Blackburn Beverley Uploaded

[Scianoir]

Bill,

Reviewing your reports I now think it's likely the errant sounds may be due to some sort of duplicate setup. The suspect item in particular would be the file "GCA_dsd_fsx_xml_sound.gau". You do have that in the Beverley's panel folder and a separate panel\GCA folder, don't you? (Just asking because some simmers habitually copy all such stuff to the main gauges folder.) Two additional tests along these lines come to mind:

(1) Rename "GCA_dsd_fsx_xml_sound.gau" in the Beverley's panel folder to "BEV_dsd_fsx_xml_sound.gau" and edit the corresponding gauge02 of [Window03] in panel.cfg.

(2) (Errant calls still present) Run a file search in FSX to find duplicate instances of "GCA_dsd_fsx_xml_sound.gau". Temporarily disable (rename) them and test.

Hello again Manfred,

Yes the files are where they should be (I don't copy them into the main gauges folder).

(1) I did as you suggested and the Beverley worked fine the first time I loaded it but then I shut down and restarted FSX and on loading the Beverley the second time unfortunately the issue recurred.

(2) Checked both FSX and the rest of my computer (as sometimes I find things can lurk in odd places that you don't even know about) and no duplicates of that file present.

I also thought I would try your GCA equipped C-47 release which also includes an AILA setup to see if that was showing any similar issues but that loaded perfectly on two separate occasions.

Clearly this has to be something to do with my set up as I seem to be alone in experiencing these persistent callouts, which makes me wonder if SimStarterNG is playing some role although the fact that the Beverley issue persisted when I started FSX without using that utility suggests that it is not involved. Searching through my setup the only other thing I wondered about was a program called vLSO (Virtual Landing Signal Officer) which comes with the SimWork Studios Midway Battle Group and contains audible instructions for approaching a carrier. However the voice in vLSO is completely different and there is no doubt that the voice I am hearing is the male voice from the GCA_... wav files in the panel\GCA\calls folder. However just in case it might be connected in some way I also deactivated vLSO and started FSX and that made no difference.

So, although it remains a mystery, I am very happy to be able to say that it is not affecting my enjoyment of this excellent aircraft!

Bill

[BendyFlyer]

MJ (and Nagpaw).

Here are the various readings I got from the Boost Guages:

BOOST	RPM	MP	PHASE
0	0	29	BEFORE START - SHUTDOWN
-6	1050	13	AFTER START - IDLE
0	1800	30	PWR-PRESS CHECK 1
6	2000	36.8	PWR PRESS CHECK 2
8	2200	38.2	PWR PRESS CHECK 3
12	2300	42.1	PWR PRESS CHECK 3
16	2500	45.7	PWR PRESS CHECK 4
25	2700	59.7	TAKE OFF POWER
20	2600	50.0	CLIMB 1ST SEGMENT -1ST PWR REDUCTION
16	2600	45.5	CLIMB 2ND SEGMENT - 2ND PWR REDUCTION

The values are consistent and as expected. Performance - Speeds were also consistent and correlated. All at MTOW at Sea Level with ISA values set for the sim. Note sure why you would be getting lower values as you have reported. I guess the question I would ask is what was the elevation of the airport you were using and what was the outside air temperature? ISA at sea level would be +15C. The values I obtained also confirmed the red band on the boost gauge being the area of engine operation where you get low RPM with higher than atmospheric pressure which is a NO NO for supercharged or turbocharged engines but varies with the engine type or design, I noted the comments from Manfred earlier that there was a vibration-propellor harmonic issue for the Centaurus egnine which had sleeve valves so that would be a factor as well. The Boost gauge is only going to take the values from the aircraft config and air data files and would not read the values from another gauge such as the MP gauge in the folder.

Note I did not consider throttle position as I regard that irrelevant - because PWR=Torque (MP) X RPM. In real engines and it seems it is modelled correctly in FSX the throttle merely regulates fuel flow via the main jets in a carburettor or injectors to the inlet manifold the throttle or power levers merely control that part of the engine nothing else, more fuel more power, if they get out of whack it can be a pain but it is merely a mechanical linkage (simulated in the sim)

Sometimes with FSX for some reason it takes values from the previous setup or flight especially if you have used a different aircraft type, this is particularly acute when you say swap types using the aircraft select menu or make changes to say a panel config file or textures (such a checking a repaint) and it will simply not read these changes but keep giving you the old, it is an FSX bug and the only solution is to shut it down and restart it afresh. It is the reason on my setup my default flight is a Cold N Dark with all systems OFF that is intially loaded. I can then relocate the aircraft using the menu to where I want it, set the weather (REX) and then go about doing starting from that criteria.

Cannot comment on the GCA-ILS gauge issues have not tried it.

[nagpaw]

BendyFlyer and Manfred,

Thanks for the detailed information! Yes, I do start FSX fresh as well with a similar flight setup as you. I mentioned throttle position merely because of the discrepancy between throttle position between the original MP gauges and the new boost gauges. Anyway, I rechecked everything thinking it was a local problem, but the data you posted shows that the gauge is not reading correctly.

The boost gauge should show pounds per square inch (psi) above or below standard. With the engine shutdown on a standard pressure day (about 14.7 psi or 30 inches of mercury), the boost gauge should read zero, which it does. A boost indication of +4 indicates 4 psi above standard, or 18.7 psi (14.7 + 4), which equates to about 38.3 inches of mercury as read on the manifold pressure gauge. Takeoff power on the Centaurus 173 as fitted to the Beverley is listed as +14 boost. That would be 28.7 psi (14.7 + 14), which equates to about 58.4 inches of mercury.

The problem is that as currently programmed the boost gauges are showing inches of mercury above or below standard. Looking at both of our charted numbers, the MP readings are just standard pressure (about 30 inches) plus the boost. (I never noticed the option of making a table. Bravo! ) So using the published takeoff power of +14 boost would give you only 44 inches. My cruise airspeed was low because I was setting the published cruise power setting of +4 boost, which resulted in only 34 inches manifold pressure.

I'm not sure why Blackburn installed boost gauges that read up to +25. That setting would be 39.7 psi...or a bone-crushing 80.8 inches of mercury. Must be something I don't know about operating big piston engines! (Well, I'm sure there's lots of things. I haven't flown any piston engine since the late 90s!)

It looks like just a units issue, and hopefully a simple adjustment. I know absolutely nothing about gauge programming, so I can't provide any other information. BTW, thanks to everyone for talking about this and working on it!

[BendyFlyer]

Nagpaw - I had the Beverley Manual and guess what the only section missing turns out to be the Part2 with the engine limitations performance etc. You are correct in terms of what the guage should be reading if it was calibrated to PSI, I think MJ has the air files data set for MP using inches of mercury not PSI (The British Measurement), the boost gauge is conveiniant fix to give a boost guage in the cockpit. To redo it would require him to re do the air file tables and parameters and then gauge to work off that. Basically a complete rebuild on some levels. Due to the way FSX works this stuff out there are whole set of other problems that would arise and the issue of superchargers in FSX has been a significant problem for a long time because of the way the ESP engine calculates values etc etc.

I guess I read off the values being shown and they equate to what one would expect, but as you correctly indicate they do not equate to the Beverley or Centaurus 173 engine because of the PSI v Hg issue I alluded to above.

As for why would Blackburn use a guage showing such high values? Well that was common in the British aircraft at the time they would simply borrow a guage from another type that would do the job and was available and then give you the correct values to stick with in the manual, the fact that it shows 25 Boost never meant it would get there. The fact that they put in a Torque gauge strongly suggests this was the case.I can live with what Manfred has put together even if it is slightly out of whack with the manual.

[nagpaw]

BendyFlyer,

That makes total sense about the gauge and +25 boost! I guess that would really help standardization, wouldn't it? The same gauge in every airplane. A mechanic's (and accountant's) dream!

I agree with you. The gauges works fine the way they are, and I don't want to give Manfred any more work...unless he wants to make a version without the Rebecca aerials and supply aimer's position...



...I kid...I kid!

[jjdc]

JK yes please. Home, Middle East or Far East they will all be on the ramp.

is there room in your hangar for another Beverley, XH123 of 47 Sqn ?

2020-5-31_9-25-1-777

2020-5-31_9-26-6-84

2020-5-31_9-26-41-151

I ask, because it is such a huge bird..

[mjahn]

Hello again Manfred,

Yes the files are where they should be (I don't copy them into the main gauges folder).

(1) I did as you suggested and the Beverley worked fine the first time I loaded it but then I shut down and restarted FSX and on loading the Beverley the second time unfortunately the issue recurred.

(2) Checked both FSX and the rest of my computer (as sometimes I find things can lurk in odd places that you don't even know about) and no duplicates of that file present.

I also thought I would try your GCA equipped C-47 release which also includes an AILA setup to see if that was showing any similar issues but that loaded perfectly on two separate occasions.

Clearly this has to be something to do with my set up as I seem to be alone in experiencing these persistent callouts, which makes me wonder if SimStarterNG is playing some role although the fact that the Beverley issue persisted when I started FSX without using that utility suggests that it is not involved. Searching through my setup the only other thing I wondered about was a program called vLSO (Virtual Landing Signal Officer) which comes with the SimWork Studios Midway Battle Group and contains audible instructions for approaching a carrier. However the voice in vLSO is completely different and there is no doubt that the voice I am hearing is the male voice from the GCA_... wav files in the panel\GCA\calls folder. However just in case it might be connected in some way I also deactivated vLSO and started FSX and that made no difference.

So, although it remains a mystery, I am very happy to be able to say that it is not affecting my enjoyment of this excellent aircraft!

Bill

Bill,

D**n it I am very sorry we can't seem to get this sorted! What if you comment out that reference to the DSD sound module (gauge02 of window03) -- do the the rogue callouts stop then? So that we can at least establish that relationship?

--Manfred

[mjahn]

Bendyflyer, Nagpaw -- I do have the option of letting the boost gauges show boost as inches Hg or as psi. Currently they are set at inches HG, and I am restricting the values to -6 min and +26 max to make them conform to the numbers on the gauge (in reality they go lower and higher, depending on throttle). But as I say, I can just as well display boost as psi and with that I get a min of -8 and a max of +15 or thereabouts. I am attaching a revised BoostPress_1.xml for you to try out - simply install it and see how it compares with the gauges of nos 2,3 and 4 when run at the same settings. Very interested to see what you make of it!!

[BendyFlyer]

Bendyflyer, Nagpaw -- I do have the option of letting the boost gauges show boost as inches Hg or as psi. Currently they are set at inches HG, and I am restricting the values to -6 min and +26 max to make them conform to the numbers on the gauge (in reality they go lower and higher, depending on throttle). But as I say, I can just as well display boost as psi and with that I get a min of -8 and a max of +15 or thereabouts. I am attaching a revised BoostPress_1.xml for you to try out - simply install it and see how it compares with the gauges of nos 2,3 and 4 when run at the same settings. Very interested to see what you make of it!!

OK will do Manfred.

[BendyFlyer]

MJ - checked. No1 gauge keeps the Bev Manual limits well but the MP for all four is of course identical. Heres what I recorded:

NO1 GAUGE	`N0 2/3/4 GAUGES	MP
0	0	29	NOT OPERATING
-6	-6	13	IDLE
0	0/0/0	30.4
6	12/12/12	42.3
8	17/17/17	46.7
10	20/20/20	50.4
12	24.5/24.5/24.5	53.8
15.2	25/25/25	59.7	METO

I guess the NO 1 guage is the realistic one, it is also more responsive due to the value range changes compared to 2/3/4. The values of No1 accord with the normal or white operating range marked on the gauge as per the original. A bit weird looking at the gauge to see it reach a value limit at 17 but realising it has max value on the face of 25. I can live with the new version quite easily knowing the values that Nagpaw provided above.

I also discovered as I suspected that boost gauges in all types of British aircraft were a generic gauge. The were made with max values of 6/8/12/16/20/24 and 32 lbs of boost pressure. So essentially the gauge were off the shelf and the maximum value would be for the anticipated boost value required. In the case of the Beverley it was originally intended to have a version of the Centaurus that produced some 3200 hp but it was never fitted to any aircraft and it got the 173 instead that produced some 2400 hp. So I guess that is why it got the high value boost gauge. You can still buy them by the way from a spares place in the UK for a 24 lb boost gauge they are about 175 British Pounds each. So it was not unusual to have a gauge like this with values well above what it could do but never did do. Put it down to one of those quirky English engineering things. The German manufacturers did the same thing R Fuess in Berlin used to make them and therefore the same gauge went into the BF 109 BF 110 and FW 190.

[Scianoir]

Bill,

D**n it I am very sorry we can't seem to get this sorted! What if you comment out that reference to the DSD sound module (gauge02 of window03) -- do the the rogue callouts stop then? So that we can at least establish that relationship?

--Manfred

No worries Manfred! Occasionally it seems these mysteries arise in FSX and I am certain it must be something uniquely related to my system and no reflection on the Beverley. I am just very happy to have another high quality classic large piston-engine aircraft that I can fly in FSX.

Yes, I can confirm after two test flights that commenting out that line in the panel.cfg stopped the rogue callouts and I can live with that!

Thank you once again for a great aircraft and also for your help and patience in dealing with this issue. I don't want you to waste your time on this but if, by chance, you think of any other things I could try, I would appreciate if you would let me know and if I manage to somehow identify the culprit I will update you on the cause here.

Have a good day and stay healthy!
Bill

[HighBypass]

Slightly confused in trying to get to grips with the power settings. Doesn't take much I know!!

Should i use the amended boost gauge number 1 or just carry on with the 4 boost gauges set in HG?

Cheers, guys!

[nagpaw]

Manfred and Bendy,

I haven't had a chance for a thorough test of the new gauge, but at first blush I'd say it works great! Well done, and thanks again for working on it!

Slightly confused in trying to get to grips with the power settings. Doesn't take much I know!!

Should i use the amended boost gauge number 1 or just carry on with the 4 boost gauges set in HG?

Cheers, guys!

Right now, I'd say use whichever you like until a final update is available. Here's some quick and dirty power settings for all three gauge sets (the original manifold pressure, the first set of boost gauges, and the new #1 boost gauge). These work with the published numbers and will give you appropriate performance. (Sorry, still figuring out how to make a table...and I'm on the run today!)


Takeoff Power Wet = 58" MP or +14 on the new #1 boost gauge / 2800 RPM (If using the first set of boost gauges, you'll have to use the monitor to set 58" as you would need to set a boost of +28, which is off the top of the gauge.)

Takeoff Power Dry = 56" MP or +13 on the new #1 boost gauge / 2800 RPM (If using the first set of boost gauges, you'll have to use the monitor to set 56" as you would need to set a boost of +26.)

Max Continuous (i.e. Climb Power) = 50" MP, +20 on the first set of boost gauges, +10 on the new #1 boost gauge / 2500 RPM

Max Cruise = 38" MP, +8 on the first set of boost gauges, +4 on the new #1 boost gauge / 2100 or 1800 RPM

Max Reverse = 48" MP, +18 on the first set of boost gauges, +9 on the new #1 boost gauge / 2800 RPM

[johndetrick]

I couldn't resist a bit of fun. Textures for a fictional ARABCO aircraft, just like the C-82 in the film Flight of the Phoenix. Uploaded here.

[IFlySWA]

I couldn't resist a bit of fun. Textures for a fictional ARABCO aircraft, just like the C-82 in the film Flight of the Phoenix. Uploaded here.

Love it! So would this model be the pre-crash original aircraft, or the zany contraption the German model builder comes up with after the crash? Just kidding. Ha ha.

Brian

[tommieboy]

I couldn't resist a bit of fun.

[nagpaw]

Just uploaded! This was my first paint which required making my own alphas and specs, so please do provide some constructive feedback. I'm always willing to learn!

[mjahn]

Great fictional repaints, thanks all! BTW, if you get a black square on the tailplane it's not the painter's fault but an artefact with some FSX versions. I have a revised exterior model now that gets rid of it.

Re the boost gauges: I think the consensus is that the psi boost gauge corresponds rather well to what the Manual says, and is fairly easy to handle, too. So for a second upload I'll make psi boost gauges the first choice and revise the checklist using the power settings of the Manual as quoted by Nagpaw. Thanks all for your input on this, it's much appreciated!

--Manfred

[511Flyer]

I can't find the 47 Sqdn paint anywhere. Has it been uploaded?

Den.

[jjdc]

It’s up at Avsim

[511Flyer]

Thank you, I now have it.

I've had the Beverley from day one, and the FEAF texture, which are both in the Warbirds Library. I just assumed that 47 Sqdn would be there as well.

Den.

[HighBypass]

Thanks again, gents!

[BendyFlyer]

Manfred. Did a long run in the Bev today Seletar to Labuan @5 hours. Half Day, Half Night. The VC lighting is good and it is nice to swap from a bright cockpit back to just the instrument lights. Too much reflection with the bright lights on for my liking but that is all. Fuel consumption seems about right but I was messing about to see if I could get hPa or millibars on the altimeter and FSX changed all the fuel parameters to litres and kilograms so not sure what I ended up with.

There is one small issue for your information. The panel config did not have the GPS window in it so you cannot bring it up with the monitor. I added it back in myself and it works fine. (GPS is always my onboard Navigator).

I had some fun trying to intercept the localiser and then fly the ILS at Labuan seems I have a scenery-aid issue there which has it all back to front so ended up doing it visually. The landing lights are good as well. I wanted to check out the AP app function, try again another day. The only other issue I have is mouse related, I do not have a three button mouse to I cannot use the centre button to switch between NAV1 and NAV2 but that is my problem and mixing and matching with the navaids is always a workaround.

Look forward to the patches or updates in due course. A great effort well done and a very enjoyable aircraft to fly.

[harrybasset]

I can't find the 47 Sqdn paint anywhere. Has it been uploaded?

Den.

There seems to have been a little mix up with some files as when I downloaded these files the descriptions were not correct and the thumbnails both were for XB261.

[jankees]

There seems to have been a little mix up with some files as when I downloaded these files the descriptions were not correct and the thumbnails both were for XB261.

Indeed, I seem to have mixed up a few things, too many paints at the same time, I do apologize!
I never use thumbnails, and I forgot to delete them here. But I hope the final textures were OK?