONF up (nose)
Left brake
Right brake
Trim RV (?) up
Trim RV (?) down
Starting brake(?)
head movement (side looks?)
Emergency brake
Aileron trim left
Aileron trim right
Stick mode "roll"
Stick mode "pitch"
AP stabilizer "roll" channel
AP stabilizer "pitch" channel
ZPU (AP Heading mode)
AP stabilizer M/Tt (pitch mode hold Mach speed?)
AP stabilizer V (pitch mode hold IAS?)
AP stabilizer H (pitch mode hold Altitude)
Course (ILS lateral channel)
Glissade (ILS vertical channel)


From the manual

[SH427]

well, I finally got the engines up and running.

Now, after taking off I'm noticing a weird trend. The aircraft tends to want to bank to the left (correctable with aileron trim) and there's an oscillating yawing motion that starts and does not stop.
is this a typical thing, or is it something off that I can fix.

[SeanTK]

That's a new one for me.
What's your weight/balance and fuel situation like?
Also, how do you have the fuel pumps set on the engineers panel?

[SH427]

I think the problem is purely hardware. The stick I'm using is a few years old and it's due to be replaced.
the gentlest touch tends to make the a/c roll left. doing calibration tests, the stick tends to lean left and show far faster than the right, so I'll tune down the sensitivity. the yawing seems to be a response to the SUPER sensitive stick twist. I'll have to crank the sensitivity way down there too.

Mystery solved. The big one for me is that the engine start usually requires me to ctrl-e after the instruments are set up. I'm gonna try a couple things and go from there

[ce_zeta]

Sh427 in which position you have the wheel labeled with [7] in the AP panel?

When I load the aircraft always I found this wheel in the left from the center position. For this reason, when I activate the ABSU bank, the aircraft turn to the left forever.

[SH427]

I actually checked it and it might have been a shade to the left

[ce_zeta]

Does anybody know how to connect the ABSU to the VOR I and II? And how to operate the Autothrottle?

[SeanTK]

I'll look into it. I always fly with manual throttle control, and I also manually track my navigation beacons just because they change so often (and the aircraft hand-flies well...at least for me), so I haven't looked into extensive use of the AP for authrottle purposes or beacon tracking (though I do use it for climb, alt hold, descent, and turns to headings).

[SeanTK]

Sorry to dredge this back up, but since we had a couple of outstanding questions, here's the answers (or non-answers) and additional info:

Ce_zeta,

While you can fly an AP coupled approach once established on the localizer and glideslope, I have not yet uncovered a way through experimentation nor documentation to track VOR signals with the autopilot. Additionally, I'm still trying to determine how the get the AT to work, as the switches seem to be there, but I'm not sure on an on/off or how to activate it. There seems to be limited documentation in that regard. On a personal note, I have always preferred manual control of the throttles (in the 154 too) once you figure out the ideal N1 percentages to use for various flight regimes. I'll continue trying to figure this aspect out.

All,

With the acknowledgement that some aspects like the above are still a mystery (assuming they are even possible) I would still say that I can at least provide interested parties here with useful advice when they are first exploring this addon. With that being said, I'll be hosting an online (via Teamspeak and FSX multiplayer) lesson of sorts for those wishing to learn how to use this addon. This lesson will occur twice to cover multiple timezones:

1st lesson = Friday, May 16th at 2100 US Eastern Time (to accommodate those parties who have expressed interest here and elsewhere in the Asia/Pacific region)
2nd lesson = Saturday, May 17 at 1300 US Eastern Time (to accommodate everyone else).

Both lessons are the same, so you only need to attend one (if you are interested) though feel free to attend both if you wish. The lesson is estimated to last approx 2.5 hours, and I'll post a "lesson plan" if there is interest closer to the date.
I will post further info on the server to use closer to that time as well.

It is expected that those participating in this lesson will have read through this thread, as well as downloaded and installed at least the basic 3.5 package into FSX. The lesson will start off with installing the updates prior to even starting FSX, and then proceed from there, concluding with a short full-flight from two airfields.

[ea2000]

Hi all,
First of all I'd just like to say this is one of the best FS add-ons ever. I've flown the FS2004 version and this one looks even better. Sadly, I don't know russian so I can't read the manuals. That is why I decided to start translating them. Let me reiterate, I know ZERO russian,:banghead: so I'm relying on Google translator to do this, while trying to maintaing the overall format of the original PDF. I've also tried to leave any labels or button names in russian to be easier to find on the panels. There are some words that were not correctly translated by google, they were probably mis-spelled in russian, I have no idea.
Here is the first file I've completed:
9697
Here is the next file:
9703

[Anneke]

AlthoughI don't use this aircraft, it's admirable that you took the effort of translating the manual and sharing it with the community. Kudo's!:wavey:

[Naismith]

must have taken you a while - thank you

[SeanTK]

Looks great, thanks!
This'll help me figure out the flight computer system, and hopefully can help others who may be interested in this aircraft.

[ce_zeta]

Thank you very much! Ea2000 :encouragement:

[ea2000]

I put together this very basic start up procedure for anyone having trouble getting off the ground (myself included). Most of this is from what has already been posted and from that Russian guy's YouTube video.
This will allow you to start the engines and take off, but not much else.
Feel free to update this as you see fit.

[ea2000]

Does anyone know how to disable the joystick hat switch in the Shift+5 utility? It is conflicting with EZdok.

[ce_zeta]

Does anyone know how to disable the joystick hat switch in the Shift+5 utility? It is conflicting with EZdok.
I don't know...But if you disable the joy's hat...maybe the problem with the view appear again. You can delete all your config in the utility and setup again without config the hat.

[SeanTK]

I don't know...But if you disable the joy's hat...maybe the problem with the view appear again. You can delete all your config in the utility and setup again without config the hat.

Agreed. I suspect you may have view problems if you remove the hat switch capability (if you even can). I don't use the "EZdok" program you mentioned, but considering how user unfriendly this addon is to begin with, I'm not confident that it will work properly with it.

[Istvan]

Hi!

As I understand, I need mandatory a joystick?

[ce_zeta]

Hi!

As I understand, I need mandatory a joystick?
Maybe not.

Check this post (http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?86929-Flying-Supersonic-Tu-144-Charger-v3-5&p=880944&viewfull=1#post880944)and use the button [17].

[EstebanP]

Hi!

I have start up the "Charger", as posted here; but when I go to move on land, the plane doesn't turn into taxiways. :frown-new:

The joystick is set, following the steps described here.

[SeanTK]

Have you turned on the nosewheel steering on the overhead panel?

[EstebanP]

Yes.

It's strange, the Z axis in my joystick, is the RZ axis in the Charger... Any issue with this? :icon_question:

[vl82m]

Yes.

It's strange, the Z axis in my joystick, is the RZ axis in the Charger... Any issue with this? :icon_question:

I assume you have troubles with steering? On my configuration from Russian manual, I made it to work both rudder and elerons work together same axis.

[ce_zeta]

Yes.

It's strange, the Z axis in my joystick, is the RZ axis in the Charger... Any issue with this? :icon_question:

Check your joystick setup. I had the same issue and I found that I couldnt move in ground because my previous setup was deleted.

This aircraft is amazing but, like the real Tu-144 have a lots of bugs (or marvellous features :biggrin-new: ).

[SeanTK]

I've noticed when loading it that you have to do the following:

1. The aircraft MUST be loaded in 2D panel mode before switching to VC mode. This is the same situation with the PT Tu-154B-2. There is a setting to check within FSX itself (Display - Aircraft).
2. Upon loading, you should see the main 2D panel. I recommend moving your view with your hatswitch or doing some other minor joystick function in order to get the addon to recognize the joystick profile for that session, prior to switching views.

I have the aircraft working wonderfully with my X-52 and Saitek rudder pedals, and have been thinking about transitioning to my Saitek Pro Flight (Yoke/Throttle) systems as well (though you cannot map each engine individually as far as I can tell).

[vl82m]

Even knowing Russian won't save your headaches. The navigation is not clear and many features are not explained. Perhaps I'm spoiled by Project Tupolev quality but I don't really feel secure in a plane that I don't understand fully. Unfortunately same headache was for Aeroflot and it's pilots in real life due it has similar issues. Very buggy and might do the unexpected any second which means the flight is a constant horror. The Tu-144 is not something I'm proud of having once had. And on top of that refused to take out of service before loss of life started to happen.

English documentation is clearly not enough and has tons of errors, but still very appreciated by the people who made it and I'm not critizizing them as they have done very good work. Just I do not expect any english speakers to have correctly flown this aircraft on a long haul?

What about Tu-134, anyone mastered that? It's a plane I'm considering doing an "angle of attack" style video documentation on it's system and operation, navigation and of course the real aircraft. Also considering recompiling a full manual for it. Wish I could say the same for Tu-144 but if not even it's real world pilot understood it fully, neither will I. Aim of this? To boost popularity of the SCS Tu-134 in the english community for hopefully bigger support of it's developement. I talked with people on making a similar package for the Tu-154 (obviously also for free) but I do not think it's needed as it seems most people who fly the Project Tupolev Tu-154 fully understand their aircraft with help of the manuals.

[Anneke]

Where can I download the Tu134 (and what FSX fixes are necessary?)

Ah here: http://scs.avsim.su/tu134.html

Thanks!

[vl82m]

Where can I download the Tu134 (and what FSX fixes are necessary?)

Ah here: http://scs.avsim.su/tu134.html

Thanks!

That airplane is for FS9. Adapted version (non original) for FSX is here: https://yadi.sk/d/oqPwe4_1bW9Xu

It does have bugs as the SCS wasn't developed for it, particularly with autopilot. I recommend flying this aircraft in FS9 as it'll have the full benefits there.

P.S, regarding video tutorials (I copied over my text from another forum):

Video tutorials package for Tu-154B-2 and the newer Tu-154M is confirmed, will cover both groundwork and flightwork. Complete tutorial of NVU system undecided. I talked over with a friend but it's an extensive project and will cover the Tu154 completely, hence if anyone wants to help or be a part of the team it would be very welcome.

The tutorials will most likely be done on a combination of different simulators and hopefully project will start already next week (I want to keep my mind busy from things other than girls and vodka http://forums.x-plane.org//public/style_emoticons/default/laugh.png ). If anyone wants to help, (even if you don't know anything about Russian aviation or Russian language), please contact me or respond to this quote.

Perhaps to make it more interesting for the average enthusiast, the location for training flights could be an airline in Russia, or Belarus... Maybe even completely different country? Also planning opening virtual flight school. I have plenty of time...



Yes, small change of plans :)

[Anneke]

That airplane is for FS9. Adapted version (non original) for FSX is here: https://yadi.sk/d/oqPwe4_1bW9Xu
forum):

Thanks sir, much appreciated. I wish you good luck with this adventure. I am surely following you with interest! Keep us posted.

[vl82m]

If anyone is interest, here is the first video of Tu-154 (advanced systems), description of the APU: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QlWXdWjDWVk&index=1&list=PLiwIlCsKaT5T9F3oTBpCqtpA_ydyEgyB2

Advanced users do not need it, it's aimed as starting material.

[ce_zeta]

Thanks vl82m for the videos. I understand perfectly your speech. :encouragement:

I want to fly the Tu-134A3 but the lack of documentation in english, spanish, french....is an Iron curtain.

[vl82m]

Thanks vl82m for the videos. I understand perfectly your speech. :encouragement:

I want to fly the Tu-134A3 but the lack of documentation in english, spanish, french....is an Iron curtain.

I hope video tutorials for Tu-134A3 will realise too, and very likely will be in detail after the completion of the Tu154B2/M project. I never knew a full description of the simple APU took 10 minutes so things such as navigation and electrics, autopilot will be a headache...

The information for Tu-134A is almost nothing (even Russians have some problems) although I have a few manuals in english if you're interested:

https://yadi.sk/i/WFztaIONbquYZ
https://yadi.sk/i/Cm110g9-bquYf
https://yadi.sk/i/Cpn83bgWbquYh
https://yadi.sk/i/_hOPLVEQbquYo

https://yadi.sk/i/jSf1TqJcbquYq (Courtesy of Walter Leo project tupolev, reuploaded due to the shutdown of 5gb.net)

Advanced tutorial for engine start and setting up systems made by me (to be used together with the above manual from Walter Leo) :
https://yadi.sk/i/s_q_BzfGbqvJJ

[Anneke]

Wow what a wealth of information. Great video's! Thanks very much :applause:

[ce_zeta]

Thanks again vl82m for the documentation. :encouragement:

[RyanJZ]

Thanks everyone who offered setup advice and translated the manuals! This is one of my favorite aircraft, and I'm looking forward to trying it out soon! :D

[RyanJZ]

I'm starting to get the hang of the Tu-144.... sort of. I'm having a hard time programming it for my joystick. IS it compatible with the Thrustmaster T-Flight Stick X? Also, which axis is for the elevator? Ailerons? Rudder? and throttle? I did manage to get the nose cone down and extend the canards though :jump:

[SeanTK]

I'm starting to get the hang of the Tu-144.... sort of. I'm having a hard time programming it for my joystick. IS it compatible with the Thrustmaster T-Flight Stick X? Also, which axis is for the elevator? Ailerons? Rudder? and throttle? I did manage to get the nose cone down and extend the canards though :jump:

It should work with any stick. I am currently using it with the Saitek X-52, along with the Saitek Pro Flight Rudder pedals. I would use it with my yoke and throttle system, but you can't map each engine independently, so I've gotten more comfortable with the stick.

Please ensure you read through this SOH thread thoroughly.

I've also re-uploaded some English-language guidance I found on Project Tupolev's website long ago. One of the documents in there explains the joystick mappings.

http://www.speedyshare.com/QkJ3p/Tu-144-manuals.rar

[RyanJZ]

Thank you very much Sean!! :D

[RyanJZ]

Wait which axis is the throttle?

[vl82m]

Wait which axis is the throttle?

вы только говорите по-английски? пожалуйста читать руководство и РЛЭ!

EDIT: confused forums, but point still valid, Please read manual and RLE! Here is procedure engines but you won't get far unless you take time to learn, this is not a concorde.

http://hostthenpost.com/uploads/f69db839510fdd7a317800209cc9147e.png

[RyanJZ]

Sean, the Adobe PDF you attached isn't loading on my computer. It probably just needs an update, I'll let you know if it still doesn't work

[RyanJZ]

Yeah I can't open that file. Even with the latest update of Adobe installed :banghead:

[Naismith]

Yeah I can't open that file. Even with the latest update of Adobe installed :banghead:

Foxit reader, like Adobe without the bloat reads PDFs

[SeanTK]

Try this link via SOH...

14269

[RyanJZ]

Sean its not the link its the file itself. I get an error message saying "Adobe Reader could not open 'Tu-144_manuals.rar' because it is either not a supported file type or because the file has been damaged (for example, it was sent as an email attachment and wasn't correctly decoded).
Is that Foxit reader free?

[SeanTK]

Sean its not the link its the file itself. I get an error message saying "Adobe Reader could not open 'Tu-144_manuals.rar' because it is either not a supported file type or because the file has been damaged (for example, it was sent as an email attachment and wasn't correctly decoded).
Is that Foxit reader free?

RAR files are a type of compressed file format. The PDFs are IN the RAR file. You need something like 7Zip or WinRAR to unpack the file.

[RyanJZ]

RAR files are a type of compressed file format. The PDFs are IN the RAR file. You need something like 7Zip or WinRAR to unpack the file.
Ah okay. I didn't realize that. Thanks Sean
Which do you recommend?

[vl82m]

For anyone with issue on Tu-144 here is step by step in Russian. Video explains more than badly translated words in my opinion.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ARFfdXFzh9k

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9jfrTa97sU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EcJE7ZTIyBE


I find it strange foreigners want to fly this, I understand the usual subsonics. But a plane troublematic even for Russia is beyong my thinking.

[RyanJZ]

Sean never mind. I finally got into those files with 7Zip. Thank you so much!
vl82m, I'll check those videos out. I'm actually a little familiar with Russian alphabet, so the figuring out the instruments isn't too bad. It's just what order the switches need to be activated in and such:confused: Hopefully I'll finally get it in the air now!
Also even though the Tu-144 may have been inferior to Concorde in many ways, its still a fascinating aircraft and is a challenge to fly. Isn't half the fun learning it? :P

[SeanTK]

@Ryan,

I use 7Zip for everything and have been problem free. Either option is good though.

@vl82m,

Hard to explain where the interest originates but some of the following factors are involved at least for me:

1. General interest in Soviet-era aviation.

2. It's a unique, infamous airliner with major attributes that are unseen in almost all other civil aircraft.

3. I enjoy the quality of the addon. It's a systems simulation of something from decades past, and that alone interests me. It's Soviet origins and associated systems, which differ significantly (in some ways) from standard Boeing and Airbus types are interesting to me.

4. Even though I'll never understand everything about this addon (and it looks like many in the Russian community have difficulty as well), knowing that I can at least figure it out enough to operate it in reasonably safe and competent manner (I realize that's subjective) is rewarding to me. There seem to be very few in the flightsim community, and even fewer "foreigners" as you put it, who have attempted to learn to use this aircraft.

So, part of it is in my general historical interests, part is in my enjoyment of complex addons, and part is in the exclusivity of being able to operate this specific addon within the flightsim community.

EDIT: Ryan, once you get further along with learning it, shoot me a note about the braking parachute. It's not covered in the manual, and I only found out how it works through the Avsimrus forums. In short, there's a switch on the overhead that you need to activate to turn the system on, then when you have touched down, you need to press the spoiler key "usually default is your slash '/' key" to deploy the chute, and press it again to remove it. One time use, and it's a necessity on landing.

[RyanJZ]

@Ryan,

I use 7Zip for everything and have been problem free. Either option is good though.

@vl82m,

Hard to explain where the interest originates but some of the following factors are involved at least for me:

1. General interest in Soviet-era aviation.

2. It's a unique, infamous airliner with major attributes that are unseen in almost all other civil aircraft.

3. I enjoy the quality of the addon. It's a systems simulation of something from decades past, and that alone interests me. It's Soviet origins and associated systems, which differ significantly (in some ways) from standard Boeing and Airbus types are interesting to me.

4. Even though I'll never understand everything about this addon (and it looks like many in the Russian community have difficulty as well), knowing that I can at least figure it out enough to operate it in reasonably safe and competent manner (I realize that's subjective) is rewarding to me. There seem to be very few in the flightsim community, and even fewer "foreigners" as you put it, who have attempted to learn to use this aircraft.

So, part of it is in my general historical interests, part is in my enjoyment of complex addons, and part is in the exclusivity of being able to operate this specific addon within the flightsim community.

EDIT: Ryan, once you get further along with learning it, shoot me a note about the braking parachute. It's not covered in the manual, and I only found out how it works through the Avsimrus forums. In short, there's a switch on the overhead that you need to activate to turn the system on, then when you have touched down, you need to press the spoiler key "usually default is your slash '/' key" to deploy the chute, and press it again to remove it. One time use, and it's a necessity on landing.
You got it exactly right Sean! One of the most fascinating airliners there is, IMO, as flawed as it was. Also of major interest to me are the Antonov 225 and the Hughes H-4 Hercules! :D

[RyanJZ]

Also thanks for the tip on the parachute! Wasn't the Tu-144 the last airliner to use parachutes? And what's the landing performance/run in it like?

[SeanTK]

Also thanks for the tip on the parachute! Wasn't the Tu-144 the last airliner to use parachutes? And what's the landing performance/run in it like?

Not sure if it was the last commercial airliner to use parachutes routinely. I'd have to look into that more.

Regarding the landing distance, again, the deployment of the parachute makes a big difference. Do the final approach around 330km/h +/- 10km/h. The landing distances I'm reading for maximum weight is in the 8,000 - 8,500ft range, but again, that's maximum weight and without tracking it precisely, I think many of mine are closer to the 7000ft region +/- 500ft in actuality.

[RyanJZ]

Sean, on those files you attached a few posts ago, it looks like they're for the FS2004 version(2.0). Will these manuals work for the FSX version (3.5)?

[vl82m]

Sean never mind. I finally got into those files with 7Zip. Thank you so much!
vl82m, I'll check those videos out. I'm actually a little familiar with Russian alphabet, so the figuring out the instruments isn't too bad. It's just what order the switches need to be activated in and such:confused: Hopefully I'll finally get it in the air now!
Also even though the Tu-144 may have been inferior to Concorde in many ways, its still a fascinating aircraft and is a challenge to fly. Isn't half the fun learning it? :P

I personally use winrar, not sure how it ended up on my computer but it does open up all files I ever want to see.

Russian alphabet is easy, here is a small course in Russian if interested. I redirected some other people I'm helping with the Tu-134 and Il-62 to it and they have made great progress. Knowing how to read cyryllic is very easy and can be learned in only a day: http://learnrussian.rt.com/

Tu-144 wasn't inferior to Concorde despite both aircraft we somehow based on each other due to industrial spionage on both sides, but only the west made a ruckus about theirs whilst the Soviet decided to keep shut and didn't have the same contacts to mass media, hence many in west people don't know about it.

However, as I have mentioned the Tu-144 was both economical and aviation disaster, a plane Aeroflot didn't even want to operate and highly inefficient, just like the Concorde. The difference of the Concorde was that in west at least a lot of wealthy businessmen could pay the cost off with the price of the ticket while in the Soviet Union the system was different, but far more fair.

It's fun to learn a lot of aircraft, Tu-134, Tu-154, even Yakovlev 40. Tu-134 manual is in progress but documentation for the other two are plenty, you can learn to maste it succesfully without having all the headaches of the Tu-144. A note about the manuals of 2.0 version against 3.5 version is that the 2.0 uses the simpler INS system which makes navigation a breeze. In the 3.5 version there is flight computer that is not very documented and author refused to install I-21 INS.

[vl82m]

@vl82m,

Hard to explain where the interest originates but some of the following factors are involved at least for me:

1. General interest in Soviet-era aviation.

2. It's a unique, infamous airliner with major attributes that are unseen in almost all other civil aircraft.

3. I enjoy the quality of the addon. It's a systems simulation of something from decades past, and that alone interests me. It's Soviet origins and associated systems, which differ significantly (in some ways) from standard Boeing and Airbus types are interesting to me.

4. Even though I'll never understand everything about this addon (and it looks like many in the Russian community have difficulty as well), knowing that I can at least figure it out enough to operate it in reasonably safe and competent manner (I realize that's subjective) is rewarding to me. There seem to be very few in the flightsim community, and even fewer "foreigners" as you put it, who have attempted to learn to use this aircraft.

So, part of it is in my general historical interests, part is in my enjoyment of complex addons, and part is in the exclusivity of being able to operate this specific addon within the flightsim community.


Fair enough, the Soviet Navigation at least comes with it's benefits, keeps brain working and flying to the badly equipped airports with just one to two NDBs for approach while coming from a navigation system that might have drifted a bit is a challenge, but with some corrections all landings are safe in the end. All it needs, is practice. Like with the Tu-154, and the even more problematic Tu-134 with less accurate systems and more workload.

Aside from the bugs, I guess you have managed to flown the v2.0 version (not 3.0) with the INS system and made perfect flights? Not operated in a safe manner obviously, but without fuel shifting wrongly and causing the flight to spiral out of control which is typical for most people.

About parachuting, military aircraft still use them. Last civil maybe was Tu-154, I heard it used them while still in developement and testing but can be mostly rumors.

[RyanJZ]

vl82m, thanks for the heads up on the INS. I have some free time today to study the manuals that Sean provided, so I'll let you know how it goes. Also on an interesting side note, when you mentioned not understanding foreigners wanting to fly the Tu-144, it reminded me: I have a friend from Moscow, and he isn't as into aviation as I am, but we both are car guys too, and I was telling him that one of my favorite sports cars is the Marussia B1, and he kept asking me why I liked it so much. Apparently he didn't think it was that good of a sports car :P I just thought it was a really unique car.

[RyanJZ]

Sean, in the files you uploaded, there are 2 checklists with 2 (slightly) different start up procedures. Which one should I follow?
Just looked at the third manual in there, which also has a start up procedure....

[SeanTK]

Sean, in the files you uploaded, there are 2 checklists with 2 (slightly) different start up procedures. Which one should I follow?
Just looked at the third manual in there, which also has a start up procedure....

Use "manualtest.pdf" as the primary, with the other ones for reference (though the other two seem like duplicates, with one having text and the other just having pictures). Use these in conjunction with the information posted towards the beginning of this thread.

I'm still unfamiliar with the new INS in version 3.5, so I'm afraid I can't help you there.

[RyanJZ]

Sean, I can figure out most of the axes, but which one do I set the throttle to? I know it cant be x,y, or z :P

[vl82m]

Sean, I can figure out most of the axes, but which one do I set the throttle to? I know it cant be x,y, or z :P

I posted screenshot on which axis to engines? Check back a bit on the thread.

About cars, it's not too bad, I prefer the old Ladas (Ваз) as it's cheap to mantain. It doesn't impress a girl I can admit :biggrin-new:, but I just like the lada 1200s for nostalgia feel (and I'm not even old)...

I will check into the real flight computer of Tu-144 after I'm finished with Tu-134... should be interesting.

[RyanJZ]

вы только говорите по-английски? пожалуйста читать руководство и РЛЭ!

EDIT: confused forums, but point still valid, Please read manual and RLE! Here is procedure engines but you won't get far unless you take time to learn, this is not a concorde.

http://hostthenpost.com/uploads/f69db839510fdd7a317800209cc9147e.png
Isn't z axis the rudder? Or am I just getting confused because its in Cyrillic?

[RyanJZ]

Also vl82m, what part of Russia are you in? Have you been to MAKS?

[vl82m]

Isn't z axis the rudder? Or am I just getting confused because its in Cyrillic?

On mine axis "rudder" is at RZ and throttle at axis Z. Might differ from joystick to joystick. Just rotate that big black button to "Z", move your throttle and see if the ampermeter moves, if it does, then it's the rudder, if not, set the dial to any other value, move the throttles and see on which ones make action. If the ampemeter moves, then go to "Step 2", the black button to the left to "Управление двиг." which is the engines, just rotate that button left to it until "Управление двигатели" comes up and hit save with the button at step 4. If its inverted, then flip the "invert" switch on step 3.

Also note, joystick have to be disable in FSX menu settings to avoise "noise" disrupting the controls of the Tu-144. Reason this apparently hated by everybody joystick configurator exists is because fsx default sensitivities and trim are not realistic enough. For Russians, they have no problems with utilities like this as they speak the language hence it's simple.

The real problems become when we have to talk about fuel shifting during flight...

I lived in Minsk, the capital of Belarus which isn't Russia but Russian is the national language. I've not been to MAKS, but would like to with all the new aircraft coming out never seen before. And now since Russia has to keep up yet again with the west I believe it will be even more interesting technology soon...

[RyanJZ]

On mine axis "rudder" is at RZ and throttle at axis Z. Might differ from joystick to joystick. Just rotate that big black button to "Z", move your throttle and see if the ampermeter moves, if it does, then it's the rudder, if not, set the dial to any other value, move the throttles and see on which ones make action. If the ampemeter moves, then go to "Step 2", the black button to the left to "Управление двиг." which is the engines, just rotate that button left to it until "Управление двигатели" comes up and hit save with the button at step 4. If its inverted, then flip the "invert" switch on step 3.

Also note, joystick have to be disable in FSX menu settings to avoise "noise" disrupting the controls of the Tu-144. Reason this apparently hated by everybody joystick configurator exists is because fsx default sensitivities and trim are not realistic enough. For Russians, they have no problems with utilities like this as they speak the language hence it's simple.

The real problems become when we have to talk about fuel shifting during flight...

I lived in Minsk, the capital of Belarus which isn't Russia but Russian is the national language. I've not been to MAKS, but would like to with all the new aircraft coming out never seen before. And now since Russia has to keep up yet again with the west I believe it will be even more interesting technology soon...
Ah okay thanks VL

[RyanJZ]

I'm having a hard time getting the engines started. I'm following the checklists, and I'm getting the same "hang start" that was described towards the beginning of this thread. So I posted a picture of my engineer panel so hopefully someone can help me figure out whats wrong
14336
:banghead:

[vl82m]

I'm having a hard time getting the engines started. I'm following the checklists, and I'm getting the same "hang start" that was described towards the beginning of this thread. So I posted a picture of my engineer panel so hopefully someone can help me figure out whats wrong
14336
:banghead:

You forgot to connect the bleed air to cabin ventilation and engine start systems :surprise:

[RyanJZ]

You forgot to connect the bleed air to cabin ventilation and engine start systems :surprise:
Oh well that explains it! :encouragement: Thanks!

[RyanJZ]

Having a hard time finding that switch in the manuals. Which switch is it?

[SeanTK]

Having a hard time finding that switch in the manuals. Which switch is it?

The switch directly to the left of the white circle/button near your APU controls. It's a three position switch that springs back to neutral. Hold up until the one of the green advisory lights goes out.

[RyanJZ]

Okay thanks! I have to go now. Should have more time later tonight to try again :D

[vl82m]

SeanTK mentioned the correct step. However I have to add... Don't push all those fuel start lever valves before an engine is actually started. This in the real aircraft is very dangerous and has led to fires due to poor fuel systems maintenance. However most likely not simulated.

[RyanJZ]

Sean, earlier you said you're not familiar with the new INS. When you fly the Tu-144D, how do you navigate?
Also are there any repaints available? I love the current Aeroflot livery!

[SeanTK]

Sean, earlier you said you're not familiar with the new INS. When you fly the Tu-144D, how do you navigate?
Also are there any repaints available? I love the current Aeroflot livery!

I use the autoalign function with the flight computer using the pop-up menu (I think I detailed it earlier in this thread) and generally fly VOR to VOR (or NDB). It's basic, but I haven't found intelligible (for English speakers) guidance for this flight computer yet.

[RyanJZ]

Thanks for the advice Sean. This thread seems to be getting a lot of attention too. Hopefully a lot more people will try out this amazing add on on and figure out all the systems and post some nice manuals in English

[RyanJZ]

I finally got the engines started!:jump: Only now the problem was that I couldn't get the nose cone to lower or the canards to extend. And how do I turn on the hydraulics for nose steering? Where is the landing gear lever? And finally, where's the parachute control?

[RyanJZ]

Just to clarify, I have been able to lower the nose and canards before, I know where the controls are, but when I started the engines I couldn't get them to work.

[RyanJZ]

One last thing: Because I got the engines started, even though I couldn't get the nose down or the canards to deploy, I still decided to do a take off, but when I maxed the throttle, I got a warning horn. Is it because of the nose and canards? Or something else?

[vl82m]

One last thing: Because I got the engines started, even though I couldn't get the nose down or the canards to deploy, I still decided to do a take off, but when I maxed the throttle, I got a warning horn. Is it because of the nose and canards? Or something else?

There's not enough manuals and information in Russian and only an RLE is nothing... It doesn't teach you exactly the logic and what switch does what, just the procedures... So I have low confidence anything will be translated into english anytime soon. Also making guesses of findngs and writing manual for supersonic aircraft will never be the same as there will always be huge errors and should end up fatally.

What is canards? The nose is lowered from the pedestal, press down once to get it to middle, press down once again to the lower position.

http://hostthenpost.com/uploads/03e6bad5ecc64353a8d13c9a848ba441.png (http://hostthenpost.org)

Flaps work a bit differently too, to explain simple, when lowered, your aircraft looks like a dog. The siren that comes on is normal on Tupolev aircraft and it means your aircraft is not properly configured for takeoff, just check the indicator lights and make sure you haven't really forgotten something. As an alternative you could try model 2.5, it's easier for the beginner and has navigation system everyone can use. In Russia flying VOR to VOR with NDBs is not something I would do since the Russian system was different from american and used different non-radio based navigation capatabilities.

Did you follow the whole manual from start to takeoff and still got the siren?

[ce_zeta]

The canard switch is in the overhead panel. You will see it, The canard switch have a big cover.
Read carefully the documentation provided...AS an advice...I usually fly this monster with the documentation in a tablet/phone....

[RyanJZ]

I know where the controls are. I've been able to lower the nose and extend the canards before (before starting the engines) but this time I waited until after the engines started, and the nose wouldn't go down, and when I hit the switch for the canards, I hear the motor noise for them briefly, and the switch snaps back to the retracted position?
How do I turn on the hydraulics for nose steering, etc?
Also I couldn't get the attitude indicator to work? What am I missing?
vl82m, I have only seen Version 3.5 and 2.0, never a 2.5. Where can I find it?
Also just something I'm curios about, did the Russians ever have a nickname for the Tu-144?

[RyanJZ]

14407So last night I did manage to get the engines started, and today I couldn't. The plane has fuel, I remembered to connect the bleed air to the cabin and engine start system (thank you VL) but I was still getting that hang start again!

[vl82m]

So last night I did manage to get the engines started, and today I couldn't. The plane has fuel, I remembered to connect the bleed air to the cabin and engine start system (thank you VL) but I was still getting that hang start again!

http://hostthenpost.com/uploads/6f46529895ca0754fae4f9114d19250d.png (http://hostthenpost.org)

[RyanJZ]

14409
This is what my engineer panel looks like now. I took care of those switches underneath the engine instruments ad I'm still getting the hang start :banghead:

[sepp666]

Hello, just only want to share a picture with you.:wavey:

http://s17.postimg.org/tcr8fpgq7/image.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/id6143qaz/full/)

[RyanJZ]

Update: I was able to get the engines started, but for some reason, once the engines are started, I can't get those nose or canard controls to work! Ugh! What am I missing??? And how do I get the gauges to turn on???

[vl82m]

Update: I was able to get the engines started, but for some reason, once the engines are started, I can't get those nose or canard controls to work! Ugh! What am I missing??? And how do I get the gauges to turn on???

Theres a lot of issues that could be going on, so I cannot know exactly. I'm an expert on Tupolev aircraft including the 134, 154 and 204/214 but should at least be of some use. However, I suggest to watch the startup videos so that you can see step by step what is done.... then you will see procedure of the nose, and the gauges and how they are made to work. Rome wasn't built in a day, neither is a Tupolev captain.

[RyanJZ]

Its weird though because before I knew how to start the engines, I was always able to at least turn on the battery and lower the nose and extend the canards, with the engines OFF. I know there's a steep learning curve but it just seems like when I solve one problem another arises. I don't suppose anyone on this forum has a way of getting in touch with the authors of this plane?

[Bjoern]

Hello, just only want to share a picture with you.:wavey:



http://englishrussia.com/2014/09/08/hidden-tu-144-in-kazan-outskirts/

Instructional airframe.

[vl82m]

Its weird though because before I knew how to start the engines, I was always able to at least turn on the battery and lower the nose and extend the canards, with the engines OFF. I know there's a steep learning curve but it just seems like when I solve one problem another arises. I don't suppose anyone on this forum has a way of getting in touch with the authors of this plane?

I can get you in touch with the autors and some others, if you're really serious about learning this aircraft and investing many hours on it.

steep learning curve, yes, but i understand you, if i had only manuals with almost no information at all not speaking the language i'll be frustrated too

[RyanJZ]

VL that would be great! Feel free to PM me! :D

[ce_zeta]

Its weird though because before I knew how to start the engines, I was always able to at least turn on the battery and lower the nose and extend the canards, with the engines OFF. I know there's a steep learning curve but it just seems like when I solve one problem another arises. I don't suppose anyone on this forum has a way of getting in touch with the authors of this plane?
I never had this problem...I always start and connect all systems...Try this first. Maybe, without hydraulic system or electrical system feed from engines....or without other equipment you can't deploy canards and lower the nose when engines are running.

Good luck.

[RyanJZ]

CE_zeta, how do you turn on the hydraulics and connect the electric system feed to the engines? I can't find anything in the manual

[vl82m]

CE_zeta, how do you turn on the hydraulics and connect the electric system feed to the engines? I can't find anything in the manual

RyanJZ, I sent you a mail

[RyanJZ]

VL, thanks again for the links you PM'd me, but I finally figured it out and completed my first flight! Now I just need to figure out where the trim controls are. I think figure out the trim for roll, but haven't found the elevator trim control yet. Also need to figure out how to navigate and use the autopilot!

[sepp666]

http://englishrussia.com/2014/09/08/hidden-tu-144-in-kazan-outskirts/

Instructional airframe.

Nice pictures.:applause:

[vl82m]

VL, thanks again for the links you PM'd me, but I finally figured it out and completed my first flight! Now I just need to figure out where the trim controls are. I think figure out the trim for roll, but haven't found the elevator trim control yet. Also need to figure out how to navigate and use the autopilot!

The trim controls can be assigned to joystick, do you know how to do it?

Navigation is a trickier part, as for now due to no english information of flight computer, you can retrofit GPS. Also, if you want to navigate with I-21 INS, which I can send documentation for, download beta V3.0 over here: http://rusfolder.com/27906311


For everyone else, making fun of this airplane is ridicolous.

[RyanJZ]

The trim controls can be assigned to joystick, do you know how to do it?

Navigation is a trickier part, as for now due to no english information of flight computer, you can retrofit GPS. Also, if you want to navigate with I-21 INS, which I can send documentation for, download beta V3.0 over here: http://rusfolder.com/27906311


For everyone else, making fun of this airplane is ridicolous.
Yeah I've tried to set the trim to my joystick, but the utility doesn't seem to recognize any of the buttons. Just the stick and throttle. And how do I add GPS to the plane? Is there a way to slave the autopilot to the GPS? And what does version 3.5 have that version 3.0 doesn't? Will I be losing any realism?
And I don't know why people would make fun of this plane. It definitely had its share of teething problems, but I bet if the Soviets had been able to put more money into it, the Tu-144 could have been a major Concorde rival. Who knows, might have been able to build and sell more too. The Soviets definitely built a few planes that could be considered superior to what the West could produce at the time. Like the Tupolev 114! :P

[vl82m]

Yeah I've tried to set the trim to my joystick, but the utility doesn't seem to recognize any of the buttons. Just the stick and throttle. And how do I add GPS to the plane? Is there a way to slave the autopilot to the GPS? And what does version 3.5 have that version 3.0 doesn't? Will I be losing any realism?
And I don't know why people would make fun of this plane. It definitely had its share of teething problems, but I bet if the Soviets had been able to put more money into it, the Tu-144 could have been a major Concorde rival. Who knows, might have been able to build and sell more too. The Soviets definitely built a few planes that could be considered superior to what the West could produce at the time. Like the Tupolev 114! :P

Do you see the button to the left of the save button for axis? well, that's the save button for buttons and commands... however there is a bug with my particular joystick that prevent me from actually knowing which button i set, and displays buttons not on my joystick (8 out of 32). So I have a problem too but will attempt to fix it later.

There is several tutorials on how to add a gps to aircraft, usually made by changes in panel.cfg. most popular one is KLN90GPS which comes with the project tupolev 154. however, it's not very accurate to follow a gps without precision and the autopilot won't be slaved to it. the different in v3 is less features, and primarily, the english documented INS system instead of the flight computer on 3.5. this way you will be able to navigate really easily.

[RyanJZ]

Do you see the button to the left of the save button for axis? well, that's the save button for buttons and commands... however there is a bug with my particular joystick that prevent me from actually knowing which button i set, and displays buttons not on my joystick (8 out of 32). So I have a problem too but will attempt to fix it later.

There is several tutorials on how to add a gps to aircraft, usually made by changes in panel.cfg. most popular one is KLN90GPS which comes with the project tupolev 154. however, it's not very accurate to follow a gps without precision and the autopilot won't be slaved to it. the different in v3 is less features, and primarily, the english documented INS system instead of the flight computer on 3.5. this way you will be able to navigate really easily.
Alright I'll check out V3.0. Do you know if there are any repaints available for either version? I really like the modern Aeroflot livery

[vl82m]

Alright I'll check out V3.0. Do you know if there are any repaints available for either version? I really like the modern Aeroflot livery

There is modern Aeroflot livery for the FS9 version. Perhaps the textures can be converted for FSX. I will look into it tomorrow as they could potentially have the same structure.

However for realism purposes if I were you, I would fly with the Aeroflot - Soviet Airlines livery.

[RyanJZ]

How do you get the primary attitude indicator on? And the heading indicator? Also how do you use the autopilot? The manuals aren't really clear

[SeanTK]

How do you get the primary attitude indicator on? And the heading indicator? Also how do you use the autopilot? The manuals aren't really clear

Check out my posts on the first page, and for this specific issue, post #9.
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?86929-Flying-Supersonic-Tu-144-Charger-v3-5

[RyanJZ]

Check out my posts on the first page, and for this specific issue, post #9.
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?86929-Flying-Supersonic-Tu-144-Charger-v3-5
Oh yeah! I forgot the autopilot controls were on the yoke in the Tu-144! The AP master switch is the 2 switches covered by the big red cap on the OHL panel right?
Also, how do I activate the primary attitude indicator? I can get the secondary on but not the main one

[SeanTK]

Oh yeah! I forgot the autopilot controls were on the yoke in the Tu-144! The AP master switch is the 2 switches covered by the big red cap on the OHL panel right?
Also, how do I activate the primary attitude indicator? I can get the secondary on but not the main one

The primary attitude indicator at least on mine is aligning as soon as I use the pop-up pictured in post #9 previously.

[RyanJZ]

Can anyone tell me how the autopilot works???

[RyanJZ]

Update: I figured out the autopilots basic functions and how to turn it on

[Stefano Zibell]

All my views keep pushing up whithout any input. Control K doesn't stop it. Also, there's a control device causing input which is none of mine in that configurator utility. Anyone using Thrustmaster Hotas X who's able to donate the configuration?

[RyanJZ]

You kinda just have to play with the control utility. First, make sure you start in 2D panel view, not the VC. Than use shift 5 to bring up said utility. Use the bottom left dial. In the pic below, note the option I have selected in the bottom box, and use the selection knob to select the option I did in that pic. That is your look "axis". Its where my cursor is in the pic. Then, wiggle your hat/view switch. If you get that green light, you're doing it right. Then, save it with the right button under those 2 boxes on the left. Now navigating the plane in flight is another matter! I've settled for merely adding a GPS! This thread has a lot of information in it, and all of this has been explained earlier. It takes a lot of setup. But it is worth it! Good luck! Just make sure you read through the ENTIRE thread!
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/attachment.php?attachmentid=17226&stc=1
Just realized my cursor disappeared in that screenshot. Anyways, this should help. Also I use a Thrustmaster joystick with no problems

[vl82m]

To the people wondering about the Tupolev Tu-134, I have now released the english Tu-134 manual on the project tupolev forum.

[Anneke]

Thanks! Here's a link (http://www.protu-154.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12904).

[Adonis]

I'm having a bit of a problem with the Tu-144, during flight at random, the CG pointer of the fuel transfer likes to jump back to around 40 suddenly. Any ideas to how to fix it? I am loading the plane in 2D panel mode, and enter fuel through FSX's fuel UI. The author has stated in his postings that clicking the yellow center of the fuel totalizer gauge reassigns it to the correct setup after a fuel change when the plane is already loaded.

[SeanTK]

I'm having a bit of a problem with the Tu-144, during flight at random, the CG pointer of the fuel transfer likes to jump back to around 40 suddenly. Any ideas to how to fix it? I am loading the plane in 2D panel mode, and enter fuel through FSX's fuel UI. The author has stated in his postings that clicking the yellow center of the fuel totalizer gauge reassigns it to the correct setup after a fuel change when the plane is already loaded.

Hi, I can't say that I've ever experienced that problem, unfortunately. I recommend adjusting the fuel and payload before loading the aircraft in the actual flight session, and from a balance perspective, loading no more than 75-78% fuel seems to work best. Perhaps an image of your CG panel when this happens would be beneficial, but again, I have not experienced an issue with the pointer jumping back to 40 suddenly.
Other guesses as to the culprit include rapid changes in the angle of attack and/or airspeed.

[Adonis]

Well, it's clearly an issue with the fuel resetting itself to it's pre-takeoff configuration. I set up the plane as per the authors videos that are linked here.

[Adonis]

I think I might have fixed the issue. I noticed with both the FS9 and FSX versions that the widescreen panel lacks Panel_tranferkvs.xml which is pretty much the gauge that is giving me troubles. Copying it into the widescreen panel folder and the drops are gone so far with one partial flight completed (in which previous attempts resulted in at least 2-3 resets of fuel during flight). :)

[SeanTK]

I think I might have fixed the issue. I noticed with both the FS9 and FSX versions that the widescreen panel lacks Panel_tranferkvs.xml which is pretty much the gauge that is giving me troubles. Copying it into the widescreen panel folder and the drops are gone so far with one partial flight completed (in which previous attempts resulted in at least 2-3 resets of fuel during flight). :)

Glad to hear that you were able to fix it. That was certainly a new issue for me that I didn't have the background on. Hope you enjoy your supersonic flights!

[Adonis]

Glad to hear that you were able to fix it. That was certainly a new issue for me that I didn't have the background on. Hope you enjoy your supersonic flights!
I can now confirm that it works correctly :) Domodedovo to Almaty and no issues with the fuel system whatsoever :)

A question tho: is it possible to utilize both Comm radios? Like use Comm 1 for ATC and Comm 2 for ATIS? I haven't found the switch for it anywhere.

[ce_zeta]

Fantastic Adonis. Thanks for the solution. :encouragement:

[SeanTK]

I can now confirm that it works correctly :) Domodedovo to Almaty and no issues with the fuel system whatsoever :)

A question tho: is it possible to utilize both Comm radios? Like use Comm 1 for ATC and Comm 2 for ATIS? I haven't found the switch for it anywhere.

As far as I know it's one or the other. I do not believe there is a way to receive on both at once. I would need to double check though.

[Adonis]

As far as I know it's one or the other. I do not believe there is a way to receive on both at once. I would need to double check though.

More like switch between the two :) As is I'm stuck with Comm 1 only.

A little update concerning my problem: It seems that the issue was more connected to running FSX in Windows 7 compatibility mode under Windows 8 then just the xml itself being absent from the widescreen panel folder. I do not have fuel tank resets when Win7 compatibility mode is on (all tho it makes no difference to anything else in FSX or any other addons).

[Adonis]

Correction: I still get them, but not that often. Tanks Nr.2 seem to get fuel in them all of a sudden and that drops the CG back to 39, when it should be emptied by the time I reach Mach 2. I'm beginning to think that Windows's xml version being newer could be the culprit...

[SeanTK]

Sorry to bump this, but a few users have been asking for assistance, and a couple of them have full message inboxes so I can't respond to their Private Messages.

For those learning the Tu-144, carefully read post #6 at the beginning of this thread for direction on where to get some updates for the model.

[ce_zeta]

I think that It's better post all the questions in this thread because everybody can learn. At the same time we are building a 'Database' where we can check the info when we have doubts flying this monster of the skies.

[SeanTK]

I think that It's better post all the questions in this thread because everybody can learn. At the same time we are building a 'Database' where we can check the info when we have doubts flying this monster of the skies.

I'll post a few updated answers to questions, but I didn't want to continaully push this to the top as I'm sure it's a bother to others here who aren't interested in this addon.

In any case, one user had some difficulties getting the fuel balancing automation system to work (which impacts the center of gravity) but they are on Win10, so I don't know if that makes a difference. I have not encountered those difficulties but am still trying to investigate.

Another use had difficulties experiencing uncontrolled view panning in the VC, as well as mach tuck when exceeding Mach 1. As illustrated in post #6 at the beginning of this thread, there is a file update that mitigates the Mach 1 issue. Regarding the view panning, one must disable their joystick hardware in FSX itself, and use the addon's included joystick/hardware utility.

I attempted to send the following (in part) to one of the users:

I recommend carefully reading from that big Tu-144 thread I made a few months (year?) ago here at SOH, as I have provided links to a few patches in there that correct the nose dip behavior when going over Mach 1, and I specifically reference it in the thread. Most direction is in post #6 in the thread:
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/showthread.php?86929-Flying-Supersonic-Tu-144-Charger-v3-5

In additional to this, I also recommend being sure to make use of trim, and ensuring that the aircraft's canards as well as nose are up/retracted prior to going Mach 1.

Additionally, you need to do the following to set up the joystick properly:

1. Disable your joystick/controls in FSX. I think there's a checkbox in the controls settings that does it universally.
2. Load the aircraft in 2D panel mode. (Should be a setting with FSX to load aircraft in 2D mode).
3. Following the attached PDF guidance to select the proper controls and map them to your hardware. This takes a few tries as the tool isn't very friendly, but I provided links earlier with further detail on how to use it.
4. Upon completion, you should have a fully mapped Tu-144. Remember, it has its own joystick utility, and trying to use hardware that is activated in FSX itself will lead to problems like the view panning issue.
5. When loading the aircraft in future sessions, you still need to ensure that you load in 2D first, with the joystick disabled. After the aircraft initially loads in the sim, I'll usually flick the hat-switch on my joystick left or right to "wake up" the aircraft's joystick logic so it starts reading my hardware for this session. Following that, I'll right click on an open spot out of the windows in 2D mode and switch to the VC for the remainder of the flight. Keep in mind that some functions such as the engineer's panel are only available in 2D mode.

[SeanTK]

My first attempt at a flightsim video. Looks like some of the 2D panel views got cut off due to the recording resolution, but other than that, everything else is intact.
From cold/dark to wheels-up in less than 15 minutes.
For those that want to actually see this addon in action....


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yOwJyP23dI

[ce_zeta]

Thank you Sean.

[SeanTK]

Updated links as I was notified that a few on page one are dead.
If you try to reach me by PM, make sure your inbox is not full. If it is, I can't respond to you.

Aircraft and most fixes + manuals:

http://www.megafileupload.com/i7ds/TU-144_BACKUP.zip

One more fix (overwrite original XML file):

http://www.megafileupload.com/i7dp/Hidro_Logik.zip


(http://www.megafileupload.com/i7dp/Hidro_Logik.zip)

[RyanJZ]

I don't suppose anyone has figured out the INS yet?

[Adonis]

I don't suppose anyone has figured out the INS yet?

I have, I'll write a short guide here in a few days for you all.

[RyanJZ]

I have, I'll write a short guide here in a few days for you all. SWEET!!!!!! We all appreciate that!! Also, has anyone had a problem with FSX crashing while using live weather with this plane?

[Adonis]

Sorry for the delay guys, this has taken me longer than expected. I'll write a doc file that's basically an amalgamation of Sean's instructions, my observations, the Russian YouTube vids, and my translations of the Russian documents to Serbian which I speak, into a checklist form that's easy to follow.

I have completed numerous flights from UUDD-UAAA - Moscow Domodedovo to Almaty (which not long ago got a nice little freeware scenery for FSX on avsim.su btw) - since I figured out why the fuel system was resetting for me at random (I'll include an explanation why this happens of course).

[Raphael0607]

I'd love to have an understandable INS guide, since I can understand 0 of any of those russian videos. Can't wait for your INS guide!

[Adonis]

I'd love to have an understandable INS guide, since I can understand 0 of any of those russian videos. Can't wait for your INS guide!
I'm just left with adequate explanations of a few terms from one of my Russian friends and then I'll be finished with it ;)

[ce_zeta]

Fantastic Adonis!

[Raphael0607]

Hey Adonis,
when do you think you can post the guide for the INS? in the coming week, or month?
(not to be pushy, I just can't wait to learn the aircraft :D)

[Adonis]

Hey Adonis,
when do you think you can post the guide for the INS? in the coming week, or month?
(not to be pushy, I just can't wait to learn the aircraft :D)

Next 2 weeks abouts. And it won't deal with the INS only, but with flying the plane all together ;)

[vl82m]

There is still a lot of bugs with Tu-144D. I recommend most people if interested in Russian aviation to fly with Tu-154B-2 or Tu-134A-3 (latest Tu-134A-3 from avsim.su is not too bad). Tu-154 has NVU, INS, GPS, radio navigation which gives you many options. Tu-134 fly with RSBN, NAS-1 or radio navigation.

In Tu-144, similar INS (different from I-21) exists. It is not very complicated and I never had time to write manual. It is good Adonis make this. Hopefully Russian aviation will be more popular instead of only Airbus and Boeing in the vatsim skies.

[Adonis]

There is still a lot of bugs with Tu-144D. I recommend most people if interested in Russian aviation to fly with Tu-154B-2 or Tu-134A-3 (latest Tu-134A-3 from avsim.su is not too bad). Tu-154 has NVU, INS, GPS, radio navigation which gives you many options. Tu-134 fly with RSBN, NAS-1 or radio navigation.

In Tu-144, similar INS (different from I-21) exists. It is not very complicated and I never had time to write manual. It is good Adonis make this. Hopefully Russian aviation will be more popular instead of only Airbus and Boeing in the vatsim skies.

What bugs exactly? I might have come across one with the ABSU vertical going up and down all the time above like 500km/h. First time ever happened to me after numerous flights. If I go manual on the vertical channel all is well.

[vl82m]

Bug is with control inputs mostly, from the joystick configuration. It is easy to set it all up, but the airplane many times forgets the settings. Also there is few bugs with the engineers system, causing engine start to become impossible randomly. Then every 1 flight out of 3 the aircraft starts vibrating/shaking violently when transiting to the speed of sound.

It's possible this only happens for me, however in Russian forum I have read similar issues.

[Raphael0607]

Next 2 weeks abouts. And it won't deal with the INS only, but with flying the plane all together ;)

Hey Adonis,

Any updates on the guide?

Raphael.

[Adonis]

Hey Adonis,

Any updates on the guide?

Raphael.

Been a bit busy with RL commitments, and had a problem with the autopilot vertical channel acting up. I think I fixed that too, so it's fix is another addition to the manual itself. Plus, I have all the unknowns now sorted. The damn thing can do SID/STAR as long as it's max 9 waypoints :D Haven't tested it out myself yet tho.

[Raphael0607]

Been a bit busy with RL commitments, and had a problem with the autopilot vertical channel acting up. I think I fixed that too, so it's fix is another addition to the manual itself. Plus, I have all the unknowns now sorted. The damn thing can do SID/STAR as long as it's max 9 waypoints :D Haven't tested it out myself yet tho.


Nice! Good to hear. :D

[coolguy3]

Hi All,

A couple of quick questions - does this plane work in P3D v2.5? Does it recognize GoFlight modules? (I have the full airliner GF setup). I still have problems with the loads - switching to VC from 2D initially causes the viewpoint to roll upwards so I'm looking at the ceiling...external view rolls up to directly above the plane, looking down at it....
Thanks,
Jim

[ce_zeta]

Hi All,

A couple of quick questions - does this plane work in P3D v2.5? Does it recognize GoFlight modules? (I have the full airliner GF setup). I still have problems with the loads - switching to VC from 2D initially causes the viewpoint to roll upwards so I'm looking at the ceiling...external view rolls up to directly above the plane, looking down at it....
Thanks,
Jim
The solution to the problem of the viewpoint is in this thread. You should configure the joystick utility of the arcraft. Check this thread from the beginning.

[coolguy3]

Oops, sorry, I missed the explanation about fixing the view...I have not yet done the joystick setup. What about my GF modules, particularly the MCP Pro?

I know this plane is specifically for FSX....does anyone know/has anyone tried to get it to work in P3D v2.5?

Thanks,
Jim

[RyanJZ]

There might be some issues with the engineer panel in p3d, but its no loss as freeware if it doesn't work, so try it out.
Does anyone else have these issues? The plane crashes FSX when using live weather, and sometimes the airspeed indicator and vertical regime indicator stop working and read 0. even pressing shift z doesn't work, as that reads 0 too:banghead:

[RyanJZ]

Anyone know where to find the deice switches? Also, does anyone have this issue: when using this plane and live or custom weather, FSX crashes?

[Raphael0607]

Hello Adonis,


Do you have any updates about the guide you were making?
I'd really like to get it.


Raphaël.

[RyanJZ]

New problem with the Tu-144d, I can't transfer fuel for supersonic flight. The lights indicating fuel transfer come on, but the needle stays at 40%. http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/attachment.php?attachmentid=45362&stc=1

[RyanJZ]

I'm resurrecting this thread! Adonis, any update on your manual and fixes? Also, I got the plane sort of working in FSX:SE, and can transfer fuel around, but for some reason, when breaking the sound barrier, the airplane still pitches down aggressively, even after transferring fuel aft and after the fixes from page 1 of this thread. I would really appreciate any help

[RyanJZ]

Guys, any thoughts or updates here?

[Bjoern]

Guy, any patience there?

Haven't seen Adonis around here in ages, so you're poised to wait for quite a while.

[RyanJZ]

It's not just an update from Adonis, I've also got this weird issue I've never had before with this plane

[Naismith]

FWIW I saw yesterday a English Manual for this a/c at Simviation just posted.

[RyanJZ]

FWIW I saw yesterday a English Manual for this a/c at Simviation just posted.
This may just be the best news I've gotten today...