Grounded: And it is all Caz's fault

[jmig]

Just kidding on it is Caz's fault. Ha, ha.

However, he started it. After reading all his posts on how great his new flight sim puter was, I started thinking. (which can be dangerous)

My flight sim computer was just fine. However, my everyday computer, which is always the previous flight sim computer hand-me-down, was getting long in the tooth. So, I decided to build a new flight sim computer to "upgrade" my everyday computer. Thus Caz's fault.

Based on his comments and those of others, I decided to go with an AMD 7800 X3D CPU rather than my usual Intel purchase. Being an Asus ROG fan, I went with an AMD ROG Strix B650E-F motherboard. I selected 32 GBs of DDR5 RAM from the suggested RAM listed on the bottom of Newegg's page.

Everything came in on time and I put it together, reusing an existing case and PSU. When I fired it up on the bench all the pretty LED lights and fans lit and spun up. So far so good. However, after hooking up the monitor, keyboard and mouse I got no video. I swapped GPUs and monitors to no avail. I eventually realized (from a comment on AVSIM) that it wasn't even going to POST. So, I contacted Asus's support.

Let me say that Asus support was excellent. They have a chat feature (USA and Canada only) that allows real-time help. It still took a day to get the system working. I had to reflash the BIOS. However, the WIN 11 installation would stop loading at “needing internet service.” Hirens allowed me to get on the internet but not the Window's installation. By this time it was evening and I decided this was a problem for another day.

Yesterday morning when I sat down and flashed another Win 11 usb, thinking since my other flash drive with Win 11 was over a year old, maybe I needed a more recent version. The new system was back to not POSTing. Nothing but pretty LED lights and whirling fans.

Back to Asus support I went. An hour later the support person said that I was using an unlisted and unsupported version of RAM. AND, such unlisted and unsupported version of RAM could cause instability and failure to boot. Now, this is the RAM listed by Newegg as recommended.

My next contact was Newegg's return program. All went smoothly, they RMAed the RAM, I UPSed it out and ordered new RAM from Asus's listing of supported RAM.

So, I am grounded until my WIP ticket clears when the parts are delivered (and hopefully work). And I blame it on Caz. 😉

[Priller]

John,

You're also planning to go to an AMD GFX card on that rig? If so, which one?

Cheers,

Priller

[jmig]

John,

You're also planning to go to an AMD GFX card on that rig? If so, which one?

Cheers,

Priller

For the time being, I will stick with my RTX 3080. It is sill serving me well.

[Bushpounder]

I can see the look on Caz's face when he reads the thread title! LOL!

Don

[modelr]

I'm sure you'll get it all working in the end, John. But the headaches will be legion.

I blame all the problems I was having with my build on Caz, also. If I hadn't started this, it never would have happened. Ha Ha.

I also blame Windows 11! Most of my problems were non-existant until I upgraded.

Also turns out all my camera problems in the sim were due to a faulty download in the sim. Last week, my sim refused to load past the first screen. Multiple times. So, full uninstall, INCLUDING my Community folder, and start over from scratch. So far, everything is working properly!

Have fun.

[jmig]

I'm sure you'll get it all working in the end, John. But the headaches will be legion.

I blame all the problems I was having with my build on Caz, also. If I hadn't started this, it never would have happened. Ha Ha.

I also blame Windows 11! Most of my problems were non-existant until I upgraded.

Also turns out all my camera problems in the sim were due to a faulty download in the sim. Last week, my sim refused to load past the first screen. Multiple times. So, full uninstall, INCLUDING my Community folder, and start over from scratch. So far, everything is working properly!

Have fun.

Don, looking over you computer specifications, I see that you are using the same RAM that I purchased. It works on your MOB but not mine. Go figure. The computer gods are laughing as they look down from Mt. MS.

[Cazzie]

I can see the look on Caz's face when he reads the thread title! LOL!

Don

John needs to blame my son, I am far from a nerd, he's 100%. It was he and his partner who suggested I go with AMD. I'm sure happy with the rig he built for me. Nice to have a computer engineer for a son.

Cazzie

[Javis]

The new system was back to not POSTing. Nothing but pretty LED lights and whirling fans

Up front: nothing to do with Cazzie..

Not sure what 'Not Posting' means but i've been looking at nothing but "Pretty Led lights and Whirling Fans" for a couple days myself, John. Most probabely not to do with the problem you're having but i thought i'd tell you anyway.

I sure had this problem before: hit the keyboard or move the mouse to wake up my puter from its beauty sleep with the only result of your 'Pretty Led lights and Whirling Fans' and my monitor saying: "No DP Signal from your device. Entering save energy mode"....

Everytime since last week that this would happen i managed to become the proverbial prince to kiss that sleeping beauty to come alive again anyway ( just hitting the big shut down knob, disconnect the current, wait a minute, connect the current again and hit that big knob again. 9 times out of 10 i'd get into the BIOS, Save without changes, et voila there's my beloved Desktop again ! If it would come to the 1 out of 10 and still no Desktop i'd try that same process again and again until it *did* work, usually in 3 or 4 times ).

Not so last week however !

No matter what i'd try all i could get was your 'Pretty LED Lights and Whirling Fans' !.... After trying and trying, checking cables and even cleaning the case and components and looking at those damn lights and whirling fans for more than an hour i gave up. I had to surrender to the unmistakable conclusion that my computer this time had really givin up the ghost. Next day i called a computer buff who came round the next day. Cold Turkey with a dead computer for 2 days = no fun !

Certainly not a computer nerd myself but i have a good relationship with it, love it (well, ADORE IT !!..) and understand it when it feels a bit feverish or when it's in a bad mood but that's all, really. I have always thought that NOT sending out a DP signal to my monitor was caused by it NOT waking up from its beauty sleep. Later found that's not true because i got to watch just the pretty lights and whirling fans once in a while also after i had shut down the machine completely.

So in comes the doctor. And what he did was looking at the Pretty Lights and Whirling Fans a couple times, mumbled "Hmmmmmm".... and than he disconnected the CMOS with a small screwdriver and then reconnected it again. After reconnecting the current as well i thought i saw him make a quick cross fingers sign and hit that big knob et presto here comes that glorious BIOS finally back on the monitor !!

I could kiss that guy but i didn't (i did give him a great tip he was very happy with )

So what do you think John, could this maybe have anything to do with *your* "nothing but Pretty Lights and Whirling Fans" experience ?

So far my computer is behaving very well again (knock on wood)

[Priller]

What I always do after installing or reinstalling a PC is disable sleep and hibernation. Disabling hibernation has the added advantage of freeing up a couple of GB's on your hard drive.

Priller

[modelr]

Don, looking over you computer specifications, I see that you are using the same RAM that I purchased. It works on your MOB but not mine. Go figure. The computer gods are laughing as they look down from Mt. MS.

I've used Corsair RAM almost exclusively in my builds, since back in the late '90s when I built my first one. Never a problem. I have heard of people occasionally getting a bad stick. Maybe same with yours?

FYI, I'm not an electronics guru/nerd, I just like to build/assemble things. "Jack of all trades, Master of none." I'm sure there are a lot of us on here.

BTW Caz, I think you get the blame forall our problems by posting so well about your new build. It got most of us thinking about, and performing new builds ourselves. We just aren't lucky enough to have sons as smart as yours, LOL. All in good fun.

[Ferry_vO]

On my last build I found it quite surprising that I had to use the 2&4 slots for the RAM Modules, not the 1&2 (Counting from the processor) as I always had. Also using Corsair btw.

[jmig]

Up front: nothing to do with Cazzie..

Not sure what 'Not Posting' means but i've been looking at nothing but "Pretty Led lights and Whirling Fans" for a couple days myself, John. Most probabely not to do with the problem you're having but i thought i'd tell you anyway...


So what do you think John, could this maybe have anything to do with *your* "nothing but Pretty Lights and Whirling Fans" experience ?...

The BIOS stands for Basic Input/Output System. All it knows is turn on the computer, start the POST, which is the Power On Self Test. The POST looks for the CMOS. The CMOS tells the computer which drive the Operation System ( Win 11) is located, current date and time and a few other basic instructions. The CMOS not code. It is a special chip that stores the actual BIOS code. When you hit F2 or Del during POST you open the user interface (UI) that allows you to adjust the BIOS settings. The new adjusted settings are then stored on the CMOS chip

Sometime the BIOS gets confused and can’t find the CMOS. Using the screwdriver to short the pins forces the BIOS to reset back to normal.

In my case, the memory issue made the BIOS unable to find the CMOS. So it didn't start the POST, meaning nothing else happened. In other words, the computer was brain dead. When I reflashed the CMOS the first time, somehow the BIOS was able to find the Boot files. Later it went brain dead again.

On a postive note, I now have time to work on my cockpit. I have wanted to make some changes for a while. It is easier for me to do this when the computer is out of the cockpit.

[Cazzie]

I've used Corsair RAM almost exclusively in my builds, since back in the late '90s when I built my first one. Never a problem. I have heard of people occasionally getting a bad stick. Maybe same with yours?

FYI, I'm not an electronics guru/nerd, I just like to build/assemble things. "Jack of all trades, Master of none." I'm sure there are a lot of us on here.

BTW Caz, I think you get the blame forall our problems by posting so well about your new build. It got most of us thinking about, and performing new builds ourselves. We just aren't lucky enough to have sons as smart as yours, LOL. All in good fun.

It doesn't matter, I have always been the black sheep boy of the family. I was born a half-bubble off plumb, now at 77, I'm a full bubble off. The last time I took an IQ test, my score came out on the same level as that of a dead monkey. Boy got his brains from his mom, I majored in Chemistry, my degree was in the ingestion of chemicals, specializing in sedation.

Cazzie

[jmig]

It doesn't matter, I have always been the black sheep boy of the family. I was born a half-bubble off plumb, now at 77, I'm a full bubble off. The last time I took an IQ test, my score came out on the same level as that of a dead monkey. Boy got his brains from his mom, I majored in Chemistry, my degree was in the ingestion of chemicals, specializing in sedation.

Cazzie

That has to one of the best all time replies I have seen in decades.

[Javis]

What I always do after installing or reinstalling a PC is disable sleep and hibernation. Disabling hibernation has the added advantage of freeing up a couple of GB's on your hard drive.

Priller

Thanks, Jan. So you shut your puter down after each and every session ??....

[Priller]

Thanks, Jan. So you shut your puter down after each and every session ??....

Yes I do. And at work the same thing is enforced using group policy.

Priller

[Javis]

The BIOS stands for Basic Input/Output System. All it knows is turn on the computer, start the POST, which is the Power On Self Test. The POST looks for the CMOS. The CMOS tells the computer which drive the Operation System ( Win 11) is located, current date and time and a few other basic instructions. The CMOS not code. It is a special chip that stores the actual BIOS code. When you hit F2 or Del during POST you open the user interface (UI) that allows you to adjust the BIOS settings. The new adjusted settings are then stored on the CMOS chip

Sometime the BIOS gets confused and can’t find the CMOS. Using the screwdriver to short the pins forces the BIOS to reset back to normal.
In my case, the memory issue made the BIOS unable to find the CMOS. So it didn't start the POST, meaning nothing else happened. In other words, the computer was brain dead. When I reflashed the CMOS the first time, somehow the BIOS was able to find the Boot files. Later it went brain dead again.

Thanks John, very interesting ! I know a bit about the BIOS (in ancient times like with Windows 4/5 and FS5/95 et all). Had to because every other week my computers then would go belly up for whatever reason. Those days are deffinately gone. CMOS i know must be some kind of battery or accu or something but never had the intelligence to bring it into connection with my irritating problem. That's what the doctor was for.. Power On Self Test i.e. POST, sure, i've heard or read about it somewhere but must have forgot about almost immidiately..

So thanks very much for the reminder, John !

On a postive note, I now have time to work on my cockpit. I have wanted to make some changes for a while. It is easier for me to do this when the computer is out of the cockpit.

What cockpit might that be, John ?

[Javis]

Yes I do. And at work the same thing is enforced using group policy.

Priller

Good to know, thanks !

Would you say it's better to shut down a computer completely after each session or put it in sleep mode after each session and do a close down/startup maybe one or two times a week ?

And if you'd say the former, what would then be the reason ?

Thanks, mate !

[Priller]

Good to know, thanks !

Would you say it's better to shut down a computer completely after each session or put it in sleep mode after each session and do a close down/startup maybe one or two times a week ?

And if you'd say the former, what would then be the reason ?

Thanks, mate !

Personally, I do the former. Mainly because I'm old school in these things. The second one should help, but I'm a firm believer to power down a rig regularly, preferably daily.

It does help with regards to longevity of a rig, if only because the electric current on the components is minimal after a shutdown. It's never down to completely zero, but still.

Again, I'm old school in these things.

Priller

[Tom Clayton]

I'll add one more thing to the topic of shutdowns. I also disable "fast startup" in the Control Panel. As fast as these rigs are now, it doesn't matter anyway, but with that feature enabled, the rig doesn't fully shut down the file system, and changes that require a restart won't take effect unless you actually "restart" the system. With "fast startup" disabled, you don't have to wait through an entire restart cycle to run updates before you shut down the system for the night, which would actually take far more time that you'd save.

[Priller]

I'll add something about the AMD vs Intel/Nvidia builds.

I've done some reading and comparing stuff, and if nothing changes, my next PC build will probably be AMD. Pricing is one (important) issue, but so is CPU architecture. Having looked at AMD CPU's a bit more closely, I'm pretty impressed, especially in the way they're built to handle graphics together with the GPU.

But my current rig is new, so it will have to wait a couple of years (unless this one suffers from something catastrophic)

Priller

[modelr]

Another big thing about shutting completely down overnight, while at work, (for those of you still young enough to do that, LOL,) is the reduction in the electric bill. My (unwanted, forced on me) "Smart" meter can tell immediately when I shut down.

I second Tom's advice about not using Fast Boot. I tried it for a short while, then went back to total shutdown, especially for the updating as he mentioned. The difference in boot time with this newer rig doesn't let me go to the kitchen to grab a cup of coffee before it's up and ready. Heck, my 3 year old Android phone boots at almost the same speed.

@Caz

[P51FAN]

I've used Corsair RAM almost exclusively in my builds, since back in the late '90s when I built my first one. Never a problem. I have heard of people occasionally getting a bad stick. Maybe same with yours?

FYI, I'm not an electronics guru/nerd, I just like to build/assemble things. "Jack of all trades, Master of none." I'm sure there are a lot of us on here.

Back when I first built my desktop in 2019 about a month later it would turn on but not display anything. Since I'm a member of the "I know just enough to be dangerous" club with computers I didn't realize that one of the sticks of RAM was bad (I guess I got one of the few bad Corsairs), given my situation at the time I went in prepared to replace half the computer. Ended up using the motherboard and graphics card that I bought "in case of" in a computer for my sister, so no loss there.

Anyways, after swapping out the RAM I had video again, but I found out/remembered (I can't remember which now) during this process my ASUS motherboard has a 2 digit display that shows the boot process and gives an error code if necessary. I know for mine code 55 equates to a RAM problem.

I'll add something about the AMD vs Intel/Nvidia builds.

I've done some reading and comparing stuff, and if nothing changes, my next PC build will probably be AMD. Pricing is one (important) issue, but so is CPU architecture. Having looked at AMD CPU's a bit more closely, I'm pretty impressed, especially in the way they're built to handle graphics together with the GPU.

I remember reading a while back that some games did not play nicely with Intel's system of the power & efficiency cores, although I think that was the previous generation. I haven't looked into it too deeply, but I wonder if that's still the case?

[jmig]

Thanks John, very interesting ! I know a bit about the BIOS (in ancient times like with Windows 4/5 and FS5/95 et all). Had to because every other week my computers then would go belly up for whatever reason. Those days are deffinately gone. CMOS i know must be some kind of battery or accu or something but never had the intelligence to bring it into connection with my irritating problem. That's what the doctor was for.. Power On Self Test i.e. POST, sure, i've heard or read about it somewhere but must have forgot about almost immidiately..

So thanks very much for the reminder, John !



What cockpit might that be, John ?

It is a fighter cockpit that I built after retiring some ten years ago. It is my third cockpit. I have previously built a replica of a T-38 cockpit. I had flown the T-38 and loved its sports car look and performance. However, as I got into DCS I wanted something that simulated weapons.

The new cockpit was built as a cross between the F-16 and F-18. I made a major concession to my age by giving the left side a clam shell design, so I could just open it like a door and slide into the seat. I had to climb into the T-38 cockpit and lower myself in the seat.

Then came VR and I could no longer see all the cool switches, knobs, and buttons. Also, I was flying more and more GA singles and twins. I bought a Honeycomb Alpha, Bravo combination. To fit them, I had to redesign the cockpit again. I removed the right side and built a rolling box 12” wide and 48” long. One end has a side mounted joystick, which I had removed from its center position. On the other end is the Honeycomb Bravo throttle setup. The Alpha yoke is mounted in front of me like any yoke would be.

To switch between fighter type airplanes and GA yoke type airplanes, I only need to remove two cables, pull the pin on the door hinge that attaches it to the main portion of the cockpit. I then roll the side and turn it around 180 degrees. I then reinsert the pin into the second door hinge (one half of the hinge is attached to both sides) and reattach the power cord and usb cable that runs the right side hub.

Here are a couple images of when it was a T-38 cockpit. I will take some more recent images and post them later.

[modelr]

Dang it, John. Now I need to wipe the drool off my keyboard!!