B-17 Sighting!

[PRB]

Was out mowing the grass. Saw large plane from corner of my eye, looked up... B-17G at low altitude. Woooo!! Aluminum finish with blue and yellow chevron marking under the left wing. Turned off mower to listen to magnificent music from four radials. Dang that's good stuff!

[Trans_23]

I got a great look of a B-24 flying low over I-294 last year on my way up to Wisconsin. I have no idea where he was going to or headed from but it was only a couple thousand feet AGL.

[Wittpilot]

Paul,

Judging by your info on the left there, (KSUS) you saw Liberty Belle today... They are at Spirit of St. Louis Airport giving rides all this weekend... If you get a chance to head out that way, do yourself a favor and check her out... And if you want to treat yourself to something nice, buy yourself a ticket to a ride of a lifetime.... If not, then just show up and watch her fly... Nothing in the world like hearing a B-17 fly over....

-witt

Also, We will be in Indy on the weekend of the 4th, and then we will be in Columbus the following weekend... Hopefully I will be there most of the time they are giving rides on teh 11th & 12th in Cbus.... Please come out and see us!

[PRB]

Witt!! I owe you one, buddy! It was indeed Liberty Belle. By the time I got there, the ship was in flight, the last for today. But (but) I got me a seat for tomorrow, 12:45, 12:15 mission brief! Whoohoo!

[Wittpilot]

Paul,
That is fantastic to hear... Looks like the weather was great today! I can promise you you will have the ride of a lifetime if you have never flown in one before... I think that sets the Liberty Belle apart from other B-17's offering rides, is the crew... Every comment that I have recieved or heard, is about the crew...I don't know who is flying this weekend, only next weekend...but they are all real top-notch guys...

Make sure you take a lot of pictures... I always tell people no matter how many you take, you always regret not taking more...

-witt

[Curtis P40]

You do realize that's it going to take 6 or 7 days to get that Big Grin off your face.
Have fun.. the nose is a blast.
Curt:kilroy:

[dcc]

that look slike tons of fun, Paul. Looking forward to seeing pictures from the flight. Wish I could get you my portable digital audio recorder to take along.

- dcc

[PRB]

Two things that struck me about that B-17: 1) The flight deck is tiny!! Every time I see the inside of one of these I marvel at how small it really is in there, and wonder what it must have been like at 25,000 feet dodging FW-190s from that tiny flight deck. The center post of the windshield can’t be much more than six inches high. If you play FS on a 42 inch wide monitor, your FS B-17 cockpit is probably bigger than the real one! And 2) the inside of that plane, especially the flight deck, is spotless and shiny. It looks like new. Awesome. My crappy photos don’t do it justice. My camera holds about 200 pics with the extra memory stick. I dumped all the files just now to make room… Dcc, rgr on the sound recording – that would be cool. As she was coming back to the airport, the first sound you pick up is a very “bassy” rumble. There was very little activity at the airport when it landed, so it was very quiet, so we got the full sound treatment as it flew over, circled, and then landed. The sound of the tires screeching as the mains touched was quite loud. Very cool.

[Willy]

I'll never get the chance to fly in a Stratoliner, but a B-17 would be close enough ;).

Get plenty of good pics for us P!

[Lionheart]

They are awesome birds....

You are blessed Paul! Have fun up there.


I am sure there are ointments and medications that will get that grin off your face if its stuck for too long.. I think the Chinese have some good Accupuncture techniques that help that area...

:d

<-- picture from Kung Fu Panda, during accupuncture, mishap and found main facial nerve cluster

[Mithrin]

Have fun man, that's going to be a great experience! :D

[Bomber_12th]

Paul, I'm looking forward to your report back from your flight tomorrow! I'd imagine that it will be hard for you to sleep at all tonight! :) I just happened to see it in my neck of the woods a couple of weeks back, when it was in St. Paul, but unfortunately never got photos of it.

I too have been surprised in recent years, as to how scaled down the actual cockpits are of these warbirds when you see them, as compared to how they look in the sim. I was able to poke my head into the cockpit of a Mustang last summer for a while, and it indeed looked tiny after spending nearly a year focused on enlarged photos and building it for the sim.

[Snuffy]

I envy you PRB ... something I've always wanted to do ...

Congrats Man. Enjoy your day tomorrow ...

OH! Take a camera and you know ... take some internal flying pictures for us.

Thanks PRB!

:ernae:

[stansdds]

I've flown in two WW II era bombers, a B-17G and a B-25J. Both were great experiences that I doubt I'll ever forget. To anyone who has to opportunity to go up in a classic aircraft I say "go!" You won't regret it and one day the opportunity may no longer be available.

[Wittpilot]

the inside of that plane, especially the flight deck, is spotless and shiny. It looks like new. Awesome. My crappy photos don’t do it justice.



You have to remember Paul, people consider this the 'newest' B-17 out there... It's restoration was finished in '04... I remember the weekend I had my first ride she had just 100 hours on the airframe...

-witt


Waiting to see those pics when you get back!!

[PRB]

And it's a beautiful day too! :jump:

[TomSteber]

I wonder if he got any sleep?

[Quicksand]

It's doubtful. Some guys have all the luck!....:icon_lol:

[Daveroo]

its 10:12pst....he should be done wiff his flight?....waiting impatienly.......:bump:

[Snuffy]

3:55 pm EST here ... not a peep ... c'mon! :bump:

[PRB]

Ok, that was fun. I was worried that there would be a fight to get to the flight deck and nose section, but, amazingly, most of the people were content to ride in the back. Me and this one other guy easily got the two flight deck seats on take off. Then we went down into the nose section, spent a little time there, to give the rest a chance. Before the flight was over, nobody was interested in the nose section anymore, so we went back up there. I spent most of the flight standing behind either the pilot or co-pilot. It was as awesome as awesome gets. The air was bumpy too, so much so that one young lad got sick, poor guy. But I was having a BLAST!!! There was air blasting back from the open windows up front, the ship rocking back and forth, up and down. Had to hold on to something to keep balance most of the time. DAMN THAT WAS FUN!!

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1703.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1704.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1705.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1706.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1708.jpg

[PRB]

More pics:

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1709.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1712.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1713.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1714.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1715.jpg

[Lateral-G]

It's been flying over my house since this morning. Very low, probably around 2500' AGL (need to keep under the TCA since KSUS is not far from Lambert. That way they can stay VFR.

I'll try to get some inflight shots if I can.

-G-

[Willy]

Looks like you'll be months getting that grin off of your face Paul! :ernae:

[Curtis P40]

:applause:Looks like you had a beautiful day for a flight. Nice pictures from the flight deck. I forgot to mention to take a picture of the pilots from the sexton blister in the nose but I see that you found that out. Good show!! Now when your watching those old World War Two movies/documentary's you can say, " I've flown on one of those."
Curt

[Wittpilot]

Glad you had a great time Paul... It really is a blast... I can't tell who the crew was in that picture, but I'm sure they did a heck of a job... It is hard to tell yourself to give other people a chance in the nose, I've had to go down there and cycle through some reporters who wanted to stay down there the whole time on a media flight...

[TomSteber]

Great shots! Great looking day too. I agree with Curt, now you'll be able to say "I flew in one of those". Just make sure to say it real nonchalant and then yawn.

[PRB]

... I can't tell who the crew was in that picture, but I'm sure they did a heck of a job...

I spoke with the pilots briefly before take off and they introduced themselves as "John and John". The pilot looked quite young. The flight engineer was a retired TWA mechanic. It was so cool watching them fly the Fortress. I tried to watch how hard they were working, and how much control input was needed to bank the plane. Heck, they didn't look like they were working very hard at all. Just flying a B-17, that's all! I'd have been happy to stay right there the whole flight, but I went back aft and up forward to get the whole experience. It was fun walking along that narrow beam in the bomb bay to get to the radio room! The two seats on the flight deck behind the pilots face backwards, but as soon as the wheels left the runway, the flight engineer told us to "get up" meaning we were "free to move about the aircraft." So I stood up and turned forward to starting getting flight deck shots.

[PRB]

... Looks like you had a beautiful day for a flight. Nice pictures from the flight deck. I forgot to mention to take a picture of the pilots from the sexton blister in the nose but I see that you found that out. Good show!! Now when your watching those old World War Two movies/documentary's you can say, " I've flown on one of those."
Curt

Yep, it was only by accident that I got that cool shot through the navigotor's dome looking at the pilots. I was in there looking around and saw it. At first I took a shot through there looking forward, but it was all scratched up and full of dead bugs so it wasn't no good. Only then did I think to face aft... It was a beautiful day today too. Yesterday was 98 and humid as heck. Today was just perfect.

[PRB]

Here a couple more. One because I think it's funny with that dude hanging out the top window, and the others because they show the pilots better, so maybe Witt can ID them!

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1716.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1717.jpg

http://www.prbsystems.com/pics/b1718.jpg

[tigisfat]

Thank you so very much. I've had a magical experience with a B-17 lately, but it was down for maintenance otherwise I would've bought a ride. What a beautiful thing to see. Call me crazy, but my heart lept as I looked at these.

http://i595.photobucket.com/albums/tt32/walkeramerican/forum%20commentary%20pictures/1227958008915.jpg

[Wittpilot]

There are actually at least 2 or 3 pilots in Belle's rotation by the name of John believe it or not... I would wager a guess that the gentleman in the left seat was John Hess...

Like I said they are all great guys and pretty down to earth.... as is Mr. Don Brooks himself.

Check out this youtube link with an interview with Ray Fowler, the Belle's chief pilot. The interview is done by the daughter of the man who produced the future documentary about Liberty Belle's trip to the U.K.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hqoj537pqw

[Wittpilot]

Scratch that Paul, the guy in the left seat is not Mr. Hess, I believe that is John Shuttleworth, from somewhere in the midwest I believe.... Indiana possibly... I do not know the fellow in the right seat.

[Gdavis101]

Awesome man! Thanks for sharing the pictures... :applause::applause:

[Quicksand]

Beautiful shots, Paul. Thanks for sharing your experience with us. Awesome ride, I am quite certain....:medals::applause:

[N2056]

What an awesome adventure! :jump:
Thanks for sharing the pics. I really like the one taken from the dome looking back at the windshield :ernae:

[Trans_23]

Beautiful shots Paul. I had a chance to ride in a B-17 many years ago when one was at O'Hare for Armed Forces day. It is an opportunity I won't pass up again. Somewhere I have photos of my older kids gripping the machine guns in that plane.

[dcc]

fantastic Paul! Thanks for shaing the pics. What ride of a lifetime. :jump:

(I'd like to discuss your impressions of the sounds some more with you sometime)

- dcc

[PRB]

fantastic Paul! Thanks for shaing the pics. What ride of a lifetime. :jump:

(I'd like to discuss your impressions of the sounds some more with you sometime)

- dcc

Rgr that David...

I do have one question for the B-17 experts here. As we were taxiing, there was, from time to time, a rather loud noise. It sounded to me like something being mechanically driven at high RPM. Rather like the flap deployment noise you can sometimes hear on airliners. Naturally I thought it was the flaps, but every time I heard that noise I would look at the flap position gauge, and it never left zero. I asked the flight engineer what it was, and he pointed to a green tank on the rear bulkhead, right side, near the floor, and said it was hydraulics, which powers the flaps, and a couple other things. So now I’m confused. According to the flap position indicator gauge, the flaps were never deployed. At least I think I was looking at the flap position gauge. It said “flaps” on it and had “0”, “20”, “30”, “40” etc., so what the heck else could it have been?

[N2056]

Possibly a pump that cycled to maintain hydraulic pressure?

[Willy]

A pump cycling would be my best guess too...

[PRB]

Yep, that makes sense to me too!

[dcc]

that'd be my guess as well, probably keeping hydraulic accumulators pressurized. That'd be another fun thing to add to the FS soundscape.

- dcc

[Moses03]

Very cool Paul. Looks like you had a blast! :applause:

[Snuffy]

Excellent Paul!

Thanks for sharing your experience ...

One day maybe I'll get my turn ... :kilroy:

[Wittpilot]

My sources(:wiggle:) tell me... that you would be correct....hydraulic accumulater.. It is an interesting sound the first time you hear it... pretty loud if you can hear it over the roar of the engines...

[PRB]

Thanks, Witt! Actually I only heard it while taxiing, when the engines were at relatively low power settings. Plus, the device making the noise was pretty close at hand on the flight deck someplace, evidently. Or right below the floor boards. During taxi I didn't have my hearing protection headset on because it wasn't that loud, and this pump noise was quite distinct. While in flight, with the engines at flight power settings, and my hearing protection thingies on, I never did hear it. But maybe it only operates on the ground. It was pretty loud...

I found this in my B-17 pilot’s manual. The tank shown looks just the one the flight engineer pointed to when I asked about the noise.

[Wittpilot]

If you are looking aft from where you were sitting, which would have been straight forward the way you were sitting, it would have been just left of the door... I thought I had a picture of it somewhere but can't find it...

[Wittpilot]

Just as another heads up....Liberty Belle will be at Mt. Comfort just outside of Indianapolis through the week and this coming weekend for those of you in Indiana... Come out and see us..... Next stop, Columbus....

Anybody from the Indianapolis area around here? Can't remember any...

[PRB]

It must be fun traveling with that plane as it flies from city to city!

[Wittpilot]

Unfortunately I don't get the pleasure to do that Paul... other than an occaisonal jump from one city to the next when they are near by...Look for pictures in about a week....:wiggle:

[gera]

Hey Paul great pics of the flight.....is that the kid that got sick????, the one with the plugged ears??? were you sticking your head into the wind???...nice day.

[Wittpilot]

Paul, did you at least take your ear protection off at least once while up in the air? It is a great sound even inside... I don't think I have ever worn any protection myself... First time I flew back in '05, my dad told the guy taking us up to skip over my brother & I when passing out the ear plugs.....

:icon_lol:

[PRB]

... my dad told the guy taking us up to skip over my brother & I when passing out the ear plugs... :icon_lol:

(See Note 1)

Note 1: :eek:

I guess that's ok for short periods of time...

Actually I did remove them for a bit, while up front, just to see how loud it was. It was loud. :d My hearing is FUBAR'd due to spending way too much time around navy jets over the years, without hearing protection (see Note 1) so I try to protect what I have left... I don't think the hearing protection altered the experience that much. There was still the immense power that was felt as much as heard. The sound comes through the airframe in the form of vibrations, and the protectors just turned the volume down a bit. I could still very clearly hear the deep bassy "note" of those four engines, and it was quite impressive indeed!

On a related note, between the Wings of Power B-17 and the Donationware version by Gramps and Co., I thing Gramps got the sound closer. At high power, the Donationware sound is almost dead on perfect. At low power I think neither properly captures the "machanical component" of the sound.