Any Developers using the 4MM Vertex Limit Bypass and the Poly Limit bypass?

[Lionheart]

Hey all,

I am just learning this new bypass system where you can get a super model into FS9. Its pretty interesting and not as difficult as I had thought. However, I do have some quirky issues going on with my plane when it arrives in FS9. But the others say theirs do not do this, so I must have stumbled onto a mild issue.

Pretty interesting though. I have a model about 110,000 polys sitting in FS9.

What one does, (in a very very vague outline) is export your model in 'chunks'. Keep all the X files. No model can be over 64,000 polys, of course. Then, you run the main X file through MakeMDL.exe, then modify the main ASM, and then drop that main ASM into/onto BGLC-9 and Voila.... Turn the BGL into a MDL format (rename it) and you have a super model.

Many are creating their models in oversize scales, then in the ASM file, you reset the Super_Scale to a new setting, such as 2 or 3, what ever works on your model, and you are set to go. One gentleman found a way to scale up the models in the X files, then in the main ASM file, you reset that to Super_Scale 2 or 3 or what ever scale you need it to work right, and you have your model raised up in scale, and then reduced when the ASM runs again through BGLC-9.

No more Poly limits, no more Vertex 4MM weld limits.



Is anyone else doing this?


Bill

[full]

Hi Bill, ive been using the scale up 6x method then scale down in the asm file, but i would definately be interested if you were to write a tutorial on this new method.

[nazca_steve]

Sounds very interesting, I had no idea of this technique. It could definitely breath life into the future of FS2004 modelling, given that I thought poly limits were going to prevent stuff from ever reaching into the realms of FSX. Personally speaking, the only real downside I see in doing in in chunks like you described is project/asset management. You'd really have to keep very thorough tabs on all the parts in projects where multiple variants are involved.

[Lionheart]

Sounds very interesting, I had no idea of this technique. It could definitely breath life into the future of FS2004 modelling, given that I thought poly limits were going to prevent stuff from ever reaching into the realms of FSX. Personally speaking, the only real downside I see in doing in in chunks like you described is project/asset management. You'd really have to keep very thorough tabs on all the parts in projects where multiple variants are involved.

From what I have seen, people are working on projects that are roughly 150,000 polys for the exterior and the same for the interior (300,000 polys total). Thats the highest I have heard.

With my project, I have sub-Hierarchies named for their sections. They are all in the same 'exterior' model structure, so the exports from sub-assemblies use the same 'exterior' center node. Then the 'chunks' or packets that are exported and named with interior in the names will auto-compile into the 'interior' Hierarchy via the ASM assignments.

I do some of those long addon variants as well and it is easy enough. Just have to export several times instead of once. (FSX is twice). Also, if you havent touched any parts in a certain packet section, then no need to export it again if you kept it, so you would only export the ones you modified.



full
Hi Bill, ive been using the scale up 6x method then scale down in the asm file, but i would definately be interested if you were to write a tutorial on this new method.


I do plan on it. Once I get it all working.

Right now, I have exported my newest bird into FS9 with this technique, but some of the stock animated parts are having gizmo confusion, like the turbine impellars turning on the Y axis instead of the Z axis. Very odd how some side effects are occurring. The others say they havent been having any of the problems I have been having, so who knows....



I did try the trick of making the X files into a super model (without scaling the plane up in Gmax) but the model didnt want to come back down in scale. I wonder if perhaps I missed the area that was to be scaled?


Pretty cool concept. This could really get my enthusiasm going again in building planes. Unlimited models in FS9!

[OBIO]

A bit OT sort of...but these Super Models....how are frame rates on them? For those of us with slower and older systems, will we be able to enjoy these Super Models without our sim becoming a slide show?

OBIO

[nazca_steve]

Good question, Obio, you took the words out of my mouth! It does raise the point however, of frame rates. When FSX first came out, all you heard was how it was a frame-rate killer; while I will admit, from a modelling perspective, a poly limit in FS9 somewhat restricts your horizons, it does in effect, keep models low-poly and frame rates smooth on older systems. It will therefore, be interesting to see over time, how FS9 'super models' fare...hopefully well, and as you say, Lionheart, it opens the door to bigger and better in good old 9.

[Wing_Z]

This is the biggest breakthrough news since, I don't know ... photoreal clouds, maybe?
It'll launch another dimension in FS9.
Well done for sticking with the thought, Bill.


...For those of us with slower and older systems, will we be able to enjoy these Super Models without our sim becoming a slide show...
Microsoft included something just for such an eventuality:
http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h200/CHARL_photos/SOH/HJCAP929.jpg

[FengZ]

Show us what you are working on bill! :)

Sounds like something cool for FS9!

-feng

[Lionheart]

Hey Feng,

Where yah been?



OBIO
A bit OT sort of...but these Super Models....how are frame rates on them? For those of us with slower and older systems, will we be able to enjoy these Super Models without our sim becoming a slide show?

Reports from the gentleman that is helping walk me through this is that his giant model flies perfectly fine in FS9, no odd slow frame rates like others have talked about. He is also the one with a 140,000 poly exterior and 150,000 poly interior which is normal in FSX, but yes, amazing in FS9.



FengZ
Show us what you are working on bill!


Long story on what I am working on. I'll try to make it short.

* Boeing 797 Blended Wing Body (BWB) freeware (very basic), using this as my starter to learn on with this new FS9 compile process.
* WT-9 Dynamic (Aerospool). This 'must' be for FS9 as well as FSX, and I need to have the cockpit 'extremely refined' and not notchy like normal models. The Factory requested it for FS9 if I was to be allowed to make it, and I like FS9 better anyways, so its cool.

So I am making the B-797 first to 'learn' this system, and then the Dynamic will be second nature in getting all its massive amounts of high detail parts into 9. (The mesh is already done, not mapped or animated, holding for its production que to resume).

Some bugs yet to work out. I have been having to place all animated parts in the last LOD model parcel as they do not load/work in the main model pack.

Odd how it all works...


If the Boeing works well in interest, I may obtain the license and do a payware with a super detailed VC, and then the Boeing Bird of Prey.

[Lionheart]

Here are some pictures of the cabin of the Dynamic and why I need this new system. Many parts and things in there.

[FengZ]

wow! sweet looking birds! I love that Boeing plane; one of my favorite designs from the aerospace industry. It's very Burt Rutan-ish. That WT-9 looks very cool too.

Glad you are still supporting FS9.

I bought a new Alienware a month ago, and finally decided to install my copy of FSX. The sim looked nice and ran fine, but somehow, it just didn't feel right. Un-installed and went back to good old FS9.

Yeah, was away from Flightsim for a while cuz of work and also trying to finish a bunch of games i bought on Steam over the Xmas break. Finally completed Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age...so i'm back on FS9 again. Though Starcraft II is coming out in 7 days...oh man...need...to....resist...

-feng

[Matt Wynn]

man that BWB/797 is sweet! can't wait to put my brushes to her! out of curiosity Bill you going to add the refuelling boom for the refuelling aircraft that was proposed? either way i want to paint her.... darn this wait... :wiggle:

[Lionheart]

man that BWB/797 is sweet! can't wait to put my brushes to her! out of curiosity Bill you going to add the refuelling boom for the refuelling aircraft that was proposed? either way i want to paint her.... darn this wait... :wiggle:

Hey Smoothie,

Actually that is going to be a 2/3rd scale version, or smaller, with two engines instead of three, sort of a replacement to the C-130 from what I hear.

Its a wild bird. Its really beautiful in the flight simulator. When you can look around it, you can see that its a flying wing and really sleek. Very huge.

[Lionheart]

I bought a new Alienware a month ago, and finally decided to install my copy of FSX. The sim looked nice and ran fine, but somehow, it just didn't feel right. Un-installed and went back to good old FS9.


Nice! I have only heard the best about those. I would take one of those over a MBP! lol... Do you have a dual HD in it?




Yeah, was away from Flightsim for a while cuz of work and also trying to finish a bunch of games i bought on Steam over the Xmas break. Finally completed Mass Effect 2 and Dragon Age...so i'm back on FS9 again. Though Starcraft II is coming out in 7 days...oh man...need...to....resist...

-feng

I still havent finished Mass Effect 2. What an awesome game! So much of Syd Mead in that its incredible, lol... Love running around on the ship. If only we could walk around in FS like that.

Starcraft II should be awesome.


Bill

[Matt Wynn]

wow them in flight shots look stunning, i always did like the BWB design... very aesthetically pleasing :jump:

[FengZ]

Nice! I have only heard the best about those. I would take one of those over a MBP! lol... Do you have a dual HD in it?

Bill

Hehe, everything is dual. 2 x Nvidia GTX 295s running in Quad SLI mode (crushes any game even at 2560x1600 res...FS9 runs at about 150-200fps, maxed out).

There are 6 Western Digitial Raptor Hard Drives in this beast (raptors spin at double the speed, 15,000rpm). Every 2 drives are combined into striped mode RAID for ultra fast read/write. So 6 harddrives show up as 3. Load time for any program/game is less than a few seconds.

You should definitely consider getting one. They are a bit over-priced, but the experience they bring is awesome. You can install any game on the market right now, max out all the settings, and the fps will never drop below 60. Playing games at these settings is almost like a different experience.

It's overkill...but since i work in this binessness and need to install a lot of next-gen games (sometimes 2 years before they come out), i have to constantly upgrade my PCs to the fastest available on the market....

-feng

[FengZ]

since you like design bill, this current Area-51 has a great case (my favorite so far). It's finally easy to open/close and install stuff.

The harddrive area is the best. You just open the case like a fridge, and slot in the harddrive...no wires, cables, etc.

my wife thinks i'm a total geek for getting this...lol...but then she has like 100+ pairs of shoes...so there!

(these are not my pics...got them off of a review site):

http://fengzhudesign.com/fs2004/alienware_01.jpg

these open/close depending on temperature
http://fengzhudesign.com/fs2004/alienware_02.jpg

hard-drive slots
http://fengzhudesign.com/fs2004/alienware_03.jpg

-feng

[Felixthreeone]

I am very excited to see what comes of this....and can't wait to add another Lionheart creation to my stable....or maybe more than one :jump:

[Lionheart]

since you like design bill, this current Area-51 has a great case (my favorite so far). It's finally easy to open/close and install stuff.

The harddrive area is the best. You just open the case like a fridge, and slot in the harddrive...no wires, cables, etc.

my wife thinks i'm a total geek for getting this...lol...but then she has like 100+ pairs of shoes...so there!

(these are not my pics...got them off of a review site):

-feng

My goodness man! That thing is awesome! Thanks for the heads up on that. I'll have to check it out.

Heat actuated thermal plating louvers, lolol.. Most narly...!

[Lionheart]

Here is a link to the discussion we're having presently at the www.FSdeveloper.com forums on this subject.

http://www.fsdeveloper.com/forum/showthread.php?t=20064




Bill

[bpfowler]

awesome lateral thinking in the vision for this super-complex model technique.
Very exciting about the emissive textures applied in post-production, as it were.

thanks for the tech HU, Bill.

cheerio,
brady

[Flyboy208]

Yet again, new life is given to FS9! Mike :salute: