SOH P-61 project

***PRB*** · August 19th, 2010, 20:47

Looking great! I know this is going to be a blast to fly!

**Cag40Navy** · August 19th, 2010, 21:06

Looks really good! Sorry i was not on tonight Robert.

***warchild*** · August 19th, 2010, 21:10

I just uploaded a new fligyht model. Once fliger is able to get me his latest updates, i'll marry them withy this one. till then, i'll keep improving on it as i can..
The file version is Alpha 1.6, and theres a ton of improvements.. roll rate, pitch rate, trim moment etc.. Take off with no adjustments in load is 110 mph,, dont retract the flaps till you hit 146 mph ( first step ) and 175 mph ( full retract ) or you'll sink like a rock..
download it and replace the files you now have with it. its in the FDE folder of the file browser..
Enjoy.. Pam

***Ferry_vO*** · August 20th, 2010, 00:01

Good to see this project being continued! For a while I thought it was as cursed as the Fokker G.1, of which plenty were started but none ever finished since Fs2000....

The Fs9 early build I have had a lot of promise with a solid flight model and a very smooth exterior model!

***warchild*** · August 20th, 2010, 01:45

this one Is getting lots of love

.. I wont let it be cursed. Whatever it takes, we'll get it done. i hadnt had a chance to fly the fs9 version but this one is getting whole new everything, including a flight model sculpted by fliger, myself and my team at JFTC. i wont say we're experts or know it alls, but we aint too shabby

.. Stay tuned and i promise you a plane you will enjoy for a very long time to come

..
Pam

***stansdds*** · August 20th, 2010, 03:17

I'm happy to see the P-61 FSX project moving along so well.

The FS9/FSX F7F project seems to have stalled, no one has stepped up to make the VC.

**padburgess** · August 20th, 2010, 03:20

Hi Pam

Please excuse the presumption, but I have been following the discussion on dealing with the problem of WEP on this project. By the way I am seriously looking forward to this aircraft coming out.
My 2 cents worth. Why not leave the WEP at 94% throttle, and with the 90 second time limit (these are generally set by both the heat problem in the engine and the quantity of water meths or what ever other agent was used) and then at the end of the time limit apply a bit of random logic. Look at other parameters (engine age, ambiant temp, altitude etc and use a random generator to either blow the sucker or let her run. This would cover real world scenarios nicely and add a bit of spice to the flight. You just wouldn't know if you were going to have two, one or none turning. Sorry if this sounds simplistic. I have no idea of the coding involved, but I'm sure that you all could breeze it.
Getting back to my enthusiasm for this aircraft. I am a great fan of WWII twins. Any of them. So if you feel the urge to carry on after this one and do say a Ju88, Do217, Fw189, B25, B26, A26, Ki46 Dinah, Ki45 Toryu or any other it will bring me great pleasure.

Cheers
Paul

**txnetcop** · August 20th, 2010, 03:50

Sorry I have been away from this...the progress you have made is incredible! YOU GUYS ROCK! Fliger is right about the R2800s they loved the WEP effect. This engine was damn near bullet proof, but not under all conditions. They could behave very badly when mishandled. The engine powered not only WWII aircraft. It was made all the way up into 1960 for Convair and Douglas Aircraft. Today these engines are still sought for restoration purposes.
Ted

***warchild*** · August 20th, 2010, 04:53

Hiya Ted, Welcome back

Thanks for the input. With all the input on it, theres a lot to consider and think about.. i trust what you and Fliger said about the engine liking WEP, and air, and intercoolers, and anything that helped keep the heat down. They're 18 cylinder monsters. Pure iron. Its not the coolest running material in the world, so anything that would cool them down was much loved by them..
I know the p-61 had water meth tanks on thm, but what i dont know is how much they carried. Still, I'm inclined to use reality here. You have so much water/meth to use, you can use it when you need it, but when its gone, its gone.. At that point, if we dont throttle back below 95% the engine overheats and seizes up.. How long to give it before it seizes up is a question that will have to be researched. That plane in africa mentioned earlier could have been sitting with engines running for up to 5 minutes ( the length of time a B-17 has before it begins to have troubles ) But sitting on a tarmac is not running at full power. Taking into account the number of hours on the engine as Paul suggested, may at this point be a good idea. The newer the engine, the longer its ability to handle extremes.. and maybe we can create a curve based on that which can be used to seize the engines.. Hope i'm making sense.. its 4:30Am and pretty far past my bedtime so i know i'm rambling a bit here.. however, what im thinking would give us a more realistic result than just setting a 90 second time limit on it, and add a bit of randomness to the scenario..

I was going to wait to ask for this but i can see that waiting would be foolish as theres so much to do. At this time, N2056 is building the VC and gunnery position, but theres so much to be modeled in there that to ask any more of him would be sadistic at best.. That means, we dont have anyone coding for us.. We need a coder, a gauge guru, and with all the gauges in this thing, we need one soon. We need SOH's help and skill there..
We're also going to be needing an effects guru. The P-61 carried four 20mmk canon and four 50cal canon, and it was easily the most devestating fighter of world war two. The combined fire power on this plane when unleased may very well qualify it as americas first gunship. The original Dragon. I'd like someone who could reate the effects of that armament with tracers visible for some time.

I was asked recently how soon the plane could be done. i didnt have an answer, but there's a round the world race coming next febuary and mid december is the date for entrance. Providing the rules allow, this could be a good plane for that race. it may not be as fast as others, but its range would even out the difference as it wouldnt have to refuel as often.. I wouldnt mind seeing her in that race to be honest, and with a three man crew, non stop is a possibility.
Anywayy, i'm rambling and i'm sorry, but please folks, if you can code and enjoy it, please let us know.. we need your help..
Thanks
Pam

***N2056*** · August 20th, 2010, 05:57

Pam, keep in mind that I am doing 3d gauges...unless you think there is really a need for a 2d panel the gauges are already part of my work package

***MudMarine*** · August 20th, 2010, 10:25

My 1/2 cents (don't have enough cents to make two). 2d panels are a waste of time! JMO

**txnetcop** · August 20th, 2010, 10:55

Originally Posted by warchild

Hiya Ted, Welcome back

Thanks for the input. With all the input on it, theres a lot to consider and think about.. i trust what you and Fliger said about the engine liking WEP, and air, and intercoolers, and anything that helped keep the heat down. They're 18 cylinder monsters. Pure iron. Its not the coolest running material in the world, so anything that would cool them down was much loved by them..
I know the p-61 had water meth tanks on thm, but what i dont know is how much they carried. Still, I'm inclined to use reality here. You have so much water/meth to use, you can use it when you need it, but when its gone, its gone.. At that point, if we dont throttle back below 95% the engine overheats and seizes up.. How long to give it before it seizes up is a question that will have to be researched. That plane in africa mentioned earlier could have been sitting with engines running for up to 5 minutes ( the length of time a B-17 has before it begins to have troubles ) But sitting on a tarmac is not running at full power. Taking into account the number of hours on the engine as Paul suggested, may at this point be a good idea. The newer the engine, the longer its ability to handle extremes.. and maybe we can create a curve based on that which can be used to seize the engines.. Hope i'm making sense.. its 4:30Am and pretty far past my bedtime so i know i'm rambling a bit here.. however, what im thinking would give us a more realistic result than just setting a 90 second time limit on it, and add a bit of randomness to the scenario..

I was going to wait to ask for this but i can see that waiting would be foolish as theres so much to do. At this time, N2056 is building the VC and gunnery position, but theres so much to be modeled in there that to ask any more of him would be sadistic at best.. That means, we dont have anyone coding for us.. We need a coder, a gauge guru, and with all the gauges in this thing, we need one soon. We need SOH's help and skill there..
We're also going to be needing an effects guru. The P-61 carried four 20mmk canon and four 50cal canon, and it was easily the most devestating fighter of world war two. The combined fire power on this plane when unleased may very well qualify it as americas first gunship. The original Dragon. I'd like someone who could reate the effects of that armament with tracers visible for some time.

I was asked recently how soon the plane could be done. i didnt have an answer, but there's a round the world race coming next febuary and mid december is the date for entrance. Providing the rules allow, this could be a good plane for that race. it may not be as fast as others, but its range would even out the difference as it wouldnt have to refuel as often.. I wouldnt mind seeing her in that race to be honest, and with a three man crew, non stop is a possibility.
Anywayy, i'm rambling and i'm sorry, but please folks, if you can code and enjoy it, please let us know.. we need your help..
Thanks
Pam

Pam I have been trying to find out. The best I know would be to call Mid Atlantic Air Museum and ask them. They have one almost totally restored. I'm trying to get an 800 number maybe Jarvis knows it. Otherwise use your best guess. None of us are gonna complain we have been P-61 starved in FSX!

***stansdds*** · August 20th, 2010, 10:57

P-61A and early production B models carried 26 gallons of water-methanol, giving approximately 15 minutes of WEP. Later production B models had 34 gallons, allowing for up to 20 minutes WEP. This is directly from the P-61 flight manual.

***warchild*** · August 20th, 2010, 11:52

Originally Posted by N2056

Pam, keep in mind that I am doing 3d gauges...unless you think there is really a need for a 2d panel the gauges are already part of my work package

Ahhh.. Thanks N2056.. I honestly didnt know that.. Theres no need for 2D panels in this. They were really nice in 1993 but that was then..

***warchild*** · August 20th, 2010, 11:58

Originally Posted by stansdds

P-61A and early production B models carried 26 gallons of water-methanol, giving approximately 15 minutes of WEP. Later production B models had 34 gallons, allowing for up to 20 minutes WEP. This is directly from the P-61 flight manual.

You sir are a God Send.. Thank you.. Since our P-61 has the four fifty's mounted on top, that would place it among the later models, so 34 gallons at 20 minutes it is..