OT: Hollywood makes me crazy.

[spotlope]

Okay, here's a fun rant thread for ya. How many times have you been at the movies or watching a little telly, probably enjoying the show, when WHAM! some major aviation faux pas just kills it for you? I've learned to keep my mouth shut to my wife, 'cause she just rolls her eyes and calls me a plane geek, but come on -- how hard is it to hire an aviation consultant? Doesn't have to be an industry expert, most any of us 'simmers would do.

Case in point: Plane registrations. I've lost count of the times I've been watching a movie that's supposedly set in Kansas or Arizona, only to have the actors wind up at an airport that's populated with C-XXXX registered planes. Look, I know that a lot of movies get made in Canada, but at least stick on some vinyl N-numbers for the day, lol.

My pet peeve du jour is the opening sequence of the TV show "Burn Notice" (not sure if this is even seen outside the US). In the pilot episode, the main character gets blacklisted as a spy and has to high-tail it out of the country where he's operating at the last moment. There's the obligatory shot of him getting on a plane in some third-world country. It's a high-wing twin prop, sort of like a Dash-8. Then they cut to him taking off, and the dang thing has morphed into a DC-3, fer cripes sake! The only thing the two planes share in common is a red stripe! It was bad enough to have a gaff like that in the first show, but they included shots of both planes in the opening credits of every subsequent episode. Gaaaack!

I could go on, but you get the point. So how about it -- does this stuff get to you sometimes, too? Maybe I just need to :friday: more.

[Kiwikat]

Most TV shows with airplanes don't even show the same plane throughout the show. It is really bad when it comes to business jets. At the beginning they show a big extravagant Gulfstream taking off. Then they go inside it and its a Falcon interior. Finally the landing footage shows a cessna citation or learjet. Doesn't make too much sense, but anyone but us and real pilots wouldn't know the difference (or care).

By far the worst part is when news anchors have to talk about airplane stories. They always say some of the most retarded things. Even a minute in FS would save them from saying such stupid things let alone a minute in a real plane.

[SkippyBing]

It does occasionally annoy me, but then I read a thread somewhere else where they slated a version of 'The 39 Steps' because the train he abandons on the Yorkshire Moors or some such was only used by Great Western Railways and therefore would never have been seen further North than Bristol. After that I learnt to let go if only to avoid becoming a trainspotter!

Reference the news commentators, I'm starting to think if they appear to know f*** all about stuff I do know about, how bad are they on the stuff I don't know about?

[spotlope]

Oh, don't get me going about newscasters. My favorite lately was a commentary I heard recently about the Dash-8 crash in Buffalo, NY. "Sources report that it's possible one or both of the engines stalled," the bleach-blonde says with a furrowed brow. And I'm jumping up and down on the sofa yelling "stalls in aviation have nothing to do with the engines stopping!" And then I have to get a beer.

[kilo delta]

You mean that those black jets in Top Gun really weren't MiG-28's???? :faint::friday:

[Kiwikat]

You mean that those black jets in Top Gun really weren't MiG-28's???? :faint::friday:

I hope that doesn't ruin it for you LOL

Again, just another example of taking advantage of the general public's lack of knowledge (and in this case probably the unavailability of real migs to use). Another good example is in movies about pearl harbor... you gotta love all of those T-6's flying around. Though the number of flying Zeros is probably closer to 3 than 300...

[kilo delta]

(and in this case probably the unavailability of real migs to use).

:D Hmmmm......back in '86 they had a whole squadron of them out in Tonopah ;P

Regarding dodgy aviation scenes in tv series.....it all comes down to budget, hence they use stock footage. For example.......how many times did Airwolf shoot down those same OH-6's? :) The average joe won't know the difference between a Cessna Citation and a Gulfstream anyhow..........least of all a Griffon engined Spitfire or a Merlin engined "Me-109" during a movie about the Battle of Britain.

[MudMarine]

God.....the list of aviation stupidity in Hollyweird movies is endless!

[Odie]

I remember watching one WW2 film in which Mustangs were painted as German fighters.......



Or, in the 70's when car chase scenes were a staple of every TV show, made-for-tv-movie, Hollywood movie and the cars would go down a hill but a different make of car would emerge in the next shot of it going over the next hill?

Chrysler turns into Chevy just by going up a hill !!

[MudMarine]

Oh, don't get me going about newscasters. My favorite lately was a commentary I heard recently about the Dash-8 crash in Buffalo, NY. "Sources report that it's possible one or both of the engines stalled," the bleach-blonde says with a furrowed brow. And I'm jumping up and down on the sofa yelling "stalls in aviation have nothing to do with the engines stopping!" And then I have to get a beer.

I live about 30mins from the crashsite. You think that's bad Spotlope! The first report I heard from the local Buffalo station went something like this: "There have been reports of a small plane crash. Initial sources are saying that it was a small Cessna aircraft. All three passengers on board have been reported fine and walked away from the crash." JEEEZ! Talk about heads up your arse! I looked at my wife and said that you don't often crash a plane in a housing area and walk away fine. Later reports proved unfortunately that the crash was much worse.....tragic.

[kilo delta]

Or, in the 70's when car chase scenes were a staple of every TV show, made-for-tv-movie, Hollywood movie and the cars would go down a hill but a different make of car would emerge in the next shot of it going over the next hill?

Chrysler turns into Chevy just by going up a hill !!

Plus they had an unending amount of hub caps destined to fly off........and speeding up narrow alley-ways included the obligitory "crash" through empty cardboard boxes :woot: :monkies: :focus: :)

[chinookmark]

I don't mind the technicalities so much. If it get's the story across, well I can handle a little suspension of reality. People get on a plane in LA, and get off one in NY, and only us aviation buff notice they got on a 737 and got off a 747. They got where they needed to go and the story goes on.

What chaps my rear end is when these faux pas make the story unbelievable. For instance the helicopter chase scene in Mission Impossible 3. Chasing each other through the windmills? Come on now. The gunship pilot would've just flown above the windmills and shot the Huey from there. Or that ridiculous Harrier scene in True Lies, and the final battle in Behind Enemy Lines, with the two Hueys hovering out in the open taking on the entire Serbian army. That stuff is what gets me.

[IanP]

...only used by Great Western Railways and therefore would never have been seen further North than Bristol.

Nope. You'll never make a trainspotter. ;)

I travel through the Great Western station in Birmingham every workday. They just pulled down the one in Wolverhampton for some new development that has since gone bust and will never happen. Back in Big 4 days, GWR included the LNWR. Still the wrong side of the country, but hey, MS put the Frying Scotsman on the (LNWR/LMS) West Coast Main Line Settle and Carlisle rather than the (LNER) East Coast Main Line. Bah, these Hollywood types. Game developers are just as bad. Why's that American Pacific DHC-8 sitting at Birmingham International (EGBB, not KBHM) eh?

</geek mode> :wave:

[n4gix]

Most TV shows with airplanes don't even show the same plane throughout the show. It is really bad when it comes to business jets. At the beginning they show a big extravagant Gulfstream taking off.

You brought up the very thing I was going to say... Even funnier are the ones that show the pax loading on a CJ1, then cut to a Gulfstream interior...

About the only way you can "walk down the aisle" in a CJ1 is on you knees! :gossip:

[Ferry_vO]

Very annoying sometimes! Texans have been used in almost every major war movie, including Tora,Tora,Tora and a bridge too far. The Hughes H-1 with the canopy disappearing in the clos-ups was annoying too, as was the scene were they are welding! the wooden spruce goose together..
Anybody noticed the use of 'runway 44' in 'Catch me if you can'..?
There's a scene in 'Rat race' where you see a Learjet from the outside, but once inside there's four rows of seats and at least twenty people aboard..

[Barvan40]

Some movies do much better. A Bridge Too Far was not bad, making an effort to use the correct vehicles and weapons, Band of Brothers was great with mostly correct hardware, scenery and tactics, as was Saving Private Ryan.

I don't know who advised the makers of Hogan's Heroes, but the uniforms were very well done. Even down to the NSDAP pins on the SS uniforms and the proper insignia, awards and decorations, helmets, dress hats, etc. Weapons were also mostly correct although the armored vehicles often were not, probably because they just were not readily available. Of course the plots were ridiculous, without much historical accuracy.

[mustang51]

How about when the news people say "it may have been ice on the tail wing". Never heard tires squeal on a gravel or sand road. I have a Z28 and never heard it, but then I don't do that with this car. On a gravel road that is.

[kilo delta]

....and ain't it amazing when a aircraft is diving it sounds like a Stuka dive bomber............doesn't matter whether it piston,turboprop, or jet powered :faint:

[mike_cyul]

As soon as any aircraft sequence comes on the television, my wife shoots me a look, rolls her eyes, and says "here we go..." :costumes:


Mike

[RudiJG1]

Boy, if you think all of this is bad, be grateful you aren't a birdwatcher like me...Hollywood puts certain species in the most unlikely places, and the calls of a red-tailed hawk and the common loon are THE movie-makers' most misused "natural" sounds.

[Kiwikat]

Boy, if you think all of this is bad, be grateful you aren't a birdwatcher like me...Hollywood puts certain species in the most unlikely places, and the calls of a red-tailed hawk and the common loon are THE movie-makers' most misused "natural" sounds.

...more specifically, red-tailed hawk screams when eagles are soaring ;)

The bald eagle sounds like a chicken. Not the big screaming bird hollywood makes it to be.

I'm a bird person too :d

[spotlope]

And here they were, thinking we didn't notice. ;) To fr. Bill's comment - yeah, I love it when they show an exterior of a Citation cruising through the clouds, then cut to an interior with room to stand up and put your arms over your head, seats six across.

[Naki]

As soon as any aircraft sequence comes on the television, my wife shoots me a look, rolls her eyes, and says "here we go..." :costumes:


Mike

Haha ditto

I always thought "Flight of the Intruder" was fairly accurate in the aircraft it depicted but my memory maybe fading as its been ages since I have seen it.

[Gdavis101]

I know what you mean, the same can be said about a lot of the cop shows on TV. Case and point, CSI Miami.

[Cazzie]

It's not just Hollyweird, the TV people are just a notorious, especially on golf coverage. One can hear birds that are not native to the course they are playing on, I have heard it more than once.

The peckerheads that run these ideas through the producer are just that, peckerheads!

Caz

[cheezyflier]

being a ductman, everytime i see someone climbing through the ductwork in a movie my wife and step kids tell me "don't say it"

because i ignore them, every single time, and point out all the things that would never be like that in real life. ever notice that the inside never has any screws or jagged edges? it's always shiny and clean? no dirt? the elbows never have turning vanes, or splitters? you never see motor operated dampers, spray humidifiers, smoke detectors, fire dampers, etc.

[MCDesigns]

and the final battle in Behind Enemy Lines, with the two Hueys hovering out in the open taking on the entire Serbian army. That stuff is what gets me.

But I love that scene, LOL :Banane09:

Yep, love heli scenes when they change choppers or use fake ones, like the fake Hind in Rambo

[spotlope]

being a ductman, everytime i see someone climbing through the ductwork in a movie my wife and step kids tell me "don't say it"

because i ignore them, every single time, and point out all the things that would never be like that in real life. ever notice that the inside never has any screws or jagged edges? it's always shiny and clean? no dirt? the elbows never have turning vanes, or splitters? you never see motor operated dampers, spray humidifiers, smoke detectors, fire dampers, etc.

I also enjoy how much room there is inside those ducts - and how each and every one can support the weight of several men and their battle gear. ;)

[kilo delta]

Almost forgot this one.......Executive Decision,

4Oeo-YbNAds

[PRB]

My most recent favorite was watching the NASA TV coverage of one of the Space Shuttle’s return to Earth. They do a good job, most of the time, so I was shocked to hear the narrator voice say: “Ok, the de-orbit burn was perfect, and entry interface will be in about 30 minutes; that’s when the Shuttle will begin to heat up as it begins to feel the effects of Earth’s gravity.”
<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
I thought maybe he just miss-spoke, and just swapped the word “atmosphere” with “gravity” in all the excitement. But as atmospheric entry interface came closer and closer, he said it again, twice!
<o:p></o:p>
I’ve watched three Shuttle returns now on NASA TV, and the narrator voice did not make that mistake again. Somebody must have smacked him upside the head with a science book or something.

[Navy Chief]

My wife and I were watching one of those "hate it when this happens" type show the other night. The particular segment was about a crash on a carrier.

The first shots were of a F-9 Panther hitting the round down. Then, as the pilot began ejection from his aircraft, it became a Tornado, and in the remaining shots, it turned into a Skyray. Amazing transformation. We need an aircraft to be able to do that!

NC

[chinookmark]

....and ain't it amazing when a aircraft is diving it sounds like a Stuka dive bomber............doesn't matter whether it piston,turboprop, or jet powered :faint:

And they always shake!

[chinookmark]

Almost forgot this one.......Executive Decision,

4Oeo-YbNAds

The F-117 was so top secret that we didn't even know it had a passenger compartment. Good thing they thought to put that upward extending transfer tube!

Speaking of bombs ... which wire do I cut on my alarm clock to make it count faster?

[stiz]

i hate the fact that every car that crashes goes up into a massive fireball, or the never ending clips, or the total disrecard for anything historical, o and i hate the fact they still use that tom cruise thing :kilroy: :monkies:

[Quixoticish]

Or that ridiculous Harrier scene in True Lies

I'm sorry but, taken in the context of the film I find it ridiculous that anyone can have a problem with it. It's a comedy for crying out loud, a million other things happen in it that would never happen in "real life". :rolleyes:

[cheezyflier]

Speaking of bombs ... which wire do I cut on my alarm clock to make it count faster?


the red one!!! no wait!! green! yes! no! hold on blue, im 47% sure it's the blue one!

[spotlope]

And why would any self-respecting bomb maker not just use all black wires? :gossip:

[IanP]

Which appalling film was it that had escape pods on Air Force One and where he landed it on a the airstrip he was learning to fly a Cessna from?

That was "Executive Decision" or something equally muppetous.

[Bjoern]

I'm very close to throwing up everytime I see that spanish abomniation of a 109 disguised as an "Emil" in a movie about WW2.

Or whatever tank depicting Tigers/Panthers or any other german tank.


But then again, it's all Hollywood. Shut off your brain and throw everything over board you know about warfare and aviation.


P.S: I've been told that the russian war opus "Liberation" seems to be very accurate in terms of equipment on both sides.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0151852/

[Bjoern]

Which appalling film was it that had escape pods on Air Force One

"Air Force One". LoL. :d

[spotlope]

Actually, I can forgive movie makers for their WWII transgressions where something like a 109 is concerned. Prior to the advent of high-grade CGI, I imagine it was damn near impossible to round up much in the way of original, accurate, flying stock. In a weird twist, now that computer-generated animation has reached such a high quality level we should start seeing more accurate depictions.

[stiz]

yea same here, after all the only things thats different between a 109 and a bouchon is the nose, i'd rather have them and spits dogfighting than some silly cgi where the planes can turn on a penny :engel016:

[JIMJAM]

A little OT but I hate those canned sound effects in those helicopter filmed car chases. Especially Americas police chases with Sheriff John Bunnell.
Tires screechng on every turn,5 mph,screech,on a dirt road,screech.All the while being Filmed from 1/2 mile away from a heli.They have like 3 crash sounds, boom ,bang,smash.
The same news reporter who can see from that distance in a shaky heli that the driver has a gun on his lap. And can magically know the guys personal bio,criminal background and intent all while on the fly.
Still I cannot take my eyes off a good car chase.

[Bjoern]

yea same here, after all the only things thats different between a 109 and a bouchon is the nose, i'd rather have them and spits dogfighting than some silly cgi where the planes can turn on a penny :engel016:

CGI over inaccurate real depictions. Tenfold!

[ericts]

My two 'pet peeve' movies involving aviation--these are the worst offenders out of many very bad Hollywood aviation disasters:

Die Hard II:
Widebody 707 (or 720) that is nearly empty of fuel, crashes when the terrists adjust the 'glideslope angle'. The aircraft explodes like a fully laden KC135 tanker--or like the NASA footage of the 720 crash at Edwards.

I also learned that a 747 uses a high-octane gasoline/rocket fuel mixture, as when our hero lights a stream of leaking fuel with his Zippo which causes the Jumbo, which has already taken flight, to explode like the Challenger.

I didn't realise that the C-123 was equipped with ejection seats.

Con Air:
Another type-mismatch between the interior (huge--almost C-5 sized) of the C-123 and the exterior.

We have a hostile aircraft approaching Las Vegas. I have an idea: let's scramble the SLOWEST and most obsolete aircraft available in the militairy's inventory to chase it.

There is a tunnel on the Las Vegas Strip?

[Cazzie]

God.....the list of aviation stupidity in Hollyweird movies is endless!


Mud et al, all I can say is consider the source. :icon_lol:

[stiz]

Mud et al, all I can say is consider the source. :icon_lol:

blimy whats this, the 1 year aniversary of the thread? :icon_lol:

a new one, anyone else notice that the corsairs in "the pacific" where dropping napalm with their gear down? :mixedsmi:

[Quixoticish]

blimy whats this, the 1 year aniversary of the thread? :icon_lol:

a new one, anyone else notice that the corsairs in "the pacific" where dropping napalm with their gear down? :mixedsmi:

I believe the F4U used to have the capability to partially extend its landing gear to use as dive brakes.

[peter12213]

Don't even get me started on this, has anyone seen Stealth, apparently G force does not exist in there world, such an appauling film among many other, and if I see just one more M47 Patton being shown as a German Tiger I'm going to blow my own brains out!

[Matt Wynn]

oh my pet peeve are weapons and equipment in movies... but yes Tanks do sometimes surprise you a bit, aircraft even worse can be watching a film, aircraft comes on screen i sit up and get told "Don't even think about it..." needless to say i continue "ok what year is this supposed to be set?...1940, then why are there FW190's? they didn't appear till 1941...", other things as well like round size in firearms... TV this happens, take mythbusters' James bond special, Kari has a S&W99, which resembles a Walther P99, it is called on the show "....Bonds gun.."
Bond Uses a P99, which on another note is not standard issue to British security services... but this S&W99 is chambered for .40S&W...errrr ok... call it bonds gun. (Bond carries a P99 chambered in 9mm)...

i think i need to stop noticing these things.... :monkies:

[An-225]

Eh, I don't see what's wrong with the P99. He wasn't strictly issued it - he acquired it in Tomorrow Never Dies, and his ageing PPK probably needed replacing anyway.

[Ferry_vO]

I'm very close to throwing up everytime I see that spanish abomniation of a 109 disguised as an "Emil" in a movie about WW2.

You'll be surprised how little real Messerschmitt 109's are still around; most are either rebuilt Buchons or Avia's.

;)


I believe the F4U used to have the capability to partially extend its landing gear to use as dive brakes.


Correct!

[Clarke123]

You can't beat Bruce Willis wrestling an F-35 to the ground :icon_lol:

[bushpilot]

Die Hard II:
Widebody 707 (or 720) that is nearly empty of fuel, crashes when the terrists adjust the 'glideslope angle'. The aircraft explodes like a fully laden KC135 tanker--or like the NASA footage of the 720 crash at Edwards.

I also learned that a 747 uses a high-octane gasoline/rocket fuel mixture, as when our hero lights a stream of leaking fuel with his Zippo which causes the Jumbo, which has already taken flight, to explode like the Challenger.

I didn't realise that the C-123 was equipped with ejection seats.




Die Hard 2: here's a movie that shows us, that you can take down the ATC of a major airport with the chainsaw (and mount your own ATC in near by church).

and almost every aviaton related scene in this movie is wrongwronwrong:salute::salute::salute:

[Snave]

blimy whats this, the 1 year aniversary of the thread? :icon_lol:

a new one, anyone else notice that the corsairs in "the pacific" where dropping napalm with their gear down? :mixedsmi:

Actually, that is a fine example of Hollywood exactitude, as you might expect from Messrs Hanks and Spielberg. On Peleleu the ridge that was the Japanese stronghold was less than thirty seconds flying from the airfield, so it made no sense to lift the gear when they'd be deplying it again less than two minutes later for landing and re-arming.

You can read confirmation of this: http://homepage.eircom.net/~frontacs/WBStored/F4UGearAsDivebrakes.html

Thereafter, the close drop pattern permitted by using napalm tanks dropped in this way permeated through the Marine Corps and the technique was used elsewhere...

So this is one time when getting it right mean they deserve apologies and praise rather than bitching and moaning.

Pedanticism aside, Hollywood seems to have very little aspiration toward technical accuracy in ANY flying scenes these days. Small errors and adjustments for availability are one thing (if there are no Messerschmitt 109's flying, then that's one of those `things`, but if you're going to commission a Messerschmitt CGI sequence, get the right make and models and liveries, fer crissakes!) but unforgivable errors crop up all the time - Our Hero boards a twin-engined jet, shortly thereafter find himself at the cockpit controls of something that clearly has four engines.

And totally agree with the earlier poster - these pulse-racing `through the canyons` dogfights are just total B*ll*x. The smart air-fighter would pull up, maintain contact with the target and swoop down for a `boom and zoom` when the target was forced to pull up and lose energy. Or simply shoot them down with a sidewinder from above.

It's the casual lethargy and laziness that really gets my goat. If they have to do it, do it RIGHT, the first time. It's no harder than doing it wrong and destroying any vestige of credibility. Library shots usually have the name and model of the aircraft, Simply ensure that you use the same make and model for ALL exterior shots and you don't even have to be an aviation expert to avoid the `boards high wing twin turboprop, leaves a low wing twin piston` syndrome.

[falcon409]

You can't beat Bruce Willis wrestling an F-35 to the ground :icon_lol:
Which, by the way was also referred to as a "Harrier" as well as a "Raptor". . .who knew? lol

[Clarke123]

Which, by the way was also referred to as a "Harrier" as well as a "Raptor". . .who knew? lol
Die Hard 5 "Look, shiny metal bird go shooty shooty at us" :icon_lol:

[Daveroo]

ok ..ive got to popoff here..

criminal minds..show a gulf stream outside shot and then some interitor thats bigger than my RV...

but my biggest peeve lately.(but a fav show) is the mentalist..its based in old town sacramento (the CBI office)but they can drive to places like reno/lake tahoe in 10 minutes..that one isnt so bad..its a 2 hr drive from sacto...BUT they once went from the CBI office to deathvalley in less than a "tv" hour...and then back to the office and back to the crime scene all in one day...cracks me up...oh and citrus hieghts..which is in the sacramento valley IE flat lands..was in the same mountains and valleys that the MASH show was filmed in...

[Bjoern]

You'll be surprised how little real Messerschmitt 109's are still around; most are either rebuilt Buchons or Avia's.

I know. But at least they got 'em back to a normal state (stock engine and front).

[Ferry_vO]

I know. But at least they got 'em back to a normal state (stock engine and front).

So you're saying a Buchon painted like a Messerschmitt is worse than a Buchon rebuilt to look like a Messerschmitt :ques: ;)

BTW Most Ju-52's and He-111's still around came from a Spanish factory too.. :wiggle:

[pilottj]

My wife turned me on to LOST, all in all a pretty good show but she told me I would have to bite my tongue during the aviation scenes. She was right lol. But it happens in many fields of expertise as well as aviation. My lady is a horse expert and she has to hold her tongue when she sees all the equestrian mistakes made in TV/Films.

I avoided seeing Pearl Harbor because I thought it made too many goofs (from the previews)considering the large budget it had and access to CGI. IMO Tora Tora Tora may be old but it is still the best Pearl Harbor film out there.

Cheers
TJ

[Quixoticish]

Which, by the way was also referred to as a "Harrier" as well as a "Raptor". . .who knew? lol

When was it called that in the film? I really can't recall...

[Quixoticish]

oh my pet peeve are weapons and equipment in movies... but yes Tanks do sometimes surprise you a bit, aircraft even worse can be watching a film, aircraft comes on screen i sit up and get told "Don't even think about it..." needless to say i continue "ok what year is this supposed to be set?...1940, then why are there FW190's? they didn't appear till 1941...", other things as well like round size in firearms... TV this happens, take mythbusters' James bond special, Kari has a S&W99, which resembles a Walther P99, it is called on the show "....Bonds gun.."
Bond Uses a P99, which on another note is not standard issue to British security services... but this S&W99 is chambered for .40S&W...errrr ok... call it bonds gun. (Bond carries a P99 chambered in 9mm)...

i think i need to stop noticing these things.... :monkies:

He uses a P99 up until the latest film (Quantum of Solace) when I noticed he was back using the staple PPK I think, which would be a bit of a continuity blooper as it's supposed to follow straight on from Casino Royale?

[Ken Stallings]

God.....the list of aviation stupidity in Hollyweird movies is endless!

Before the advent of computer graphics, there was a period of time that if you wanted to see authentic tanks and planes in a World War II movie you had to watch one made a few years after the war. Because at the time that the movie Midway was released, that was pretty much the end of the road for authentic vehicles.

Most movies then started using stuff from the Cold War or used T-6 Texans for everything from Kates to Zeros. If the movie called for a P-51 or a Corsair, you'd get that.

Unfortunately, now you get good looking c/g aircraft but they fly assinine tactics like we saw in that awful movie Pearl Harbor!

Ken

[anthony31]

My wife turned me on to LOST, all in all a pretty good show but she told me I would have to bite my tongue during the aviation scenes.

What about the final episode where the captain says he can only try to restart the engines of a commercial airliner one more time because he doesn't have enough battery power for another attempt?

Not to mention trying to takeoff said airliner on a sandy runway?

[Ken Stallings]

Here is a true factoid ...

How many of you have seen the movie "Air Force One?"

Remember the scene near the end when the 747 crashes into the ocean?

Well, originally the producer and director were going to have the 747 blow up as it crashed. However, they had a crew from my old squadron there (8 SOS) flying the MC-130E during the dramatic Fulton recovery operation that was filmed for the movie.

Anyway, the flight engineer on that crew, Frank Demchenko "Heavy D", was speaking with the director and when he heard the plan to have the 747 blow up, he mentioned that if the script said the 747 experienced a four engine flameout from fuel starvation that it wouldn't blow up. There would be no fuel in the tanks and likely not even fuel vapors in the lines. But even if there were vapors left, with the engines flammed out, for any length of time, it would be almost impossible for the vapors to ignite due to the extremely high flash point temperature of Jet-A fuel.

He rightly said the 747 would simply break up. The director listened and decided to change the entire scene! So, that's why you see the evil guy in the door whinning just before the jet crashes and tears itself up into small pieces in a rather spectacular destruction.

A 100% true story folks!

BTW: Our squadron got a lot of cool stuff from the producers, including a signed poster that included Harrison Ford's signature!

Ken

[PRB]

Remember “Pearl Harbor”? (Hehe, get it?) That was a dumb movie. Ok, it was a love story, not an aviation story, but dang. I loved the air combat tactics developed, on the tarmac as our two intrepid pilots were about to strap on their trusty Curtis mounts: “Ok, you go south, around the water tower, and draw them around the hangar. I'll go north and draw the other 200 Zeros around the buildings the other way. Then when we meet up, we both pull up, and all 400 Zeros will smash into each other!”

And my favorite is the 10 minutes scene of the bomb dropping from the plane, and hitting Arizona, to deliver the fatal hit that doomed the ship. The bomb falls forever, then bursts through the armored deck, rolls around the magazine for several seconds, long enough for a startled sailor to come around the corner, get a wide-eyes expression of horror on his face, exclaim “Oh My God … It's a BOMB!” before the things “goes off”. I lost it at that point. That was it.

[FAC257]

Just watched a fairly new movie a couple of days ago called "The Burning Plain", with Kim Bassinger and Charlize Theron. It's a great human story that I really liked and not an aviation flic.

An important element of the storyline involves a young man living in Mexico with his daughter who helps her dad run his small aerial crop dusting service. I was facinated by the fact that the aircraft was a Piper Cherokee set up with spray rigs. I've never seen one used for spraying. The flying scenes were brief but shot really well from great perspectives.

The blatant aviation blooper I didn't catch in my facination with the aircraft was that this Mexico based aircraft was flying back and forth the whole time with it's huge "N" registration number down the side. I read about the blooper afterwards reading info on the movie and some of the actors I didn't recognize.

FAC

[PRB]

I love it when our hero takes off from New York in a 727 for a non-stop flight to Los Angeles and lands in a 747. How do they do that? :icon_lol:

[burcham8]

All I can say is this...

If I have to watch an unreal aviation clip to see the real image of Gabrielle Anwar...well, so what the heck!?

Marc :jump:

[Ken Stallings]

Remember “Pearl Harbor”? (Hehe, get it?) That was a dumb movie. Ok, it was a love story, not an aviation story, but dang. I loved the air combat tactics developed, on the tarmac as our two intrepid pilots were about to strap on their trusty Curtis mounts: “Ok, you go south, around the water tower, and draw them around the hangar. I'll go north and draw the other 200 Zeros around the buildings the other way. Then when we meet up, we both pull up, and all 400 Zeros will smash into each other!”

And my favorite is the 10 minutes scene of the bomb dropping from the plane, and hitting Arizona, to deliver the fatal hit that doomed the ship. The bomb falls forever, then bursts through the armored deck, rolls around the magazine for several seconds, long enough for a startled sailor to come around the corner, get a wide-eyes expression of horror on his face, exclaim “Oh My God … It's a BOMB!” before the things “goes off”. I lost it at that point. That was it.

You know, the worst part of that junk is the blatant disrespect it shows to the men who died in that attack and also to the airmen who went up onesy, twosy, in their P-36's and P-40's to do battle with hundreds of Japanese aircraft, including a little known fighter, the A6M, that was vastly better performing than either aircraft, especially the P-36!

It disrespects their bravery and sacrifices. It implies that these assinine tactics could be used to defeat the enemy when, in reality, it had to be done by simply diving down on huge formations with no expectation of survival, and then getting bounced by dozens of Zeros that flew faster, turned tighter, and climbed better than your badly outnumbered fighter!

But they did it anyway, despite seeing dozens of their buddies getting blown to hell on the runway and apron getting bounced on the ground by strafing runs!

What these men did isn't some prop for Hollywood. What these movie producers must know is that this has to be done accurately out of simple respect for them. This is the approach used in Band of Brothers and Saving Private Ryan. Steven Speilberg had so much respect he sweated as many details as possible to get the little things right.

Ken

[PRB]

You know, the worst part of that junk is the blatant disrespect it shows to the men who died in that attack and also to the airmen who went up onesy, twosy, in their P-36's and P-40's to do battle with hundreds of Japanese aircraft, including a little known fighter, the A6M, that was vastly better performing than either aircraft, especially the P-36!

It disrespects their bravery and sacrifices. It implies that these assinine tactics could be used to defeat the enemy when, in reality, it had to be done by simply diving down on huge formations with no expectation of survival, and then getting bounced by dozens of Zeros that flew faster, turned tighter, and climbed better than your badly outnumbered fighter!

But they did it anyway, despite seeing dozens of their buddies getting blown to hell on the runway and apron getting bounced on the ground by strafing runs!

What these men did isn't some prop for Hollywood. What these movie producers must know is that this has to be done accurately out of simple respect for them. This is the approach used in Band of Brothers and Saving Private Ryan. Steven Speilberg had so much respect he sweated as many details as possible to get the little things right.

Ken

Exactly!
:ernae:

[clmooring]

to me the worst offenders are my favorite channels.... the military and history channels. They constantly show footage of a plane that may have similar appearance to the plane being discussed at the particular point in their shows. You would think that if anyone would get it correct, it would be the shows on the military and history channels.

[Ken Stallings]

to me the worst offenders are my favorite channels.... the military and history channels. They constantly show footage of a plane that may have similar appearance to the plane being discussed at the particular point in their shows. You would think that if anyone would get it correct, it would be the shows on the military and history channels.

Amen!

Ken

[Prowler1111]

Well..i agree with the Pearl Harbor looney tunes style dogfights, not to mention split second maneuvers that defies the simple laws of physics (and mostly..the simple laws of common sense)..worst offender EVER imho is Iron Eagle III..
But sometimes you get some really good scenes, even as the main equipment is wrong, i suggest you check "Steal the Sky" based in the real story of of Iraqi pilot Munir Redfa flying a Mig-21 fighter jet from Iraq to Israel in 1966, in the movie, they use Mig-17´s and is the BEST jet to jet dogfight scene i´ve seen (besides top gun, which besides the mig 28 had great aerial footage..c´mon those were real planes) in a mig to mig melee using real planes.

Best regards
Prowler

[Daveroo]

All I can say is this...

If I have to watch an unreal aviation clip to see the real image of Gabrielle Anwar...well, so what the heck!?

Marc :jump:

ill agree with that...and then im not lookin at her face