9/11 conspiracy theroist goes nuts ...

[Snuffy]

At the Pentagon and pays the ultimate price for his stupidity.

http://www.myfoxdc.com/dpp/news/local/pentagon-metro-station-shooting-030510

[cheezyflier]

9/11 conspiracy theroist goes nuts ...

a litte redundant. that's like saying a crazy person went crazy :icon_lol:

[Snuffy]

Nah, there is a difference ...

Being a nut is a hell of a lot different than going nuts.

[stansdds]

The world is filled with nuts, evidently the filter in the gene pool no longer works.

[cheezyflier]

that's because there's not enough sand :icon_lol:

[Dain Arns]

...
http://i19.photobucket.com/albums/b162/Leorstef/Almond_Joy.jpg

[Ken Stallings]

Nah, there is a difference ...

Being a nut is a hell of a lot different than going nuts.

I'm not sure that's true. You have to be insane before doing some act that is insane!

My view is that anyone who believes in the 9-11 conspiracy theories are either sane people trying to make the cheapest of buck, or truly insane people who are being exploited for profit by those who play the issues up for money.

This individual was tragically insane. I just hope all the one's doing it for money (not because they believe the crap they put forth) might take a second to consider what their efforts helped achieve!

I feel sorry for people who walk the earth with their heads filled with such nonsense, especially when it leads to such anger and evil.

Ken

[Toastmaker]

I think what he meant was that there's a significant difference for society between someone who lives a benign life of quiet psychosis and delusion and someone who's insanity explodes into violence. There are plenty of both out there.

[Ken Stallings]

No doubt there!

[boxcar]

.
From the OP's linked report, regarding the shooter's "bad feelings"
towards government & military regarding the 9-11 demolitions:

"Keevill said Friday that authorities had not made "a final determination" that the writer was the same as the suspect."
.

Ken writes:

"My view is that anyone who believes in the 9-11 conspiracy theories are either sane people trying to make the cheapest of buck, or truly insane people who are being exploited for profit by those who play the issues up for money."

Hardly, friend. Pictures speak thousands of words:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atSd7mxgsGY&feature=related

WTC 1, WTC 2 & later (at 5:25 p.m.) WTC 7 all fell at virtually the speed of gravity.
FEMA was deployed to NYC the day before. Did you know that?

The bulk of our fighter forces were deployed to Alaska & Canada beforehand to
participate in huge wargames, leaving us wide open. Did you know that?

No modern steel framed building has ever totally "collapsed" from fire except 3 of them.
They all happened that day in the same place.

It takes days to set up demolitions charges correctly to bring down a building.
They admitted that day that Building 7 would have to be "pulled" because it was unsafe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0GW6QXKyp0&feature=related

Molten steel was continuing to be found no less than 5 weeks later in the basements of WTC towers 1, 2 & 7.

The biggest body parts found of those that still in towers 1 & 2 were sliver-sized with almost no exceptions.

Virtually all of the concrete was pulverized, not broken.

Those buildings were built like no others, designed to take two impacts each of aircraft that size.

The tower fires were smoking black before coming down, the sign of relatively cool-burning fires
& not nearly the temperatures to so much as weaken ASTM E119 grade steel columns. That requires
temperatures of well over 2500 degrees F to weaken, 3000 degrees F to melt.

Could go on & on for days, friends, of all that has been documented (not just asserted) of the tragedies of that day.


Have still got many, many questions, all of which the prior administration assured us would all be answered. They never have been... & this has spawned every kind of wild conspiracy theory out there, so many nut-cases. I am quite sane, not after making a "cheap buck" or seeking attention for myself. Will gladly share with you what I am, though...


I am an American fighting man. I am prepared to give my life.
I will support & defend the Constitution of the United States of America
against ALL enemies, foreign & domestic. I am a patriot.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qdrGKwkmxAU&feature=related


We were all warned long ago by this great man.


Stop being spoon-fed your information, your beliefs, your division. Think for yourselves.


At the very least, the attacks were allowed to happen. At the very least.


.
May God help us all.
.
.

[Toastmaker]

Oh boy! I can't wait for what's on the way - :pop4:

[djscoo]

I think it's best if this thread gets shut down now...

[boxcar]

.
So long as all remains respectful, what need is there to shut down this thread?

If it is truly foreseen that this thread will get out of hand then, by all means, please lock it down now, Moderators...
but I respectfully ask that the thread remain & not be removed, as all I posted is documented. Thanks.

[djscoo]

.
So long as all remains respectful, what need is there to shut down this thread?

If it is truly foreseen that this thread will get out of hand then, by all means, please lock it down now, Moderators...
but I respectfully ask that the thread remain & not be removed, as all I posted is documented. Thanks.
Historically (I can think of 2 instances), SOH and 9/11 conspiracy theories don't go well together. Too many hotheads...

[Rami]

Hello,

Regardless of what your opinions are, remember to keep this thread civil and avoid all personal attacks. If you want to make this thread political, there's always the Quarter Moon Saloon....

[boxcar]

.
Then based on history, djscoo, am sensing you are correct in having this thread locked.
And good thoughts, Rami, thanks.

Apologies, Snuffy. You are a patriot too, albeit we have differing views, sir.

*Edit-
One more respectful thought, towards Ken:
You assert, "I feel sorry for people who walk the earth with their heads filled with such nonsense, especially when it leads to such anger and evil."
I am offering the thought that that is because the angry & evil ones are the only ones people hear about. Myself, my heart is still breaking.

[tigisfat]

I know soldiers who were stationed at Ft Myer, in Washington DC (Virginia) when the Pentagon was attacked. Do you know how many "open your eyes, man" clowns I've had to tell that I know people people who not only saw the plane, but had to go pick up body parts, aircraft parts and children's luggage? (I know you didn't mention the pentagon, I was just making a point)

If steel doesn't melt, then how do they make it? Look up the Macarthur maze tanker fire, Boxcar. It'll show that all those 'sount bites' are just that, 'sound bites' that keep getting repeated but aren't true. Steel structures melt and collapse all the time.

Here's another one. "Saddam never had WMD's, man". Oh yeah? What'd he do to the kurds then?


cheers to you for being able to state your opinion without throwing it in everyone's face. :medals:That's how 9/11 stuff goes way downhill fast.

[boxcar]

.

I know soldiers who were stationed at Ft Myer, in Washington DC (Virginia) when the Pentagon was attacked. Do you know how many "open your eyes, man" clowns I've had to tell that I know people people who not only saw the plane, but had to go pick up body parts, aircraft parts and children's luggage? (I know you didn't mention the pentagon, I was just making a point)

Am taking the point. Name-calling, it would seem to me. Could discuss the Pentagon for hours, as it was my specialized area of researching.

.

If steel doesn't melt, then how do they make it? Look up the Macarthur maze tanker fire, Boxcar. It'll show that all those 'sount bites' are just that, 'sound bites' that keep getting repeated but aren't true. Steel structures melt and collapse all the time.

Of course steel melts... just not at the temperatures of those fires, not that grade of steel or any steel for that matter. Nor does steel remain molten in the basements no less than 5 weeks later. Your assertions have no basis in reality regarding the "collapsing" of modern steel buildings, especially of the grade of steel that the WTC towers were made of.

.

Here's another one. "Saddam never had WMD's, man". Oh yeah? What'd he do to the kurds then?

Of course he had them. And certainly the Kurds know this more than most. Saddam did not have them when we went in. Big difference.



cheers to you for being able to state your opinion without throwing it in everyone's face. :medals:That's how 9/11 stuff goes way downhill fast.

Agreed. I love our country, ladies & gentlemen. I would gladly lay down my life to protect & defend her. Just please consider that not all dissenters are non-patriots or clowns or nutcases. Respectful dissent & asking legitimate questions are all part of a free & noble society.

Go inside that day: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfce_C8GzdE
.
.

[cheezyflier]

before one can even begin to discuss the anomalies, one thing has to be understood clearly.
that thing is, in order for 9/11 to be a conspiracy, hundreds maybe even a thousand people or more would have to keep a whole lotta secrets. no way in this world. it's just not reality. i can see a small handful of people keeping big secrets. but hundreds? it's impossible.

[boxcar]

.
Thanks, cheezyflier. My response is the Manhatten Project, over 130,000 people worked on the project... & it never leaked.

Now days, military applications are so highly compartmentalized that only a few handfuls of people know the big picture of any project, even though tens of thousands work on them. Need to know basis. Even naval commanders of cruise missile frigates have no idea whatsoever of their targets. They simple feed in the data received.
.

[luckydog]

Boxcar.............

Just out of curiosity.......how many doomsday and conspiracy THEORIES due you subscribe to................??

[wombat666]

Boxcar.............

Just out of curiosity.......how many doomsday and conspiracy THEORIES due you subscribe to................??

Enough people.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, if this continues to go further along the above lines this thread will be locked.
:173go1:

[luckydog]

AND nobody is allowed to ask simple questions ???

[boxcar]

.
Thank you wombat.

luckydog: Of course you are privileged to ask simple questions...
though when you assert that (before you edited)...
.


"Boxcar.............

You're in need of some long-term psychiatric help !!!!:isadizzy::isadizzy::isadizzy:

Just out of curiosity.......how many doomsday and conspiracy THEORIES due you subscribe to................??"
..

.
...then you are most certainly going beyond asking simple questions. S'ok... the mainstream
media also likes to shout down, deride, divert, make crazies of many patriots these days.

Snuffy, am again apologizing for the apparent imminent locking of your thread, friend.
Rami, you are correct: too many hot-heads. Am confessing to knowing better.
.

[wombat666]

AND nobody is allowed to ask simple questions ???

Edited your post I see.....simple questions asked in a civil manner are always welcome.
As we have another forum for this type of 'discussion' it should have been posted there.
Not difficult.
:rolleyes:

[luckydog]

I edited to be civil........

I'm still waiting for an answer to my "civil" question.............

[boxcar]

.

Edited your post I see.....simple questions asked in a civil manner are always welcome.
As we have another forum for this type of 'discussion' it should have been posted there.
Not difficult.
:rolleyes:

Am in full agreement with you, wombat.

luckydog: None. I never get caught up in any of the bizarre, wild, crazy theories out here. Am in the habit of thinking for myself & not allowing anyone to sway me from facts. I stick to the facts & stand behind everything I wrote in this thread, sir. All of my questions as well as comments are based on well-documented evidence. 'Nuff said. Am out of this thread now. Make of me what you will.
.

[luckydog]

.


Am in full agreement with you, wombat.

luckydog: None. I never get caught up in any of the bizarre, wild, crazy theories out here. Am in the habit of thinking for myself & not allowing anyone to sway me from facts. I stick to the facts & stand behind everything I wrote in this thread, sir. All of my questions as well as comments are based on well-documented evidence. 'Nuff said. Am out of this thread now. Make of me what you will.
.

You contradict yourself.

[cheezyflier]

.
Thanks, cheezyflier. My response is the Manhatten Project, over 130,000 people worked on the project... & it never leaked.



my pop-pop worked on it. he was an electrical engineer. there are 3 important reasons why the comparison doesn't work.

1) 99% of the people working on that project didn't know what they were working on until after the war.
each part of it was highly compartmentalized for obvious security reasons. the many people who would have to have been involved in 9/11 would have direct knowledge of what they did probably while they were doing it, but certainly by the time of the event.

2) that project was for a wartime effort with a clear, easily defineable polarity between right and wrong, or good and evil, if you will. a sense of patriotism would have been sufficient to keep most people quiet, because they were working to save american lives. (as well as the lives of others around the world) that can't be said of a 9/11 conspiracy.
also, during the time of ww2, people were routinely coached about keeping things quiet with posters and slogans such as "loose lips sink ships". that's not the case now.

3) communication, and technology being what they were at that time combined to nurture a more innocent john q public. another thing to offer perspective is, at the time of the manhattan project, america did not even have it's interstate hiway system, and there were still alot of dirt roads in america, where it was alot less unusual to see someone riding a horse and wasn't amish. today people move and comunicate with far greater speed and at far less cost. it's a helluva lot harder to keep a secret now than it was in the late 30's/early 40's.

[jmig]

I am occasionally brought into an emissions maintenance issue as a consulting engineer, when maintenance and troubleshooting techniques don't work. As Snuffy and other engineers can tell you, we are taught to look for the Root Cause of a problem. In layman's language this is known as KISS, Keep It Simple Stupid. Philosophers call it Occam's Razor. I subscribe to these techniques. When in doubt, look for the simple solution.

We humans want to make things far more complex than it need be. I think it somehow makes us feel special? This is saddly true in tragic events. I am old enough to remember JFK's death and the conspiracy theories that followed. I can remember people of my parents generation talking in hush, hush, how they heard that FDR KNEW the Japanese were going to attack Pearl Harbor in Dec. 7th and did nothing about it. This was spoken in the same unspoken, "He wanted the war" that I have heard about GWB and 911.

To even out the political tabletop, I also recall hearing my friends talking about Bill Clinton and the Great World Order. As if he was part of a few select people who were controlling the world secretly. Then there is my dear departed demented Aunt who KNEW the CIA and FBI were following her and using UFO's to keep track of her goings and comings...to the store and beauty parlor, I guess.

The trouble I have with conspiracy theories is that they give too much credit to mere humans to see and maneuver complex timings, events, people, and nature. In other words they violate the KISS and Occam Razor methods of looking at things. I am not saying that any or all of these theories, including my Aunt's, aren't true. I just know that is it awful easy to make facts fit a predetermined answer than to develop an answer from seemly unrelated facts.

[Ken Stallings]

Oh boy! I can't wait for what's on the way - :pop4:

Nothing should be said in reply to that post, and I will say nothing in reply.

And no, I firmly believe this thread should remain firmly open -- banned from closing down. That's merely so the member who posted the remarks can understand how little credence his words are given.

Cheers,

Ken

[Ken Stallings]

The Manhattan Project was leaked!

There was a Soviet mole with access to the project and this is why Joe Stalin was not surprised when Harry Truman advised him of the successful bomb test while he was attending the Potsdam Conference. Truman remarked immediately to his aides that Stalin knew ahead of time.

Years later, that suspicion was confirmed.

Ken

[djscoo]

Nothing should be said in reply to that post, and I will say nothing in reply.

And no, I firmly believe this thread should remain firmly open -- banned from closing down. That's merely so the member who posted the remarks can understand how little credence his words are given.

Cheers,

Ken
By posting this, you have said something in reply, and the message is loud and clear.

Please speak for yourself, sir.

[Ken Stallings]

I did -- thank you for noticing!

[Panther_99FS]

Tic, tic, tic.....

[Henry]

Tic, tic, tic.....
yup i wonder who's stop watch we use:icon_lol:
getting a little political and personal
arnt we fellas:pop4:
H

[redriver6]

:wavey:http://www.debunking911.com/index.html (http://www.debunking911.com/index.html):wavey:

[luckydog]

http://www.conspiracytheories.us/

compartmentalization ?? :isadizzy::isadizzy:

There's a domino effect with theories in as much as soon as you knock one down the rest tend to follow. For the U.S. to organize such a ridiculously complicated plan where so many things could have gone wrong would surely have meant co-operation with the very people we are at war with now. So many cover-ups it would only be a matter of time before at least some were uncovered. It would need the help and support of way too many people and organizations.

[tigisfat]

I agree that times have changed regarding to secrets. While transporting the U-2 prototype to Nevada, Ben Rich's transport crew had a HUGE rig that nicked a greyhound bus. Lockheed bigwigs on the scene immediately pulled the bus driver aside and counseled him. They told him that it was a matter of national security that noone know anything about the events of the night. Lockheed payed for the damages on the spot and we never heard any more about it. If that were to happen today, the bus driver would've taken the money and then started hiring folks to arrange book and interview deals. I don't know if I'm going to say there's no patriotism left, but there is no trust left in the government and politicians.

[Snuffy]

I can't say that I feel that anyone who voices conspiracy theroies are not patriotic. In their own odd way I suppose they are. They honestly feel that what they believe is for the betterment of their country, despite blaming their country.

But today's standards, of people telling all they know has really boiled down, not to a lack a patriotism as much as it is the basic greed of an individual. Everyone as their price now days, and the scandal sheet paying the most money will almost always get the story.

Society today also because of the leanings of the "right to know" group feel that everything that transpires in all aspects of life be it private, corporate, state, or federal, all this information needs to be processed and divulged. Whether its patriotism, or anti-patriotism I can't say, but one thing is for sure ... (and this is said alot in the contract employee business,) Money talks ... B.S. walks.

[luckydog]

Personally, I believe that the Illuminati are responsible for 9/11.
The attack was part of an evil MIND CONTROL PLOT to implant the number "11"
into the minds of Americans.........
The plot started years ago with the establishment of 7-11's ( owned and operated by the Illuminati )

The towers looked like one giant 11
The day of the attack: 11
The Date of the Attack, September 11 or 9/11 = 9 + 1 + 1 = 11
911 is emergency number = 9 + 1 + 1 = 11
September 11th is the 254th day of the year: 2 + 5 + 4 = 11
After September 11th we have 111 remaining for the end of the year.
119 is the Area Code for Iran & Iraq 1 + 1+ 9 = 11
The first plane to hit one of the buildings was Flight 11
The State of New York was the 11th State to join the Union
New York City = 11 letters
Afghanistan = 11 letters
The Pentagon = 11 letters
Flight 11 had 92 passengers, 9 + 2 = 11
Flight 77 had 65 passengers, 6 + 5 = 11
Twin Towers had 110 floors


This number planting will eventually lead to the creation of an Illuminati army of zombie minions who will rid the world of its EVIL ways.

[tigisfat]

This number planting will eventually lead to the creation of an Illuminati army of zombie minions who will rid the world of its EVIL ways.




Oh my god, you've opened my eyes!!:pop4:

[Piglet]

The very people who often claim the gov't can't do ANYTHING right, or properly, will also credit the gov't with getting away with the most complex, long lasting, outragous conspiericies even imagined...

[Z-claudius24]

Hi,


The very people who often claim the gov't can't do ANYTHING right, or properly, will also credit the gov't with getting away with the most complex, long lasting, outragous conspiericies even imagined... Do you honestly think that the US Governement make things better right or properly concerning the 9-11 ?
Have you readed the report of the inquiry commision ?
It's some recommandations there about the governement actions before the day, this day and the following days.
BTW .. many members of this inquiry panel tell today they worked not free and finally this report is not a master piece of truth ....
Maybe many people ask questions cause the US Governement not acted properly this day and after.

[luckydog]

Hi,

Do you honestly think that the US Governement make things better right or properly concerning the 9-11 ?
Have you readed the report of the inquiry commision ?
It's some recommandations there about the governement actions before the day, this day and the following days.
BTW .. many members of this inquiry panel tell today they worked not free and finally this report is not a master piece of truth ....
Maybe many people ask questions cause the US Governement not acted properly this day and after.



I think we can all agree you'd have to be some kind of idiot to think that 9/11 had anything to do with Al Qaeda.

[tigisfat]

I think we can all agree you'd have to be some kind of idiot to think that 9/11 had anything to do with Al Qaeda.


Exactly. All the videos of them celebrating were only because they knew we had worked so hard on this conspiracy.:salute:

[Z-claudius24]

Hi,

I wrote


http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/../images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by claudius24 http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/../images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/../showthread.php?p=370382#post370382)
Hi,

Do you honestly think that the US Governement make things better right or properly concerning the 9-11 ?
Have you readed the report of the inquiry commision ?
It's some recommandations there about the governement actions before the day, this day and the following days.
BTW .. many members of this inquiry panel tell today they worked not free and finally this report is not a master piece of truth ....
Maybe many people ask questions cause the US Governement not acted properly this day and after.
The answer ...



http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/../images/misc/quote_icon.png Originally Posted by luckydog http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/../images/buttons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforums/../showthread.php?p=370412#post370412)
I think we can all agree you'd have to be some kind of idiot to think that 9/11 had anything to do with Al Qaeda.
What is as to do with the lack of competence and no right actions from the US Governement (the subject of my message) ?

Back on the original subject
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K-XjX00UHkk&feature=player_embedded

[viking3]

I don't have any theories about that day, only questions that have not been answered by any of the official reports. My first reaction is like a reporter, to follow the money trail. Who had the most to gain by the events of that day.:kilroy: The other fact I keep in mind is that things are not always what they seem, powers that be have ways of advancing their agendas and us peons are led around by our noses to believe whatever they tell us. This is not to say there is some nefarious conspiracy afoot, but events like JFK's assasination and the Iran Contra Affair show us that we are usually the last to know what our governments are doing. I don't believe the official story, but whether it was to cover mistakes or to cover a conspiracy I don't pretend to know.

Regards, Rob:ernae:

[jmig]

Luckydog and to a lesser degree tigisfat, you guys are coming awful close to crossing the line on personal insults. I am not saying you called claudius24 an idiot. However, form his return post, I think he took it that way. By quoting him before using the word, "idiot", it sure looks like you called him an idiot. That is not acceptable in the Newshawks.

I find it interesting that many of the same people who believe that George W Bush is dumber than a rock and, the most incompetent leader since Nero burnt Rome to the ground, also believe that he somehow killed thousands of his own citizens for what?
1. Start a war to do what Papa George didn't finish?
2. Get fat oil contracts for his buddies?

Number one could have been done in any number of easier and cheaper ways. Number two was a failure. We never got all this cheap oil it was claimed we were after. I guess you could say "Halliburton"? However, what they made from Iraq was only part of their international global affairs. Halliburton was a rich company before and after the war. A few hundred million in profits more for them is hardly something to start a war over.

claudius, I think what happened after 911 is a different color horse than 911 itself. I a lot of what happened was knee-jerk reactions that are typical of governments. President Bush made a comment shortly afterward that if this country allowed the fear to cause us to curtail our freedoms, then Al Qaeda would have won. In some ways, especially when I think TSA, they have won.

[djscoo]

Luckydog and to a lesser degree tigisfat, you guys are coming awful close to crossing the line on personal insults. I am not saying you called claudius24 an idiot. However, form his return post, I think he took it that way. By quoting him before using the word, "idiot", it sure looks like you called him an idiot. That is not acceptable in the Newshawks.

I find it interesting that many of the same people who believe that George W Bush is dumber than a rock and, the most incompetent leader since Nero burnt Rome to the ground, also believe that he somehow killed thousands of his own citizens for what?
1. Start a war to do what Papa George didn't finish?
2. Get fat oil contracts for his buddies?

Number one could have been done in any number of easier and cheaper ways. Number two was a failure. We never got all this cheap oil it was claimed we were after. I guess you could say "Halliburton"? However, what they made from Iraq was only part of their international global affairs. Halliburton was a rich company before and after the war. A few hundred million in profits more for them is hardly something to start a war over.

claudius, I think what happened after 911 is a different color horse than 911 itself. I a lot of what happened was knee-jerk reactions that are typical of governments. President Bush made a comment shortly afterward that if this country allowed the fear to cause us to curtail our freedoms, then Al Qaeda would have won. In some ways, especially when I think TSA, they have won.

This is probably getting too political, but...

It isn't the oil, it is the war itself. A perpetual war will benefit not only government contractors, but the governing body itself. A population that views itself as under threat (at war) is less likely to question the actions of their government.

My opinion on the matter is that the United States government has a history of not being "up front" with the general population (see Gulf of Tonkin, Vietnam War). There are too many incongruencies between the actions perpetrated against our country and the subsequent reactions of our leaders for me to not be suspicious.

[luckydog]

I was calling MYSELF an idiot for thinking Al Qeada had anything to do with 9/11. Can't see how that could be interpreted any other way......:isadizzy:

[Snuffy]

I think LD you can find the answer in one or two verses in the following video ...

qeMFqkcPYcg

[Ken Stallings]

The very people who often claim the gov't can't do ANYTHING right, or properly, will also credit the gov't with getting away with the most complex, long lasting, outragous conspiericies even imagined...

Isn't that so true!

And among the many layers of issues I have with the conspiracies, that's a very central one. The logical disconnect you've illustrated is simply hard to refute.

Ken

[Ken Stallings]

A perpetual war will benefit not only government contractors, but the governing body itself. A population that views itself as under threat (at war) is less likely to question the actions of their government.

I am currently a government contractor. I will avoid stating my review of your words. However, I will firmly tell you that I would very gladly trade my job tomorrow for an immediate, or even short term, victory for the United States and her allies in this war against terrorism.

When you see so many innocent people slaughtered by the terrorists we work to defeat, you realize how individually insignificant your job truly is. Further, you perform your job with the best of your ability simply because it might help keep innocent people alive.

If this means nothing to you, and if you really think we contractors are evil people, then there isn't much more I can say to you except that I sincerely hope soon you begin to understand the true implications of your statements and that there are human faces behind the apparent inanimate nature of the organizations it seems you have such deep-seated concerns with.

Cheers,

Ken

[Rami]

Hey all,

The content in this thread is teetering on the edge of the abyss...tick...tick...tick

[Ken Stallings]

Hey all,

The content in this thread is teetering on the edge of the abyss...tick...tick...tick

True, but I think only because there are a few who are trying to ensure it does!

Cheers,

Ken

[djscoo]

...If this means nothing to you, and if you really think we contractors are evil people,...


Without knowing the specifics of your job, I don't think any employee of a defense contractor is necessarily evil by proxy. I think that you are just making a living doing what you know how to do, you have a family to feed.

[Ken Stallings]

Without knowing the specifics of your job, I don't think any employee of a defense contractor is necessarily evil by proxy. I think that you are just making a living doing what you know how to do, you have a family to feed.

True.

But what I am really hoping you can appreciate is that there is a lot more to my daily job than simply bringing home the bacon to my wife and two sons. In fact, there's a lot more to it.

I train pilots (and by association other aircrew) who within days of leaving my teaching, will be flying combat missions over Afghanistan and Iraq. What they then do is more than actions that can mean the difference between success or failure on a mission, but also literally mean the difference between our guys and gals coming home walking off the airplane vice being carried out in a box!

What I am really trying to get you to see is that there are men and women who live by honest principles who understand first hand the stakes of this war and realize that we have one chance to get this right, or millions of innocent people can suffer a terrible outcome to their lives.

Therefore, since we realize this, we aren't in this for the money half as much as we are in it because we think the United States is a great nation which deserves to be defended from evil. The people whom I work with in Lockheed Martin routinely work more hours than we log -- not because we are cheap, but because we believe it's more important to do a quality job than be a "clock watcher."

All I am saying is to remember that there are faces of normal Americans behind the corporations that it sometimes becomes popular to beat up. Until you have first-hand knowledge of a situation, be very reticent to sweep an industry, an aircraft test and development program, and a way of life with a negative broad brush.

Lastly, it is this understanding that makes me bridle with outrage at all the conspiracy theories about 9-11 because for this supposed conspiracy to have been carried out, it required thousands of people whom I work with daily to have been complete idiots or complicit agents for such a conspiracy to be carried out. Some of the stuff I have heard bandied about is simply beyond foolish -- it is frankly mean and insulting to so many good people who work hard every day to protect and defend this nation against some truly evil people who mean absolute and total malice to our way of life.

Cheers,

Ken

[Z-claudius24]

Hi,


Lastly, it is this understanding that makes me bridle with outrage at all the conspiracy theories about 9-11 because for this supposed conspiracy to have been carried out, it required thousands of people whom I work with daily to have been complete idiots or complicit agents for such a conspiracy to be carried outRGR that !
The best is that Al Queda was able to make the same conspiracy with a lot lot less people :) and carried out with great succes the whole operation.
So ... it's not strange than some people (a lot in fact) believe others than Al Queda or others with the complicity of the very competent Al Queda (or the inverse) carried out those attacks ?
The germans were very competent in WW2 for carry commandos operations .. pratically suicidal missions.. (Skorzeny .. etc) but never have the competency level shows by the Al Queda group.
Also it's not to forget .. Al Queda was already know as a dangerous group and was under high scrutinity of many US and foreign security offices ...
So .. in regard of this .. their succes is amazing .. exeptionnal .. or incredible for some people ...
Cave men (Ref .. the famous Afghanistan caves of Ben Laden .. who were just dig holes .. ) .. with incredible knowledge and skill :)

[hey_moe]

This thread is closed before another war is started.