Wep paks and preloads

[hurricane3]

I think I asked this a long time ago but forgot what the answer was. Whats the difference betweeen the AvHistory Wep Pak and the Full preload? The discription seems the same for both.
Also if I wanted to install all the addons, OFF,MAW ,PTO,ETO,and the new BOB would I need these wep paks and the nationality pak?
Sorry if I asked this before but thinking about a new computer and my install of CFS3 works fine but don't remember all I've done to it over the years.I still have problems installing new aircraft freezing up the computer though,and having to delete them.
This time I'll save the answer, if someone is kind enough to overlook my dumbness. Thankyou

[gaw]

no such thing....we all forget....I know I do. The AvHistory weapons pak is the gold standard for guns, pylons, bombs, bullets.....a gazillion things that all the installs use.....it's a must for all of them as most planes, vehicles, ships, etc. use those elements. The preload I believe is simply a set of effects that are seen a great deal and that the game must search for whenever you see a muzzleflash or a splash for example. The preload.xml that comes standard is a lot shorter than the full preload that helps your computer get a jump on a lot of the newer effects that are in the newer installs. The wep pak and the preload are two different beasts and both are necessary. The NEK or nationality pak is also needed to access all the nationalities that DIDN'T come with the base install.....Russia, Japan, Romania, etc. What does that mean....it means when you load your newer add-ons you have a bigger list of nations on your drop down menu and can choose and fly the planes that belong to that country......ie:you must install the NEK. Lot of stuff to be sure but worth it. Good Luck

[hurricane3]

Thankyou so much for the reply,I thought a long time ago someone said if you install any or all the addons,MAW, OFF,ETO,PTO,BOB,(DPC Korea,which I have) ,that they all came with their own Wep Paks and Nationality paks and you didn't need the ones from AvHistory, but I guess thats wrong.
I know I had the Wep Pak current at the time and Nationality Pak as well as Firepower installed when I installed DPC Korea.
So as I understand it now you really should start with a clean install with the update(is it 3.1?there goes my mind again)the current Wep Pak and the full preload plus the Nationality Expansion pak,before you install any addons.

[gaw]

no....you're right...the new add-ons do include all the things you need...it's just the original CFS3 that needed modding to to play other planes/nationalities.....and all you need to start with to install any of the others is a clean CFS3 patched up to 3.1

[ndicki]

The AvHistory pack came out after MAW, uses a lot of MAW effects, etc, and adds to them. I've installed it over the issue MAW effects and weapons. Take care though to back everything up though, just in case!

[hurricane3]

Thankyou both for replying,sounds like you can install the WEP PAKS AND Preload and the addons,it won't hurt but may add to some efffects.I know I already had the WEP PAK of the time,installed (don't think there was a preload at the time) and it didn't hurt DPC Korea.

[hurricane3]

OK guys more questions.Sorry for all the questions but since I'am retired and sooner or later will get a new computer this is stuff I'd like to know ,although surprizingly my computer is 10 years old and am still running a ATI 128 vid card.It runs CFS3 and DPC korea surprizingly well though.
Ok enough yaking off topic ,I have a lot of older AvHistory planes, would it hurt to download the newer AvHistory weapons pak and preloads.
I can't seem to download any newer planes which have anything other than guns. An example is the Wellington from Regs hanger it freezes up the computer every time I try and download it and I have to reboot so I can fly something else to delete it.I was able to download the Defiants but they have no weapons other than guns.I couldn.t download the Boomerang even though it had a self installer,everything frozeup.
I've had planes that freeze up the sim as soon as they appear ,and ones that freeze up when you click on a weapon.
I know some of these might be a sound issue as I had to replace the sound files on Regs Hurricanes ,but I was wondering if installing the latest wep Pak and preload might help with planes that have ordance.
One more question for now ,should I make a folder for shared files? Right now they are scattered all over. I'am sorry this is so long ,I'll try and make the next smaller. Thankyou

[ndicki]

That is what happens whenever you have missing pylons, weapons or guns. I imagine it'll cease - or pretty well cease - once you've got the AvHistory weapons installed. These are to all intents and purposes the standard used for most add-on aircraft.

To be really sure, open the aircraft's xdp file using windows notepad, and look for the following lines:

<GunStations>
<GunStation UpLimit="0" DownLimit="0" LeftLimit="0" RightLimit="0" RateLimit="0" SystemID="machine_guns" Tracer="40" Trainable="0" Trigger="1" Type="AvHistory_gr_gun_Mg131_L" Name="Left MG" ConvergeDistance="300" Pitch=".1489" MaxAmmo="300" UseSmallFlash="1"/>
<GunStation UpLimit="0" DownLimit="0" LeftLimit="0" RightLimit="0" RateLimit="0" SystemID="machine_guns" Tracer="40" Trainable="0" Trigger="1" Type="AvHistory_gr_gun_Mg131_R" Name="Right MG" ConvergeDistance="300" Pitch=".1489" MaxAmmo="300" UseSmallFlash="1"/>
<GunStation UpLimit="0" DownLimit="0" LeftLimit="0" RightLimit="0" RateLimit="0" SystemID="cannon" Tracer="40" Trainable="0" Trigger="0" Type="AvHistory_gr_gun_Mg151-20L_Bf109" Name="Nose Cannon" ConvergeDistance="200" Pitch=".1489" MaxAmmo="150"/>
</GunStations>

The bits highlighted in red define the guns used - go to the guns folder (CFS3/Guns) and check you have them. The tag is xdp.

Then further down:

<Loadouts>
<Loadout Name="Clean"/>
<Loadout Name="(1)300l Drop Tank">
<Hardpoint ID="0" PylonType="dr_109g6_pylon" PayloadType="AvHistory_gr_109_tank_300L" Quantity="1"/>
</Loadout>
<Loadout Name="R6 20mm Mg151/20L Gondolas (135rds 20mm ea)">
<Hardpoint ID="1" PylonType="pylon_null" PayloadElement="AvHistory_gr_gondola_Bf109_Mg151-20L_L" PayloadType="AvHistory_gr_round_Mg151-20L" Quantity="1" Fill="1.0"/>
<Hardpoint ID="2" PylonType="pylon_null" PayloadElement="AvHistory_gr_gondola_Bf109_Mg151-20L_R" PayloadType="AvHistory_gr_round_Mg151-20L" Quantity="1" Fill="1.0"/>
</Loadout>
<Loadout Name="R6 20mm Mg151/20L Gondolas (135rds 20mm ea) +(1)300l Drop Tank" MissionType="Escort,CAP,Intercept,Sweep,Nothing,Bo mber_Intercept">
<Hardpoint ID="1" PylonType="pylon_null" PayloadElement="AvHistory_gr_gondola_Bf109_Mg151-20L_L" PayloadType="AvHistory_gr_round_Mg151-20L" Quantity="1" Fill="1.0"/>
<Hardpoint ID="2" PylonType="pylon_null" PayloadElement="AvHistory_gr_gondola_Bf109_Mg151-20L_R" PayloadType="AvHistory_gr_round_Mg151-20L" Quantity="1" Fill="1.0"/>
<Hardpoint ID="0" PylonType="dr_109g6_pylon" PayloadType="AvHistory_gr_109_tank_300L" Quantity="1"/>
</Loadout>
<Loadout Name="(1)70kg Stabo Bomb">
<Hardpoint ID="0" PylonType="dr_109g6_pylon" PayloadType="AvHistory_gr_bomb_sd__70_stabo" Quantity="1"/>
</Loadout>

</Loadouts>

The green entries are pylons - look in CFS3/pylons, while the blue entries are weapns - look in CFS3/weapons.

If you can find it all, then you should be OK. You already know about sound aliases - something you should check every time you install a new aircraft. Don't trust anyone to get it right all the time!

[hurricane3]

Wow thats a lot to check for,if I downloaded the latest Wep Paks and preload wouldn't all that be there?I know your not supposed to download any older planes with newer wep pak and preload but does that work in reverse?In other words I have older wep paks installed ,would installing newer wep paks overwrite the older ones and make the old planes cause the computer to freeze up?
Also what about making a folder and putting all shared files in one place ,would the game reognize the files?Thanks for all the work you did anwering.

[ndicki]

If a new file overwrites an old one, that's OK. Shouldn't cause a problem, although you should get the "BDP zapper" or BDP Nuker" - probably in the AvH weapons pack - drop it into CFS3 root and run it. It will eliminate all the bdp files in that install so they can rebuild with the new information. Next time you launch CFS, it'll take a while longer as it has to rebuild the files - just let it run. The older planes use weapons which have the same names and usually the same models, so you'll be OK there.

DDS texture files are really the only ones you can just dump anywhere - but don't, because you'll lose track of them. Otherwise, stick to the standard structure and you'll know where everything is, where the new ones go, and you won't end up with doubles.

[hurricane3]

So if I read you right it's ok to make a new folder for the shared file except for the texture file,is that right?Do you have to get inside the shared file and separate them from the other shared file and put them in the main textire folder? Sorry I'am so dumb about this but I like CFS3 and have much trouble installing new planes.Thanks for your patience.

[ndicki]

Texture files you can share, and it doesn't matter where you put them - put an aircraft's textures in the buildings folder, it'll find it. But it's best to keep things in an orderly manner, because you'll find yourself sometimes with two texture files which have the same name - say extra skins for an aircraft - and there, the sim will simply pick one of the two at random, regardless of where you put them. So good housekeeping is important. Any dds file can be "shared" if it's used by more than one model, aircraft or not. In that case, you can put it in a "Shared" folder, or leave it in the folder of an aircraft, or...

All other types of file though really ought to go into the appropriate folders.

[hurricane3]

So I should make a shared folder and put the shared folders in that,that are scattered around the sim? Sorry I
'll try not ask anymore questions for a while but sooner or later I know I'll have some.

[hurricane3]

Forgot I have the BDS Nuker but kep it in a file in my documents called CFS3 utilitys,is that ok?Till I have a problem plane no more questions,I promise.

[gaw]

hurri...........large learning curve but well worth it....the aircraft folder has a folder in it by default called "shared"......in it should go all the shared files you get with various planes that cover that series of plane's textures.....you can leave the various downloaded "shared" folders loose in your "airplanes" folder.....the game'll find them... but it'll become a mess....keep 'em in one place. You don't have to make new folder called "shared"...it's already there. At the same time be aware that weapons have "shared" textures and that if you place the wrong files in the wrong place the game'll lock up or you just won't see what's supposed to be there. keep asking....you'll get there

[hurricane3]

Just when I think I've got it ,I don't.It's like CFS2 I'll never figure out the DP stuff.I have at least a couple of shared files outside of the aircraft folder and a bunch scattered around inside the aircraft folder.First you said put shared files except textures in the shared file .Now your saying the texture files go in the shared folder.
When you said keep the shared files in one place ,and that the shared file is already there ,that means putting them in the shared file with the texures doesn't it?Also that would mean making a shared file to put all the files scattered around.
And as far as weapons having textures aren't they included in the Weapons Paks. Right now I'am so confused with CFS2 and CFS3 I'am not going to touch either one.
If and when I get a new computer ,if I download all the addons ,they have the Weapons Paks already with them ,but I'll still have to install planes.
Even though I've been flight simming for over ten years now I realize I never understood even though I've installed hundreds of planes and scenery and effects,just dumb luck. I never really understood the file structure ,which is why my root folders are such a mess.
Maybe I'am just not smart enough for this hobby. It's not your falt or anyones but my own.You have done a wonderful job of explaining things and taken time to go into the detail and for this I thankyou very much.FS9 seems so much simpler.

[gaw]

"First you said put shared files except textures in the shared file .Now your saying the texture files go in the shared folder.
When you said keep the shared files in one place ,and that the shared file is already there ,that means putting them in the shared file with the texures doesn't it?Also that would mean making a shared file to put all the files scattered around."

No doubt I expressed myself badly or failed to understand the question but....the shared folder in the aircraft folder, if you'll open it up, has .dds files.....those are the texture files common to several planes of the same type generally (gauges, cockpit, etc).....there are also .dds files in every plane's folder.....those are the textures particular to that plane alone...(it's numbers, paint job, etc)....these you need to leave in place because they're only for that plane....the "shared" files should go into the "shared" folder because they're common to several planes. For example...if you download the Groundcrew's 110's....there are 3 or 4 of them.... they come with a shared folder. The self installer places those shared .dds files common to all the GC 110s in your "shared" folder....it is itself a folder labeled GC_Shared. Lots of planes in a series don't have self installers....for example...at Reg's Hanger there are a series of Ju52s that also come with a shared folder of .dds textures common to all the variants there. You should manually place that folder....called
Ju52_Shared.....into the "shared" folder in your "aircraft" folder. Now...here's the confusing part...you don't always have to follow this protocol....you can sometimes scatter files almost anywhere around in the CFS3 main folder and the game'll find and use them which is why your root folder may be a mess but the game still works....most of the time....but knowing what you have and where files are as you add more and more pieces makes plodding, systematic, unvarying installation protocols helpful when the block drops and you have to try and find out what went wrong.

[hurricane3]

Ok your last post was a little clearer, can't say crystle clear(not your fault) but getting a little easier.I gotta keep checking your post against the CFS3 root tree.Unfortunatly my printer has a habit of screwing up more than two pages so I can't print it out I have to write it out by hand. Thankyou so much for your patence and taking the time.I'll do some studing and get back ,thank you so much.

[gaw]

you're welcome

[hurricane3]

Hi,just went over my CFS3 root tree and aircraft folder ,I'lll try and describe as briefly as I can. In the CFS3 root tree there is one AVH-Special_Effects_XML ,under that is 3 lines of Avhistory what appear to be weapons,_HS_9HS_404and one called MAC_1934,then on down their are some shared files ,HG Shared 14 Shared ita gauges and JU 52_Shared,then in the Aircraft folder their are a bunch of shared files outside the shared folder most under the planes their for,like under the Fiat G50 and G55 and Yak are their respective shared file for example there are more like under the Hurricane MKIIC LKA their are two files 14 shared 115 shared,their are more but you get the idea.
Should all these shared files both in the CFS3 root tree and aircraft tree be put in the aircraft shared file?I'am kinda afraid to mess with things as the sim runs fine.
Maybe just tell me where to put future files?