Flight Dynamics
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Thread: Flight Dynamics

  1. #1

    Flight Dynamics

    Hi

    I'm having a problem with some flight dynamics that when pulling high G's in a turn my aircraft sits in a 20 degree angle knife edge as it performs the turn, it doesn't drop or gain height in the turn it just sits in a knife edge all the way round

    Is there anything in the aircraft.cfg that I can edit that can keep it at 0 degree so it doesn't side slip in the turn

    [flight_tuning]
    cruise_lift_scalar=1.000
    pitch_stability=1.000
    roll_stability=1.000
    yaw_stability=1.000
    parasite_drag_scalar=2.000
    induced_drag_scalar=1.000
    elevator_effectiveness=2.000
    aileron_effectiveness=1.000
    rudder_effectiveness=1.000
    elevator_trim_effectiveness=1.000
    aileron_trim_effectiveness=1.000
    rudder_trim_effectiveness=1.000

    That's the flight tuning in the cfg

    Thanks
    Matt
    Usually found in Sony Vegas creating the next FS Video and occasionally repainting for movie purposes

    http://www.youtube.com/user/UKVoodooUK

    Spring chicken to s***ehawk in one easy lesson

    daga daga daga daga daga daga daga daga

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by UKVoodoo View Post
    Hi

    I'm having a problem with some flight dynamics that when pulling high G's in a turn my aircraft sits in a 20 degree angle knife edge as it performs the turn, it doesn't drop or gain height in the turn it just sits in a knife edge all the way round

    Is there anything in the aircraft.cfg that I can edit that can keep it at 0 degree so it doesn't side slip in the turn

    [flight_tuning]
    cruise_lift_scalar=1.000
    pitch_stability=1.000
    roll_stability=1.000
    yaw_stability=1.000
    parasite_drag_scalar=2.000
    induced_drag_scalar=1.000
    elevator_effectiveness=2.000
    aileron_effectiveness=1.000
    rudder_effectiveness=1.000
    elevator_trim_effectiveness=1.000
    aileron_trim_effectiveness=1.000
    rudder_trim_effectiveness=1.000

    That's the flight tuning in the cfg

    Thanks
    Matt

    Flight_tuning is not sufficient to analyze the problem, even if the values parasite_drag_scalar and elevator_effectiveness=2.000 are maybe too big... The entire flight dynamics is needed to solve the problem...

  3. #3
    I don't quite understand what is happening with the aircraft from your description. What is the aircraft by the way?
    W10-64 Pro, 3GHz, 16GB Ram, AMD Radeon HD 5570

  4. #4
    Its the Alphasim Viggen



    As you can see rather then been level in the turn (like the contrails show it should be) the aircraft is 20 degrees nose up in a knife edge as I'm making the turn

    Below is everything in the cfg apart from the flightsim.x entries


    [General]
    editable=1
    performance=Model: C Edwards\nPanel: P Perrott\nTextures: C Edwards \ Jens-Ole Koelberg\nFlight Model: J. McDaniel\n\nLength: 53 ft 9.25 in\nSpan: 34 ft 9.25 in\nWing area: 495.16 sq ft\nWeight: empty: 26,896 lbs\s maximum: 49,604 lbs.\nPower: (1) Volvo Flygmoter turbofan, 16,200 lbs thrust, 28,110 lbs. with afterburning\nRange: 1,250 miles\nMax Speed, altitude: Mach 2.0 @ 36,000 ft\nMax Speed, sea level: Mach 1.2\nService Ceiling: 60,000 ft.\nArmament: (1) 30 mm Oerlikon cannon, up to 13,228 lbs. of disposable stores.
    atc_type=SAAB AIRCRAFT
    atc_model=


    [Views]
    eyepoint=16.8, 0.0, 1.75 //(feet) longitudinal, lateral, vertical distance from reference datum

    [weight_and_balance]

    // ACM V2.3
    max_gross_weight = 49604
    empty_weight = 26896
    reference_datum_position = 0, 0, 0
    empty_weight_CG_position = 0, 0, 0
    empty_weight_pitch_MOI = 130981
    empty_weight_roll_MOI = 65720
    empty_weight_yaw_MOI = 110426
    empty_weight_coupled_MOI = 0
    max_number_of_stations = 1

    station_load.0 = 0.000000,0.000000,0.000000,0.000000


    [lights]

    //Types: 1=beacon, 2=strobe, 3=navigation, 4=cockpit, 5=landing

    light.0 = 4, 18.75, 0.0, 1.00, fx_vclight,
    light.2 = 2, -16.5,-14.9, -1.50, fx_contrail_Alpha Viggen
    light.3 = 2, -16.5, 14.9, -1.50, fx_contrail_Alpha Viggen
    light.4 = 2, 5.1, 7.82, 0, fx_contrail_Alpha Viggen
    light.5 = 2, 5.1, -7.82, 0, fx_contrail_Alpha Viggen
    light.6 = 3, -14.00, 0.00, 0.0, fx_engine_Alpha Viggen
    light.7 = 5, -14, 0, 0, fx_coral_f15ab-blue
    light.8 = 5, -13.92, 0, 0, fx_coral_f15ab-or

    [GeneralEngineData]

    //0=Piston, 1=Jet, 2=None, 3=Helo-Turbine, 4=Rocket, 5=Turboprop
    engine_type = 1
    fuel_flow_scalar = 1.000
    engine.0 = -14.000, 0.000, 0.000

    [smokesystem]
    smoke.0 = 0, -17.84, 0, fx_coral_f15exhaust


    [fuel]

    //Longitudinal (feet), Lateral (feet), Vertical (feet), Usable(gallons), Unusable (gallons)

    fuel_type = 2
    number_of_tank_selectors = 1

    LeftMain = 0, -1.5, 0, 750, 5
    RightMain = 0, 1.5, 0, 750, 5
    electric_pump=0


    [contact_points]
    static_pitch = 0
    static_cg_height = 7.335
    tailwheel_lock = 0
    max_number_of_points = 7

    point.0 = 1.000, 16.919, 0.000, -7.500, 3000.000, 0.000, 0.685, 30.000, 0.400, 2.500, 0.800, 5.000, 5.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000
    point.1 = 1.000, -2.917, -6.650, -7.333, 4000.000, 1.000, 1.000, 0.000, 0.282, 2.500, 0.800, 5.000, 5.000, 2.000, 0.000, 0.000
    point.2 = 1.000, -2.917, 6.650, -7.333, 4000.000, 2.000, 1.000, 0.000, 0.282, 2.500, 0.800, 5.000, 5.000, 3.000, 0.000, 0.000
    point.3 = 2.000, -15.748, -14.989, -1.333, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 5.000, 0.000, 0.000
    point.4 = 2.000, -15.840, 14.989, -1.333, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 6.000, 0.000, 0.000
    point.5 = 2.000, -19.917, 0.000, -2.000, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 9.000, 0.000, 0.000
    point.6 = 2.000, 27.288, 0.000, -2.525, 1574.803, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 0.000, 4.000, 0.000, 0.000
    gear_system_type=1


    [keyboard_response]
    elevator = 150.000000, 250.000000
    aileron = 150.000000, 250.000000
    rudder = 150.000000, 250.000000


    [forcefeedback]
    gear_bump_nose_magnitude = 1000
    gear_bump_nose_direction = 18000
    gear_bump_nose_duration = 250000
    gear_bump_left_magnitude = 2000
    gear_bump_left_direction = 35500
    gear_bump_left_duration = 250000
    gear_bump_right_magnitude = 2000
    gear_bump_right_direction = 500
    gear_bump_right_duration = 250000
    ground_bumps_magnitude1 = 1250
    ground_bumps_angle1 = 8900
    ground_bumps_intercept1 = 5
    ground_bumps_slope1 = 0.48
    ground_bumps_magnitude2 = 450
    ground_bumps_angle2 = 9100
    ground_bumps_intercept2 = 0.075
    ground_bumps_slope2 = 1
    crash_magnitude1 = 2000
    crash_direction1 = 1000
    crash_magnitude2 = 2000
    crash_direction2 = 9000
    crash_period2 = 7500
    crash_duration2 = 2500000
    stick_shaker_magnitude = 2000
    stick_shaker_direction = 0
    stick_shaker_period = 111111

    [airplane_geometry]
    //ACM_AREAW1// 0,0,0,6.7939,0.5891,0.5891,0.8413,7.2956,1.1782,1. 1782
    //ACM_AREAW2// 1.6826,7.7972,1.7673,1.7673,2.5240,8.2989,2.3564,2 .3564,3.3653,8.8005
    //ACM_AREAW3// 2.9455,2.9455,4.2066,9.3021,3.5346,3.5346,5.0480,9 .8038,4.1237,4.1237
    //ACM_AREAW4// 5.8893,10.3054,4.7128,4.7128,6.7306,10.8070,5.3019 ,5.3019,7.5720,11.3087
    //ACM_AREAH1// 0,0,0,1.6936,0.2822,0.2822,0.4031,2.0121,0.5645,0. 5645
    //ACM_AREAH2// 0.8062,2.3305,0.8468,0.8468,1.2094,2.6490,1.1291,1 .1291,1.6125,2.9674
    //ACM_AREAH3// 1.4113,1.4113,2.0156,3.2859,1.6936,1.6936,2.4188,3 .6043,1.9759,1.9759
    //ACM_AREAH4// 2.8219,3.9228,2.2582,2.2582,3.2250,4.2412,2.5405,2 .5405,3.6282,4.5597
    //ACM_AREAV1// 0,0,0,2.0878,0.2319,0.2319,0.3313,2.2521,0.4639,0. 4639
    //ACM_AREAV2// 0.6626,2.4164,0.6959,0.6959,0.9939,2.5807,0.9279,0 .9279,1.3252,2.7450
    //ACM_AREAV3// 1.1599,1.1599,1.6565,2.9092,1.3919,1.3919,1.9878,3 .0735,1.6239,1.6239
    //ACM_AREAV4// 2.3191,3.2378,1.8558,1.8558,2.6504,3.4021,2.0878,2 .0878,2.9818,3.5664
    //ACM_CAREAW1// 2.6509,2.6509,7.1830,8.5418,2.9455,2.9455,7.6036,8 .8945,3.2401,3.2401
    //ACM_CAREAW2// 8.0243,9.2472,3.5346,3.5346,8.4450,9.5999,3.8292,3 .8292,8.8656,9.9527
    //ACM_CAREAW3// 4.1237,4.1237,9.2863,10.3054,4.4183,4.4183,9.7070, 10.6581,4.7128,4.7128
    //ACM_CAREAW4// 10.1276,11.0109,5.0074,5.0074,10.5483,11.3636,5.30 19,5.3019,10.9690,11.7163
    //ACM_CAREAH1// 0,0,0.8468,1.6936,0.2822,0.2822,1.2499,2.0544,0.56 45,0.5645
    //ACM_CAREAH2// 1.6531,2.4152,0.8468,0.8468,2.0562,2.7760,1.1291,1 .1291,2.4593,3.1368
    //ACM_CAREAH3// 1.4113,1.4113,2.8625,3.4976,1.6936,1.6936,3.2656,3 .8584,1.9759,1.9759
    //ACM_CAREAH4// 3.6687,4.2192,2.2582,2.2582,4.0719,4.5800,2.5405,2 .5405,4.4750,4.9408
    //ACM_CAREAV1// 0,0,0.5219,1.5659,0.2319,0.2319,0.8532,1.8137,0.46 39,0.4639
    //ACM_CAREAV2// 1.1845,2.0615,0.6959,0.6959,1.5159,2.3092,0.9279,0 .9279,1.8472,2.5570
    //ACM_CAREAV3// 1.1599,1.1599,2.1785,2.8048,1.3919,1.3919,2.5098,3 .0526,1.6239,1.6239
    //ACM_CAREAV4// 2.8411,3.3004,1.8558,1.8558,3.1724,3.5482,2.0878,2 .0878,3.5037,3.7960
    wing_area = 495.160
    wing_span = 34.790
    wing_root_chord = 22.290
    wing_dihedral = 3.000
    wing_incidence = 0.000
    wing_twist = 0.000
    oswald_efficiency_factor = 0.890
    wing_winglets_flag = 0
    wing_sweep = 55.000
    wing_pos_apex_lon = 14.012
    wing_pos_apex_vert = 0.000
    htail_area = 71.000
    htail_span = 16.670
    htail_pos_lon = -20.760
    htail_pos_vert = 0.000
    htail_incidence = 0.000
    htail_sweep = 55.000
    vtail_area = 30.000
    vtail_span = 6.850
    vtail_sweep = 55.000
    vtail_pos_lon = -5.110
    vtail_pos_vert = 3.060
    elevator_area = 30.000
    aileron_area = 50.000
    rudder_area = 15.000
    elevator_up_limit = 24.000
    elevator_down_limit = 20.000
    aileron_up_limit = 15.000
    aileron_down_limit = 15.000
    rudder_limit = 22.000
    elevator_trim_limit = 18.000
    spoiler_limit = 60.000
    aileron_to_spoileron_gain = 0.000
    min_ailerons_for_spoilerons = 0.000
    min_flaps_for_spoilerons = 0.000
    spoilerons_available = 0

    [electrical]
    max_battery_voltage = 24
    generator_alternator_voltage = 28
    max_generator_alternator_amps = 300
    electric_always_available = 1

    [TurbineEngineData]
    fuel_flow_gain=0.002
    inlet_area=6.500
    rated_N2_rpm=29920.000
    static_thrust=16200.000
    afterburner_available=1
    reverser_available=1.000

    [Reference Speeds]
    flaps_up_stall_speed=126.000
    full_flaps_stall_speed=97.000
    cruise_speed=800.000
    max_indicated_speed=1200
    max_mach=2.1

    [autopilot]
    autopilot_available=1
    flight_director_available=1
    default_vertical_speed=2000.000000
    autothrottle_available=1
    autothrottle_arming_required=0
    autothrottle_takeoff_ga=0
    autothrottle_max_rpm=90.000000
    pitch_takeoff_ga=8.000000
    max_pitch=15.000000
    max_pitch_acceleration=2
    max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt=2.0
    max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt=1.5
    max_pitch_velocity_lo_alt_breakpoint=20000.000000
    max_pitch_velocity_hi_alt_breakpoint=28000.000000
    max_bank=25.000000
    max_bank_acceleration=1.800000
    max_bank_velocity=3.000000
    max_throttle_rate=0.100000
    nav_proportional_control=9.000000
    nav_integrator_control=0.250000
    nav_derivative_control=0.000000
    nav_integrator_boundary=2.500000
    nav_derivative_boundary=0.000000
    gs_proportional_control=9.520000
    gs_integrator_control=0.260000
    gs_derivative_control=0.000000
    gs_integrator_boundary=0.700000
    gs_derivative_boundary=0.000000
    yaw_damper_gain=0.000000

    [direction_indicators]
    direction_indicator.0=3,0

    [brakes]
    toe_brakes_scale=1
    parking_brake=1
    [gear_warning_system]
    gear_warning_available=1
    pct_throttle_limit=0.000000
    flap_limit_power=0.000000
    flap_limit_idle=0.000000
    [hydraulic_system]
    normal_pressure=3000.000000
    engine_map= 1, 0, 0, 0
    [stall_warning]
    type=1
    [attitude_indicators]
    attitude_indicator.0=1
    [turn_indicators]
    turn_indicator.0=1,0

    [jet_engine]
    thrust_scalar=0.700

    [flight_tuning]
    cruise_lift_scalar=1.000
    pitch_stability=1.000
    roll_stability=1.000
    yaw_stability=1.000
    parasite_drag_scalar=2.000
    induced_drag_scalar=1.000
    elevator_effectiveness=2.000
    aileron_effectiveness=1.000
    rudder_effectiveness=1.000
    elevator_trim_effectiveness=1.000
    aileron_trim_effectiveness=1.000
    rudder_trim_effectiveness=1.000

    [Flaps.0]
    type= 1
    span-outboard= 0.500
    extending-time= 5.000
    system_type= 1
    damaging-speed= 325.000
    blowout-speed= 400.000
    lift_scalar= 0.001
    drag_scalar= 3.000
    pitch_scalar= 1.000
    flaps-position.0= 0.000, 0.000
    flaps-position.1= 10.000, 0.000
    flaps-position.2= 20.000, 0.000
    flaps-position.3= 30.000, 0.000
    flaps-position.4= 45.000, 0.000

    [Radios]
    // Radio Type = availiable, standby frequency, has glide slope
    Audio.1=1
    Com.1=1
    Com.2=1
    Nav.1=1,0,1
    Nav.2=1
    Adf.1=1
    Transponder.1=1
    Marker.1=1
    Usually found in Sony Vegas creating the next FS Video and occasionally repainting for movie purposes

    http://www.youtube.com/user/UKVoodooUK

    Spring chicken to s***ehawk in one easy lesson

    daga daga daga daga daga daga daga daga

  5. #5
    A link to the aircraft in question would be helpful, since there's data in the .air file that's not in the aircraft.cfg file.
    Thermaltake H570 TG Tower
    X670 Aorus Elite AX motherboard
    AMD Ryzen 9 7900X 12-Core Processor
    NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070
    NZXT Kraken X cooler
    32GB DDR5 RAM
    750 Watt PS
    Windows 11 Home

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Tom Clayton View Post
    A link to the aircraft in question would be helpful, since there's data in the .air file that's not in the aircraft.cfg file.
    Yes indeed...
    And some flights to refresh the nose...

  7. #7
    As stated in above its the Alphasim Viggen so I cant provide links as its a payware aircraft, it doesnt matter ill write it off as a bad job and find another aircraft
    Usually found in Sony Vegas creating the next FS Video and occasionally repainting for movie purposes

    http://www.youtube.com/user/UKVoodooUK

    Spring chicken to s***ehawk in one easy lesson

    daga daga daga daga daga daga daga daga

  8. #8
    High angle of attack at high G forces in curves are normal.
    It is quite normal when the aircraft is decelerated.

  9. #9
    I'd say that sounds normal to me, i remember seeing one perform at an Mildenhall air fete (oh happy memorys ) doing just that.
    cheers ian

  10. #10
    Oh right that's okay then, just seemed weird it knife-edging all the way through the turn while not gaining or losing height...thanks for the help all :salute:
    Usually found in Sony Vegas creating the next FS Video and occasionally repainting for movie purposes

    http://www.youtube.com/user/UKVoodooUK

    Spring chicken to s***ehawk in one easy lesson

    daga daga daga daga daga daga daga daga

  11. #11

    Hair Ball?

    UKV,
    Here are my recommendations for changes to aircraft.cfg geometry section. I suspect the air needs tweaking as well.
    Viggen: 'bogus' attitude on turns:
    ------------------------------------------------
    wing_sweep = 55.000 change to = 0.000
    oswald_efficiency_factor = 0.890 change to = 0.680
    wing_pos_apex_lon = 14.012 change to = 4.012
    htail_area=34.000 change to = 24.000
    htail_sweep = 55.000 change to = 0.000
    htail_pos_lon = -20.760 change to = -13.000
    vtail_sweep = 55.000 change to = 0.000
    vtail_pos_lon = -5.110 change to = -15.000

    All the above (default) values are PATHETIC. They are not spec or 'real' (B-737 maybe?). Change to values indicated. Try it. The air file (flight_dynamics) section most likely needs to be scrutinized/ammended as well. 'Creative' dynamics are not preatty, or cute, or cuddly, or worth a dime. Good luck with this.
    Chuck B
    Napamule
    [SIGPIC]i7 2600K @ 3.4 Ghz, Asus P8H67 Pro, Super Talent 8 Gb DDR3/1333 Dual Channel, Sapphire Ati Radeon HD-5700 1 Gb DDR5, Corsair 650 W PSU, Acer 23 in LCD, Windows XP SP2, MS Sidewinder Precision 2 Joy, Logitech K-360 wireless KB & Mouse[/SIGPIC]

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