Alpha Sim SkyRaiders..a prop question

[OBIO]

For those who have flown or flown in a real prop plane...a question. But first the background behind this question.

On the hunt for a decent freeware Skyraider, I found that there are 2 available. The one by Ed Wilson and the ones by Alpha Sim (A1-J, A1-H, AD-4). The Ed Wilson Sky Raider works fine in FS2004, with everything showing as it should...but the external model is a bit rough around the edges. The Alpha Sim Sky Raiders are older models, for CFS2 and FS2002. Externally, they look great..very sharp modeling, very crisp skins, very paintable....but, the prop does not show.

Okay, now the prop question...after a bit more information of sorts. I read a review about a Cessna model (can't remember what model, who made it, or who wrote the review) and in that review he stated that the prop blur was too strong and that having flown that particular model of Cessna in real life for a number of years, the reviewer stated that the only time you could see the prop was when the sun was directly ahead of or behind you.

Okay, now the question..for real this time. Is the prop, when at flight RPMs, barely visible, is it mostly unseen except under certain light conditions?

The reason I ask is two fold...one, out of curiosity as I have never been in a plane (well, not since I was 3 or 4 and can't remember a darn thing abou the flight) and two, I have elected to use the older Alpha Sim Sky Raiders due to their better external appearances, easy of painting, and the fact that I can use those skins in CFS2 (where the prop on the plane does show up). Not having a prop blur is not a big issue, especially if the prop is rarely seen during flight anyhow.

OBIO

[Ferry_vO]

If you really want a good Skyraider, you might want to spend a few $$ on one of the two Razbam packs. You will get a lot of aircraft for a relatively cheap aircraft.

:)

[stansdds]

My experience in seeing props flying and from flying in prop driven aircraft is that you see a faint disc, but not the blurred blades that you see in movies, videos, or still photography. Those blurred blades are the result of shutter speed, the human eye (unless you can blink really, really fast) cannot see the blades, but you will see a faint disc. Lighting direction as well as viewing direction can amplify the visibility of the disc.

[modelr]

My experience is the same, in real life, the rotating prop disk is nearly invisible, except at idle, when the painted tips, (depending on lighting conditions, sun position,) are just barely visible. When watching flybys, the sun may make the disk visible for an instant or two, but that's it. From the cockpit, it's invisible, or maybe seen as a darker area on the scenery.

Prop blur as we know it in FS and movies, or pictures, is the result of camera shutter speed, taking still photos at high speed.

The same goes for my R/C models. I can only see the prop when the sun hits it properly.

[adhockey]

"...the human eye (unless you can blink really, really fast) cannot see the blades, but you will see a faint disc."

I was watching an MD500 flying parallel to the street we were driving down today. I could briefly see individual blades close to the hub, whereas mid-disk and the tips were a blur. I've seen this stopped-blade glimpse effect before, and I suspect this is caused by saccades my eyes are making while tracking the moving helo near the slower turning rate of the blades near the hub, producing a "telecine judder"-like effect similar to videotaping prop discs or your TV screen.

I'm no expert on eyesight, but it's a theory I have.

[EMatheson]

My experience in seeing props flying and from flying in prop driven aircraft is that you see a faint disc, but not the blurred blades that you see in movies, videos, or still photography. Those blurred blades are the result of shutter speed, the human eye (unless you can blink really, really fast) cannot see the blades, but you will see a faint disc. Lighting direction as well as viewing direction can amplify the visibility of the disc.
I am interested to hear you say that... I swear I can see the individual blades of the Natl. Guard Helicopters as they land at my local airport...

[robert41]

I flown on the EAA Ford Trimotor twice, the second time seated next to the right side engine. From the inside you can barely see any prop at idle or take off power. Just a hint of a disc spinning. I was surprised at how little difference the prop looks and engine sounds from idle to full power inside the plane. I was more impressed at the sides of the plane bulging out and feeling the outside air coming in when taking off. That second time, it was very windy and the flight was very rough, glad it was a short flight that day. Watching the aircraft on the ground however you can noticibly see the prop and hear the difference between idle and take off power! So for most prop planes in FS, I try to make the prop as least visible as possible, like the real thing.

[Milton Shupe]

I have two of the now freeware Alpha aircraft, one has a blurred prop with an alpha channel, one does not.

If it has an alpha channel of black, you can try changing the the alpha color to 60,60,60 RGB to see if it shows up.

If the bmp has no alpha, then the blurred prop material was made nearly transparent in the design program and needs no alpha. In this case, you probably will have to live with it. You can try to add an alpha channel and vary the color from say 200,200,200 down to 60,60,60 to see if it makes a difference.

[stansdds]

I am interested to hear you say that... I swear I can see the individual blades of the Natl. Guard Helicopters as they land at my local airport...
Aircraft props typically turn around 800-900 RPM at idle and over 2000 RPM during takeoff and 1500-2000 at cruise. Helicopter rotors, especially the larger helicopters, only make 200 to 400 RPM, so it is easier to see the blades on a helicopter rotor.