Is this a bug in the DP files

[AcWai]

The Hurricane has 4 guns on each wing. You can model it by using 1 gun station and 1 gun # with 4 guns.

[GUNSTATIONS]
; Port Browning .303
gunstation.0=0,47,1,0.05,811,2,0.02,500,0,40,1d1*8 ,-1.990,-0.500,0.860,-0.38761,0,0.31246,0,0,0,0,0.344

[guns.0]
gun.0=333,0.000,0.000,0.000,0,0,1,333
gun.1=333,-0.163,0.010,-0.020,0,0,1,333
gun.2=333,-0.335,0.020,-0.030,0,0,1,333
gun.3=333,-0.490,0.030,-0.050,0,0,1,333

You will see 1 set of tracer and not too many bullets.

If you model it by using 4 gun stations and 4 gun #:

[GUNSTATIONS]
; Port Browning .303
gunstation.0=0,47,1,0.05,811,2,0.02,500,0,40,1d1*8 ,-1.990,-0.500,0.860,-0.38761,0,0.31246,0,0,0,0,0.344

gunstation.1=0,47,1,0.05,811,2,0.02,500,0,40,1d1*8 ,-1.990,-0.500,0.860,-0.38761,0,0.31246,0,0,0,0,0.344

gunstation.2=0,47,1,0.05,811,2,0.02,500,0,40,1d1*8 ,-1.990,-0.500,0.860,-0.38761,0,0.31246,0,0,0,0,0.344

gunstation.3=0,47,1,0.05,811,2,0.02,500,0,40,1d1*8 ,-1.990,-0.500,0.860,-0.38761,0,0.31246,0,0,0,0,0.344

[guns.0]
gun.0=333, 0.000,0.000, 0.000,0,0,1,333

[guns.1]
gun.0=333,-0.163,0.010,-0.020,0,0,1,333

[guns.2]
gun.0=333,-0.335,0.020,-0.030,0,0,1,333

[guns.3]
gun.0=333,-0.490,0.030,-0.050,0,0,1,333

You will see all 4 sets of tracers and many more bullets. The guns seem to be more effective because you got more bullets coming out.

Am I correct or is this just an illusion? Are the two methods the same?

Anyway, I have changed all guns to individual gun station and gun number, I like to see more tracers and bullets.

Sorry, I pasted in the wrong set of numbers for method 2, there should not be any -1 in the guns. The #47 is the original value in the AeroHeaven Hurricane aicraft.

[Sarg Willy]

The two methods are equal , but where things can go wrong , is the tag no , in your case
the number was 47 = tag ,, that tag should also be attached to port wing box tag for point value + tag =47 , As well as system, armour rate ,then tag = 47 , If the port box wing see,s a different mg tag ,say -1 an example then strange effect,s occur , less tracer , less damage ,

[AcWai]

The photos show that using method 2 produces more tracers and bullets than using method 1.

I can not explain it. Both methods should be the same.

[Blood_Hawk23]

Here is a quick bit for you to consider.

The DP file is nothing more than a list of command strings for the sim to follow. It calls on these for different behaviors and effects. Think of them as guild lines or upper and lower limits. depending on what its looking for.

More than likely you already knew that. Moving on...

In the case of your example. The two setups are the same but different. In one, you are saying that this group has this many items attached. In the other you are saying you have this many groups each with its own item. For the sake of rendering the effect, the first setup will cheat and use the fewest resources to display the effect. The other setup is telling it to do it like this no mater what.

Does that make sense?

So having said all of that, If you are doing a player AC you want the Eye candy to show. PC hardware be damned. If you are making an AI you want the max PC performance for the best frame rate. Which one is best depends on what you want it to do.

Anyways that is how I see them when I set one up.

I hope that helps.

'til Later,
John

[Worthless]

Makes lotsa sense. Thanks BH. I usually cut down the tracer percentage anyhoo. Still, a question remains....in both of the examples mentioned is there any difference in the effective damage that is occurring? In other words, do both examples still throw the same amount of lead?

[AcWai]

Makes lotsa sense. Thanks BH. I usually cut down the tracer percentage anyhoo. Still, a question remains....in both of the examples mentioned is there any difference in the effective damage that is occurring? In other words, do both examples still throw the same amount of lead?

I think it is more effective using method 2. The aircraft is the AeroHeaven Hurricane, I think I can kill the enemy easier with method 2. If you look at the two photos carefully at the aim point, you will see more bullets (or tracers) using method 2.

I hope you guys will try it and tell me whether it is true. You can easily make the switch in less than 5 minutes. You only have to duplicate the gunstation 4 times and separate the guns into 4 guns.

[Blood_Hawk23]

I think it is more effective using method 2. The aircraft is the AeroHeaven Hurricane, I think I can kill the enemy easier with method 2. If you look at the two photos carefully at the aim point, you will see more bullets (or tracers) using method 2.

I hope you guys will try it and tell me whether it is true. You can easily make the switch in less than 5 minutes. You only have to duplicate the gunstation 4 times and separate the guns into 4 guns.

Without plugging the numbers into DP edit myself, I think you would see more hits with the second. As far as damage goes, turn on the damage messages and see if there is any variation. I think the sim will calculate the numbers differently just as it does the effects. I could be wrong.

So next i say test it against an AI.

Make one plane have the first setup and the other have the second. let them attack you. The AI with the first setup will still chew you up without any noticeable difference. The second might just look better doing it. Although in large numbers you'll see a frame rate drop.

I think one shows the "broom" technique and the other shows the sharpshooter. Historically harmonizing the guns was done to each pilots preference. Some wanted a tighter pattern. If you have Aim_it you can read about this in Jerry Beckwith's Readme file.

In the end I'd go with what you like. Just remember what I said about AI and Player differences.

I hope you have a better answer to your question.

[bub]

I prefer the individual gun set-up. You will "see" more hits. You also go through ammo quicker as now it will use all the guns. To paraphrase Gen. Chennault, The less rounds you use per aircraft, the more you have for others. So, marksmanship is the key.

[Sarg Willy]

Thank,s for the photo post , had a bit of time to kill , so tested out both methods , from the hurricane , remember the game was wrote for six mg,s they never shipped the p47 for it , and I see you view point , but the end result is the same , damage incurred from both dp,s as far as I can determine is exactly the same , Both dp,s will cut down a Ju 88 in 3 seconds as used by a wing man Ai combatant , Graphically the multi gunstation
looks better but as Blood hawk pointed out , may pose more of a draw on resources , with large formation,s