Reverse Thrust

[OBIO]

I know that some planes have the ability to reverse thrust to slow down after landing. How does one reverse the thrust. I looked through the control assignments and saw nothing for reverse thrust. Does it require a more compex throttle set up, such as on the Thrustmaster HOTAS Cougar throttle, that will allow you to input negative throttle? I have a Cougar flight stick and throttle set, but am not using them due to the lack of a set of control pedals. I there a way to get reverse thrust without using a top-end throttle?

Can the Thrustmaster HOTAS Cougar throttle lever be hooked into a PC's game port and be used in conjunction with a Saitek ST290 Pro stick?

OBIO

[Brian_Gladden]

Press and hold F2. To cancel, hit F1.


Brian

[OBIO]

Thanks Brian. Will give it a try....sure to add more realism to my simming....not sure how many of the planes I regularly fly have reversable thrust, but I am sure a few may have it.

OBIO

[Wing_Z]

Press 'n hold doesn't seem to have the same effect on my system, as multiple rapid taps on F2.
The frequency of application seems to have something to do with the aircraft weight, speed, and the remaining length of runway available...
My keyboard's F2 key has a dent in it.

[miketull]

I have the Mike Stone C-119G which he did an excellent job on. I flew as a passenger on one of these airplanes in 1963 and I know that reverse thrust was used both times that we landed. I tried to add prop reversal to this airplane but was unable to do so. Can you help here or should I start a new thread?

[Rich]

The F2 only works on jets and I think some turbo props piston props need a little work in the aircraft.cfg prop section, I have a set of instructions on how to do it, not my work it was posted on SOH a few years back I have it working on the Blackburn Beverley, I will dig it out and post it

[Rich]

Took less time than I expected to find it, this is a copy of the origonal post.


reverse pitch props...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
...for real!
Hi, most people say that you can not have reverse pitch props with a piston engine in fs9. Well I found a way to do it without all the fancy gauges.
Step 1
Find a aircraft that needs reverse pitch props and go to its aircraft.cfg file.
I will use the soh b-26k as a example, but this should work for all constant speed prop aircraft. Go to the prop section and find the this:
prop_reverse_available = 1
minimum_on_ground_beta = 1
minimum_reverse_beta = -14
If the section is already like this, leave it, if not change to the above values.
Step 2
Next go to
beta_max = 65
Now take that value (minus 1 + make it a negative #) and put it in the
beta_feather =
Area.
(If there is no feather value they will need to be added)
Step 3
Now the
beta_feather =
Should look like this
beta_feather = -64
That’s it for the soh b-26k but for other aircraft you must make sure that the
power_absorbed_cf =
Has a value of 0.1 or higher (I recommend 0.1) if not props will go out of control.
Step 4 test!
Use the steps below to test while aircraft is at a standstill. If it moves backwards you did it!
(Note: make sure aircraft is not overloaded before testing)
Use in the sim
To make the props reverse do these following steps:
1. Once on ground hit Ctrl + F1. (Or move prop pitch lever all the way back)
2. Then hold Ctrl + F2 and increase throttle to takeoff power.
3. To return props to normal hit Ctrl + F4. (Or move prop pitch lever all the way foreword)
4. That’s it!
__________________
Reversing Props
To reverse the props, simply pull the propeller control all the way to the minimum position by using the prop control or pressing Ctrl-F1 (or any key assignment you choose). Then use full throttle to add reverse thrust (F4). If you pull the prop control back and leave the throttle at idle, nothing will happen. F2 has no effect on prop reverse on this aircraft; it is controlled entirely with the propeller control and throttles as on a real aircraft. If you wish to back up while on the ground, you can do so just by throttling up with the prop control pulled all the way back.
To use prop reverse to reduce the landing roll, pull the prop control right back the instant the wheels touch the ground and then add as much throttle as you would like, up to full throttle. This will greatly reduce the landing roll.
If keypresses are desired (as when the prop control is not assigned to a slider), on landing hit Ctrl-F1, then F4. After coming to a halt, hit F1 then Ctrl-F4.

I have it working ok

[modelr]

And there were two revisions to the instructions. Here's v2

revised inctuctions
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
this should clear some confustion. main changes are in red.
Step 1
Find an aircraft that needs reverse pitch props and go to its aircraft.cfg file.
This should work for all constant speed prop aircraft. Go to the prop section and find this:
prop_reverse_available = 1
minimum_on_ground_beta = 1
minimum_reverse_beta = -14
If the section is already like this, leave it, if not change to the above values or add them.
Step 2
Next go to
beta_max =
Now take the value there and subtract 1and make it a negative # and put it in the
beta_feather =
Area.
(If there is no feather value they will need to be added)
Step 3
You must make sure that the
power_absorbed_cf =
Has a value of 0.1 if not props will go out of control.
Also make sure that the
min_rpm_for_feather =
is 0
Step 4 test!
Use the steps below to test while aircraft is at a standstill. If it moves backwards you did it!
(Note: make aircraft is not overloaded before testing)
Use in the sim
To make the props reverse do these following steps:
1. Once on ground hit Ctrl + F1. (Or move prop pitch lever all the way back)
2. Then hold Ctrl + F2
You will see on the rpm gauge that the rpm drops below its usual minimum. As soon as you see that, then advance the throttle.
3. To return props to normal hit Ctrl + F4. (Or move prop pitch lever all the way foreword)
4. That’s it!
__________________
here are the settings for the cal classic cv-240
[propeller]
propeller_type=0
propeller_blades=3
gear_reduction_ratio=1.0
propeller_diameter=8.8
propeller_moi=26.8
beta_max=65.0
beta_min=15.0
prop_sync_available=1
prop_deice_available=1
prop_feathering_available=1
prop_reverse_available=1
min_rpm_for_feather=0
beta_feather=-64
power_absorbed_cf=0.1
minimum_on_ground_beta=1
minimum_reverse_beta=-14
defeathering_accumulators_available=0
prop_auto_feathering_available=1
min_gov_rpm=650.000000
prop_tc=0.010000
fixed_pitch_beta=20.000000
low_speed_theory_limit=80.000000

[modelr]

and v3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
important parts are in red.
Step 1
Find an aircraft that needs Step 1
Find an aircraft that needs reverse pitch props and go to its aircraft.cfg file.
This should work for all constant speed prop aircraft. Go to the prop section and find this:
prop_reverse_available = 1
minimum_on_ground_beta = 1
minimum_reverse_beta = -14
If the section is already like this, leave it, if not change to the above values or add them.
Step 2
Next go to
beta_max =
Now take the value there and subtract 1and make it a negative # and put it in the
beta_feather =
Area.
(If there is no feather value they will need to be added)
Step 3
You must make sure that the
power_absorbed_cf =
Has a value of 0.1 if not props will go out of control.
Also make sure that the
min_rpm_for_feather =
is 0
Step 4 test!
Use the steps below to test while aircraft is at a standstill. If it moves backwards you did it!
(Note: make aircraft is not overloaded before testing)
Use in the sim
To make the props reverse do these following steps:
1. Once on ground hit Ctrl + F1. (Or move prop pitch lever all the way back)
2. Then hold Ctrl + F2
You will see on the rpm gauge that the rpm drops below its usual minimum. As soon as you see that, then advance the throttle.
3. To return props to normal hit Ctrl + F4. (Or move prop pitch lever all the way foreword)
4. That’s it!


I'm ashamed to say I haven't tried it, yet, but I did keep the instructions.

[Tom Clayton]

The F2 press-and-hold is dependent on your keyboard's repeat setup. Go to your Control Panel and open the Keyboard Properties dialog. Make sure the repeat rate is maxed out. Here's how mine looks:

[Brian_Gladden]

The F2 press-and-hold is dependent on your keyboard's repeat setup. Go to your Control Panel and open the Keyboard Properties dialog. Make sure the repeat rate is maxed out. Here's how mine looks:

I meant to say, press and hold until the buckets deploy. then release. hit F1 to bring em back in.

Brian

[Reddog]

Tried the above changes in the C123 cfg file but no reverse, even put in the Alphasim caribou air file still no reverse.

[Brian_Gladden]

Tried the above changes in the C123 cfg file but no reverse, even put in the Alphasim caribou air file still no reverse.

Only works for Jets and Turboprops.

To make a Piston reverse, there are a bunch of cfg and air file changes to make. I think there was a discussion a while back in the Albatross FSX thread.

The guys over at Cal Classic did it with a gauge I think. The latest DC-6's will reverse.


Brian

[Rich]

I have the aircraft.cfg changes working fine on the Blackburn Beverley

1. Once on ground hit Ctrl + F1. (Or move prop pitch lever all the way back)
2. Then hold Ctrl + F2
You will see on the rpm gauge that the rpm drops below its usual minimum. As soon as you see that, then advance the throttle.
3. To return props to normal hit Ctrl + F4. (Or move prop pitch lever all the way foreword)

Does the Alphasim caribou reverse ?

[Reddog]

Does the Alphasim caribou reverse ?
Yes it does. Prop lever all the way back then throttle up as much as u want or need to stop it then throttle back and props forward. really slick setup. supposidly a few posts back there is insrtuctons on how to do that with any prop plane but so far have not gotten it to work on theC123 i tried it on.

[strikehawk]

If you don't want to do all that editing pay the registration fee for FSUIPC, it will let you fine tune your props, throttle, reverse thrusters, etc. You can also make the settings specific for each aircraft if you want.

[Rich]

As memory goes the Caribou and the other Alphasim planes with prop reverse the reverse is in the airfileI do'nt have any of them so cannot confirm, remember there was something about it on the old Alphasim forums.

[Reddog]

If you don't want to do all that editing pay the registration fee for FSUIPC, it will let you fine tune your props, throttle, reverse thrusters, etc. You can also make the settings specific for each aircraft if you want.

FSUIPC runs my computer out of virtual memory so can't use.

[Rich]

I do'nt have the Alphasim Albatross but I have loaded this one and got it happily reversing on land but up to now it will not reverse in water the reverse thrust is there to slow and stop on water it but it will not reverse, More work needed.

U.S. Airforce Gurmman HU-16 Albatross 2.0 for FS2004
by Greg Pepper and Michael Verlin

[chrisf36]

Manfred Jahn's Lockheed L1649 Starliner has a very slick prop reverse setup. I believe its done with a gauge. Works for me.

Chris

[Ralf Roggeveen]

Depends how serious you are about playing flightsims, but all Reverse Thrust problems (apart from the skill in knowing when to apply & when to stop applying it) are solved by getting a Flight Yoke System:

http://www.saitek.com/uk/prod/yoke.htm

The RH (black) lever on the quadrant is, of course, Throttle and you simply shove it below zero once your wheels are all on the ground. The middle (blue) lever controls your rudder - only used on the ground - and the red one is for mixture in propliners.

I don't have shares in the company, but would very much recommend this to enhance your simming, especially if you're flying anything other than warbirds. early stories of problems with them switching views unbidden, etc. have been ironed out. Mine seems to work just about perfectly, but it has taken many hours' practice to learn how to use it!



Perhaps the only downside are (1) that, as you can see, it really is BIG, takes up a lot of space & has to be screwed to the table (though fairly easy to put aside), so ideally requires a dedicated PC. (2) installing it overrides everything else for hardware on your computer - you can't have the Yoke and a Stick both set up at the same time & switch between the two. So before getting it you should decide seriously what you most want to fly and whether the Yoke simulates it most realistically.

I'm not quite nerdy enough to have pedals, but do believe that this Yoke is infinitely superior to any Joystick for realistic large aircraft flight - see my current Speedbird around the World thread for further proof...

[Rich]

Reverse now works on land and sea. Works on this one so should work on the Alphasim model,it realy needs the Alphasim airfile modifying to keep same dynamics.

Been reversing around Manila Bay through ships and other odds and ends can't measure reverse speed but I think around 10 kts and cheaper than a whole new yoke and throttles

I do'nt have the Alphasim Albatross but I have loaded this one and got it happily reversing on land but up to now it will not reverse in water the reverse thrust is there to slow and stop on water it but it will not reverse, More work needed.

U.S. Airforce Gurmman HU-16 Albatross 2.0 for FS2004
by Greg Pepper and Michael Verlin

[Ashaman]

The art of making a prop (be it piston or turbine powered) reversible is very hairy and sometimes cannot be explained. I had my own problems trying to make the FSDZigns L-049, with upgraded dynamics files to L-749, capable of reverse. In the end, in spite of all the help I could have from the ever helpful people at Calclassic (whose suggestions ran along the lines of those given in this thread), in desperation I had to transplant on the L-749 the same propeller section of the Starliner, because the modifies that on other people's L-749 gave great results, on my plane just didn't want to work in no way, shape or form.

And still can't explain the fact that the same modifies made on other planes (Mike Stone's Boeing B-314, Lockheed Electra and various C-130), does work well. One of the mysteries of FS.

[Rich]

You may want to look at the Alphasim Albatross thread in the FSX section, 3 undoctored screenshots of planes in reverse thrust on water