What WWI/WWII historical sites to see around Paris France?

[Moparmike]

Has anyone here ever visited any WWI or WWII historical sites around the Paris France area?
A couple years ago, I visited my cousin stationed in Naples at the time. Besides the local Roman Empire historical stuff we also made a trip to Monte Cassino. Was a great yet sombering experience to see the rebuilt abbey and both the Polish and Commonwealth cemetery monuments.

Fast forward to this year and they've talked me into meeting them in Paris for a few days.
I would like to take in some military history in the area.
So far I'm thinking Belleau Wood and most likely a trip to the coast to see the Normandy beachheads.

Any other ideas?

[Moparmike]

Here's a few shots from Cassino and the 2nd Polish Corp cemetery.

[SSI01]

There are a couple of places I can think of.

North of the city is the Marne river. It marks the farthest point of advance of the German Army in its attempt in 1914 to encircle Paris from the north and west. French General Gallieni - one of the oldest generals in the French Army - used two of the newest inventions - the airplane and the motor car - to save Paris. He, in company with only a very few other French generals, believed the information provided by French pilots and observers who reported the Germany Army was turning south-east prematurely in its attempt to encircle Paris. It was presenting its right flank to an enterprising enemy who could take advantage of this weakness. Gallieni took them at their word and mobilized every available vehicle - including all of Paris' taxicabs - as troop transports and rushed as many men as he could to French positions along the Marne river, where they stopped the German advance within (I think) 30 miles of the capital. The Germans almost did it. The battle is famous because it more or less ended the war of maneuver that WWI in the West had been up to that point and ushered in trench warfare on a massive scale on the Western Front.

There is a forest about 60 miles to the northeast of Paris, the Forest of Coucy, that was the location for the Paris Kanone, or Kaiser Wilhelm Kanone - what the press called the Paris Gun. This thing could shoot about 75 miles and did drop shells into Paris at the rate of one about one every 15 minutes - 21 were fired on the first day. The barrels - which were tremendously long, and required a sort of trestle to hold them straight - could fire only 75 projectiles accurately (on a city-sized target, that is) before they had to be removed, sent back to Krupp, and rebored and new ammo provided. It was a most remarkable achievement for that time period, and still ranks as one of the longest-ranged and strongest artillery pieces ever constructed. Dad tended 12-inch and 16-inch coast defense guns before he switched to the field artillery later in WWII - the Paris Gun was still a topic of some discussion in their training.

So there are a couple of unusual places for you to think about.

France is not a large country - no European country is large compared to the US - so there are many, many other places that would be of intense interest to a WWI buff like me if I were short on time. To me, as an American, no trip to France would be complete without seeing the Argonne Forest (where they have located the exact site where Sgt York won his Medal of Honor), Chateau-Thierry, and St-Mihiel. Verdun is the site of a MASSIVE French memorial and ossuary - where bones that still turn up from the battlefield are taken for custody. It's quite beautiful on the inside. It's surrounded by an equally massive cemetery of France's dead, most of them from that battle. There is a hill there called Mort Homme (Dead Man's Hill) - Cote 304. I thought Dad was pulling my leg about this story until I found it is true. The hill has two summits. Both were fought over incredibly fiercely and changed hands multiple times. So much steel and lead were fired into that ground, and remain embedded in the soil, a compass held in the hand on Mort Homme will not point to magnetic North. Technically Cote 304 no longest exists because about 7 meters of soil was blasted clean off the top of the hill. It's hard to believe two armies could fight like that over a piece of ground - but they did.

[srgalahad]

So far I'm thinking Belleau Wood and most likely a trip to the coast to see the Normandy beachheads.

Any other ideas?

For a few days? yes, several dozen :adoration:
We were there last April/May for 3 weeks and only scratched the surface but did see some areas in depth - mostly the Somme (100th anniversary celebrations), a bit of Normandy, as well as museums in Paris.

Beyond the standard list there are things like the fly-in/commemoration of the Caudron Brothers Aviation School at Le Crotoy (June 9th this year) with the aircraft landing on the beach which was the original site in WWI.
Last year we hit upon a fly-in & static show at Amiens that featured a Spit, AN-2 (selling rides) and a great assembly of classic aircraft. Beyond the history of the two wars, Amiens is interesting and one highlight was a tour of Jules Verne's house (now a museum).

PM me your email to make sure I have the right one and I'll send you some of the research I did last year.

[speedy70]

If you google WW2 tours in France there are stacks of them.

Cheers Chris

[Moparmike]

Thanks for the ideas! Yes, I know the list is long and the visit will be too short.
Mainly looking for a few highlights besides the normal ones. Sometimes you get the best tips on little-known but good sites from stuff that others have stumbled onto besides what the tour guides gravitate to.

Myself and my cousin's family are more self-explorers than guided tour folk. They're active and retired Navy and have visited the area several times already while stationed in Italy. It's nice to move along at our own pace and if we find something interesting not on our plan it's no big deal to spend some time looking at that instead of just getting herded back on the bus to the next site. :D Besides...that gives me an excuse to go back some year!

Snooping around the area of Sgt York's MOH action I found Valee Moreau, a German encampment site, that looks interesting.

PM sent Rob.

[huub vink]

Mike,

Museum which pop-up in my mind immediately are the "Musee l'Air et l"Espace" at le Bourget. Check before you go there whether the museum is open as I remember it is closed at Mondays. http://www.museeairespace.fr/

Not aviation related, but an other museum which is definitely on my list is the "Musee des BLindes" (Tank museum) in Saumur. Depending where you stay in Paris, but its roughly a 2.5 hour drive from the center of Paris. http://www.museedesblindes.fr/ . They have a huge collection.

In the Calais area (roughly 3 hours drive from Paris) you have many great sites. You can visit the museum in the "Batterie Todt" http://www.batterietodt.com/ , located in a huge coastal battery. They even have a huge railway gun over there.

But there are more impressive structures like "La Coupole" https://www.lacoupole-france.co.uk/ where they constructed the V-2 rockets. Le Blockhouse d'Eperlecques, near St.Omer http://www.leblockhaus.com/en/ and you can also combine this with a visit to the Mimoyecques site where you can visit the remains of the high velocity super canon designed to shoot at London http://mimoyecques.fr/fr/en/home/

The Normandy coast is of course infested with museums, but in gereral there a lot historic places to visit in France. Just follow the signs "Musée"!

Whatever you decide to visit have a good holiday!

Huub

[Moparmike]

Thanks Huub! I think we will probably be focusing mostly around the Normandy area and east along the Marne river towards Reims but we haven't planned a definite route yet.
If we head north to Calais then I will keep those in mind.
I would like to take in the air museum at Le Bourget.

Unfortunately I'll be flying into CDG...we had a nightmare going through customs during our layover en route to Naples and I am dreading that part of the trip!

[dhasdell]

Well, if you get to Normandy then Pegasus Bridge and St Mere Eglise are there, and just like they looked in The Longest Day, especially the latter.

[Moparmike]

Well, if you get to Normandy then Pegasus Bridge and St Mere Eglise are there, and just like they looked in The Longest Day, especially the latter.

Thanks! We'll be near Pegasus Bridge. Not sure if we'll be hitting the Utah beachhead area though. St Mer Eglise and Carentan are on my list but we're also going to wander east into Belgium for a few days too so I'm sure we won't be covering the whole coast.



In planning, we're discovering how hard it is to get iPhone users (my cousin and crew) to see my Google Maps wishlist. LOL But...I'm have a hard time viewing their Apple Maps list too.

[huub vink]

South East Belgium has Bastogne the place to visit there. There is a nice museum there. But in the whole region you will find a lot of history and remains of the battles over there.

Make sure to visit Luxembourg as well when you are there. They have their very interesting Battle of the Bulge museums as well . But even better they have huge medieval castles and fortifications at breathtaking locations.

Cheers,
Huub

[Moparmike]

Time for me to follow up on this a bit...I'm still processing my picture roll but here's a few to share.
Spent 10 days in France and Belgium beginning Easter Sunday.
A day in Paris and then road-tripping around in a rental.

Take a good look at the goofball in front of the Arc de Triomphe...first time I've ever posted my ugly mug here at CFC or SOH...and that's since 1999! :indecisiveness:

[Moparmike]

Omaha Beach. Started the day early...same time and tide that the landing craft began coming ashore. VERY sobering to walk that stretch of sand!

[Moparmike]

The US Cemetery at Colville.
The Ranger monument at Pont du Hoc.
Dick Winters Leadership Monument near Utah Beach.
"Dinah Might" at the Utah Beach Museum. It's SOH...I better have a plane pic or two!!!

[Moparmike]

St mer Eglise.
The 101st Airborne HQ (now a museum) in Bastogne.
The Belgian countryside outside La Gleize.
King Tiger "213" at December 44 Museum in La Gleize.

[Moparmike]

German Cemetery at Recogne (just down the road from Foy).
Mardasson Memorial outside Bastogne.
Bois de Jacques (Jack's Woods) outside Foy.

[Ferry_vO]

Thanks for sharing, looks like you had a fun trip Mike!

[Moparmike]

Thanks Ferry! It was an excellent trip and family visit!
Still sorting through the pics from my day at Musee l'Air et l'Espace. Lots of good French aircraft there!


And don't worry, you and Huub aren't off the hook yet. Part two of this trip will be more of Belgium and the Rhine valley someday. Pretty sure I will fly into Amsterdam instead of Paris to begin so you guys are definitely on my meet list!

[Ferry_vO]

Looking forward to that, Mike!

Plenty of WW2 related stuff to see here!

[wombat666]

We did the opposite last November, but that was the 100th Anniversary of the Armistice.
Even a Century later it is obvious why casualties were appalling!
Aside from the battlefields and memorials we did some tourist side trips, our next Euro trip we will spend time in Bruges, one of the best kept secrets I had never heard of.
:encouragement:

[Moparmike]

We did the opposite last November, but that was the 100th Anniversary of the Armistice.
Even a Century later it is obvious why casualties were appalling!
Aside from the battlefields and memorials we did some tourist side trips, our next Euro trip we will spend time in Bruges, one of the best kept secrets I had never heard of.
:encouragement:

We made a few Great War related stops on the return trip to Paris. Several of the US cemeteries and battle locations.
The 100th anniversary of the Armistice stuff was beginning to get set up in spring already.
The main focus of our trip was militaria but we took in some older historical stops too.