The End of Milviz Mil Jets?

[DaleRFU]

I found out today that the T-38C is no longer available for private use (only commercial sales), I fear that with Milviz now being a military contractor that future developments in the military area won't be for public use such as their F-15C, F-16C, C-130J and potentially their SR-71. I hope they won't abandon us in the military enthusiast section of our hobby. Time will tell I guess.

[odourboy]

The sad reality is that commercial and GA aircraft outsell military by a fair bit. Exacerbated by the problem that militaries biggest fans often find it a stretch to pay the price for today's quality add-ons and a high quality military aircraft is every bit as complicated to implement (or more) as a commercial or GA when you look at weapons and targeting systems for example.

I expect MilViz turned to private customers to make ends meet. But I also expect MilViz would never turn a blind eye to us hobbiest customers unless it absolutely had to (which I am assuming was the case for the T38C). My hope and expectation is that only current aircraft, and only if they were obligated to, would MilViz not make their military add-ons available publicly. We should be happy for them thst they are able to secure a private customer to help finance other developments thst we can have. I'm hopeful!

[DC1973]

The sad reality is that commercial and GA aircraft outsell military by a fair bit. Exacerbated by the problem that militaries biggest fans often find it a stretch to pay the price for today's quality add-ons and a high quality military aircraft is every bit as complicated to implement (or more) as a commercial or GA when you look at weapons and targeting systems for example.

Wise words indeed. Milviz make truly top-notch airplanes, and they take a long time to create, so it's tough to build a viable business around military airplanes solely from the flight simulator community, when only around 20% of the total sales are of military aircraft. Good to hear that their other outlets are paying dividends though, it shows how good their airplanes are.

[wombat666]

The sad reality is that commercial and GA aircraft outsell military by a fair bit.

One only has to look through the libraries at popular and long established sites such as AVSIM or FlightSim to see the lack of interest in Military aviation.
Cost is a factor in 'Study Level' simulations, a niche market within a niche market as well, best suited to a study Sim like LM P3Dv5 Pro.

[ColoKent]

I could envision a scenario where CURRENTLY operational creations by MILVIZ take that direction (C-130J, T-38C, F-16C, etc.). And it's a bummer, as I like current military aircraft...however, as a longtime businessman myself, I understand and respect the desire and need to take that direction if that is required to maximize profits.

However, I still can imagine past military titles being created and offered to hobbyists: F-105, SR-71, F-4E/N/S, A-1H Skyraider, etc.

We'll see...maybe Osh or D'Andre will pop up here and offer insight.

Kent

[StormILM]

Having been a long time tester and supporter of the company, I would be taken aback of this were the case but then again, there may be specific reasons they are funneling those modern products for training purposes only (via some back channel agreement)? Honestly, when it comes to Military types, I have largely moved over to DCS. For many it's just a vastly superior platform and experience over P3D and legacy platforms and it's depth of content is excellent and growing at a steady pace now. I also believe that once MSFS2020 comes out and content begins to grow from it, it's likely going to sunset P3D fairly quickly in terms of sales and use. My current use of P3D is largely with commercial and GA types which is what I will likely use FS2020 for as well. Milviz builds great stuff, I'm sure they will continue to add to the future market.

[Mach3DS]

I think the reason that Military aviation in Flight sim had died out is that it lacks the infrastructure to do anything but really fly in formation. Even TacPack is abysmal I'm comparison to something like DCS or IL2. Which is where the cash is for military Flightsimmimg. Even A2A hasn't come out with any new warbird stuff in ages. F-4D dead. F-104 dead. T-33 dead. They had some military contract work which they showed off the T-38A and a T-6II. But likely like MilViz are not able to sell to the entertainment side.

I'm hoping that the HUN will make it to P R and be exportable to FS2020.

[jeansy]

the general consensus on most forums or social media platforms are the market has reached a stalling point.

there is MSFS on the horizon and there is a very large percentage of people no longer purchasing add-ons until MSFS is out and people have had enough of LM and hotfixes that require some major overhauling of advanced addons which require extended periods of waiting or requiring a paid update

With the current climate of COVID, one would think people are spending money while sitting at home, a lot of chatter is saying otherwise as employment or sources of income are questionable

due to the NDA I had to sign for MV i cant disclose on whats happening behind the scenes or who they have contracts with. What MV do from here is what pays their bills

As for the lack of mil addons in the market, from the side lines watching, we seem to focus on previously released addons and making 4th or 5th generation releases opposed to looking at what we dont have.

You can scroll through the request threads and see a trend for the demand, however we end up seeing another this or that, that already exists or was released 12mths earlier.

for me games like squad and uboat are whats entertaining me, painting or flying is normally a after thought post p3dv5 and its limitations with painting live

[wombat666]

And we Aussies are on the brink of the 'Second Wave' of the virus, which means further and more intense lockdowns, more paying jobs disappearing and little money available for 'necessities', let alone Flight Sims.
Given the current climate it will be 'interesting' to see if and when MicroCrud push an FS2020 release date, while LM/P3D 'technically' do not see their system 'for entertainment' use.

"As for the lack of mil add-ons in the market, from the side lines watching, we seem to focus on previously released add-ons and making 4th or 5th generation releases as opposed to looking at what we don't have."

It seems that 'Re Birthing' is often 'Platform Specific' plus a desire to improve on previous efforts with the aim of the game generating sales with minimal effort.

[bazzar]

Last month was the best we have EVER had in 20 years. For what that is worth to anyone I don't know but I would say people are still spending on the hobby and are enjoying sim-flying just as much as ( and maybe more so) pre-Covid. No complaints here.

[jeansy]

I found out today that the T-38C is no longer available for private use (only commercial sales), I fear that with Milviz now being a military contractor that future developments in the military area won't be for public use such as their F-15C, F-16C, C-130J and potentially their SR-71. I hope they won't abandon us in the military enthusiast section of our hobby. Time will tell I guess.

there you go, Colin posted this today http://www.milviz.com/forum/viewtopi...aae039#p100492

[DC1973]

Sounds like Milviz's F-15C will indeed make it to P3D - and that means everybody gets what they want!

For what it's worth, my main passion is for military aircraft, and as I don't go in for the study-level stuff I don't worry about DCS World as competition. I have a HUGE list of military airplanes, both modern and historical, lined up for future projects - the biggest problem is deciding which one to do next. I also think that MSFS2020's next-gen graphics along with that all-essential entire-globe flying will bring back casual simulation fans who enjoy military types. As said, DCS World will be where the study-level fans mainly go, barring releases from Milviz / Sim Works Studios / VRS etc. All this is to say really that military isn't dead in flight simulator - it's had something of a slump but will almost certainly bounce back over the coming years.

And don't get me started on a weapons package - it's hugely tempting for me to try one that's more focused on being reliable than super realistic....

[centuryseries]

While my aircraft are not study sim, I can safely say that I have a new SR-71 coming for P3D and FSX. I too look forward to a study level SR-71 and would've bought it on day one - still will if they release it, but just saying there's another option coming for anyone who wants it.

Details and screenshots on my Facebook page.

One thing that DCS is missing Rick is a full fidelity F-15C.

[YoYo]

Last month was the best we have EVER had in 20 years. For what that is worth to anyone I don't know but I would say people are still spending on the hobby and are enjoying sim-flying just as much as ( and maybe more so) pre-Covid. No complaints here.

Very interesting and CRG, I think it was #stayathome also BUT you did a lot of models in the last few months (and many developers was sleeping a little in the same time )....
Nice to hear it and keep good work.

[trindade]

One thing that DCS is missing Rick is a full fidelity F-15C.

..and a Flanker.

[Mach3DS]

Yes agreed Dave. Wish it had Full fidelity 15C.

Regarding FS2020 and military add-ons....I sure hope so. I've heard rumors that it might not support some features which would make certain Military add-ons not doable. I'm hoping that what I've heard will be worked out and that functionalities will be added.

I'm with most of you. My passion is military add-ons. I

[bazzar]

In the end it comes down to balance. Balance of subjects and balance of time. We, unlike most developers, do this work for a living, it's all we do. We also chose subjects we want to do (providing there is some sort of market there) rather than any particular genre. Military and especially warbirds has always been a tricky path to follow because not only is the category small by comparison to GA, it is sub-divided into very subjective areas. If you can afford to do it and make a profit, commercial development of military and warbirds can be most rewarding. Sadly, if other matters like putting food on tables is more of a priority, GA and Commercial is probably a better prospect.

As the World's military and manufacturers of their hardware become more litigious, we will undoubtedly see more branded military subjects leave the options list.