Western Roundup: Announcement and Discussion - Page 2
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Thread: Western Roundup: Announcement and Discussion

  1. #26
    Charter Member 2022 srgalahad's Avatar
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    The secret info is hidden behind a tree on a grass knoll.

    The list is extensive and contains a broad range of viable aircraft. In this event, every potential competitor knew the test criteria and could therefore evaluate at least the freeware listed aircraft (it doesn't take long ) and maybe, in the process learn a bunch of things about what makes the difference among those choices. Certainly it's easier to be spoon-fed but that does nothing to improve knowledge or skill.

    This is a low-key competition - it once was unlikely that any except the most extreme competitor would go out and buy a payware plane because it is a bit better but it's been known to happen. That's a matter of personal choice and not something the committee is motivated to encourage. In fact, if a payware plane were the "best" there would be accusations that the rules were intended to promote that product!

    I am well aware there are those who believe having the "best" aircraft eliminates any need for flying skill and there may be some truth in that. Since I have a personal theory that the last thing learned in Flight Sim is flying skill then perhaps the ideal race with the greatest appeal would be in untested, non-rated planes over flat land at sea level with pre-built flightplans that can be loaded into the GPS and landing is not required (since that is the greatest cause of crashes).

    We could go all-out trying to find the fastest barely-legal (or change rules to make it legal) aircraft and get it airborne and on autopilot. Now that we have eliminated the annoyance of having to fly we could crown the winner of the "fastest airplane in X category of FlightSim."

    For this event the primary goal was to craft a race that was simple enough in which novice pilots could compete and ease into FS distance racing but challenging enough to test some flying skill. However, every year I have been involved in these events there have been a few people who have complained about the legality of certain aircraft, or tried to squeeze one in but complained if someone else tried to do the same, or suggested conspiracies. With a week to go before the official start, what have the novices learned so far?
    • "There are faster planes that aren't being allowed for unknown reasons"
    • "The rule makers stack the odds in favor of the 'insiders'"
    • "There must be a secret plane on the list and they don't want us to know which it is"
    • "Knowing how to fly well, at the limits of an aircraft's ability and without pilot error is far less important than finding a secret weapon."


    I will not spend another minute of my time or ounce of energy to build something, only to have people who never help with the organization or operation of events to drop in like entitled consumers, exercise their "right" to complain and then disappear into the darkness, muttering about how they were 'cheated'. This is not the last year, nor the last event - this is the last minute I will allow someone, directly or by inference, to accuse me of conspiring, cheating or allowing subterfuge in the development or operation of a flight sim event.

  2. #27
    Senior Administrator Willy's Avatar
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    If there's a top secret magic ship aircraft on the list that will guarantee a win, neither I or any one else on the Committee know it. We worked hard to keep 'em off the list. I think I can speak for the rest of the committee when I say that in these events, we're not in it for the win. We truly enjoy the challenges to our flying skills and would hope that others do too.
    Let Being Helpful Be More Important Than Being Right.

  3. #28
    SOH-CM-2019 MM's Avatar
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    Ms. Murphy must be looking at the forums. She called me into the office and made her stance crystal clear.

    "There will be no Magic Ship."

    "The purpose of the White List is to set the parameters of the competition and eliminate a search for the fastest aircraft, the 'Magic Ship.' We are allowing a few additional entries which represent aircraft of real interest for the participating pilots – and whose characteristics lie well within the boundaries of the established competition."

    "For a couple of months now, Slim Berinsky has been working on the flightline and in the back office. With some help from his friends, he has compiled the numbers that we are using to set the competition. Nothing is perfect, but things seem fair enough."

    "Obviously, there are piston-engined GA aircraft that are faster and/or more fuel-efficient than those on the White List. In the interest of a maintaining a competitive fleet, they are excluded from the final White List."

    As I turned for the door, I thought about mentioning the "Platinum Class" line in order to inject a bit of humor. Decided against it.

    There are some people you just don't want to mess with...and this tough redhead is one.
    -Mike

  4. #29
    SOH-CM-2019 MM's Avatar
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    Just got a handwritten note from Berinsky. He reports that, as everyone expected, the Glassair III TC submission is far too capable an aircraft for the current competition.

    He also added a few choice words suggesting that our publicity team could do a better job on clarifying matters.
    -Mike

  5. #30
    For me it's mostly a race against myself -- speed, precision, and good judgement (or guesses) and how to deal with the unexpected.

    Thank you so much for organizing these events, wish I had the time to join in. My last events were IIRC part of the London-to-Melborne, and I think the Pacific Island Hop before that.

    Really like the looks of this event, I fly out of KCOS and KGJT almost all the time and like to think I know my way around the Southwest and West pretty well. ;-) Would love to tag along and will certainly be doing so in spirit.

    Java
    "Let Being Helpful Be More Important Than Being Right!"

  6. #31
    Hey All,

    First: I have been in touch with the committee and am assured only one person knows what the performance of the white sheet aircraft more or less looks like. The information has not been shared and I have faith in that. Hence the information is "asymmetric" in a completely appropriate way given the way the flight sim community realistically operates. I am completely satisfied with this arrangement and think this will be a fine event. I think being transparent and communicating how competitions are set up is important and would only suggest that as an improvement for future events.

    Second: I agree that the Glassair is too fast for this event since the Legacy is not one of the really fast Lancairs

    Remember what it says at the top of the front page of the Sim Outhouse forums.

    -Ed-
    My heroes have always been cowboys and they all carried guns-
    and they all rode horses-that is all but one.
    When he went to the rescue he flew a Cessna plane.
    His ranch was called the "Flying Crown" and "Sky King" was his name. -Jim Dilly-

    The rich man writes the book of laws that the poor man must defend, but the highest laws are written on the hearts of honest men. - Ricky Skaggs-

  7. #32
    Hey All,

    Pavel Toman Lycoming 360 DA-40 XLS - Clear weather - all AFSD

    This aircraft was a premier collection aircraft at Abacus - it is no longer offered as the new aircraft by Pavel Toman is the diesel.

    6000 144.7 IAS 157.3 GS 65.9 lbs/hr 23.21 MP
    10000 129.8 IAS 150.2 GS 52.5 lbs/hr 20.01MP
    18000 98.2 IAS 129.5 GS 31.2 lbs/hr 14.77 MP
    Max indicated 196
    Overspeeds at about 200 kias

    Nice plane what do you think? Bronze low course.

    -Ed-
    My heroes have always been cowboys and they all carried guns-
    and they all rode horses-that is all but one.
    When he went to the rescue he flew a Cessna plane.
    His ranch was called the "Flying Crown" and "Sky King" was his name. -Jim Dilly-

    The rich man writes the book of laws that the poor man must defend, but the highest laws are written on the hearts of honest men. - Ricky Skaggs-

  8. #33

    which hour starts?

    Hi! Tomorrow is the starting day! but which hour? UTC please! Thanks! (I am in Spain)

  9. #34
    Senior Administrator PRB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Japo32 View Post
    Hi! Tomorrow is the starting day! but which hour? UTC please! Thanks! (I am in Spain)
    00:00 ZULU!
    MB: GIGABYTE GA-X299 UD4 PRO ATX
    CPU: Intel(R) Core™ Processor i9-10900X Ten-Core 3.7GHz
    MEM: 64GB (8GBx8) DDR4/3000MHz Quad Channel
    GPU: RTX 3080 Ti 12GB GDDR6
    OS: Win 10 Pro 64bit
    HP Reverb G2

  10. #35
    Ed,
    Tho it's just my opinion, traditionally the RTW races (an similiar events) didn't allow for A/C models that weren't currently available to all participants, so tho it looks to be a worthy contender I feel that since it's an old model that's not available to the rest of us (short of warez sites) it shouldn't be allowed. Also to submit so close to starting time isn't a very friendly thing to do IMHO.
    "May fortune favor the foolish"
    MaddogK

  11. #36
    Senior Administrator Willy's Avatar
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    I've talked to Miss Murphy and she decided that as this isn't the RTWR that we could allow the Pavel Toman Lycoming 360 DA-40 XLS in the Bronze class and to welcome Easy Ed to the Western Roundup.
    Let Being Helpful Be More Important Than Being Right.

  12. #37
    Hey All,

    Thank You sir!

    -Ed-
    My heroes have always been cowboys and they all carried guns-
    and they all rode horses-that is all but one.
    When he went to the rescue he flew a Cessna plane.
    His ranch was called the "Flying Crown" and "Sky King" was his name. -Jim Dilly-

    The rich man writes the book of laws that the poor man must defend, but the highest laws are written on the hearts of honest men. - Ricky Skaggs-

  13. #38
    Ms. Monroe,

    Please check your email regarding my mishap today in the A36.

    Best,
    Rob O.


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