Ivan's Workshop - AF99 Tutorial - C205 Veltro

**Ivan** · August 13th, 2011, 10:14

The problem with gluing single Propeller Blades to the Spinner is that after each Blade is attached, the center of the whole assembly thus far moves substantially. Thus each blad is not attached quite as you might expect. The appearance looked more or less reasonable in the last screenshots but here is what happens when the pieces are animated and rotated from their original positions.

The First Screenshot shows the far side propeller blade bleeding through the front part of the Spinner. Note that from the AF99 standpoint, those blades are on the NEAR side and are in the foreground. Aircraft Animator did the rotation but did not change the viewing planes to correct for these differences.

The Second Screenshot shows the Spinner bleeding through the near side propeller blade. Again, this was correct from the AF99 standpoint. Some designers don't take this into account which is why this is often seen in CFS aircraft.

Note that these screenshots were taken while the Propeller was spinning.

At this point we are at 1196 of 1200 Parts, so there isn't much left to use to address any issues. I went back and made some changes to the Rudder, Stabilisers, and Wing Tips to recover about 12 Parts. There is room to remove more in my opinion, but beyond this point, the model is being degraded. It may not be noticeable, but the countours WILL be affected.

....

**Ivan** · August 13th, 2011, 10:56

The reason why the Propeller Blades were added to the Spinner as single blades rather than as a Component is because as Single Blades, they are Insignia Parts. They all face forward and are invisible when seen from behind. Note that when we had Propeller Blades assembled with the Spinner and facing aft, they were bleeding through the Nose.

The solution to this situation (after much experimentation) was to use two Components for the Propeller Blades. This project had already used 30 of 30 Components, so the Tail Gear Doors were converted to single Parts.

Now considering that we want just the Forward Side of the Propeller Blades to show in the Spinner Assembly, but the fact that they all radiate from a single center point means that if we change the Component to Sharp or Smooth, what will actually show is indeterminate.

My solution to this was to create some new Propeller Blades for the Component included with the Spinner assembly. Each Blade is rotated 1 degree so that the Front side of the Blade is facing OUTWARD from the Component. The difference between the rotated and unrotated blade is not very visible in the simulator but is enough for AF99 to determine an inside and outside face. When we change the component to Sharp or Smooth, only the Outside face shows. The Difference between the original blade and the slightly rotated blade can be seen in the First Screenshot.

The Second Screenshot shows the result in the simulator. Watching the Propeller spin shows that the result was as intended. This is not so well illustrated in a Screenshot.

Time for Lunch.
- Ivan.

**Ivan** · August 14th, 2011, 06:14

There is a lot of stuff coming together at the underside of the Veltro. Many other planes have a similar arrangement with Flaps, a central Radiator, Landing Gear Doors, etc. The technique described here results in what I believe to be minimal bleeds (though there are some as always) without a lot of complicated usage of "Glue".

The Screenshots attached show the various groups that all come together at the underside of the aircraft: Body Main, Center Gear, Wing (I am only showing the Left), and Left Gear. The Right side is identical of course. Note that the Pilot appears in all of the Screenshots. The reason for this is because AF99 apparently requires that SOMETHING exist in "Body,Main" or else the project can not be produced.

Figuring this sequence out actually took me a couple days to go through things that did not work. I was trying out some very complicated solutions with much worse results until this simple solution just became obvious.

- Ivan.

**Ivan** · August 14th, 2011, 06:23

Here are some Screenshots showing the result. Note that the model has been animated at this point. Flaps and Landing Gear are all down to show the most complicated situation possible as far as relationships between the various pieces.

Remaining Bleeds are fairly minor..... Mostly.

- Ivan.

**Ivan** · August 14th, 2011, 06:28

There is one major bleed that I really have no solution for. It is the result of using Aircraft Animator to move Pieces away from their relative positions when the veiwing planes were established. It happens in just about every aircraft I have ever built.

It only occurs during the landing gear retraction sequence but it isn't visible for very long.

- Ivan.

**Ivan** · August 15th, 2011, 04:24

http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforum...tid=19&id=4491

Hello All,

At this point, I consider the basic 3D model of this aircraft to be complete within the limits of AF99 and Aircraft Animator. I am fairly satisifed with the shape and general appearance of this Aeroplane as an untextured model. As with any project there are things that may yet be improved or changed and I may continue to do that at some point. If there are questions about what was done or items that require clarification, please post and I will address if I can.

The 3D model has been uploaded here so that anyone who is curious may download and review in their simulator. The flight model that is in this package has not been extensively tested because I really don't have enough information on handling characteristics. The Level Speeds, Engine Power, Fuel, and Basic Characteristics are pretty much correct. I have no faith that the Climb Rates claimed for this aircraft are correct. The DP file was created quickly to be used in flight testing (Weights and Balance affect performance and handling) but otherwise also has not been extensively tested. Use the Checklist and ReadMe files for additional information about this aeroplane.

I believe the coverage of the techniques uses has been adequate but if anyone has questions or comments, either contact me here or at Ivan1GFP@yahoo.com.

Enjoy!
- Ivan.

**hubbabubba** · August 15th, 2011, 06:35

This tutorial is well beyond BALSA1 and BALSA2.

The AF99 would-be designers now have all the tools to make their own planes.

Congratulations on a job well done, Ivan.:ernae:

**smilo** · August 15th, 2011, 18:14

i agree, nicely done.

**Ivan** · August 16th, 2011, 03:43

Thanks Guys. Let me know if there are any other areas that need some extra coverage. Considering how little time I actually spent on the AIR file, it seems to be pretty fair. The plane was supposed to be capable of around 400 mph at 18,000 feet. This one hits 405 mph at 15,000 feet and 399 mph at 17,500 feet. Engine power is within 5-10 hp of where it should be. Guns are not harmonised.

Time for another project!
- Ivan.

**Ivan** · August 18th, 2011, 12:49

I sent a version of this plane to Hubbabubba a couple weeks ago and he managed to find a rather unsightly bleed of the Pitot Tube through the Left Wing when seen from the back. I will post a screenshot when I get a chance. This bleed was trivial to fix. I had simply left out the Glue between the Pitot and the Left Wing.

Hubbabubba has a VERY good eye for detail. If there is something to be found, chances are pretty good he will find it. One additional Glue Part was added as a result. Thans again, Hubbabubba!

Total Parts Count is up to 1192.

- Ivan.

**hubbabubba** · August 18th, 2011, 21:25

Originally Posted by Ivan

I sent a version of this plane to Hubbabubba a couple weeks ago and he managed to find a rather unsightly bleed of the Pitot Tube through the Left Wing when seen from the back. I will post a screenshot when I get a chance. This bleed was trivial to fix. I had simply left out the Glue between the Pitot and the Left Wing.

Hubbabubba has a VERY good eye for detail. If there is something to be found, chances are pretty good he will find it. One additional Glue Part was added as a result. Thans again, Hubbabubba!

Total Parts Count is up to 1192.

- Ivan.

That's what friends are for!

I could basically say the same of you, Ivan. When it comes to eyeballing bleeds, you're the best. I'm simply trying to emulate you (and seldomly succeed!).

Incidentally, how about painting this one and give us an AF99 texture tutorial. I know you've already done something along these lines, but starting with this project "from scratch" would certainly help me understand your technique (I hope...

).

**smilo** · August 19th, 2011, 09:47

Originally Posted by hubbabubba

That's what friends are for!

I could basically say the same of you, Ivan. When it comes to eyeballing bleeds, you're the best. I'm simply trying to emulate you (and seldomly succeed!).

Incidentally, how about painting this one and give us an AF99 texture tutorial. I know you've already done something along these lines, but starting with this project "from scratch" would certainly help me understand your technique (I hope...

).

i was thinking exactly the same thing,
but understand that Ivan wants to move on.

shhh, did somebody say B-26?

**Ivan** · August 22nd, 2011, 13:04

Actually it isn't so much a matter of moving on. I never really had all that much interest in this aircraft even in the beginning. The Paint Shop to me is the most tedious part of the whole project. I really dislike this part.

I probably will eventually paint this aeroplane so perhaps a few weeks down the road, I may start a tutorial on the subject. In some ways this plane is a good illustration of the AI Propeller and Animated Spinner. These features really aren't visible unless the aircraft is textured.

At the moment, I just want to spend some time doing some "Lazy Designing". (Sort of like "Lazy Flying" with no definite deadline or result in mind.)

Besides the B-26, I am also actively researching the Ju 87B Stuka, A-20 Havoc, J2M Raiden (which was shoved aside for this tutorial), and the Ki-84 Hayate.

I am also debating on mentioning this tutorial on WW2Aircraft.net.

- Ivan.

**Ivan** · August 29th, 2011, 07:16

Hi Folks,

What kind of paint should the C.205 Veltro wear? I am just looking for suggestions. My first paint job for this plane will wear at least the Savoy cross and markings from before Italy's surrender in 1943. I have a couple ideas, but just wanted to see what others were looking for.

- Ivan.

**hubbabubba** · August 29th, 2011, 14:55

This one looks great; HERE.
I like the darker tones than what we're used to see.

**Ivan** · August 29th, 2011, 18:28

To me that photograph just looks like the Desert pattern under poor lighting.

**hubbabubba** · August 31st, 2011, 12:27

Originally Posted by Ivan

To me that photograph just looks like the Desert pattern under poor lighting.

The "poor lightning" is in fact the fading of an old colored photograph taken in the summer of 1943 in Sardinia. As you want to depict a fascist Reggia Aeronautica aircraft, your choices are pretty limited. I would lighten the basic yellow-brownish background but keep the dark olive blotches. Another example can be found HERE

To my taste, other models are too light and not very "camouflaged".

**Ivan** · August 31st, 2011, 15:18

Hi Hubbabubba,

I believe the basic choices to be more or less authentic for this aircraft are:
1. Dark Green overall - I believe this was done on the early versions to be flown in Europe.
2. Dark Green base with Light Brown or Tan splotches.
3. Tan base with Medium Olive splotches.
4. Tan base with Medium Olive Rings.
5. Tan base with Dark Green Rings.

I am tending toward the Dark Green base with Light / Medium Brown splotches. The ANR stuff was different shades of Gray and very similar to the contemporary Messerschmitt 109, but I don't know if it ever wore the Savoy Cross before the surrender. Perhaps it was only an insignia change perhaps more.

- Ivan.

**Ivan** · May 27th, 2012, 03:19

I guess it is this bird's time for a paint job.

Anna Honey is on a trip in Asia for trhe next week and a half, so I am not likely to get much time in front of the development computer.

- Ivan.

**Ivan** · October 29th, 2012, 18:10

Here is the Veltro with a Ghost Gray scheme (Gray Primer) in a duel with its AI twin.

- Ivan.

**Ivan** · August 14th, 2013, 16:18

Here is a minor update. This is actually not the Veltro; It is the little brother the Folgore.
Paint job isn't anywhere near done yet, but I thought the Savoy crest would be the hardest part so did it first.

I believe it turned out quite well considering that the actual crest is only about 20 pixes wide in the actual texture file

- Ivan.

**No Dice** · August 15th, 2013, 06:06

Crest came out great !! The plane ain't to bad either.

Dave

**smilo** · August 16th, 2013, 09:51

yup. i concur. very nice on both counts.

**Ivan** · July 6th, 2015, 14:42

With the recent issues with Window 8.1 and its Paint Utility, I decided to do a bit of work on the Macchi C.202 Folgore.
One can always improve the paint scheme a little, but this is close enough to satisfy me for now.
The spots are actually more difficult to paint than the insignia. Once I explained what the requirements were to my son, he commented also that it was much harder than it appeared.

I also found a section on which I simply could not effectively apply a camouflage pattern at all. Hopefully it is hidden well enough that it doesn't matter.

So now, we just have to give the paint a chance to dry.

Too bad all the prior screenshots are gone. It would have been interesting to do a comparison.

- Ivan.