Legacy Aircraft

**DennyA** · August 25th, 2020, 15:42

They've announced helicopter support is in the works, and there will be a helicopter add-on available with multiple craft, helipads, etc.

***Penzoil3*** · August 25th, 2020, 16:18

If we have to pay for the helicopter add on, I will be very unhappy after dropping $120 to begin with.
Sue

***Sundog*** · August 25th, 2020, 17:36

You will have to pay something for the Helicopter add-on. I don't recall if they are going to add the capability for free, but if you want their helo models you'll have to pay for them, just as you paid for more planes when you bought MSFS. It's something like that.

**SkippyBing** · August 25th, 2020, 22:38

My understanding was the simulator would get the capability in an update, i.e. you don’t have to pay for it as it will be part of the regularly updates to the programme. However, when that happens you’ll still need to pay for the helicopters whether that’s from MS/ASOBO or a third party. In the interview I saw they mentioned maybe doing a pack of four helicopters to showcase the range of possibilities.

**Seahawk72s** · August 30th, 2020, 06:09

A B-2 in MSFS, nice external views.

***blanston12*** · August 30th, 2020, 10:05

I have been trying to add some legacy aircraft to my sim and have had varying levels of success, here are some of my results. First is Ants tiger moth.

It does appear that only 3D modeled gauges work and none of the popup 2D panels. This one worked fairly well except I could not find a way to remove the non-functioning GPS.

***blanston12*** · August 30th, 2020, 10:11

Ant's Tigermoth Pro worked ok except for the strange polygons around the gauges.

***blanston12*** · August 30th, 2020, 10:16

Some definite fails

Coronado's Bonanza F33

AH P47

Nigel Richards's FSX Native AVRO 621

***blanston12*** · August 30th, 2020, 10:22

The GAS Super Stearman was a winner,

These are the A75L300

But the A75AG had some panel issues.

***blanston12*** · August 30th, 2020, 10:48

Another test, this with the JustFlight Battle Of Brittan pack, for the most part its pretty good. However.

The BF109's gauges had no hands so I did no further testing with it.

The Hurricane looked good

The spitfire did not look bad also, both the Spit and the Hurricane both had an issue with not having textures on the wheels (something I can live with). Most of the small tail draggers I tested, with the exception of the stearman, tended to go nose over very easily and it was very difficult to come to a stop safely.

**Ganter** · August 30th, 2020, 11:38

Come on guys - sort it out.

Can't keep flying the 152. It's boring. . .

**bazzar** · August 30th, 2020, 13:22

Blanston12, the strange wireframes etc in your VCs are mouse clickspots and 2D gauge panels. The only way to remove those is with access to the original model. XML and 3D gauges will be OK. Quality of textures will depend on resolution of the originals and what kind of testure they are. Remember that in FSX, several types of DDS and bitmaps (BMP) were/are used to achieve different results and keep framerates down in that sim. Animations in legacy add-ons may behave strangely too.It's all a bit of a lottery.I wonder how our Duxford Mk1 Spitfire and the new Hurricane work. We are very busy on contract work at the moment so have no time to test. Anybody game?

BTW, I lived on Jersey for 17 years.

**OzWookiee** · August 30th, 2020, 14:47

Biggest thing to understand with these conversations is that all 2D instruments in the 3D cockpit will not work. This was a very common technique of previous FSX developers, both payware and freeware alike, so majority of aircraft converted will not work without a LOT of work.

At this point it is much better that they (the developers) break something's so that we can having some really amazing things going forward. Honestly there is 0 reason to have 2D instruments in a 3D cockpit in 2020. There are some instruments that you do need to draw on a 2D plane (glass instruments) and they have given us new tools to do that. Which requires the new 3D art format and some new coding.

***blanston12*** · August 30th, 2020, 15:54

Baz, I hope when you said "XML and 3D gauges will be OK" that it means its something they have said they will fix in time.

I have the Dunkirk Spit but I don't have you latest Hurricane. Here are some shots from the Spit, they speak for themselves.

Then inspired I tried a couple older aircraft, first the AH B-17G, for the most part a success. It flew reasonably well and I managed to land without doing a nose plant (but it was close)

Then the AH C-46, I selected one with the more modern gauges and it looked promising.

Only as I few around did I discover that the AP and radio gauges looked like they were working when in fact they were not, they displayed stuff but you could not change it. It landed fine but could not steer on the ground even with left and right brakes enabled.

**keithb77** · August 31st, 2020, 06:05

Originally Posted by blanston12

Baz, I hope when you said "XML and 3D gauges will be OK" that it means its something they have said they will fix in time.

...

Then the AH C-46, I selected one with the more modern gauges and it looked promising.

....

Only as I few around did I discover that the AP and radio gauges looked like they were working when in fact they were not, they displayed stuff but you could not change it. It landed fine but could not steer on the ground even with left and right brakes enabled.

3D gauges work, they are in the MDL file. XML gauges don't work at the moment.

For the C-46 I prefer the older military model, the autopilot works and the radios are hidden in the roof so you don't see the cross-outs. They work though.
The AH/JF Lockheed Electra also works well, just the collins radios are crossed out, sadly in plain view.

For Ant's Tiger Moth you CAN get rid of the wire frame - they are in the panel.cfg as 'click-spot' XML gauges, just delete them.
Sadly though the controls (eg throttle) don't move in the cockpit but you do still control them with joystick etc.
But for me it is silent - do you get any sounds? I think they are all from a sound DLL.

Another one I've had success with is the Virtavia Islander, again everything except the radios, GPS and A/P display and everything works.

DC6 looks good but most of the instruments are bust

Cheers
Keith

**centuryseries** · August 31st, 2020, 06:49

Hoping to get this one native at some point.

***Navy Chief*** · August 31st, 2020, 08:32

Originally Posted by Ganter

Come on guys - sort it out.

Can't keep flying the 152. It's boring. . .

Ditto! NC

***Navy Chief*** · August 31st, 2020, 08:42

Originally Posted by keithb77

3D gauges work, they are in the MDL file. XML gauges don't work at the moment.

For the C-46 I prefer the older military model, the autopilot works and the radios are hidden in the roof so you don't see the cross-outs. They work though.
The AH/JF Lockheed Electra also works well, just the collins radios are crossed out, sadly in plain view.

For Ant's Tiger Moth you CAN get rid of the wire frame - they are in the panel.cfg as 'click-spot' XML gauges, just delete them.
Sadly though the controls (eg throttle) don't move in the cockpit but you do still control them with joystick etc.
But for me it is silent - do you get any sounds? I think they are all from a sound DLL.

Another one I've had success with is the Virtavia Islander, again everything except the radios, GPS and A/P display and everything works.

DC6 looks good but most of the instruments are bust

Cheers
Keith

Would LOVE to see the Just Flight Islander work in this sim!! NC

**Ganter** · August 31st, 2020, 09:33

Nice work lads, nice work.

If you were doing all this work together in a hangar I'd bring you all a cup of tea and tray of biscuits.

Keep going. Let's get all these birds off the tarmac and in to the MSFS skies.

***blanston12*** · August 31st, 2020, 10:03

Originally Posted by keithb77

3D gauges work, they are in the MDL file. XML gauges don't work at the moment.
DC6 looks good but most of the instruments are bust

Cheers
Keith

Is that the JF DC6? An aircraft I have used a lot in both FSX and P3D (yes 64 bit compatible) but mostly it's mostly 2D XML gauges I figured it would be a lost cause.

I did try the JF Electra and it worked quite well, same issues as the C-46. Interestingly using the Sperry autopilot with the mouse, I could rotate the heading bug or the pitch one way but not the other, I would have to map a keyboard key to do that when it's time to fly it for real.

***Spook48*** · August 31st, 2020, 10:19

Did anybody try this ?
I cant download it.

https://www.msfsaddon.com/2020/08/fl...d21-plane.html

edit: Hmm , was browsing through that site and i seriously doubt if its all legit in there so nvm .

**keithb77** · August 31st, 2020, 10:32

I couldn't download the D21 either - looks like a lot of clickbait, I wouldn't trust the .com site at all - stick to https://www.msfsaddons.org/

Yes that's the JF DC-6 and no it's not really flyable with few working gauges.

The BoB Spitfire and Hurricane are pretty nice though

just a few white textures (need converting to 32bit bmp I think) and very unstable on the ground, maybe the contact points or similar need adjusting?

The Virtavia / Flight1 Islander converts nicely - I'm not aware of a JustFlight version?

None of the later JustFlight models display properly, pretty sure that's copy-protection kicking in because a DLL fails to load in MSFS despite it being a legit licensed retail copy installed straight into MSFS.

Cheers
Keith

***anthony31*** · August 31st, 2020, 12:33

Originally Posted by blanston12

Ant's Tigermoth Pro worked ok except for the strange polygons around the gauges.

Those would be the mouse rectangles. I map them to a virtual cockpit texture which uses a special blend to be invisible (or not). It makes development a lot easier too as the mouse logic can be put into a simple XML gauge instead of needing to be part of the model file. I guess MSFS doesn't like them.

**bazzar** · August 31st, 2020, 13:33

"Baz, I hope when you said "XML and 3D gauges will be OK" that it means its something they have said they will fix in time.

I have the Dunkirk Spit but I don't have you latest Hurricane. Here are some shots from the Spit, they speak for themselves."

Blanston12, you might want to try converting to 32bit bitmaps for the textures. If you used the FSX versions, they should at least show up I would have thought. Also there will be JF security on the originals.The security dll will be blocking out much of the model.

**musterpilot** · August 31st, 2020, 16:39

Originally Posted by keithb77

3D gauges work, they are in the MDL file. XML gauges don't work at the moment.

For the C-46 I prefer the older military model, the autopilot works and the radios are hidden in the roof so you don't see the cross-outs. They work though.
The AH/JF Lockheed Electra also works well, just the collins radios are crossed out, sadly in plain view.

For Ant's Tiger Moth you CAN get rid of the wire frame - they are in the panel.cfg as 'click-spot' XML gauges, just delete them.
Sadly though the controls (eg throttle) don't move in the cockpit but you do still control them with joystick etc.
But for me it is silent - do you get any sounds? I think they are all from a sound DLL.

Another one I've had success with is the Virtavia Islander, again everything except the radios, GPS and A/P display and everything works.

DC6 looks good but most of the instruments are bust

Cheers
Keith

G'day Keith how can I get the Virtavia Islander in the sim my favorite aircraft

John