I'm so tired....

[Cees Donker]

...of all the crashes, low framerates and hughe loading times I'm about to give up on this sim.




Cees

[gman5250]

I don't think you are alone Cees.

I work fourteen to twenty hour days solely developing my sceneries and now, airplanes. The dev work is time intensive enough, but the beta is freakin' brutal with the incessant sim crashes, long boots etc.

Typically I get a crash on boot every third or fourth time I boot in. First boot in the early AM is always a fail.

Following various Win10 updates, I've seen as many as twenty four consecutive crashes on boot in P3D. Much of the time, if I am in the sim and mouse click a switch, a very slight drag of the mouse will crash the sim...again. Sometimes just touching a controller will send the sim into cardiac.

I acknowledge that I do this work out of my own choice, but in all the years I have worked in graphics, art and it's technical applications, the sim is by far the most un-stable and manifestly aggravating.
I'm not whinging...just illuminating the point that Cees has just made.

I know other devs go through it too, so my hat is off to each and every one. I love what I do, and do not contemplate quitting, but I do look forward to improvements in the future that may make the road a bit smoother.

IMHO

[Jafo]

Step One.....get out of Windows 10.

The 'public release' is a public Beta at best.

Windows 7 has been out long enough to be reliable.
Nothing since has been as yet.

[gman5250]

Step One.....get out of Windows 10.

The 'public release' is a public Beta at best.

Windows 7 has been out long enough to be reliable.
Nothing since has been as yet.

Yeah...

I've got the house up for sale and I'm moving. When the place sells I'm going to step up the computer to a EVGA GTX 1080, drop in a 1 gig SSD and a couple other upgrades. I'm seriously looking at an industrial disk wipe and going back to the Win7 install disk that came with this box when it arrived new. My number two box still runs Win7 and I just don't see anything in 10 that really blows my skirt up.

[Mach3DS]

What version of the sim are you running? FSXA? FSXSE? P3DV3?

FSXA is by far the worst performer of the bunch. I've NEVER had good performance with it, without dropping my settings way down.

Which leads me to my next question: What CPU specs do you have and what GFX card specs?

Essentially, in the most honest terms, if you bring a Geo metro to haul a big rig trailer you're setup to fail.

To yours and Gman's point, though, it seems like the instability is not uncommon. Poor performance though is another beast. Don't quit!

[Mach3DS]

... I just don't see anything in 10 that really blows my skirt up.

Probably one of the funniest lines ive read here in a while! Haha

[gman5250]

What version of the sim are you running? FSXA? FSXSE? P3DV3?

FSXA is by far the worst performer of the bunch. I've NEVER had good performance with it, without dropping my settings way down.

Which leads me to my next question: What CPU specs do you have and what GFX card specs?

Essentially, in the most honest terms, if you bring a Geo metro to haul a big rig trailer you're setup to fail.

To yours and Gman's point, though, it seems like the instability is not uncommon. Poor performance though is another beast. Don't quit!

Not speaking for Cees, but my performance is acceptable Rick, if I can actually get out of the pattern.
My specs are in the signature, but I run a mild overclock on the GTX 780.

I canned FSX entirely, but run FSX/SE for beta. Quality time is spent in P3D 3.3.5.

[gray eagle]

I remember you sayin' that you lived "off the grid", are you gonna be closer to the grid now?

Yeah...

I've got the house up for sale and I'm moving. When the place sells I'm going to step up the computer to a EVGA GTX 1080, drop in a 1 gig SSD and a couple other upgrades. I'm seriously looking at an industrial disk wipe and going back to the Win7 disk that came with this box when it arrived new. My number two box still runs Win7 and I just don't see anything in 10 that really blows my skirt up.

[gman5250]

I remember you sayin' that you lived "off the grid", are you gonna be closer to the grid now?

LOL...no frickin' way. Farther and wayyyy off grid.

Don't want to "Bogart" Cees' thread...back on point.

[Ian Warren]

Probably one of the funniest lines ive read here in a while! Haha

So bloody true tho ... On the NZFF forum when it decided to take over I was in the middle of a paying job ... my exact words were "Friggen Gay Program" all this crap that come with .... some reason a lot got offended at NZFF when I said 'Gay' ... maybe I should have said 'Enola Gay' and Nuke the bloody program then I get told off for mentioning Nuclear war

[StormILM]

I'm still using my old 2007 purchased FSXA discs (with a year old fresh install on my SSD's). With my brand new/recently installed EVGA GTX960 SC GPU, my frame rates have never been more stable & fluid. A good part of it has to do with the FSX config file tweaks but I understand intuitively that from one system to another, things can vary significantly to greatly. One other thing I would recommend (if you haven't already) is the shut down as many unessential processes which are running in the background as well as checking for any addon which might be killing FPS performance. I had to jump through a lot of hoops to get to where I am and I am super reluctant to add or change anything at this point (and I have all my current settings/files fully backed up in case something gets screwed up). I have no intentions of moving to FSXSE or W10 for as long as I can but my future system build will have a copy of P3Dv3(or later versions) and the forthcoming X-Plane 11 as well as DCS.

[Cees Donker]

The instability is the worst factor. I get 30 frames with 'heavy' planes and demanding scenery. And then, after10 minutes of flying, the sim crashes, freezes. Not always, but too often to be ignored.

Cees

[mal998]

I'm having more luck with Steam but having said that she crashed this morning so what do I know. But that is a bare bones install without all the bells and whistles. Kinda boring.

[gman5250]

The instability is the worst factor. I get 30 frames with 'heavy' planes and demanding scenery. And then, after10 minutes of flying, the sim crashes, freezes. Not always, but too often to be ignored.

Cees

As much as I'd like to get the PMDG NGX or upcoming DC-6, I just can't justify spending all that time setting up for a flight and then crashing the sim. I've already had to take the baseball bat out of the house and lock it in the bike shed.

[gray eagle]

I still am on WIN 7; if it ain't broke......

My son runs WIN 10 on a laptop and WIn 7 on desktop and told me I wasn't missing that much except if I wanted to touch the screen a lot to navigate here and there. Not in my wheelhouse.

I wanted to delve into P3d (Series) but I am on fixed income (Retired) and $$$ becomes issue however, the "Junior pilot" version of P3D looks tempting.

[mal998]

I'm still running Vista Ult . Couldn't find a full install of Win 7. Weirdly I get most of my crashes these days in FSX A when I'm in spot view. That's why I test all my new FDE's in Steam bare bones because of it's quick start up. Can't wait for 2 days for FSX to load.

[Ian Warren]

As much as I'd like to get the PMDG NGX or upcoming DC-6, I just can't justify spending all that time setting up for a flight and then crashing the sim. I've already had to take the baseball bat out of the house and lock it in the bike shed.

Gordo ... Really laughing my head off here, my younger bro decided it was time to get a computer just to be with the in-crowd , only lasted a couple months ... think he found your baseball bat

I did score a brand new printer, mouse , keyboard .... I'm sure it was Win10 that drove him to it

[Willy]

I'm using Win 10 with FSX SE and the only fps issues I have is in large cities or extensive add on scenery. My comp isn't the latest and greatest, but it does fine.

[Jafo]

The primary issue with Win 10 is the 'forced updates'.
Pro can defer them at least but not prevent them.

WHEN you think you have everything working well...look forward to the whim of some moron at Redmond pushing out some supposed fix for some irrelevance which totally screws your particular system/stability.
Then your only option is to wait and HOPE the next so-called 'fix' manages to fix YOUR issue.

Anyone who has used computers long enough will have experienced the need to undo something 'done' that caused them trouble.

When that option is effectively denied you then your fate is in the lap of the Gods.....;p

[WarHorse47]

I feel like Cees, but for different reasons.

It's not the OS - I'm still with Win8.1. My frustration is with my replacement graphic card.

It's supposed to be better than the last one, but I keep trying to dial in FSX to get it to perform smoothly. No crashes, but long load times and inconsistent frame rates over heavy scenery.

I haven't found one valid resource for what settings work best for the replacement card and I've spent hours trying one tweak after another, only to return to the basic settings. I just don't have the time or patience to be a computer guru. There are days I just have to walk away from the computer. This hobby would be so enjoyable if there was a way to get FSX to play nice.

[Sundog]

I'm getting ready to build a new system. After reading this, I may just stick with Win7 instead of moving to Win10.

[JohnC]

I've only read a few lines in this thread (sorry if anything is a repeat). But a couple of points:

a) Development is brutal on any sim installation and crashes are cumulative; each one can cause corruptions that beget more crashes. You want the cleanest base sim possible, and to keep it that way. When I was developing regularly, I had every installed file needed to run the sim 'just the way I like' in a never-been-CTD'd sate backed up on an external HDD. About every 1-2 weeks, I would wipe and restore. I still use this method of file management (but only restore every couple of months), and it's really limited the number of CTD's. I had 3 CTD's in the last 10 or so flights, and thought it was really unusual....turns out it was the GPU kicking the bucket.

b) Get an PCI SSD that can house Windows and the simulator (on separate partitions). The file sizes in FSX/P3D are enormous, and no single purchase has done so much to improve frame rates/stutters etc. I bought one on a Black Friday deal last year, and it was reasonably affordable.

c) No firm opinions on Windows 10 (not the anniversary edition) other than it's what I run and haven't seen any significant de-stabilizing issues.

[gman5250]

Interesting thoughts John.

One observation. I've installed every revision of P3D since 2.0 was first released. I maintain a dedicated SSD for the sim, and only the sim. The "finicky" nature of P3D has been a constant since the beginning. I rarely update P3D, usually doing a clean install to make sure my R&D has not translated from previous version to the newest revision.

My observation has been that the sim FSX, FSX/SE and especially P3D does not like any disturbances i.e. things multi tasking in a multi-core processor, while it the sim is operating.

Case in point. I often open my internet browser (Microsoft Edge) while P3D is booting. Usually there is no issue, but many times if I drag a menu, or click a mouse button, that action translates to a mouse drag across the live Prepar3D window. A good percentage of the time P3D will instantly shut itself down. If I let it boot back up and do not try to use my browser it usually boots without a hitch.

Just one observation that may be helpful.

[UnknownGuest12]

Quit FSX entirely. Using P3D 3.5 on Windows 10, with no problems at all. Asus 970. Good frame rates no or very rare crashes.

[txnetcop]

Didn't really have any problems of any consequence on Win 10, still kind of wonky at times. Besides I just would rather use Win 10 for other things so dual booted Win 7 to my 1TB HD and FSX Gold with Orbx and FSX Steam (plain) run just beautifully, nice frame rates, no stutters, runs all the new stuff so far on an old high end socket 775 system. I swear that sometimes I think Windows 10 is being watched by Big Brother! I did just build a new high-end system with an Intel 6700K and 16GB of fast ram and an Nvidia EVGA Superclocked GTX970 that got me salivating...man there is some nice hardware out there and cheap! By the way, P3d is nice but I highly recommend trying X-Plane 10.5...very stable!
Ted