Given the great posts recently showing the BoB campaign in ETO, I've knocked together a package which I think should improve campaign play.
http://www.mediafire.com/file/7gngez...O_BoB.zip/file
If anyone would like to test it, the link is here. One of the things is an amended country.xml file so that extraneous nationalities' vehicles and parked aircraft do not show up at airbases and other facilities. But there are a number of other goodies. Tally ho!
The faithful hurribird is a bit dinged up after a scrap over Dover
But landing is fairly routine
Grabbing it now and can't wait to check it out! Will start a fresh ETO BoB campaign for it, rather than resume my existing one with the new files. Between this and the update to CFS3-BoB, Christmas has come early!
Quick query - the readme says it's for version 2 of the campaign, not version 1. What I've got is the campaign here, on the ETO campaigns page of MrJMaint's CFS3 site, with update 1 applied - is that what's needed?
I see your dinged Hurribird, and raise you a complete write-off, pilot included...(different mod I know).Originally Posted by Daiwilletti
The faithful hurribird is a bit dinged up after a scrap over Dover
But landing is fairly routine
Dawn takeoff, intercept mission. Some of ETO's airbases allow for mass takeoffs. This is controlled by the runway file in the objects folder. Great fun!
Well I don't want to set that as routine.
It would be great if you could test the Bob package, 33Lima
Yes, I may be wrong, I just thought that is how it is described for the Sim-Outhouse download. I hope all goes well, it tests fine on my ETO 1.5.
OK thanks - planning to start a test campaign later this evening, after backing up and carefully installing per the readme. I'm guessing that it's not practicable to make this into a mod that could be enabled and if needed, disabled using JSGME, as it involves more than just files being swapped in and out.
Another question on the readme if I may!
It says 'Keep the folder and contents of ETO_BoB in a safe place outside your ETO install'. I took a complete copy of my ETO install folder (less only the separate folders in Documents and Appdata) on a backup drive a couple of weeks back so I should have enough to avoid having to install the Expansion all over if I get anything wrong.
But..my CFS3 ETO Expansion install doesn't have a folder 'ETO_BoB'. That's the name of the zip file with this mod. But I don't have anything of that name in my ETO install folder, which is a bit worrying. Am I missing something that should be in there? Or are you just suggesting I keep a safe copy of the mod somewhere before using it? Want to be sure before I kick off installation!
PS on a different tack, I thing I'm going to try to install this as a JSGME mod as that would appear to do most of what's needed, leaving just one or two steps that would need done manually eg deleting the .bdps. Still keen to be sure I'm not missing an ETO_BoB folder.
PPS I think I now have this packaged as a JSGME mod. I deleted 'BOB from the names of those four files so that when enabled, they will be backed up when the mod copies them over. So that disabling the mod will restore the backups.
The only thing that this leaves is:
(i) - not understanding the ref to backing up the folder I don't have;
(ii) - not being clear how I do step 5 (checking the fighter bombers I want to fly have 'recon' as a mission their .xdp files. What's a fighter bomber? The obvious ones like the 110C-4b and (IIRC) E-7, that can carry bombs? Or do I need to look atfor example Spit and Hurri .xdp files to see if the tag fighter_bomber exists in their files? TBH I'm not sure I'd miss not being able to fly fighter bombers as I want to fly RAF in the BoB so that means interceptors (or maybe the occasional Blenheim night bomber sortie to sink invasion barges) - not fighter-bombers, a concept that didn't really exist in the RAF in 1940.
(iii) - for step 6, the mod would need the regeneraged .bdp files for each of dozen or so A/C for which the mod provides fresh .xdp files. With the .bdp files packaged in the mod alongside the .xdps, they would be enabled when the mod , no need to delete the old .bdps as they would simply be replaced (unless CFS3 has a way of detecting and objecting to that.
I can enable the mod, copy out the .bdps, run the sim to regenerate them, then copy the regenerated .bdps into a full version of the mod which would install all the required files automatically. Edit - appart from the pair in Appdata - but I'd rather have one manual step to apply (or disable) a mod.
Last edited by 33lima; May 12th, 2020 at 10:45.
OK first test report. This is with the mod packaged for JSGME and then enabled, then the appdata files renamed.
I'm getting a CFS3 error before the animated 'pilot lounging about on airfield' screen. It says 'Cannot load campaign 'nek_ETO.xml' Reason: unknown countryID 'USA'. Could be down to my packaging for JSGME but don't think so.
I do have a file of that name in my campaigns folder which I suspect is part of the base ETO install, and maybe needs deleted because the mod 'eliminates extraneous nationalities' (there's a thought)
Will rename that file, try again, and report back.
EDIT - just realised I deleted the two appdata files on the old Vista HDD the Expansion is installed on, not the current Win 7 C: drive, fixing now!
Another Edit - deleting the two Appdata files didn't help, got the same error. Deleting the campaign nek_ETO.xml solved that problem. But now, CFS3 CTDs when I exit a mission (QC, Hurricane IIA against Bf110c-4b). Will try again changing one of those A/C at a time for one that was not included in the mod.
Final edit of this post - changing neither A/C to one not I the mod didn't help - CFS3 is still CTD'ing when I try to quit the mission. Will disable the mod and check if ETO is working again, but ATM there's something not right.
OK the good news is that the ETO expansion is working again after disabling the JSGME version of the BoB mod, copying back in the nek_ETO campaign file, and restoring my backup versions of the Appdate .xml files uisel and Unlimitedpilots.
The only strange thing I noticed is that Unlimitedpilots.xml had not been regenerated after I deleted it when installing the BoB mod. My renamed backup was there, and there was a regenerated uisel, but no regenerated Unlimitedpilots.
Provided you remember to do the step that JSGME cannot (rename the two files in Appdata - I have left out the fighter_bomber step as I don't plan to fly any) I can't think of any reason that using JSGME to install the BoB mod would of itself cause a CTD. If that's correct, that leaves either a bug in the mod, or in the way I built the JSGME version. Will double-check the latter ASAP. The error due to the presence of the nek_ETO campaign file suggests something wrong there, but not the whole story.
Hi 33Lima, I've just finished my breakfast Downunder, and am now trying to digest the implicaitons of you posts. Just let me check a few things on my CFS3 computer, and I'll get back to you.
But one thing - yes the Readme is referring to the ETO_Bob folder provided as a zip file. Also, not having the new gameBoB.xml renamed as game.xml and renaming the existing one gameSTD.xml would create the nek_ETO error message.
When I refer to backup folder, IIRC when installing ETO, there is a process to backup key files, pathway is the C: drive? I was thinking that would be a good place to put the replaced files. Now off to check my install.
Hi 33lima,
Actually I agree the preferred way to do things would be to automate as much as possible. But for the testing phase I just assembled the files that seemed the minimum necessary to minimise nations and keep the spawns interesting.
Yes I am talking about my folder unzipped which is called ETO_BoB
Also a lot of the changes could be compiled in a .bat file but I'm not proficient with compiling bat files - it will take me quite a while to compile one
Open up a the ETO_Hur_Mk2 aircraft's .xdp file. The first section of an aircraft xdp file is called General, for general stuff presumably! Within that is the Category="fighter_bomber". This is the pick type used for air.spawns - the spawns call for fighters, fighter_bomber, bombers, tactical_bomber or level_bomber.
Very few fighters have the Category="fighter" so I only referred to fighter_bomber. Anyway, step five is largely obsolete because I threw in those aircraft.xdps which have the mod done already.
But FYI, and in case you feel entused to add the Recon option to other aircraft, here is the deal:
Further down the xdp file, past the General section, is a section called Loadouts. This is where various things like fuel drop tanks, rockets, bombs or cannon pods can be selected for flying a mission. What I do is look for the loadout with a MissionType="Escort". This is for longer range duties and is typically associated with a drop tank loadout. I figure Recon missions are usually longer range.
Check that there is not a "Recon" already included in one of the loadouts. In the xdp I provided you for the ETO_Hurri_Mk2, you will see that I added the Recon Missiontype to the 2 x 45 gal drop tank loadout. The MissionType list for the drop tanks is quite long and there are no gaps in the list:
MissionType="Escort,Intercept,Sweep,Bomber_Interce pt,Recon"
If you recall, take a look at the bottom of the bo campaign xml you plan to use, for Allied players. There is a MissionEffects and an OffensiveEffects section down the bottom of the campaign file. You will notice that these missions correspond to the missiontypes listed in the aircraft loadouts section:
<MissionEffects>
<ME MissionType="Intercept" M="3" S="3" P="3" Radius="3"/>
<ME MissionType="Sweep" M="3" S="3" P="3" Radius="3"/>
<ME MissionType="Cap" M="3" S="3" P="3" Radius="3"/>
<ME MissionType="Recon" M="3" S="2" P="2" Radius="3"/>
<ME MissionType="Escort" M="2" S="2" P="2" Radius="2"/>
<ME MissionType="AntiShip" M="2" S="3" P="2" Radius="2"/>
</MissionEffects>
Although it is not explicit, I figure that it helps if aircraft involved in the campaign have all the relevant MissionTypes listed in their Loadouts section, that correspond with the missions listed in the campaign.xml file - it just helps.
.bdps - what are you saying here? I don't understand. Easiest just to delete the .bdps from the aircraft folders for which I've provided alternative xdp files.
This means you have not renamed the game.xml file to gameSTD.xml, and placed the gameBoB.xml into the root of the install, and renamed it to game.xml
Ah now this may be an issue. In my version of ETO, D:\CFS3 ETO Expansion, I have an unlimitedpilots.xml in this root pathway, as well as in the AppData pathway. In the package, I should include unlimitedpilots.xml together with the uisel.xml, in the Default folder D:\CFS3 ETO Expansion\defaults.
Just check, I suspect you don't have an unlimitedpilots.xml in your main install?
33lima, I can send you an unlimitedpilots.xml if you need.
Hi Daiwilletti
I just checked and yes I do have unlimitedpilots.xml in my ETO 1.50 install, date modified is Oct '14 so has been there a while!
I renamed the 'Hur_...' folder in the mod 'Huri...' as the former is what the files are called but the ETO aircraft folder those files are in, has the latter, with the 'i'.
Re bdps, for the mod to work with JSGME needs the revised aircraft's folders to contain a .bdp file as well as an .xdp one. To get these, I enabled with JSGME, deleted the old.bdps, ran the sim so that fresh .bdps were generated, then took copies of the new .bdps. I then disabled the mod with JSGME so it was in a 'clean' state, then copied the new .bdps into it. I could then enable and disable the JSGME mod without having to worry about .bdps, as they are now part of the mod. As far as I can see, JSGME wasn't really designed for mods for games like CFS3 which scatter files liberally around your hard drives (F: for the installs, C: for the rest in my case) so there's still a manual step or two, but I'm more comfy with that as I'm a bit prone to destroying perfectly good installs, if left to my own devices.
Anyway I just checked my JSGME version for any mistakes I can find in creating it, and your tip that the game.xml version was implicated led me to the discovery that I had neglected to follow my own instructions and rename your gameBoB.xml to game.xml in the JSGME version. This meant that JSGME was copying over gameBoB.xml into the install folder and leaving the original game.xml in place.
So I'll re-test shortly and report back. Seems I'm quite capable of wrecking an install even with JSGME's help
OK I'm in business. The JSGME version of the mod is loading both CFS3 and missions with no errors, and is now exiting missions and CFS3 as it should, no CTDs.
Plan to kick OFF an RAF campaign tomorrow and probably write it up as an illustrated after action report, such is my new-found level of confidence
Great news! One tip - the hurri 2 has a fearsome anti_ship loadout, so although not perhaps sanctioned by the purists, taking an anti_ship mission with the Hurri is a bit of fun.
Have you noticed that when you are at the mission start screen in the campaign, and looking at available missions generated by CFS3 for a particular frontline sector, that there are three stars against the highest value sorties for the sector? Selecting a 3 star mission and completing it successfully will have more impact on the progress of the campaign. In my version of the Bob (Allied) campaign, intercept missions have the highest value for an allied pilot, however if you select another frontline sector on the campaign map, sweep or even anti_ship are sometimes the highest value (3 star) mission for that particular sector.
There are a few problems with the ground spawns in ETO 1.5 with mrjmaint's updated BoB package. I've included a few modified ground spawns in the hope that you will see more activity as you leave your airfield. The main problem that I remember is that some train spawns had a dodgy speed setting for the second waypoint. Even when there is only one problem with a spawn set, it seems to inhibit any of the spawns from appearing. The same for ship.spawns.
Thanks for that. Hope to start the campaign later tonight.
Not really test criteria as such, but you might (or might not!) be interested in my list of things I will be trying to answer/looking for that are probably also applicable to the base campaign, that I'm still not sure about from playing it so far in the original version.
- It's very desirable to enable player to choose A/C or sqn at campaign start – any way to enable this eg allocate high opening stock of prestige points? Seem to remember this was possible.
- Possible to set a different player flight strength, other than 8? EG 12? Useful if attacker strengths are being increased. But maybe not a good idea, as 8 is enough of a handful for a leader!
- Are larger than stock raids spawned? EG 18-30 A/C? (here, raids = bombers, as opposed to escorts)
- Are formations closer? Player's? AI's? Both?
- Are close escorts (or sweep cover) spawned for raids: in enough strength (=8-24 A/C) and often enough (= majority of raids ARE escorted)?
- Are LW jabo raids spawned; and if so, given their rarity, at a relatively low rate, compared to other raids (say 10-20%, tho higher would be ok from October)?
- Are (non-jabo) raids spread reasonably well between all four LW dive- and level-bomber types?
- Does the LW mount single aircraft recce or 'pirate raid' flights, or just raids by formations?
- Are raids spawned to targets in something like historical progression (shipping & ports, then also coastal airfields & RDF, then also inland airfields and industrial targets)?
- What are the campaign’s victory conditions eg LW wins if London occupied by 31 October, else RAF wins on 31 October? Or something less obvious?
- Could campaign run on beyond 31 October? Best if it was resolved on some basis on or soon after that date, if RAF is not clearly already defeated earlier.
- When’s the earliest an invasion of England could happen? Should not be before early September!
- Is a counter-invasion of France possible? Completely unhistorical, so threshold best set at a level the RAF player can never reach. Stopping a successful invasion (not just an invasion) should be enough for RAF to win. An invasion which hasn’t occupied London by the time winter weather sets in can probably be considered to have failed, hence some date during Nov-Dec is probably the latest date at which the victory conditions should be resolved and the campaign concluded, allowing a little longer than the official end date of 31 October.
- If the campaign can continue into Oct-Nov-Dec, will newer A/C appear - in small numbers only eg Spit II (which was around from early Sept), Hurri II (also from Sept), 109E-7 (from about Aug-Sept), 109F (from Oct)? Better they didn’t appear, than they replaced ALL the older marks at once, which should only happen when the newer marks had widely replaced them, which probably would be early 1941 in most cases.
- Is there any particular reason why - if the spawn and era setters are used - this mod can’t be left in place and the ETO can then be played with other campaigns eg for France/attack in west 1940 or for other eras eg SCW?
As for Hurribombers, since these appeared in action over a year after the BoB officially ended, I think I will give then a miss, although attacking targets in and off the coast of France at low level in a MkIIc with 4x20mm cannon and 2x250 or 500 lb bombs would be a lot of fun, if - as in real life - dangerous!
Hi 33Lima, that's a great series of questions. A whole lot of ideas spin in my head whilst skimming over the questions and possible responses. I've tried the "reply with quote" option but its not working - possibly the quote is too large.
But as I opened up this post, it occurred to me that really, the best way to fine tune everything needed for a better BoB era campaign play, a stand alone install is the best way to go. Don't get me wrong, I find ETO 1.50 is my most crucial add-on, the great things and massive improvement over stock that it offers. But to get some of the things going (like differentiation of aircraft into fighter groups, not nations) it is much harder when integrating into an already complex set of .bat files.
I've alluded to the need for a .bat file to change country.xml files to suit the different eras. This address aircraft nationalities spawning, and aircraft and vehicle nationalities appearing around facilities due to the quirk of CFS3, distributed allied and axis nationalities amongst facilities along the frontline, and with general ground spawns too (where they are facilities). The trouble is, as I've discovered in this current exercise of "hey lets modify a few files to get the ETO BoB campaigns running more smoothly", that when I modified the country.xml to a simpler range of nationalities, I needed to stop the game.xml from pointing to the NEK_ETO,xml as the default mission file. Then I needed to modify the pilotconstants.xml as it sets the nationalities of pilot nationalities available to select and fly.
So my feeling is we shouldn't try to press ETO v1.50 Era 2 to the nth degree - it is just going to be too hard to get a lot of interesting things done.
Pat Pattle's stand-alone BoB install has provided an excellent sandpit within which to work. He has far to much work on just getting the environment right, it is up to other enthusiasts like us, to make further changes. Alternative campaigns and spawns can be set up which to not muck with the sttings of the base install.
Over the years, I have made 2 or 3 "blended" installs, where I've tried to take the best of Pat's install and the ETO goodies to make a great BoB platform. The trouble is, I always end up corrupting them and have to walk away and start from scratch again.
OK seeing as I can't "reply with quote", I'll try to past your questions here.
Not really test criteria as such, but you might (or might not!) be interested in my list of things I will be trying to answer/looking for that are probably also applicable to the base campaign, that I'm still not sure about from playing it so far in the original version.
- It's very desirable to enable player to choose A/C or sqn at campaign start – any way to enable this eg allocate high opening stock of prestige points? Seem to remember this was possible. Some of the stuff you are looking for is solved in the proprietry software developed by OBD Software in Wings Over the Reich. The solutions able to be developed in stock CFS3 are far more circumlocutary. For example, it is possible to get finer-grained control over fighter groups in England by setting them up as "nations" in the country.xml\global_layer.csv framework. It would be possible to go right down to setting up some individual squadrons as "nations" for spawning purposes.
One early attempt at differentiation between fighter groups was the work by Charlie in is 1939 and 1940 campaigns (like DC diary package - here at SOH). His techniques hae not been fully replicated in subsequent addons. For example, by attaching specific spawns triggered at geographically located facilities, he tried to get a spawning environment that provides more accurate locations of squadrons and Groups flying in the right places. He also pioneered radio traffic but that is another story.
- Possible to set a different player flight strength, other than 8? EG 12? Useful if attacker strengths are being increased. But maybe not a good idea, as 8 is enough of a handful for a leader! There is always more than one way to skin a cat! When you read about the pitifully small resources that were allocated by Fighter Command in the early stages of the BoB, and the way they were cobbled together from different squadrons, it might be easier to get more aircraft in the air by using other spawns rather than trying to modify the _mission.xml file to contain bigger flights. Have you found the _mission.xml file? It is in the missions folder of your install's AppData pathway. I played around with hotkey software and managed to exert a primitive level of control over the _mission.xml file, to enable assigning higher skill levels to flights because the default is "skill="1" which is very frustrating. I've tried to get around that limitation by assigning all the unlimited pilots available as AI wingmen, to have higher vision gtolerance and health and experience, via the pilotattributes.xml found with the pilotcontants.xml in the root of the install.
- Are larger than stock raids spawned? EG 18-30 A/C? (here, raids = bombers, as opposed to escorts) This can be achieved through air.spawns and intercept.spawns. The sweep.spawns are different, they involve you flying high over an enamy airfield to try and draw up someopposition. Unfortunately the bomber_intercept missiontype is not supported by the campaign engine so bomber raids have to be build into the intercept spawn set.
- Are formations closer? Player's? AI's? Both? I've added some specific offsets to many of the spawn files cobbled together inthe ETO_BoB.zip. Offset="0.3" is used, this could possibly be better at 0.2, but the AI may struggle with it - worth a shot though!
- Are close escorts (or sweep cover) spawned for raids: in enough strength (=8-24 A/C) and often enough (= majority of raids ARE escorted)? This is one area where a well-designed air.spawns set are maybe a better way to achieve the desired effect than writing in the escort formations into the specific spawns for a campaign mission. If you take a look at the MJ air.spawns for the BoB set, you will see that "modifiers" at the bottom of the air.spawns file, are extensively used. By installing specific modifiers for the "intercept" mission type, air.spawns get biased toward escort enemy fighter flights. There are a wide range of modifiers available; I think MrJmaint has utilised the technique as fully as anyone.
- Are LW jabo raids spawned; and if so, given their rarity, at a relatively low rate, compared to other raids (say 10-20%, tho higher would be ok from October)? Yes, even with the current air.spawns, low altitude flights of 6-8 me110s have been spotted on search_destroy missions at low altitude over British soil! This can easily be proliferated - just need time!
- Are (non-jabo) raids spread reasonably well between all four LW dive- and level-bomber types? The categories availbable to work with are fight_bomber, tactical_bomber (my preferred categoryfor Ju-87s), and level_bomber. Fouteman has trialled non-standard pick-types (ie not in the SDK) for air spawns, so it should be possible to establish a dive-bomer pick-type whichis used in spawns triggered by, for example, radar stations along the English Channel (Charlie has probably done it already!).
- Does the LW mount single aircraft recce or 'pirate raid' flights, or just raids by formations?
- Are raids spawned to targets in something like historical progression (shipping & ports, then also coastal airfields & RDF, then also inland airfields and industrial targets)? The quickest waty to achieve this would be with sequential campaigns over shorter periods, with different campaign MissionEffects and OffensiveEffects sections. The biggest weakness is properly representing the period when the LW attacked airfields. Unfortunately the standard campaign "strike" missions involve spawn sets and hard-coded elements which do not provide for specific "strike airbase" missions. However the current air.spawns trigger some bombers near airbases, and more often than not, the bombers choose to attack the airbase, although they are not above dropping bombs on nearby bridges! I have trialled a work-around where the airbase facility.xml file has two types at the top - "isairbase, isFactory". Given that campaign Strike missions often attack factories, I found that flying Axis bombers on strike mission over Britain were attacking airbases about half the time when the airbase facility files were modified in that way. I think using specific spawns triggered by the facility files is the best work-around, as trialled by Charlie. In several of my installs, I have (such as my modified Stock Upgrade install linked here in the Sticky thread) I have added a small flight of fighters at every airbase, tasked with "Combat Air Patrol". This spawn is written into the airbase facility files. Trouble is, it worked too well and so I limited it to ber triggered only when the player aircraft is between certain altitudes. But occasionally it has worked fantastically well. I've taken off on a campaign mission, enemy bombers have spawned over the airbase (air.spawns flights), and a group of intrepid fighters has taken off amongst the bombs behind me (spawns triggered in the facility file), tasked with beating off the bombers. Which is just as well, as my campaign flight has other mission objectives to meet if we are to win the war. ..
- What are the campaign’s victory conditions eg LW wins if London occupied by 31 October, else RAF wins on 31 October? Or something less obvious? The campaign.xml parameters are Invasion Areas and Victory Areas. There is a bug in most Bob Campaigns where the invasion areas are hard to install without generating error messages.
- Could campaign run on beyond 31 October? Best if it was resolved on some basis on or soon after that date, if RAF is not clearly already defeated earlier. I prefer campaigns that can run on longer than the "historic" version of the BoB. Campaign length is controlled at the top part of the campaign.xml file.
- When’s the earliest an invasion of England could happen? Should not be before early September! This can be influenced but not controlled specifically. In the Campaignparams section of the campaign.xml, IIRC there is a "roundstofirstoffensive" parameter. There are also national supply and strategic supply levels which can be set so low that an invasion will not occur until the levels are built up over time. There is another paramter at the bottom of the campaign file, supplyburndown indicator for each nation, which can be increased and hinder any invasion plans.
- Is a counter-invasion of France possible? Completely unhistorical, so threshold best set at a level the RAF player can never reach. Stopping a successful invasion (not just an invasion) should be enough for RAF to win. An invasion which hasn’t occupied London by the time winter weather sets in can probably be considered to have failed, hence some date during Nov-Dec is probably the latest date at which the victory conditions should be resolved and the campaign concluded, allowing a little longer than the official end date of 31 October. Yes, as I've indicated there are numerous contributing factors able to be set in a campaign.
- If the campaign can continue into Oct-Nov-Dec, will newer A/C appear - in small numbers only eg Spit II (which was around from early Sept), Hurri II (also from Sept), 109E-7 (from about Aug-Sept), 109F (from Oct)? Better they didn’t appear, than they replaced ALL the older marks at once, which should only happen when the newer marks had widely replaced them, which probably would be early 1941 in most cases. In the two relevant setcions, you can set total numbers of suadrons by month for each nation (or Group if you set up Groups as "nations". Also you can set up the entered service dates for aircraft. But I find too many of the newer aircraft do appear, although this may be influenced by the nation,s supply and reserve levels.
- Is there any particular reason why - if the spawn and era setters are used - this mod can’t be left in place and the ETO can then be played with other campaigns eg for France/attack in west 1940 or for other eras eg SCW? It could probably be done but the finer the level of control you want, eg. for BOF, the more complex it gets. That's why I think that Pat's BoB is a good place to start to achieve a tolerably decent set of BoB campaigns, together with specific global layers for specific parts of the BoB periods - coastal raids, airbase attacks, bombing london.
Hi Diawiletti
I'm sure you're right that a dedicated BoB mod like Pat's is always going to be able to do things better than something that has to accept at least some constraints from a bigger mod like ETO. Perhaps that's the best thing to invest in. But even if this mod does no more than improve the BoB experience when playing ETO, then it will have been worthwhile, and might be best packaged as an improved BoB campaign for the ETO (that will leave the ETO otherwise 'intact'), than a 'mod of a mod'. Probably not explaining that very well!
My first mission has just been flown and confirmed as expected that it didn't do anything to allow a choice of aircraft or squadron. Also that there are still far too many pilots (about 50) in the player's squadron, more like a US one of 1943-45 IIRC, than an RAF 1940 one when there should be up to 26. These of course are general observations on the CFS3 campaign not this mod.
As for the mission itself, my JSGME version of this mod has obviously messed up with your modified Hurricane files! My kite has an invisible pilot and though the AI A/C seemed to have at least landing lights, mine had none, no nav lights, and none of the ETO mod's wingtip vortices at low airspeed.
Warp took us up to the usual height of nearly 21,000 feet. A nice touch is that there was a convoy in the target area and the Huns when they soon appeared, although lower, were only a few thousand feet so, not much lower than before. They appeared just left of our assigned track just after the pic below was taken. One unusual thing was that the usual purple marker was not visible.
Maybe that was because these Huns were 109s, and there were bombers about which were our real target. If so, it was neat to run into a fighter sweep!
One thing I don't like about the ETO mod's effects is that there is often a sizeable fireball when an enemy is hit which subsides after a few seconds - by which time you have stopped shooting and broken away, thinking your target is doomed. A dastardly Hun ruse, possibly! This 109 looked to be a flamer a second or two before this pic was taken. I think Pat's BoB mod is better in this respect.
What happened next was very strange and again, maybe down to me messing up installation. In trying to get back onto the 109's tail, I spun out and could not recover; I don't recall the eTO Hurricanes being so tricky before, but maybe it's just me.
To add insult to injury, the 109, although clearly damaged, managed to hit me with unerring accuracy as I spun down.
I tried to save my invisible pilot but the results were...well, invisible. I opened the canopy (I wish the little escape hatch would not open when you did this!!!) and tried again. the camera stayed with my spinning plane.
The briefing didn't tell me I'd got the chop so the bailout must have worked. How an invisible pilot got spotted and fished out of the Channel, I can't say.
Anyhow if I can fix the Hurricane I'll play on, possibly resuming the campaign I've been reporting on in the hope switching won't mess up anything. I was going to start MrJMaint's version in Pat's BoB mod too - and ideally try out rince33's modified spawns, which were designed for that rather than the ETO anyway. You can't have too much of a good thing - I also have BoB campaigns I intend to continue at some point, going in BoB2 and WotR, as well!
PS can't find the Hurri problem yet. But one clue is that the new files seem to have added underwing pylons to the Mk2a. My kite started this mission with two drop tanks and also had bombs in the loadout drop down. Which would be ok for a IIb but probably not for a IIa and certainly not for one that's really standing in for a BoB-era MkI. Otherwise, this A/C's folder - ETO_Huri_Mk2 - looks fine to me, so I'll back out that part of the mod and see if I'm good again.
PPS good again but not much wiser. Re-enabling the mod WITHOUT the Hurricane IIa files restored the visible pilot. However, the loadout options were still there, I just never noticed them before so were not what the mod added to that A/C. Anyway stock ETO YB-J and the same plane in this mod (but the Huri files removed) now have visible pilot again.
hi 33 Lima, a few things. First check the path of your JGMSE install of the hurri xdp. ETO has a bit of a trap for a number of aircraft - almost identically named aircraft folders and xdp names. I suspect the modified xdp may not have installed to the correct folder. Unlike for ship folders, the aircraft folder name does not have to be identical to the aircraft xdp name and this makes for more potential confusion.
As for the spin - I almost tear my hair out after a long mission, when I get into a flat spin and cannot by any technique get out of it. It is an AvHistory v 4.xx flight model and this is a feature of the hurri V4.0 flight model. You could swap out for an earlier AvHistory flight model using the .air file and aircraft .cfg from an earlier 3gb hurricane. (with a couple of edits to the names).
And hmm, yes, looks like the entered service date for the hurricane 2a is a bit optimistic.
Thanks for all the info.
I suppose I was just wondering aloud how close CFS3's particular campaign system could be adapted to meet what I (FWIW) would see as the most desirable characteristics for a BoB campaign, and at what sort of effort. Somewhat bigger formations coming in at 10-15,000 feet, often if not always with escorts or sweeps, would go an awful long way compared to what I saw before in ETO (small formations, mostly unescorted and at well under 10,000 feet). And if this mod does that, then it's a big step forward in my book.
A set of scripted missions would likely be a good alternative, especially if missions can incorporate variable elements, so giving at least some re-playability. As for the dynamic campaign, it would be a shame to abandon entirely what CFS3 does offer ie the invasion/counter-invasion thing, as that's what you get instead of the 'conventional' pilot career as in WotR, where it's about surviving the history amongst your mates, not trying to influence it amidst an evolving battlefront.
I'll have another look at the Hurricane - what changes did your files make to it? And if I wanted to have clones of the current BoB campaign so that I could fly a Spit, a Defiant(!) or a Blenheim fighter (!!) from the outset, instead of a Hurricane, how is that done? I can see nothing in any campaign file which controls allocation of starting aircraft, even in those in the mossie combat add on, which does just that. I used to know stuff like this - I think!
And is there an easy way to increase mission frequency, beyond the one a day I'm seeing now, which is ok for stock CFS3 but not so good for the Battle?
Sorry about all the questions!!!
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