CFS3
LOL, 33Lima, I have to confess knowing your weakness for the 1F, I tweaked the loadouts so it could be used in a "bomber" campaign. After bombing shipping or other ground targets, it strafes them very effectively. But not one for the purists!
LOL, 33Lima, I have to confess knowing your weakness for the 1F, I tweaked the loadouts so it could be used in a "bomber" campaign. After bombing shipping or other ground targets, it strafes them very effectively
Great to see all the effort that is being put into this, and much appreciated
Really looking forward to the campaign as Pat's BoB add on is a real favourite of mine. Always loved the BoB since a youngster and my Dad took me to see the film. Somehow this add on "feels" right.
Hi Oliver, Clive got it right first time with this one, IMHO. He wanted to simplify things and avoid the complication of other addons. Yet at the same time, there are deliciously detailed airbases, which even WOTR has not been able to match thus far.
The campaign package is fully functional now, work is centered on refinement of the spawn sets, which take ages. I would ask for testers, but the trouble is there are other people working on an update, so I want to work with the latest files, to ensure compatibility.
It is always best to take it slow and steady.
Saves a great deal of time and effort in the long run.
I've been practising in anticipation of release and am curious to know if there's an easy way to change the cockpit viewpoint in the 17 Sqn Hurricane? It is lower than the similar A/C in ETO and seems designed to give a better view of the panel. But the gunsight reticle's line of sight seems badly misaligned with the line of fire. I've tried using the keys to raise the viewpoint but the issue is still there.
I do still sometimes manage to hit something, but not as hard and only after prodigious expenditure of ammunition!
Using any of these Dynamic Reticles with Pitch="90.25" fixes the aim point issue with the static one:
<Effect Type="Track" EffectName="UK_RAF_ETO-_gunsight" PosX="0.000" PosZ="-0.575" PosY="0.700" Pitch="90.25" MinVel="-999999" MaxVel="999999"/>
<Effect Type="Track" EffectName="UK_RAF_Hurricane-_gunsight" PosX="0.000" PosZ="-0.575" PosY="0.700" Pitch="90.25" MinVel="-999999" MaxVel="999999"/>
<Effect Type="Track" EffectName="UK_RAF_Bob1-_gunsight" PosX="0.000" PosZ="-0.575" PosY="0.700" Pitch="90.25" MinVel="-999999" MaxVel="999999"/>
Last edited by MajorMagee; July 19th, 2020 at 04:44.
US Army, Major, Ret.
Service To The Line,
On The Line,
On Time
US Army Ordnance Corps.
If you use a file comparison software like Winmerge or similar, you can compare the pilot seat view settings for the ETO hurri and the BoB hurri. You should be able to quickly switch the BoB Hurri's xdp over to the ETO viewpoint.Originally Posted by 33lima
But I don't have the same problem for the BoB hurris - reticle seems well aligned??
The bullet strike at convergence is below the central pip on the static reticle.
US Army, Major, Ret.
Service To The Line,
On The Line,
On Time
US Army Ordnance Corps.
I found the discussion about the gunsight interesting.
Whether or not the sight is correctly aligned has had little impact (No pun intended) for me, probably as I am a spray and pray merchant!
Not there yet; hopefully these pics, both taken in level flight with no modification to viewpoint, illustrate the issue I'm trying to resolve.
Hurricane IIa 17 Sqn in the ETO mod. Reticle is the one that comes with the aircraft. This is what I'm used to and how I want it to look. The sight glass brackets are for the later square glass, but the important points are (i) the reticle is centred on it and (ii) the tracers are lined up with the centre dot of the reticle, at about the range the guns are harmonised.
Same aircraft in the BoB mod, but this time with the dynamic reticle (which seems to work like a gyroscopic gunsight, so I'm not sure I'll retain it - but the issue was the same).
Issues I want to fix:
1. I can see less of the sky - I'd like to be able to see where the mirror would be, atop the windscreen. Possibly this just needs the pilot eye view zoomed out to the same setting as the ETO version, in the BoB A/C's .xdp file.
2. Despite not pulling any Gs, the reticle is way too low on the (correct, rounded mount) glass. Pulling Gs following a turning adversary is all it takes for the reticle to be pulled way off the bottom of the glass. completely out of sight. I need the reticle to start centred on the glass, to mitigate this effect.
3. While the tracers line up with the centre of the reticle, when I fix 2, I don't want the tracers to be going low. I want them to stay aligned with the centre of the reticle when I move it up.
Interesting that's a different pit than I have for 17 sqd in BOB.
One thing I occasionally do is to trick TrackIR by scrunching down in my seat, and hitting F12 to recenter the view. I then sit back up in my seat and it's as if I'm sitting higher in the cockpit.
p.s.
These are not really like gyroscopic gunsights in that they don't do any lead computing. It's actually just taking advantage of optical physics with nothing more required than a collimating lens and a semi-transparent mirror. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reflector_sight
They are simply focused at infinity in line with the gun convergence point. No matter how the pilot might move around in the cockpit he will always see the image form at that point in the distance. This was a significant improvement over fixed iron or telescopic sights that were only useful in one specific head position (impossible to maintain when maneuvering).
US Army, Major, Ret.
Service To The Line,
On The Line,
On Time
US Army Ordnance Corps.
The problem is that the dynamic reticle is behaving somewhat like a gyro sight, not a reflector sight. In this steeply-banked climbing turn, I'm trying to lead a 109 which is under my nose. I'd expect the reticle to be centred on the glass, but it's like the G-forces are dragging it down.
In this pic, in a steeply-banked descending turn, the reticle had been dragged downwards off the glass altogether.
If I'm recollecting this right, the trajectory of the tracers is also 'dragged down' under my nose, even the rounds which were just fired - if I was firing in the above pic, my rounds would have been going well below the 109 and possibly not even in sight. It's like there's some weird misalignment. Substituting the ETO Hurri II's pilot seat settings didn't seem to make any visible difference. I have head bobbing turned on, but I'm not getting this problem with the ETO Hurris, just the ETO ones, with the dynamic reticle adding the disappearing trick to the issue - the static reticle at least stays on the glass.
As in Cliffs of Dover Blitz - the reticle slides left or right, IF the pilot's head is dragged away far enough from behind the sight (but almost no up-down movement, only left or right) - note well off-centre view of the canopy framing...
...but as soon as the viewpoint 'bobs' back, the reticle is centred again, even in a high-G turn, and the tracers aren't invisible under the nose....
Last edited by 33lima; July 20th, 2020 at 09:02.
That's built into AnKors shaders to simulate the g-forces physically moving the pilot's heads as you maneuver. So, strictly speaking it's the not the sight that's moving, your pilot is.
This can be turned on/off in d3d8.ini
; Enables or disables (if set to 0) head movement due to G-forces in cockpit view (offset and rotation)
HeadShake=1
; Controls the magnitude of head movement. Default value is 100. Rotation is unaffected by this setting.
OffsetScale=100
; Controls XYZ offset speed. Low values have high inertia so the response will lag more. Typically 4 to 100 with higher restoring the head position faster. Default 12
OffsetSpring=9
; Controls rotation speed. Low values have high inertia so the response will lag more. Default 24
RotationSpring=9
; Offset Damping with low values being more damped, Default 6
OffsetResponse=9
US Army, Major, Ret.
Service To The Line,
On The Line,
On Time
US Army Ordnance Corps.
Thanks but I don't want to turn off or reduce the head-bobbing, as it's not that which is excessive and needs dampened, it's the up-down movement of the dynamic reticle. CloD gets it about right - there is a fair bit of left-right movement because that's physically possible, but much less up-down, because that's less so (unless your virtual straps are very loose!). And as well as less up-down movement, the dynamic reticle needs to be centred in the reflector sight glass to begin with; now, it's significantly too low.
Personally, I like the head movement too as it makes the flying experience more realistic.
If the movements seem too big, reduce the offset scale to what you prefer. Even just 10 points below 100 will make a very noticeable difference.
As I mentioned before, I routinely adjust the centered eyepoint by hitting F12 to recenter TrackIR relative to how I'm sitting and then move up or down a little to get the view I'm after. If I want to sit higher in the cockpit I hit F12 when I'm sunk down in my chair, and then I sit up straight and my view rises with me. The TrackIR motion control speed setting has a lot to do with how much response you get to small positional changes like that.
Having said that, the ONLY thing that makes the reticle APPEAR TO MOVE is your head movement (simulated g-force and/or actual with TrackIR) relative to the fixed convergence point and the mirror.
It's all about your frame of reference. There is NOTHING in the dynamic reticle that is actually moving.
If you were to move your head enough to exactly reverse the simulated g-force effects the sight would remain stationary.
This is essentially what happens with iron ring and post or telescopic sights when the g-force head movements are turned on. Your view down the sights will get way out of alignment unless you're able to maneuver your head enough to counter the effect.
US Army, Major, Ret.
Service To The Line,
On The Line,
On Time
US Army Ordnance Corps.
I get that I think, but the problems are:
1. the dymanic reticle when 'at rest' is too low - assuming 'neutral' G, it should not look like this, it should be centred in the glass.
2. the dymanic reticle up-down movement is way too much, as the pilot's head isn't mounted on a bungee cord (left-right movement is ok because the head then acts as a pendulum if side forces are applied).
It should look like this under positive G in a tight turn, displaced little or not at all...
...certainly not like this, dragged off below the glass completely...
Dampening the vertical component to the head-bobbing might help, but as it isn't excessive, I'm reluctant to do that. CloD also has head bobbing which is at least as pronounced yet it doesn't have this exaggerated up-down reticle displacement.
Item 1 needs a fix if nothing else and it would slightly mitigate the tendency of the reticle to disappear off the bottom of the glass, so that would be something. Could that be achieved by changing one of the co-ordinates for the reticle type in use, in its 'Efffects' line, I wonder? EDIT - changing the Y value didn't seem to make much if any difference. I see the static reticle is also low on the glass and I suppose moving either reticle up would just destroy such alignment as there is now between the reticle and the bullet trajectories. So I think I'll just 'bite the bullet' (sic) and stick to the static reticle which at least doesn't stray off the bottom of the glass under strong positive G.
You really should try adjusting the offset scale, as it may do exactly what you are looking for.
The positioning of the dynamic reticle in the effects line does not change the center of the aim point. It simply moves the effects texture around in the cockpit 3d space. The values are chosen so that the texture is positioned to align with the reflector glass so that the reticle will become visible. The 3D model of the cockpit includes the reflector glass, and that defines where the reticle will become visible. Position the texture away from the reflector glass and you'll never see the reticle.
The pitch value in the effects line does move the center aim point up or down within the texture space so that it lines up with the convergence point (off in the distance), but that doesn't change you eye point relative to the reflector glass inside the cockpit.
Likewise the starting eye position of the pilot is defined in the cockpit 3D model. That means the starting view cannot be changed without having the source code for the cockpit. That's why I have to trick the positioning using the TrackIR recentering function described previously to sit higher in the cockpit.
US Army, Major, Ret.
Service To The Line,
On The Line,
On Time
US Army Ordnance Corps.
I can certainly take a look at the source model. The reticle is placed on a flat plane behind the sight glass and is fixed. It only appears to move as the viewpoint changes. As far as I remember it's inline with the viewpoint. Maybe with the latest cfs3 advances the reticle can be stuck back on the glass.
Do the Spits have this issue too?
I can't get to this until after the weekend unfortunately.
Great and interesting work all!
Cheers,
Clive
CFS3 Battle of Britain Website: https://cfs3bob.wixsite.com/cfs3-bob
CFS3 ACC Member & ETO Expansion Group
OK so if this isn't just me seeing issues nobody else sees, in the current BoB mod Hurricane II (and possibly in the other BoB mod Hurris) we could use:
1. for the dynamic reticle, the pitch value (not the Y value I tried fruitlessly) needs adjusted to raise the centre dot of the reticle (when 'at rest') so that it's in the centre of the glass; and then
2. if as seems likely this means the tracers now converge well below the raised reticle centre point, adjust (raise?) the pilot viewpoint in the aircraft's .m3d file so that line of sight and trajectory where the tracers converge co-incide, again.
3. if the mod isn't going to be changed to use the dynamic reticle by default, do the equivalent for the static reticle (which is also low on the glass). Hopefully the same pilot viewpoint will suit both reticles, as they both look to be to low to the same extent. I don't know where the equivalent setting to 1 is, for the static reticle.
I haven't tried the other BoB mod Hurris yet, or its Spits, but will have a look and report back.
All this reminds me of the story, told by a Camel pilot (possibly Norman McMillan in 'Into the Blue') of a visit by Trenchard to the squadron. The great man paused to admire one Camel whose pilot had two or three separate sights installed for his twin Vickers, and asked the pilot to explain how he made use of them. 'Oh I just point the nose at the Hun and blaze away!' the pilot innocently replied, Trenchard moving quickly on as they say.
Well in the dynamic reticle's Effects line, changing... Pitch="90.25" ...to... Pitch="88.25" ...as near as makes no difference put the reticle in the centre of the glass...
As expected, the tracers now converge too low, roughly where the vertical tick meets the reticle's outer ring - the tracers are still rising to that point, in the pic below....
So this is useless without also an equivalent adjustment to the pilot's viewpoint, to re-align things. But maybe a start if that can be done too.
The movement of the reticle under G is still too severe - it can still disappear completely off the bottom of the glass in a tight turn. I think I will try MajorMagee's suggestion of reducing the head bobbing in the DX mod's settings file, from the default OffsetScale=100, to something like 50 and see if that tames it while preserving enough head movement.
Reducing offsetscale from 100 to 50 preserves quite a high degree of head-bobbing (in relation to the cockpit) and dampens down the dynamic reticle to the point there is very little movement - it's apparent but 'very little'.
So I've gone with a value of 75, which has a bit more reticle movement - up-down seems comparable to CloD, left-right seems less so which is fine by me as CloD's left-right head-bobbing and reticle movement, whether realistic or not, I find a bit on the wild side.
High G descending turn to the left - reticle is slightly low and slightly left - fine by me:
Note the greater extent of visibility of the lower row of instruments on the main panel compared to the previous nearly-straight-and-level pic, which indicates the degree of head-bobbing that is still present when set to 75 instead of 100..
That would leave:
- adjusting (raising?) the pilot viewpoint to get the points of aim and impact lined up again, there are keystrokes to do this which I haven't tried but probably needs the 3d model changed to do it right; and
- finding the setting which raises the static reticle on the glass, so it all lines up whichever reticle the player is using (unless the mod fully incorporates the dynamic reticles, which might be a good idea being inherently more real - not that I've ever used anything more like it than a red dot sight).
I take it that you don't have TrackIR?
US Army, Major, Ret.
Service To The Line,
On The Line,
On Time
US Army Ordnance Corps.
I have TIR4, and find it a lot better than FacetrackNoir which was very skittish, but find turning the head while gyro-stabilising the eyes counter-intuitive.
On the gunsight alignment, I keep the gyroscopic effect damped in the .ini, and I don't seem to have any problem with the crosshairs aligning with the tracer impact point.
Maybe its because I am shorter?
The seven campaigns I've prepared are coming along nicely, but there are always new niggly adjustment needed. A change to the starting frontline here, an invasion set to "on" that somehow slipped through and only discoverd after an hour of testing.
The habit of CFS3 of randomly assigning Allied countries to any old Allied airfields is a real pain. To completely restrict all RAF_10_Group squadrons to 10_Group airfields would require that the 10_Group global layer only have 10_Group airbases on it for the Allied side. This would make the map of airbases very lop-sided - does it mean that the Germans could walk all over Eastern Britain, when all the Allied airbases are along the West coast in the 10_Group campaign?
Haven't had time to get into such detailed scenario testing as it takes a while just to set up the GL.
Bomber campaigns can be just as tricky. Flying as a German bomber pilot, the default aircraft is the He111-H2 for some reason. It requires a fairly long run-up for takeoff. Luckily I don't need the loadouts with the additional wing fuel tanks to reach southern England. Airfields are the target quite frequently. Last night I discovered that the reason why 8 He111s cannot reach 100% when bombing an airfield, is that the damage points for all the placed trees are incredibly high! Variations of "9999" and "99999". These damage points are all summed in the damage evaluation. Trees half a million, buildings a few tens of thousands. So my wing of bombers gets left with 43% damage still required to meet the mission objective, after each emptying 8x250Kg bombs on the airbase!
Tweaks last night to the trees (I hope Clive doesn't mind) will hopefully solve that quirk.
Another 'challenge" for the bombers - CFS3 does not assign bombers to LW airbases with longer runways. There are dozens of LW runways of only 800m in length! Again, a few quiet tweaks to the runway800 object file seem to have fixed the problem - hope Clive doesn't spot it, not obvious to the naked eye and you don't notice when taking off in German fighter. But my AI bomber wingmen just scrape over the trees, which is the main thing.
Oh well, only about a hundred similar tweaks needed to improve campaign play over seven campaigns
All sounds good there!
As for lining up the tracers with the reticle, they line up fine if you leave the reticle too low, as in this 257 Sqn Hurri's reticle (all the BoB Hurris are the same):
The alignment is fine but is not the problem - which is that the reticle is loo low on the glass. And if you move it up to centre it, like this...
...it is now higher than the line of fire. These two pics are of the dynamic reticle in the modified 17 Sqn Hurri, but it's the same with the static reticle.
The easiest thing to do is leave it alone and put up with the low reticle...although it does looks rather silly once you compare with what it should look like. And if using the dynamic reticle, reduce the default the head bobbing offset value in the DX mod's .ini file from 100 to 75, which stops even the too-low dynamic reticle from disappearing off the bottom of the glass, which solves the worst problem. And if you actually like the cockpit looking like it's painted onto your screen and have head bobbing turned off, you don't need to do anything. Just tolerate the reticle being too low in the glass.
The BoB mods Spits are fine, tho I've not adapted any to use the dynamic reticle yet. The only issue is it has the later square glass and straight side brackets, instead of the correct one on the Hurricanes. Range adjustment dial also seems to be missing on the Spit sights; the Hurris have both range and base but they are the wrong way around, if the CloD one is correct. (range should be on top not underneath)
Anyway I'm looking forward to seeing lots of Huns through both sights in the new campaigns, as well as in the scripted missions!
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