Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 42

Thread: "Twilight Tear, Then & Now" (WIP)

  1. #1
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117

    "Twilight Tear, Then & Now" (WIP)

    I believe the cat is pretty much out of the bag on this one, so I thought I'd post a bit of early images and information about it.

    This aircraft actually spurred the idea about doing a "Then and Now" set of Mustangs, and became the first project of those started, but one thing led to another, and "Cripes A' Mighty" ended up being finished before this project could be.

    For a little bit of background:

    This P-51D, an early-production P-51D-20-NA, is quite unique in that it is one of a very select few surviving Mustangs that actually saw combat use in WWII. 44-63864 was built early enough in the war, that upon arrival to England it was assigned to the 78th FG 83rd FS at Duxford. From there, the aircraft became the personal mount of Lt. Hubert "Bill" Davis. Lt. Hubert named the aircraft after the "1944 Race Horse of the Year", a filly named Twilight Tear. The aircraft was credited with shooting down three enemey aircraft - 1 Me-109 on March 2nd, 1945, and 2 Me-109's on March 19th, 1945 (67-years ago today!). Following the end of WWII, the aircraft, which remained in Europe, was sold to Sweden, where it became RSwAF Fv26158 F16 coded Red D, and later Green K. Following service in the Swedish AF, the aircraft was obtained by the Israeli AF. The aircraft was then later sold to William Lear Jr. who flew it from Tel Aviv to Athens, and then to Geneva, with the aircraft registered then as N251L in 1960. In the summer of 1963, the aircraft was to be ferried accross the Atlantic to the U.S., by pilot Roger Gaston Arnoult, but Arnoult, having never flown a P-51 before, crashed on landing at Reykjavik, Iceland. The aircraft was almost sold for scrap, but the remains were rescued by Petur Jonsson and Michael Valdimarsson in 1986. The remains were then purchased by Ron Fagen, of Granite Falls, MN, who sent the project to Tri State Aviation for a rebuild to completely stock and airworthy condition. The aircraft flew again for the first time since 1963, in April of 2011. Final detailing was conducted through a joint-effort by Fagen's Warhawks Inc. restoration company, and the then newly founded Aircorps Aviation restoration company. The aircraft was then showcased at the 2011 EAA Oshkosh Airventure air show, where it won the WWII Grand Champion award for the authenticity and complexity of the restoration.

    This webpage is dedicated to this aircraft on the Fagen Fighters website: http://www.warhawksinc.com/twilight_tear.html
    Here are a collection of images of the aircraft on display at Oshkosh last summer: http://s1103.photobucket.com/albums/... Oshkosh 2011/

    Provided some amazing access to this aircraft, as well as some exclusive photographs, the project for FSX was born. Work on the aircraft as it is now, in its restored condition, is very near to being completed, and work on the depiction of the aircraft as it was during WWII is just beginning. Like the "Cripes A' Mighty, Then & Now", this project will yet again introduce a bit of a different cockpit look, completely accurate for the specific production-model type and in-field modifications (which were reproduced when the aircraft was restored).

    First off for images, here are some of the exterior of the restored "Twilight Tear", very near complete. I'll also be posting some cockpit screens soon - it has avionics that are unlike those incorporated into my past restored-Mustangs, and reflect what the real aircraft actually does use (which is more sparse, and even less intrusive on the originality/complete stock look of the cockpit, and the avionics are easily removeable). It is extremely authentic inside this Mustang, and it is the only one in existence with a full-proper early-production P-51D-20-NA cockpit configuration. The model exterior is tuned so that the markings could be fully-accurately reproduced, without any short-cuts.
















  2. #2
    Charter Member 2011 stiz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Scarborough,England
    Age
    24
    Posts
    2,940
    Blog Entries
    1
    stunning work john! but i have to ask ... aint you sick of mustangs?
    yes i know i cant spell half the time! Thank you kindly to those few who pointed that out

  3. #3
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    Thank you Stiz, and I see your point. ; ) They're all different to me, and I just can't kick it.

    As I mentioned in other threads, this type of project is only another way to keep busy on top of the P-39, A-36/P-51A/P-51B, and eventual Tony projects.

  4. #4
    Charter Member 2012 fsxar177's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Prairie, Idaho
    Age
    26
    Posts
    651
    John,
    One outstanding machine there!

    I must ask, will the bare and polished version be included??

    Good work!

    Joseph

    www.fsxairsports.com

    Support the C-170B Project; send a private message.

  5. #5
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    If not with the package, the bare finish will certainly be provided as a free download. I'll likely be taking the bare textures adding a few more touches to them to make it into my own 'signature' personal transpot of sorts as well.

  6. #6
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    Here is an assortment of images of the real aircraft.







    The only known photo showing the artwork on the aircraft during WWII.





    Some early first-flight pics. Note that in order to make the paint stick, you cannot apply it to polished metal, so the metal has to remain a bit rough, so the paint has something to stick to. As can be seen in these photos, the cowling sections had been prepped for the application of the checker-board markings, though they had yet to be applied.


  7. #7
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    "Two Twilight Tears"

    One of the things possibly worth mentioning, is the fact that this isn't the same airframe which was painted as Twilight Tear that used to be owned by The Fighter Collection and based at Duxford a few years ago. Through a mistaken identity-connection, that airframe was indeed believed to have been the original "Twilight Tear", but that was due to a, if I recall correctly, paperwork issue from its time in Israel (it seems all P-51's that entered into the Israeli AF ended up having their serial numbers shuffled around and re-assigned - one other case in-point also being, that the airframe used in the "Galloping Ghost" owned by Jimmy Leeward, that came out of Israel, was almost certainly not the same airframe as the original "Galloping Ghost" of the 40's that went into Israel, for this very same reason (despite the Israeli paperwork claiming that it was the same airframe)). Even though the name "Lt. Bert Lee" and two Japanese flags were found etched into the metal of the TFC Mustang, the same metal the Mustang was originally produced with in 1944 and never removed, not much thought was given to it at the time that all of the belief was around that it was the wartime "Twilight Tear". However, by about 2006/2007, with the owner of the wreckage removed from Iceland, being able to prove absolutely that it was in fact the original 44-46863, and photographic evidence showing the wartime Pacific-based P-51K-10-NT "Fragile But Agile" with the exact name "Lt. Bert Lee", as well as the same two Japanese flags, painted on the aircraft in the exact same spots, it became clear that the former TFC Mustang, which had now switched owners, was actually the wartime Pacific-Theatre vet, and by 2010 the aircraft was fully restored and painted in the markings it really did once have during WWII.

    One of the interesting details about this, and that I have never seen brought up before, is that P-51K-10-NT's (quite early models) were manufactured with fabric elevators, where as by the time of P-51D-20-NA production, the elevators were all metal. The former TFC Mustang that was once thought of as being "Twilight Tear", had fabric elevators even up to the point that it was operating with The Fighter Collection (which the original Fragile But Agile had, being a P-51K-10-NT) - the aircraft now known to be the original "Twilight Tear" (or at least incoporating the remains of it), and the subject of this project, had metal elevators, as would be expected for it being a P-51D-20-NA (as "Twilight Tear" was).

  8. #8
    SOH-CM-2013 mikezola's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Berea, Ohio
    Age
    55
    Posts
    261
    Quote Originally Posted by Bomber_12th View Post
    Thank you Stiz, and I see your point. ; ) They're all different to me, and I just can't kick it.

    As I mentioned in other threads, this type of project is only another way to keep busy on top of the P-39, A-36/P-51A/P-51B, and eventual Tony projects.
    Tony? Eventually? As in Ki-61? As beautiful as these Mustangs????

  9. #9
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    Yeah, the Ki-61...how nice/detailed it will be, will depend on the resource materials I can continue to secure.

  10. #10
    Charter Member 2012 fsxar177's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Prairie, Idaho
    Age
    26
    Posts
    651
    Good history John...

    In regards to NX79111, or 44-15651and whether or not it was in fact the original "Galloping Ghost", one of the tell-tale factors is that it would have had to have been a rare surviving-15-NA Model. Furthermore, here's a few items of interest.

    1.) Cliff Cummins was quoted as saying that the Israeli government attempted to purchase the aircraft (original GG), but that the US blocked the sale. As I understand it, it is reported that the aircraft was just intended for export. Dr. Cummins would have known best, I would presume? If this is true, and the aircraft remained intact, and stateside, I would say this was indeed the original Ghost.

    2.) There is a chance that merely the original NAA Data Plate went to Israel, with another airframe., and possibly that airframe returned, and later became Dr. Cummins racer?

    3.) Jimmy believed he possessed the original Ghost

    Regardless, she was probably the most colorful of the racing mustangs in history, and sported more combinations of modifications as well, particularly in canopies. Gone, but not forgotten, long live Jimmy and the Ghost!

    Joseph

    www.fsxairsports.com

    Support the C-170B Project; send a private message.

  11. #11
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    I'm sorry for adding that bit in there about "GG", Joseph - number three on your list of points is certainly what mattered most in regards to the aircraft. I'll always miss watching Jimmy fly at Oshkosh (the only opportunities I ever had, to do so).

    I was going back through some of my bookmarks, and this is a photo posted to Airliners.net, showing the remains of the crashed 44-63864 being recovered in 1980. Although severely damaged (the pilot was killed in the landing accident in 1963), you can still easily make out the wings and the tail from the Mustang: http://www.airliners.net/photo/North...74bb65811f02a2

    And another lovely photo of the completed restoration, taken at Oshkosh last summer: http://www.airport-data.com/aircraft/photo/655856L.html



    Last edited by Bomber_12th; March 20th, 2012 at 18:03.

  12. #12
    Charter Member 2012 fsxar177's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Prairie, Idaho
    Age
    26
    Posts
    651
    John,
    No reason for apology. The legend of NX79111 has always been good discussion!

    Joseph

    www.fsxairsports.com

    Support the C-170B Project; send a private message.

  13. #13
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    I thought it would be worth mentioning too, that often times when you see swastika kill-markings applied in the way they are on Twilight Tear, you will get people saying that they are backwards and incorrectly applied (as would commonly be the case), but as the wartime photo of the aircraft shows, this was in fact the case on this particular aircraft.

    BTW, the OD/green-painted tanks that look rather strange mounted to the aircraft in some of the photos from Oshkosh last year, are M-10 Chemical/Smoke tanks, that were used during WWII for dispensing anything from tear gas to smoke screens (though I have never seen any evidence of P-51's using them during WWII, let alone any 78th FG Mustangs, I have seen photos of P-40's and A-20's having them mounted). When you look at the drop tank controls within the cockpit of a P-51, you will see referene to "Chem. Tanks", as you used the drop tank arming switches in a slightly different way in order to activate them, and thus when you hear reference to "Chem. Tanks", these are them. I think they were only presented with the restoration to help boost the 'interesting' and 'attention to detail' factor.

  14. #14
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    The restored version of 'Tear is now in beta, and with the research and study of the original wartime photos complete, the plans for reproducing the aircraft as it was photographed in March of 1945 are now set.

    Here are some screenshots of the beta-candidate. The modern avionics fitted within this aircraft are extremely minimal, just Com and Transponder heads, mounted in an easy-to-remove boxed-in panel assembly. The use of these two specific avionics heads has become a bit of a trend amongst some of the most authentic warbird restorations, as they are likely the least intrusive when compared to similar options, and they can be added into the cockpit without compromising the authenticity of the cockpit. The only modern aspects of the cockpit which remain fixed (just like the real-world example), are the phone and mic jacks and avionics circuit breakers (but they are presented in a way that looks correct for the period). The modern avionics panel is even mounted to the original/authentic radio bracket/panel in the cockpit, using the same mounting-holes as originally provided on this very panel when manufactured at NAA. When displaying the aircraft on the ground, when you open the gun bay the modern avionics panel is removed, so that the cockpit is as stock, for display purposes, as it can be.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Image1.jpg 
Views:	32 
Size:	135.8 KB 
ID:	62126   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Image2.jpg 
Views:	32 
Size:	182.8 KB 
ID:	62127   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Image3.jpg 
Views:	25 
Size:	160.9 KB 
ID:	62128   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Image4.jpg 
Views:	30 
Size:	139.2 KB 
ID:	62129  

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Image5.jpg 
Views:	26 
Size:	138.6 KB 
ID:	62130   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Image6.jpg 
Views:	31 
Size:	223.0 KB 
ID:	62131   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Image7.jpg 
Views:	39 
Size:	63.7 KB 
ID:	62132   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	Image8.jpg 
Views:	31 
Size:	134.0 KB 
ID:	62133  


  15. #15
    SOH-CM-2013 Bomber_12th's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    Minnesota
    Age
    25
    Posts
    3,117
    More work-in-progress, this time with a wartime-flavor. When the aircraft was photographed in March of 1945, just after it had accumulated its third kill, it still had the N-9 reflector gunsight fitted (as original from the factory, being an early-production P-51D-20-NA), and it also had not yet been fitted with the tail warning radar set (the restored aircraft is as it was either later in the war, or post-war/summer of '45, when the aircraft, by that point, had been modified with the addition of a K-14 gunsight and the tail warning radar set). Note within the screenshots the N-9 gunsight fitted and no tail warning radar set fitted.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

Name:	wwii_tt_1.jpg 
Views:	19 
Size:	206.5 KB 
ID:	62196   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	wwii_tt_2.jpg 
Views:	16 
Size:	238.3 KB 
ID:	62197   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	wwii_tt_4.jpg 
Views:	16 
Size:	145.2 KB 
ID:	62199   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	wwii_tt_5.jpg 
Views:	17 
Size:	124.0 KB 
ID:	62200  

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	wwii_tt_6.jpg 
Views:	12 
Size:	119.4 KB 
ID:	62201   Click image for larger version. 

Name:	wwii_tt_7.jpg 
Views:	21 
Size:	107.5 KB 
ID:	62214  

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Similar Threads

  1. P-51D Mustang "Twilight Tear".zip
    By Bomber_12th in forum Warbirds Library
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: October 15th, 2012, 04:54
  2. Twilight Tear Through September Sky
    By Bomber_12th in forum FSX General Discussion
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: September 21st, 2012, 23:16
  3. Warbirdsim P-51D "Twilight Tear, Then and Now" Released (Payware)
    By Bomber_12th in forum FSX General Discussion
    Replies: 87
    Last Post: June 20th, 2012, 11:40
  4. "Twilight" at twilight
    By fsxar177 in forum FSX General Discussion
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: May 31st, 2012, 19:41
  5. TWILIGHT ZONE........."TO SERVE MAN
    By beana51 in forum The NewsHawks
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: January 3rd, 2011, 16:35

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  


Avsim - Flightsim - SimFlight - Simviation - iflyonline - CFS IP - Quarter Moon Saloon - Com-Central