A challenge if you will.

[PRB]

That's pretty funny, jmbii...

Padburgess, what Rob (srgalahad) was refering to, and one of the tools we use when we hold our racing events is the “FS-Duenna”, which records your flight data and saves it in the form of an image, text file, and link to the server when the data on your flight is stored. With this you could track the time of each flight and make it a more competitive event. It tracks your MSL altitude, but not AGL, so you would have to make the altitude “ceiling” an MSL one, which offers it's own challenges. What it's no so good at is tracking your precise course in detail, so “corner cutting” might be hard to detect. It also only measures “direct distance” or “point to point”, and not the total miles covered, which, if it did, would be a good way to detect corner cutting.

Here's the duenna data for my latest run, in the RAZBAM A-7E. I really blew this one. It seemed like my GPS was “freezing” up unless I constantly changed range scales. Good thing I had the APQ-126 radar fired up in the Corsair. And Plan-G...

http://fs-duenna.com/flights/ShowFli...4kUGQALMaEK6eo

[James1967A1]

I finally tried the A-10. Seems to work well, aside from my crash. I think I'll use this one for the trip. Handling is pretty good and visibility is not too bad. I have to remember to use Plan G. I keep turning into dead ends or having to pull up the FS map to see if I need to veer right or left. Really enjoying this challenge. And I'm enjoying all the other aircraft people are using. I think after the high speed challenge, I'd like to try it at a lower speed in a low speed aircraft.

Jim

[jmbiii]

Lower speed is fun, too! You can get right down on the water even in the narrow parts.

I had wanted to find a North American "Mach Loop". This appears to be it !

[James1967A1]

I'd like to try Rob Richardson's F-106A on the route. It would be plenty fast, but visibility might be a problem.

[ViperPilot2]

I tried out the Intruder, and the Block 60 Viper (no screenies... sorry), but keep having the same problems as Jim (james1967A1); I keep making wrong turns and end up off course! I can stay below the set ceiling and keep the speed up... I just have to get everything set up in the cockpit and on the Panel!

As an aside... this is just my personal opinion, but from the looks of it we have a pretty honest little gang here, having lots of fun. We're all competing against the course, picking our airplanes based on the mission and the terrain. In the event that everyone decides to take a run to see who's fastest, how about keeping the informal spirit going and work off the Honor System (it took me this long to complete the course, using this airplane...). Do we really need to use the Duenna for this? Maybe I'm just paranoid or something, but in my mind I see Duenna = RTWR Rules, which equals... White List. Invoke that, and there goes the spirit of the entire Thread, especially since we've been running all order of airplanes through the course.

I'm in the minority here. This is the FSX Forum after all, and I'm a Niner; I asked the OP if I could participate, just to have fun. You guys call the shots here, and will ultimately choose the best course of action about how to run a competition.

All I'm trying to do is make it through the course...

[WhiskeyEcho]

200knots @40-60 ft on the river, all the way, much more of a challenge.

[padburgess]

PRB thanks for the HU about what was meant by Rob with regard to Duenna. I think I will go with ViperPilot2 on this though. My original intention was to generate some interest and discussion around valley running within the community. I have no interest in seeing who can do this fastest or with the least amount of corner cutting or "proof" of success other than a few screen shots and a "I did it post". If someone didn't and just posted the comment then the only one they are fooling is themself. I find it challenging enough just as it is. Me and a chosen aircraft against a few arbitrary rules and the terrain of a chosen flight path. I don't mean to negate the wishes of those who desire a more competitive approach, but not for me thanks.
I welcome the fact that so many have tried this, even a niner and to see the diverse range of aircraft attempting this is awesome. I mean a Vulcan! I definitely want to see that one finish LOL.

I would love to see others post alternative routes with a different set of parameters. That posted by WhiskeyEcho is one I will try. Something a smaller piston engined warbird of GA could achieve.

I am still trying this first leg with different aircraft, my current attempts are with Flight Replicas 262. It's a lovely old bird with gentle flight characteristics, albeit a little under powered and slow on spool up. If you set her up with 80% RPM though and then just fly her she is sweet. Still haven't got there yet but I will.

I hope to start the next leg this weekend. Taking the TSR2 from Prince George to Revelstoke. Then I'll repeat it with the 262 and maybe Vertigo's F9F. I would love to do it in JF's Canberra, but I only have the free demo at present and the panel and nose fall off at 1000ft.

[PRB]

Understood. Not meaning to suggest anything different be done in this thread, only to explaining a bit what was meant, possibly, in an earlier post.

[padburgess]

Cheers PRB. I got your meaning and thank you for the clarification. I did not mean for you to interpret the rest of my reply as being about your response. I was just clarifying my position, if you will, so that everyone following this thread knew where I was coming from. I'm fairly new at this and have seen other threads, shall we say, deteriorate and I would hate for that to happen.

A further question for you though. You mention "Plan G" in your thread. What is this? I do most of my flying without add-on aids and it can be challenging at times. I haven't even got used to using a GPS yet. Probably why I like low level flying, you can see the rivers, rail-lines, roads etc. To find my way I usually have either a supplementary window open on my second monitor set to map view, or use Google Maps in the same way. Kind of clunky but it does work after a fashion.

[WhiskeyEcho]

Plan-G @ TASoftware.com, excellent planning and moving map, very helpful at 50ft.

P.S. FREE

[Essex]

I would love to do it in JF's Canberra, but I only have the free demo at present and the panel and nose fall off at 1000ft.

"F-111 Aardvark demo
This demo allows you to try the F-111 Aardvark in Flight Simulator X or Prepar3D, up to a height of 1000ft above the ground (AGL), at which point the demo model turns invisible."

I don't know if the other demos are AGL and I haven't tried it myself, but it would be good to have some FDE tweaks to differentiate the F111A demo from the F111C demo, both should manage the course anyhow.

[HarleyDude]

I tried in an Alpha F-111 and spun in after a compressor stall in a tight turn. Tried a F-16 viper, F-86 Sabre (section 8), a North American Bronco ( just to see if it could be done), a T-38 Talon, and a F-20 Tigershark. I can make it about 2/3 of the way up the course and loose it on the tight turns. A great course and I would like to see others posted. Maybe for old and slow A/C. I enjoy all the posts and look forward for more in the future. In the mean time its back to the old drawing board and try again. As for whether or not to use recorded flight data. I think keeping it on the honor system and friendly would work best. The challenge is against the course not each other. And for those who make it congratulations WELL DONE as for the rest of us I'll see you on the flight line.

[padburgess]

Well, I've given the jets a bit of a rest. I was getting tired of trying to fly through hills although the 262 is still a goer as my faults there seem to be hitting trees and water not hills. I was starting to think the first run was a fluke with the poor showing I've been getting.

Thought I would give WhiskeyEcho's idea a go. Even slower and if possible lower. Did a few trials with some piston engined warbirds, Do335, P51, Mosquito and finally A2A's Me109Emil. Settled on the Emil. Very challenging but lots of fun. No GPS moving map or whatever, just follow the river. I consider myself privileged as I have Orbyx's PNW scenery and the river goes all the way. In fact this scenery is simply stunning.

Did fall for flying goldfish's bridge fetish though. Left a few out and didn't try any of the doubles. Got the rest though. Had to cheat a little and do a sneaky "in flight" refuel. I'm going to claim it was to allow for a drop tank or two.


This run was done at about 230-250knots and much lower than the previous one.

[Deacon211]

Thanks for that challenge...it was a great amount of fun!

I thought at first to try to get the A2A P-51D up on the route by running her flat out.



But that wasn't going to work even if I didn't overheat.

Next I tried the A-4...



But the turn performance was just killing me and I ended up with a very bizarre locked in stall that pancaked me into a hillside.

Oh, well. Third time's a charm!












What a beautiful route and surprisingly real looking with all the trees covering the ground textures. I will admit to taking a wrong turn and having to skim over a bit of headland to get back in the valley, but otherwise I think I managed to stay in the groove the entire way.

I may do it with the Mustang just for fun...

Deacon

[ThePlasticMax]

What it's no so good at is tracking your precise course in detail, so “corner cutting” might be hard to detect. It also only measures “direct distance” or “point to point”, and not the total miles covered, which, if it did, would be a good way to detect corner cutting.

It actually appears to track it and record it just fine, it just doesn't present that data to you unless you click on the 'Get Full..' links, from which I can see, for example, that you blew the altitude and veered west at Fountain Indian Reserve, rather than staying in the valley.

(Sorry about not quoting properly, but 'reply with quote' doesn't seem to work for me)

[PRB]

Indeed it does. Never clicked on those before. Cool. Rgr. on busting the altitude limit. I did that several times...

[Chris Sykes]

Just tried the F-111, seems doable, a few times had to cut some corners and hit the height limit but made it. Fuel isn't an issue not is speed, only when coming to tight corners

[ViperPilot2]

I finally made it all the way to Prince George! After Lilooet, the fun really begins with the drainpipe turn the valley makes! The second turn after Quesnel is also a doozy!

Just a few screenies; the 1st one I left the red writing on to show Altitude AGL (this was just after Hope):








Kaz Ito's F-117N:



Let's send all sorts of birds through this and see where they end up!

[padburgess]

I have finally done the next leg. Prince George to Revelstoke.
srgalahad was correct about the Columbia River being wide. Compared to the lower Fraser River, from Prince George to the turn off into the Columbia River is like a 4 lane black top. This part actually turned into a bit of a speed run. Kept the TSR2 up around 600knots for most of it. I'll send my apologies to all the folks in those little towns later.
You will notice from the screen shots that I got a little lost and took the wrong turn into the , what I thought was the Columbia River. Wasn't though, just a dead end. I managed to keep to the spirit of the challenge though and turned myself around without getting more than 600ft above the terrain. Did a little side valley run with a ridge pop and down an adjacent valley back to the lake and then turned down the real river. Arrived at Revelstoke at 630Knots, 200ft AGL. Did a sideways loop and then got her down.
It wasn't quite that simple of course. I spent this afternoon practicing landings at Revelstoke. The numbers said I should be able to get the TSR2 down there so I had some practice. The model is a little finicky and the drogue shoot doesn't always work on command. The RCAF need another 4 TSR2's. The good people of Revelstoke will be picking TSR2 parts out of them there hills for a while. Eventually got the hang of it so did the run and managed to get it right on the second go around. Kissed on at 200Knots, the drogue popped on command and she pulled up sweet.


Next weekend is Easter so I may or may not get any more done. The next leg will be the Columbia River for most of its length. However this week I will be going back to the Fraser River and try some more aircraft out. That first leg is sick.
I've got a line up of aircraft to try. First up is the 262, then F9F followed by F101 Voodoo, A6E, Sea Venom, Sea Vixen at challenge pace then at WhiskeyEcho's pace, P51, Fw190D9, P40N, P38J, Mosquito, Beaufighter, He219 and Do335.
I wont get these all done in a week but we'll see how I go.

[ViperPilot2]

Looks like it's a bit wider in spots than the first one, and straighter, maybe? If so, perhaps a larger aircraft might be in order, if it'll fit in there! Definitely have to take a stab!

[padburgess]

Did a bit of recon down the Columbia River. Didn't get too far as only had a bit of time and my chosen bird cruises at 400Kph. Will finish tomorrow.



I've blanked out the swastika from the tail plane as it is not my intention to insult anyone here. I do normally leave my aircraft historically correct. I find this bird lovely to sight see in. The view from the cockpit forward and down is nearly unbeaten. Especially if you need a bit of cruising speed. I have taken the liberty of modifying this aircraft with later model DB603N engines developing 2763HP at 3000rpm at sea level. I've de-rated them slightly to 2500hp. Also de-militarised her by removing all weapons and the turret, replacing them with plastic replicas. Removed a lot of weight and turned her into a very sprightly old girl.

[padburgess]

Continued the recon down Columbia River. CastleGar to Grand Coulee Dam. Sorry but I couldn't resist the bridge at CastleGar. This part of the run is going to make for a very high speed section in the TSR2. Should be a heap of fun.


The next leg should be more of a challenge. Although for the recon it will be higher and slower. This is a wonderful way to chill out after a stressful day in the real world.

[napamule]

padburgess,
Been keeping up with this thread. I have flown all the segments so far suggested. There are some 'elevation' changes (dams?) along the way, which almost cause a crash, and cause shooting the elevation. And sometimes there is no water in river bed. If it wasn't for the GPS, which I used on all these flights, I would get lost. There is a 'sweet spot' (zoom) where the river bed will be obvious and is the best 'free' 'moving map' or guide that works good. Works for me, anyway.

I fly Kaz Ito's Boulton Paul P.111. It is highly modified for just this type of flying. Cruise is around 640 kts (Mach 0.99 @ sea level). I have it where I can use only the rudder to change directions (ie: without banking the wings). Works really well. It's sensitive enough to avoid the FSX quirks (terrain) if you have any high speed racing experience and good controller.

Here is a pic of one gorge I tried, which might interest you.
Chuck B
Napamule

[napamule]

I got a sneaky suspicion you have tried flying (and failed?) the Grand Canyon. Am I right? Anywho, I made a short (3 min) video of my try at flying the Grand Canyon. Started at Grand Canyon West (1G4) and then East to Page (KPGA). Video Link: http://youtu.be/9Kn1K525-r4 . Also jpg of route from the Map. As you can see, I am flying Kaz Ito's Boulton Paul P.111 'Experimental' model (port over from FS9). Enjoy.
Chuck B
Napamule

[padburgess]

Hi Chuck

No, sorry. Havn't been any where near the canyon. I tend to fly exclusively in ORBYX scenery at present and mainly in PNW and NZ. I would think the canyon would be very challenging and may give it a try some time. I'll check out your video. Thanks for providing the link. I'm getting ready to try the next leg of the Columbia river at present. Doing recon in the Dornier to get an idea of what the terrain will be like and then I'll see if I can do a high speed run in the TSR2.