Need a new system - I am baffled...

[DaveKDEN]

I apologize if this is in the wrong forum, but it's directly related to buying something for use with MSFS (or FS2020 if you prefer).

I've been looking for a new system with a 3080 card for MSFS. As you might already know, finding a 3080 card is like finding a Unicorn. As such, I am now thinking about getting something with a "lesser" card and then upgrading later on.
Any thoughts on what to do? I'd like to keep the total system cost to no more than $2,500 - maybe $3,000 max. I'd LOVE to have something that could run MSFS in 2K or even 4K with at least the 30fps range, and certainly something that supports VR. I really don't want to play the game of constantly having to upgrade my system, as I've done that too often in the past.
I am NOT an expert in modern systems at all, and have been scouring YouTube videos trying to come up with answers. For reference, I had been running FSX for many years on a completely antiquated Windows 7 Dell Dimension XPS 8930 with an overclocked quad core Q6600 and a GeForce GTX 460 card (yes - it's that old). I'm having boot issues with it, and fear it might be on it's last legs.

What would your "realistic" dream system include?
PLEASE - I need advice.

[guzler]

I recently got a 3070 card and it's doing a great job with most settings high / ultra and texture lod at 150 and 1440 monitor (i7 8700k with 32gb ram too). I got this as it was a big step up from my 1070ti previously yet great value. Going to a 3080 would of meant a new PSU for me so this was a step that I have no regrets over, especially when it competes with the 2080ti for half the price.

[Mach3DS]

Dave, I'm super happy with my build. See my sig. I run MSFS on ULTRA @ 1080p. You may want to upgrade GFX card to a 3070. Very powerful and economical price tag. just looked at them on Amazon. $869. That's essentially what I bought my 2080 Super for this past June.

[DennyA]

Hi Dave,

3080 availability is finally starting to get better. One option is to buy a system configured with one -- that's what I did, buying a CyberPowerPC from Best Buy that had a 10900K and a 3080. (Decent system, but I had to replace their stock cooler because it was inadequate for the i9-10900K. Price was under $2K and I added an additional 16GB of RAM and a second M.2 SSD, so well within your price range even with that.

I'd suggest an i9-10850K or 10900K/KF CPU. AMD has some very competitive new processors, but they're as hard to find as 3080s right now. 16GB will work fine, but if you want to go another long period without messing with your system, I'd go ahead and go for 32GB.

As far as GPUs go, VR is so demanding I'd say 3070 minimum, but if you're spending big money, I'd stay on the hunt for a 3080. With things maxed out in 3440x1440 resolution I'm running about 45-50 fps, and 35-45 in VR with some details turned down, on the 3080.

I just put together an example "dream system" on iBuyPower that came to $2612 with 2TB of SSD storage, a 3080, 32GB, and a 10900KF CPU, so it's about as fast as you can buy without spending stupid money on a 3090 card.

Instead of trying to catch a 3080 in stock, you can just backorder a system from iBuyPower/CyberPowerPC/etc. and they'll build/send once they have 3080s available.

Operating System :: Windows 10 Home - (64-bit)
Case :: Lian Li LANCOOL II Tempered Glass RGB Gaming Case
Case Fans :: 3x [Silent] be quiet! Pure Wings 2 PWM 120mm Black Fan
Processor :: Intel® Core™ i9-10900KF Processor (10x 3.70 GHz /20MB L3 Cache)
Processor Cooling :: Asetek 690LS 360mm Liquid Cooling System
Memory :: 32 GB [16 GB x2] DDR4-3000 Memory Module - Certified Major Brand Gaming Memory
Video Card :: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3080 - 10GB GDDR6X (VR-Ready) - [PRE-ORDER ITEM]
Motherboard :: ASUS PRIME Z490-P - WiFi, ARGB Header (1), USB 3.2 Ports (4 Type-A), M.2 Slot (3)
Power Supply :: 800 Watt - High Power - 80 PLUS Gold
Advanced Cabling Options :: Standard Default Cables
Primary Hard Drive :: 1TB GIGABYTE AORUS M.2 PCI-E 4.0 NVME Gen 4 SSD - Read: 5000 MB/s, Write: 4400 MB/s / Gen 3 - Read 3480 MB/s, Write 2100 MB/s
Secondary Hard Drive :: 1TB Samsung 870 QVO SSD -- Read: 560MB/s, Write: 530MB/s - Single Drive
Media Card Reader / Writer :: None
Sound Card :: 3D Premium Surround Sound Onboard
Network Card :: Onboard LAN Network (Gb or 10/100)
USB Expansion Card :: PCI-Express USB 3.0 4-Port Card (3x External + 1x Internal)
Limited Time Offer ::TODAY ONLY! $50 Off All Intel Powered Systems!!

[ryanbatc]

Hi Dave! I'd consider a new Ryzen 5600X and 3080 once you can find one. (Actually both might be hard to find). The newest Ryzens are super nice for single core performance. Otherwise the 10700K is just slightly better (only very slightly) but more pricey.

850W PSU

32GB RAM

I'm also in the market for a new build but there's still major availability issues imo. I'm planning a totally new build but if I can't find a GPU I'll use my 1080 Ti. I'd like to go 4K and also VR with an HP Reverb G2 at some point.

[Sundog]

If you're not averse to building your system, which is what I did last time, you can use the PC Part Picker web site to build a system and make sure everything is compatible and it also looks for the lowest price on the internet for the components (within the U.S.). I like that you can save your builds there as well. I already have a new system pieced together there, but I need to make a few changes before I decide to build my next system. Ken

[DaveKDEN]

Thank you all for your input - it is very much appreciated! I spent a good deal of time yesterday doing more research. I'm leaning towards putting together a system from iBuypower, but will likely have to pre-order as 3080 cards aren't in stock. Unfortunately, the prices on them are significantly higher then they should be, apparently as a result of their popularity with bitcoin miners and the like ().
Anyway, I think I'll wait until I see what comes out during CES next week, then place a pre-order. I just hope my current computer can hold on for awhile longer. I have a backup Chromebook (my travel machine) just in case, but certainly prefer using my desktop for daily stuff.
DennyA, I really appreciate your specific suggestions - I had not heard of iBuypower before.
PS: I've been fairly quiet on the forums here in the past few years. I had forgotten how helpful the members here are.

[DennyA]

Happy to help! You might also check out CyberPowerPC as well. I was not happy with how they configured the cooling on my Best Buy "stock" rig, but the actual build quality was fine. If you're configuring your own system anyway, you can be sure to get an adequate cooler when you're setting it up, which fixes my only real issue with them. (For a 10900-class CPU, 360mm water cooled or a really big air cooler like a Noctua NH-D14.)

Also, in my sample config, I had an m.2 SSD for boot and a second SATA SSD, but that was based on limitations in iBuyPower's configurator. I'd actually suggest going with m.2 for both SSDs -- it really provides a significant speed boost in MSFS.

[DaveKDEN]

Well, I went ahead and pulled the trigger on a build from iBuypower. I decided to go with a 8GB RTX 3070 vs. waiting for the 3080. I might regret it later, but based on my research today, I think the 3070 should suffice just fine. Once again, many many thanks for the input - especially DennyA, as I used his specs as the basis for some of the configuration. I kept the price to just above $2,500, including tax and free shipping.

Here's what I ordered - estimated ship date Feb 3rd (sheesh - that's a wait)

Intel Z490 Core i9 Configurator
Case	AeroCool Cylon RGB Gaming Case - Black
Case Fans	3x [Silent] be quiet! Pure Wings 2 PWM 120mm Black Fan
Processor	Intel® Core™ i9-10900KF Processor (10x 3.70 GHz /20MB L3 Cache)
Processor Cooling	iBUYPOWER 240mm Addressable RGB Liquid Cooling System - Black
Memory	32 GB [8 GB x4] DDR4-3000 Memory Module - Certified Major Brand Gaming Memory
Video Card	NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 - 8GB GDDR6 (VR-Ready)
Motherboard	ASUS PRIME Z490-P - WiFi, ARGB Header (1), USB 3.2 Ports (4 Type-A), M.2 Slot (3)
Power Supply	800 Watt - High Power - 80 PLUS Gold
Advanced Cabling Options	Standard Default Cables
Primary Hard Drive	1TB WD Black 3D Series SN850 M.2 PCIe Gen 4 NVMe SSD -- Read: 7000 MB/s, Write: 5300 MB/s / Gen 3 - Read 3600 MB/s, Write 3300 MB/s
Secondary Hard Drive	1TB ADATA SU800 SSD -- Read: 560MB/s, Write: 520MB/s - Single Drive
Sound Card	3D Premium Surround Sound Onboard
Network Card	Onboard LAN Network (Gb or 10/100)
Operating System	Windows 10 Home w/ Windows Recovery USB - (64-bit)
Warranty	3 Year Standard Warranty Service
Warranty	Three Year Standard Warranty
Rush Service	No Rush - Standard Service - Estimated Ship Out in 3-4 Weeks

[DennyA]

That's a sweet rig, DaveKDEN! You'll really enjoy it, and the 3070 is definitely no slouch. And with that CPU and 32GB of memory, you'll be set for long enough that you can just upgrade to a 20GB 5070 in a few years.

I have the same motherboard; it's very stable. And it has a second m.2 slot, so you can add more fast SSD space later if you find you need it.

That WD m.2 drive will be awesome for loading MSFS as fast as possible. I have a slower M.2 drive and it cut more than a minute off loading vs. a SATA SSD drive -- I can only imagine how fast that one will be!

Keep us posted when you get up and running! You'll have to install FSX on it just so you can finally fly over FSX Seattle at a decent frame rate.

[DaveKDEN]

That's a sweet rig, DaveKDEN! You'll really enjoy it, and the 3070 is definitely no slouch. And with that CPU and 32GB of memory, you'll be set for long enough that you can just upgrade to a 20GB 5070 in a few years.

I have the same motherboard; it's very stable. And it has a second m.2 slot, so you can add more fast SSD space later if you find you need it.

That WD m.2 drive will be awesome for loading MSFS as fast as possible. I have a slower M.2 drive and it cut more than a minute off loading vs. a SATA SSD drive -- I can only imagine how fast that one will be!

Keep us posted when you get up and running! You'll have to install FSX on it just so you can finally fly over FSX Seattle at a decent frame rate.

Thanks Denny, I will definitely give an update after it's delivered and I have MSFS up and running. Again, I can't thank you and the other members here enough for the help.

[wombat666]

A tale of how to fling one's self right OTT and stress even the best personal relationship!!!
Do not do this!!
My partner refers to my 'Special Projects' like this as 'Wretched Excess', but a boy needs a hobby! (And I like living on the edge!)
I tend toward the old 'how fast do you want to go? - how much do you want to spend?' maxim.
And I always build my own systems.

I started building this one just as the 'Virus' started to make it hard to get all the little extras that make a system personal and pre the RTX 3000 series madness.
After several frustrating months it is on line and I am 99.99% happy with it, despite spending a lot of time and money getting here.

Windows 10 64 (under protest)
Intel BX8069510980XE Core i9-10980XE
ASUS ROG Rampage VI Extreme Encore
ASUS Turbo GeForce RTX 2080 Ti, 11GB x2 in SLI
Corsair CMK128GX4M8X3800C19 Vengeance LPX 128GB (8x16GB) 3800MHz DDR4
Corsair iCUE H150i ELITE CAPELLIX Liquid CPU Cooler
Corsair 1600W Titanium Series AX1600i Power Supply
Corsair MP600 2TB M.2 NVMe SSD, PCIe Gen4 x2
Samsung 860 PRO 4TB SSD x4
Phanteks Enthoo Evolv X D-RGB Tempered Glass ATX
Acer Predator XB273KS UHD G-Sync 144Hz IPS 27in Gaming Monitor
Of course, there is always room for improvement and the present source of irritation revolves around a really good monitor..............................
The major problem facing DIY builders like myself is the present supply shortage on almost any high end components, but it helps if one can plan ahead.
Given that we were in a very strict COVID Lockdown for the best part of 20 weeks the need for compromise became important, usually 'upwards' of course.

Lurking in a shadowy corner of my bunker are the basics of my next project, pre ordering components is a good option if one can arrange it, having a long term relationship with one's supplier is even better.

Gigabyte GeForce RTX 3090 GAMING OC, 24GB
ASUS ROG Ryujin 360 Liquid CPU Cooler
Phanteks Enthoo Elite Satin Black Case
(To be continued)

[DaveKDEN]

A tale of how to fling one's self right OTT and stress even the best personal relationship!!!
Do not do this!!
My partner refers to my 'Special Projects' like this as 'Wretched Excess', but a boy needs a hobby! (And I like living on the edge!)
I tend toward the old 'how fast do you want to go? - how much do you want to spend?' maxim.
And I always build my own systems.

I started building this one just as the 'Virus' started to make it hard to get all the little extras that make a system personal and pre the RTX 3000 series madness.
After several frustrating months it is on line and I am 99.99% happy with it, despite spending a lot of time and money getting here.

Windows 10 64 (under protest)
Intel BX8069510980XE Core i9-10980XE
ASUS ROG Rampage VI Extreme Encore
ASUS Turbo GeForce RTX 2080 Ti, 11GB x2 in SLI
Corsair CMK128GX4M8X3800C19 Vengeance LPX 128GB (8x16GB) 3800MHz DDR4
Corsair iCUE H150i ELITE CAPELLIX Liquid CPU Cooler
Corsair 1600W Titanium Series AX1600i Power Supply
Corsair MP600 2TB M.2 NVMe SSD, PCIe Gen4 x2
Samsung 860 PRO 4TB SSD x4
Phanteks Enthoo Evolv X D-RGB Tempered Glass ATX
Acer Predator XB273KS UHD G-Sync 144Hz IPS 27in Gaming Monitor
Of course, there is always room for improvement and the present source of irritation revolves around a really good monitor..............................
The major problem facing DIY builders like myself is the present supply shortage on almost any high end components, but it helps if one can plan ahead.
Given that we were in a very strict COVID Lockdown for the best part of 20 weeks the need for compromise became important, usually 'upwards' of course.

Lurking in a shadowy corner of my bunker are the basics of my next project, pre ordering components is a good option if one can arrange it, having a long term relationship with one's supplier is even better.

Gigabyte GeForce RTX 3090 GAMING OC, 24GB
ASUS ROG Ryujin 360 Liquid CPU Cooler
Phanteks Enthoo Elite Satin Black Case
(To be continued)

That's funny - I feel your pain.

[DennyA]

It's funny, the CyberPowerPC was the first PC I'd purchased pre-built in about 20 years.

Then it turned out the Best Buy-configured system shipped with a horrible cooling setup (single-fan water cooler and all fans blowing in, none exhausting), so MSFS was pushing the CPU into thermal throttling territory.

So by the time all was said and done, I'd replaced the cooler/CPU paste, replaced the system fans and added three more (all PWM), and had the entire system apart. When you add in the troubleshooting time, wasn't really a time savings over building from scratch.

But, at the Best Buy actually had a system with a 3080 IN STOCK, and I had been planning a CPU upgrade anyway, so no regrets.