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Thread: Douglas A20 Havoc

  1. #51
    Senior Administrator Willy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milton Shupe View Post
    EDIT: Wait! Isn't that Willy 2nd from the right?
    On top, just behind the canopy.
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  2. #52
    Milton, don't know if you've seen these, but just in case...

    http://www.airplanesandrockets.com/a...Nov-1970-L.gif
    http://www.airplanesandrockets.com/a...Nov-1970-R.gif

    One of those noses refers to a 2.7 BILLION candlepower searchlight! I did some looking and found this:
    https://no23squadron.files.wordpress...turbinlite.jpg
    Source page:
    https://no23squadron.wordpress.com/2...oc-turbinlite/
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  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Clayton View Post
    Milton, don't know if you've seen these, but just in case...

    http://www.airplanesandrockets.com/a...Nov-1970-L.gif
    http://www.airplanesandrockets.com/a...Nov-1970-R.gif

    One of those noses refers to a 2.7 BILLION candlepower searchlight! I did some looking and found this:
    https://no23squadron.files.wordpress...turbinlite.jpg
    Source page:
    https://no23squadron.wordpress.com/2...oc-turbinlite/
    The rest of the story: http://www.vintagewings.ca/VintageNe...ite-Havoc.aspx
    Milton Shupe
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  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Bomber_12th View Post
    In-case it hasn't been found/seen yet, here is a collection of over 300 A-20 photos (including some great cockpit shots): https://www.flickr.com/photos/133697...57651919651333

    Thank you Sir; I had not seen that particular set, although some of the pics are around the net.

    Quote Originally Posted by Willy View Post
    On top, just behind the canopy.
    Should have known that you were on top of things. :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by jankees View Post
    excellent news, but please, make one for FSX too?
    I can't but it will be available to do should LDR or someone else choose to do so.
    Last edited by Milton Shupe; November 28th, 2015 at 20:27.
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  5. #55
    One day closer to finishing :-)

    Spent half of the day working on the front half of the fuselage and the other half with the vertical tail, rudder, and trimtab.

    Looks about as ratty as the real thing. :-)
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails HOMEUNIT-2015-nov-29-007.jpg   HOMEUNIT-2015-nov-29-008.jpg  
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  6. #56
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    "Turbinlite" with modifications and improvements eventually became the "Leigh Light" used by Coastal Command Liberators, Fortresses and Halifaxes later in the war. That light was what took away the cover of darkness from U-boats charging their batteries on the surface at that time. So, indirectly, Turbinlite did contribute to the enemy's defeat. A more refined version wound up on P2Vs and other USN ASW aircraft post-war.

  7. #57

  8. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Milton Shupe View Post
    Great reading - thanks!
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  9. #59
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milton Shupe View Post
    One day closer to finishing :-)
    Funny enough only after one day you can clearly see what it will become!

    When I hear Milton was going to do a A20/Boston I also reinstalled the old Alphasim version. I must confess I uninstalled it immediately again. Amazing to see how spoiled we have become!

    Cheers,
    Huub

  10. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post
    Funny enough only after one day you can clearly see what it will become!

    When I hear Milton was going to do a A20/Boston I also reinstalled the old Alphasim version. I must confess I uninstalled it immediately again. Amazing to see how spoiled we have become!

    Cheers,
    Huub
    Huub,

    I have it as well, and think that for a low poly version, for its time, the exterior model actually looks pretty good. But I agree, things have come a long way since computers today can handle much better details and large textures.

    I am taking my time on this one trying to notch up the exterior a bit in hopes that someone will convert it to FSX native and give it proper treatment there.
    I'll be a few more days on the fuselage trying to accommodate the variants by ensuring my cross-sections are best placed for the inevitable model changes.
    I am trying to decide if the best approach would be to do the A-20A/B "turretless" style instead of the G first. It seems more logical to start at the beginning.
    But populating the nose interior is best left until later.

    For now, time to model the cockpit window frames, an arduous task always.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails ws.jpg   3_3.jpg  
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  11. #61
    Question for you ....

    Can you identify the purpose of the heavy plates on the sides of the nose section?
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails HOMEUNIT-2015-nov-29-004.jpg  
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  12. #62
    One of the frustrating parts about modeling from 3-views are the inconsistencies on the same authored prints.

    This shows a comparison of the fuselage modeled to one and compared to the other.

    Strangely, on the print where the side views do not match up, the top and bottom views do, all on the same print.

    Of course we must also consider the different size and shaped noses for the variants.

    I really feel for how tough drawing these 3-views can be, and across top/bottom/left/right/front/rear views.

    Nothing new of course; we always have to deal with this, and will charge on. :-)
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails HOMEUNIT-2015-nov-29-016.jpg   HOMEUNIT-2015-nov-29-017.jpg   HOMEUNIT-2015-nov-29-018.jpg  
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  13. #63
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milton Shupe View Post
    Question for you ....

    Can you identify the purpose of the heavy plates on the sides of the nose section?
    Milton,

    These panels are also present at the aircraft in the pictures posted by John. They are behind the armament and according to the drawing I looked at they appear only on the later models.

    I assume they are part of the extra armor which was introduces with the G and J models to protect the crew against ground fire.

    About the drawings: I understand your frustration, but over the years I learned that even factory drawings are not always correct (understatement!). They normally show the designed aircraft and often this is not exactly the production aircraft. Not to mention common field modifications.......

    Success,
    Huub

  14. #64
    There is a heavy armor protecting plate on the front bulkhead in front of the pilots and panel; it can be seen thru the later glass nosed variants.

    I thoughe maybe these small side panels were either to protect the ammo cases for the forward guns or were there to support the recoil of the guns in the pods.
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  15. #65
    Yeah, it is extra armor plating - the solid-nosed A-20G/H and glass-nosed A-20J had about 400 lbs. of extra armor plating added, compared to earlier variants.

    As seen in these photos (and some others I posted), there are actually two plates on either side of the nose, with the lower plates wrapping underneath the nose, and there are even corresponding sections/panels on the nose gear doors as well, so that the armor plating wraps all the way around under the nose when in flight. In these photos you can also see how thick the panels are. BTW, if you click on any of these photos I have shared, it will bring you to the Photobucket page and you can view all of these photos in much larger resolution. As can be seen by these photos, the guns and ammo cans are all positioned in front of the armor plating.







    This diagram shows all of the locations of the armor plating on the A-20G/H/J. With the extra armor plating, the pilot was fairly well protected from head-on and below - just not from the side.


  16. #66
    Senior Administrator Willy's Avatar
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    Any chance of an unarmed version that could be done into a Navy BD-1 target tug?
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  17. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by Willy View Post
    Any chance of an unarmed version that could be done into a Navy BD-1 target tug?
    That should not be a problem.

    Wrestling still with the canopy and windshield; slugging it out; bruised but not beaten.
    Progress is slow and painstaking; hopefully I can get a break-though today and get things in shape for real progress.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails HOMEUNIT-2015-nov-30-001.jpg  
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  18. #68
    WOW yes the bird I have been waiting for!

  19. #69
    SOH Staff .."Bartender" AussieMan's Avatar
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    The RAAF had Bostons. I believe these are the same.


    Cheers
    Pat


    "Some people might say that freedom is being alone in the bush with the only sounds being the murmurs from the birds ... but I believe freedom is at 5000 feet with no other sound than the engine roaring."- William Hutchison, a young man taken from us far too young (16).

  20. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by AussieMan View Post
    The RAAF had Bostons. I believe these are the same.
    Similar, but meeting the RAF's specifications. The aircraft was known as DB-7/ Bostons to the Brits and other buyers.

    When the USAAF got in the game, the A-20 designation was used beginning with the A-20A.

    Here is the breakdown and evolution from the DB-7 onward.

    http://www.americancombatplanes.com/a20_1.html

    http://www.militaryfactory.com/aircr...ircraft_id=186
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  21. #71

  22. #72
    Well folks, the cockpit windows and windshield battle is still in progress but its one that must be fought. Making a little headway but the windshield look is being elusive at the moment. Five days or so and its getting less painful, but no less challenging. The issue is getting the quarter windows and curvature shaped correctly. Only time and due diligence will save the day, or week. :-)
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  23. #73
    Charter Member 2012 nigel richards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milton Shupe View Post
    Well folks, the cockpit windows and windshield battle is still in progress but its one that must be fought. Making a little headway but the windshield look is being elusive at the moment. Five days or so and its getting less painful, but no less challenging. The issue is getting the quarter windows and curvature shaped correctly. Only time and due diligence will save the day, or week. :-)
    Exquisite Artistry, Sir :-)

    Just love watching the birth of these awesome projects!

    Power to thine elbow Milton
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  24. #74
    Quote Originally Posted by nigel richards View Post
    Exquisite Artistry, Sir :-)

    Just love watching the birth of these awesome projects!

    Power to thine elbow Milton
    LOL Thanks. Funny that is doesn't feel like artistry when you are in the cage slugging it out.
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  25. #75
    Charter Member 2012 nigel richards's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milton Shupe View Post
    LOL Thanks. Funny that is doesn't feel like artistry when you are in the cage slugging it out.
    LOL :-))))

    ...think I know what you mean, but it's the slugging out part that defines the true artist.

    Keep on inspiring :-)
    Most men often say what they think!
    An honest man usually means what he says!
    A gentleman always says what he means!

    "Αίεν Υψικρατείν "

    A fool is not he who asks a simple question, but he who would simply have its asking denied. (Richards 2012)

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