Smoke Effect For A Marine Marker

**strikehawk** · January 13th, 2013, 12:02

Anyone know of a smoke effect that can be launched from a helo or fixed wing that will fall more or less straight down and burn for at least 15-30 seconds, longer would be nice, that can be used to mark a location ie; submarine or life raft, in the water? The idea is to fly over say the submerged Foxtrot and "mark on top" so your playmates online can prosecute said submarine. In VP and HCS we used Mk 58 and Mk 25 smokes that were hand launched in the helo or dropped from the "free fall" chute in the P-3.

I recall seeing a "tear gas" effect for an earlier FS generation and was wondering if that could work. Also need a rocket that could serve as a marker on a FAC bird. If I can find those two things life in the Miramar Flying Club is going to get real interesting.

**FSX68** · January 13th, 2013, 14:20

Originally Posted by strikehawk

Anyone know of a smoke effect that can be launched from a helo or fixed wing that will fall more or less straight down and burn for at least 15-30 seconds, longer would be nice, that can be used to mark a location ie; submarine or life raft, in the water? The idea is to fly over say the submerged Foxtrot and "mark on top" so your playmates online can prosecute said submarine. In VP and HCS we used Mk 58 and Mk 25 smokes that were hand launched in the helo or dropped from the "free fall" chute in the P-3.

I recall seeing a "tear gas" effect for an earlier FS generation and was wondering if that could work. Also need a rocket that could serve as a marker on a FAC bird. If I can find those two things life in the Miramar Flying Club is going to get real interesting.

That would be awesome or maybe some sonobouys that could be launched from a P3 or other ASW aircraft.

**SSI01** · January 13th, 2013, 15:33

I'm right in there with you for both these effects, but for FS9 - there are torpedoes that can be air-dropped, I've put them in every VP aircraft I have on the sim. Can the smokes be made to burn a little longer, please - maybe long enough for one to be dropped and the aircraft to fly past a little way, then make a hard 180 and run back near the marker to prosecute as has been said.

I'm wondering if it's possible to engineer an add-on for VP aircraft, including carrier-borne, that can let one search for a sub, from initial contact through sonobuoy line to torp drop. This could be put on helos, too BTW.

**strikehawk** · January 13th, 2013, 15:58

Okay, this is what I have found so far, the tear gas effect for FS2002 by Trotter does work in FSX. However, it is fired forward and in pairs along with a cloud appearance. To use it one would have to edit it to only show only one marker and make it drop straight down like a counter measures flare or eject to the rear like the launcher in a P-3. As weird as this sounds I am going to try the default white smoke effect that is normally use for a camp fire and such. This has a several advantages if it works, it is already in FSX and you don't have wind up in limbo with a good idea but it can't be handed out because the author can't be contacted or refuses to play along, it should be editable to make it last at least 30 minutes for the Mk 25 to one hour for the Mk 58 along with the fact that the column is more realistic in appearance. I will try a couple more things tonight and report back. Hopefully someone with better abilities than I can expand and improve on what I found out in this round of testing.

I have also found a air dropped para flare from FS9 that should work at night. This is unique in that it has a 2 minute duration and is dropped between 1500-3000 feet. I and my group have found that a lot of the effects that get fired off a bird will show to others if they also have the same effect installed.

**strikehawk** · January 13th, 2013, 16:38

Update:
I have found that the default smoke effect will not work as it stays with the aircraft and not drop as hoped. At this time I have gone through 2 effects and there is great deal to check so until I have tried everything I can find this is going to be a long project. My problem is that I have a HUGE collection acquired over the past 9 years I'm afraid that I'll find one that works and can't pass it out or change it because of copyright. If all else fails I suppose I can try to make my own using an SDK.

**Roadburner440** · January 13th, 2013, 17:10

Sonobuoys and smokes would be cool! In SH-60's though we would just chuck the smokes out the cabin door in order to do target practice with the GAU or M-60. Having this effect in FSX would be awesome. However I am unaware of how to do it outside of missions. Just would take some playing with SimConnect probably in order to get it to show up, and link it to a button. If you can make ships appear with AI ships on command I am sure we can figure out how to do something like smokes.

**lazarus** · January 13th, 2013, 18:52

Let me get back to you on this later tonight. I've a couple of ASW weapons on the go as dropable objects, and a smoke marker is a 10 minute job. It would be a releaseable object, however, which would limit you to carring smoke markers only from a saved flight, but the smoke will drop straight down and stay. I've also been mucking about with a number of rockets- 11.5"tiny tims, missiles-SUNBURN, SKYBOLT ect. 2 glitches. They will not 'explode' without some sort of gauge-IE: the Zuni's from Razbam. And, though I cannot say that I noticed it with Chris Skyes missiles, the damned things crash the sim about 5 minutes after launch! Cannot figure out why, except that they might be accelerating past FSX's Vmax or something. Annoying! to say the least. Sorting out the next ship packs-small combatants- some NANUCHKA's and OSA's-with hard decks for your bombing, strafing and rocketing tacpak pleasure. Also just finished the raw model and exported a Type XXI Uboat model for the first time- which also forms the basis of WHISKEY and ROMEO class SSK`s

Mebe too many projects going at once....

**strikehawk** · January 13th, 2013, 18:57

We have seen online not only the gun effect in Piglet's SPAD but tracer and rockets from the CS Weapons for FSX along with flares so my group and I do know that it is possible to see them. Sonabouys would be nice but once the go into the water you can't see them and as you can't have any function other than eye-candy it would not make sense to make an effect for them, besides where are you going to get an AWAN to load the darn things?

As it stands this is what I would like to find, edit or try to or see created....

A marker that will drop almost vertically such as the counter measures flare effect

The smoke should last for some time a minimum of 5 minutes to 60 minutes max

The smoke should make a relativity thin column like that seen in some of the campfire effects

The smoke emitted needs to be white or light grey to simulate the phosphorous candle inside the canister.

ASW ops in FSX has great potential with the release of two AI submarine packs, the S-2 series of sub hunters, a P-3 being worked on by Razbam not to mention the UKMIL Nimrods and the rotary winged assets both pay and free. Getting everything together in a session will be the hard part but the effort will be worth it.

**strikehawk** · January 13th, 2013, 19:04

Originally Posted by lazarus

Let me get back to you on this later tonight. I've a couple of ASW weapons on the go as dropable objects, and a smoke marker is a 10 minute job. It would be a releaseable object, however, which would limit you to carring smoke markers only from a saved flight, but the smoke will drop straight down and stay. I've also been mucking about with a number of rockets- 11.5"tiny tims, missiles-SUNBURN, SKYBOLT ect. 2 glitches. They will not 'explode' without some sort of gauge-IE: the Zuni's from Razbam. And, though I cannot say that I noticed it with Chris Skyes missiles, the damned things crash the sim about 5 minutes after launch! Cannot figure out why, except that they might be accelerating past FSX's Vmax or something. Annoying! to say the least. Sorting out the next ship packs-small combatants- some NANUCHKA's and OSA's-with hard decks for your bombing, strafing and rocketing tacpak pleasure. Also just finished the raw model and exported a Type XXI Uboat model for the first time- which also forms the basis of WHISKEY and ROMEO class SSK`s

Mebe too many projects going at once....

What you have described for the marker sounds good and I do have the payware mission maker so it would only be a mater of trial and error to make a mission for Multi-player. One more thing, the marker sounds like it could be made to work in the CS Weapon utility, as a free fall bomb, so you have opened an avenue of development that I never thought of. All your work is greatly appreciated myself and I venture the community in general.:salute:

**lazarus** · January 13th, 2013, 19:10

Aaahhh, not so. any dropable object also shows up on surface search radar- the one in Brians Nimrod, while not showing terrain-which can be correlated against the GPS map by careful range scale selection- if it does not destroy on impact. So a marker or sonobouy will serve as plot markers. Found out I was able to track torpedos after launch. Amusingly, they run untill they hit land, and end up several miles inland, laying there on the ground! Hilo took a whole bunch of hits that day.

***Victory103*** · January 13th, 2013, 20:42

Ahh, great to see this coming up, lots of time "chucking" 58's and 25's out the door. Unless you can have a fun to prosecute an AI sub, not sure how you will make the ASW portion fun, unless we were in the dip and actively pinging a running sub, ASW wasn't as much fun. Anyway to make this an AI object like all the other weapons and effects in Tacpack?

**lazarus** · January 14th, 2013, 12:05

Attachment 79006

OK. Didn't get to it last night, had to hack out the first pass on the WHISKEY class. Knocked the marker out here at lunch time on the laptop-31 minutes including docs, packaging,repaint. Effect is default campfire, but effect included. The duration of the effect will have to be modified by finding the appropriate line in the effect (text edits) back up your default effect or rename the effect and rename the attached effect name with MDLX. NOTE!!!!!!!! I have not had this in the sim yet. It should work(crosses fingers) if not; I'll have to dope it out tonight.
:salute:Let us know what happens.

**strikehawk** · January 14th, 2013, 20:18

I'll try it out after work tomorrow, today just kicked my butt and all I did when I got home was nap. I'll make it available to my group with your permission of course, this way we can be sure that it works across a wide range of PC's and installs.

**lazarus** · January 15th, 2013, 03:20

Tried it, and I out smarted myself. Discard previous version. This onAttachment 79042 Attachment 79043 Attachment 79044 Attachment 79045e acts like a marine marker is supposed to except burn time. And you get a generic Lightweight Torpedo to drop.

**strikehawk** · January 15th, 2013, 19:06

Getting ready to test this. I plan on flying out of Siberut, it's a fictitious base near Indonesia. Good for daytime flights on the server when it's night time at home.

One thing lazarus, the proper spelling is "ordnance". It's a small thing but it's the name of the job in the Navy that I loved very much.

**lazarus** · February 11th, 2013, 00:53

Attachment 80833Ordnance it is. Carpal fingers, a posting window that would not refresh and left you typing blind, and a couple of 75 hour back to back shifts will erase all the spelling acumen that the Sisters at the Holy Terror Ophanarium, Catholic School and Steel Ruler Emporium beat into me all those many years ago.
Time to get some more 3D spam out into the FSX gene pool. I've just started reading and messing about with the effects SDK, at some point I'd like to have some custom effects to go with this stuff. For now, assign what ever you like best, or works best on your respective Electromiun Simulation Devices. At present, I do not know of an off the shelf effect that looks like a nuclear depth bomb- just a ruddy big splash after a long delay, really. Its being worked on, at any rate. So we have a Mk.11 air launched depth Charge, a Mk.101 LULU nuclear depth charge, a resized and cleaned up roughly a Mk.54 lightweight ASW torpedo, and a APR-3 lightweight ASW torpedo, the standard Soviet/WARPAC aerial torpedo. Working on a RN Mk.30, and a US Mk.46. Attachment 80829 Attachment 80830 Attachment 80831 Attachment 80832:salute:

**lazarus** · February 17th, 2013, 11:36

Attachment 81264Worked out ASW effects. You get a splash, then a delay as the DC sinks, then the classic DC explosion, thump, splash, rebound, bubbles and slick. 20 seconds for Mk11 DC, a minute and a bit for homing torpedo, minute and a bit for nuclear DC. The Nuclear DC is an interim effect, still working on the final, but the hard part, figuring out a delay, is done.
Attachment 81262 Attachment 81263

**FSX68** · February 17th, 2013, 11:53

Originally Posted by lazarus

Attachment 81264Worked out ASW effects. You get a splash, then a delay as the DC sinks, then the classic DC explosion, thump, splash, rebound, bubbles and slick. 20 seconds for Mk11 DC, a minute and a bit for homing torpedo, minute and a bit for nuclear DC. The Nuclear DC is an interim effect, still working on the final, but the hard part, figuring out a delay, is done.
Attachment 81262 Attachment 81263

Will this work with helo's? Looking for info on how attachments will relate to pickle of a depth charge or will it? Attached pique interest.
Once files are installed; how will markers be activated?

**lazarus** · February 17th, 2013, 13:17

Droppable objects from a saved flight. They will work with helios, fixed wing, or surface vessels. Effects are triggered on impact. The effects controller sequences and times the effects. Cool,eh? now I can fuze ordnance for simulating DC's, laydown and toss(over the shoulder rather than LABS) The bugbear has always been timing,and ,lo and behold, the ACES guys allowed for that with the rather clever effects control config.
Lots of potental now that thats figured. Shame the SDK docs are so lousy.

**seawing** · February 20th, 2013, 08:53

Originally Posted by lazarus

Attachment 81264Worked out ASW effects. You get a splash, then a delay as the DC sinks, then the classic DC explosion, thump, splash, rebound, bubbles and slick. 20 seconds for Mk11 DC, a minute and a bit for homing torpedo, minute and a bit for nuclear DC. The Nuclear DC is an interim effect, still working on the final, but the hard part, figuring out a delay, is done.
Attachment 81262 Attachment 81263

Hi Lazarus,

a great effect! Thank you!!
Do you think it would be possible to make the actual explosion part of the effect a little more ... ah, dramatic? The water splash could be a bit higher, IMO, but I don't know whether it's possible.

Seawing

**warchild** · February 20th, 2013, 09:10

Originally Posted by Victory103

Ahh, great to see this coming up, lots of time "chucking" 58's and 25's out the door. Unless you can have a fun to prosecute an AI sub, not sure how you will make the ASW portion fun, unless we were in the dip and actively pinging a running sub, ASW wasn't as much fun. Anyway to make this an AI object like all the other weapons and effects in Tacpack?

Whhy make it AI?? Theres enough closet sub drivers here to make it the real thing.. Hell yes i'd drive a U-boat.. Catch me if you can :;lol::

**lazarus** · February 20th, 2013, 09:31

Yes. Trial and error. Open the 'cntrl ASW depth charge fx' with note pad and you will see a config file type thing. substitute the effect in the callout for a different one. I used a water cargo crash for the initial spash, and sinking ship for the gas bubble/glugging. the explosion effects are iterations of flak splash fx- those look the best for water explosions- so try some different ones. Timing is controled by the last 2 number values in each string, in seconds min max. The whole effect thing is user editable. But I'll have a look at that. I'm still grappleingwith a decent NDB effect- the same thing, really, just much bigger!
Operation SWORDFISH, 1962, off San Diego.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EV5q_mlhaiM

**seawing** · February 20th, 2013, 11:43

Ok, I see! So the torpedos have a different explosion effect than the Mk. 11? I'll load them into my Nimrod and try them out tomorrow. I found the Mk.11 explosion somewhat flat, that's why I was asking. The effect in your screenshot with the Shackleton looks much nicer.

Seawing

**lazarus** · February 20th, 2013, 14:10

The effects SDK should have had some sort of catalouge describing the various effects. Sure would make life easier, as now its sort of a 'tase it and see' approach.I am experimenting with the size of some of the default spash effects. Trial and error, time consuming as all get out, but I'm getting there!