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Thread: Windows 7 Support to End

  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by tommieboy View Post
    I do recall Microsoft will be offering "Windows 7 Extended Security Updates" (for a price?) beyond the upcoming cut-off date. Can anyone confirm this? Seemed a lot cheaper than buying a new computer rig to support Windows 10, as some of the components in my computer rig (motherboard, cpu, etc.) date back some 10+ years.

    Tommy
    Yes, primarily for Enterprise people...there's a sliding scale of fees for several more years all of which probably don't sit well for entities such as the ACCC...where a product MUST be fit-for-purpose.
    Compare it with the world-wide recall of Takata air-bags ...ALL at Takata's cost. Yes, I know....they kill people...which is more extreme than an MS OS which merely 'annoys people'...

  2. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Priller View Post
    Kaspersky would indeed be suitable. But there is no guarantee that you will find Windows 7 drivers for your shiny new hardware.

    Priller
    Thank you Priller.

  3. #28
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    Windows 7 Support to End

    Quote Originally Posted by Dangerous Beans View Post
    Another happy Win 10 user here. I reisted it for the first year what with all the fuss about MS trying to force it on people.
    But being a VR convert it was inevitable I would have to convert eventually and I havnt looked back.

    As for the GUI install Classic Shell http://www.classicshell.net/ and you can have the Win 7 menu back.
    Hi all,

    I can also recommend Classic Shell, I've installed and used it on many Win10 boxes with no problems. Yes the Win10 GUI does suck.

    I think it is also worth pointing out that you can still legally upgrade for free from windows7 & 8 to Win10 - have a careful read of the following:

    https://www.zdnet.com/article/heres-...ws-10-upgrade/

    and

    https://www.geeksinphoenix.com/blog/...ndows-8-1.aspx

    I've done this at least seven times this year (2019) with no real problems. However, do your research first (e.g. for hardware & software compatibility) and take backups before you start ... oh and test that your backups have worked and that you can restore from them. ... and make sure you have a record of your various software licence/activation keys, just in case.

    Should you upgrade if you can? YES ... (with some caveats below). Do some research, you'll find that a significant amount of the problems with malware is because people/organisations haven't been patching the their operating systems, software etc.

    Bear in mind that you wouldn't necessarily know that your old, unpatched system is hosting malware (even with some old anti-malware software on it) because the malware isn't necessarily going to make itself known to you - you could be hosting an attack on government web sites right now for example - the malware isn't targeting you so unless you watched your network traffic/processor you probably wouldn't know anything about it (and your old anti-malware software wouldn't either). Another example is the malware could be harvesting your banking details, address book entries etc and sending them to some bad actors - the malware isn't going to tell you that it is doing this, and your old anti-malware/unpatched OS isn't necessarily going to notice either.

    Research on the WindowsXP malware fiasco in the NHS if you want a "real life" example of why you should keep up to date.

    Caveats: 1) if you have some software that you can't live without that only runs on an old OS, don't upgrade - but disconnect your system from the Internet. 2) If you're unsure of your own computer skills, consider getting help before doing anything. 3) There will be a period of time when Win7 loses support from Microsoft but is still supported by your anti-malware software provider you *may* be safe during that period but keep an eye on the support of your anti-malware.

    Oh one other thing, yes some of the Win10 automated updates haven't gone perfectly, but they've all been fixable. There is no guarantee that an update to Windows/IOS/Unix will go perfectly in every case, Win10 is no different to any other operating system in that sense. There pretty much is a guarantee that if you don't update (but remain connected to the Internet) then eventually you'll have some malware on-board.

    So, if you don't want to upgrade but are happy to disconnect old systems from the Internet, go ahead. If you wish to connect all your boxes to the Internet - be a good net citizen and keep 'em up to date!

    Cheers,

    SW

  4. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Jafo View Post
    Sadly...8, 8.1 and 10 were Microsoft's failed attempt to push a unified GUI experience on users...all for the sake of promoting the Windows Phone...which is now dead in the water...and they did so to the detriment of actual desktop users who really have no interest in greasy fingerprints all over their screen/work. The kernel may be fine and dandy [it is...to a degree...and is easy to argue as better than 7, but it's the GUI they ruined [without Start 10] and in the end for no good reason.
    I ditched BBLean that had replaced XP's and 7's desktops for me shortly after 10 was released. The quick access, tiled, customizable start menu is just too good and exactly what I really liked about Windows Phone/Mobile as well that had a customziable start screen and a second page for everything else. Easy, simple, clean. Now if only they'd merge the control panel into the settings menu...

  5. #30
    SOH-CM-2020 Mick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackbird686 View Post
    ... I have been in touch with the Symantec (Norton) folks and so far, they are saying that if you have their product suite, you can continue to use Windows 7 safely and securely after the expiration date...
    BB686
    Thanks for that! I sort of figured that was the case, since we have folks here who still use XP (how I envy them!) and, well, they're still here using XP and their confutors seem secure. But it's a relief to hear it from Norton.

    I missed my chance to retain XP when my last confutor died suddenly and completely after it was too late to find a clean copy of XP. I lost the use of some software in the transition. I spent extra to get Win7pro because it has virtual XP, only to find that virtual XP doesn't really work as advertised. But it works well enough to run a couple of FS utilities that won't run in Win10, and there are a couple guys who have to ask me for help with certain things that they can't do for themselves on their projects in Win10.

    Eventually I will get Win10 on a separate drive in the same system and be able to boot up W10 to get on line after updated browsers will no longer run in W7 (don't know when that will happen, but some day it's bound to.) Then I'll still have my FS installations and my favorite image processing programs that probably won't run in W10 , but only expose Win10 to the hazards of the Interweb.

    For now I'm relieved that I can just stand pat for a while longer.

  6. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by Bjoern View Post
    Now if only they'd merge the control panel into the settings menu...
    I'm afraid I'm going to have to disappoint you: the control panel will eventually be dumped. That is what M$ tells us during meetings at work.

    Configuration for home and pro users will be done through the settings menu, and enterprise clients will be configured through group policies and system center.

    Priller

  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Dangerous Beans View Post
    ...
    As for the GUI install Classic Shell http://www.classicshell.net/ and you can have the Win 7 menu back.
    The W10 GUI (not to even speak of W8) is the main reason why I have been sticking to W7. This is really good news that I can replace it with one that suits much better for my desktop PC and works also with W10. Thanks for the info.

  8. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Priller View Post
    I'm afraid I'm going to have to disappoint you: the control panel will eventually be dumped. That is what M$ tells us during meetings at work.

    Configuration for home and pro users will be done through the settings menu, and enterprise clients will be configured through group policies and system center.
    Not a disappointment at all. In fact, this is great news (and just what I said before)!

  9. #34
    All in all this went pretty civil, right? Even though it's such a testy subject for some.

    Priller

  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Jafo View Post
    Yes, primarily for Enterprise people...
    I asked my IT guy for more clarification on this. He told me that the "pay for" extended security updates (up to 2023 if you want) will be available to anyone running Windows 7 Pro; it doesn't matter if it is business or for personal use. But, that the personal use subscription cost may be double that of the Enterprise user. Still, it's a cheaper option for me as my current aging rig will be my last desktop computer. The family has since moved on to non-windows android based mobile devices.
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  11. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by PHo17 View Post
    The W10 GUI (not to even speak of W8) is the main reason why I have been sticking to W7. This is really good news that I can replace it with one that suits much better for my desktop PC and works also with W10. Thanks for the info.
    Stardock has been pioneering Windows GUI enhancements for decades....and needless to say, when Win 8 came out it didn't take us long to release 'Start8' to restore 'sanity' to the 8 GUI.
    Naturally...10 was little better [if at all] and there's a 'Start10' [naturally] as well.
    I 'don't leave home without it'....

  12. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Jafo View Post
    Stardock has been pioneering Windows GUI enhancements for decades....and needless to say, when Win 8 came out it didn't take us long to release 'Start8' to restore 'sanity' to the 8 GUI.
    Naturally...10 was little better [if at all] and there's a 'Start10' [naturally] as well.
    I 'don't leave home without it'....
    Thanks for the heads up! Classicshell was discontinued a while ago and I had not heard of Start10. Just purchased the full package!
    Matt

  13. #38
    SOH-CM-2020 WarHorse47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackbird686 View Post
    Yes, Microsoft plans to end support for Windows 7 on January 12, 2020. I have been in touch with the Symantec (Norton) folks and so far, they are saying that if you have their product suite, you can continue to use Windows 7 safely and securely after the expiration date. As always, I'm skeptical but really don't want to put up with Windows 10.

    That's it, over and out.

    BB686
    So.. if support ends for Win7, are you saying they will no longer support their Security Essentials.... meaning no more updates, and the need to get another virus protection program??
    -- WH

    If at first you don't succeed, try, try,try again. ... or go read the manual.

  14. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by WarHorse47 View Post
    So.. if support ends for Win7, are you saying they will no longer support their Security Essentials.... meaning no more updates, and the need to get another virus protection program??
    Using Microsoft Security Essentials is like trying to stop a blazing fire with a sheet of paper. So yes, you should get another security suite. not just an antivirus, but the whole deal.

    And even when using decent security, it still won't be enough when people insist on using Windows 7. Hackers and the likes will be able to exploit weaknesses in your operating system that will not be addressed by M$ any longer. And your fancy security suite (if you decide on buying one that is) will not be able to stop it.

    Welcome to the 21st century.

    Priller

  15. #40
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    Correct.
    Have a Google for Windows 7 end of life.
    Nowhere can I find that having an anti virus will be the answer.
    Robin
    Cape Town, South Africa

  16. #41
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    Windows 7 Support to End

    Quote Originally Posted by aeronca1 View Post
    Thanks for the heads up! Classicshell was discontinued a while ago and I had not heard of Start10. Just purchased the full package!
    Hmm, I wasn't aware of Classicshell being discontinued ("As of December 2017, Classic Shell is no longer in active development").

    It turns out it lives on as "Open Shell", you can get it from:

    https://github.com/Open-Shell/Open-Shell-Menu

    or

    https://open-shell.github.io/Open-Shell-Menu/

    I'm not familar with Start10, I'll have to have a look at it.

    Cheers,

    SW

  17. #42
    Hi guys,

    Just a question out of curiosity from my part: what does this "classic shell" bring exactly, compared to the Windows 10 shell ?
    So far, after switching from Windows 7 to Windows 10 last year, the only difference I noticed was the start menu, which is now in alphabetical order, and yes I prefered the Win7 one but that one is not too bad.

    What else am I missing ? Excepted the start menu, my Windows 10 desktop looks exactly like my Windows 7 deskptop, which looked mostly like my Windows XP and Vista desktop, which looked almost identical to my Windows 98 and 95 desktops...

    When I read your comments here, it feels like your Windows 10 desktops are totally different from mine...

  18. #43
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    I'm also a bit confused as to how, apart from the Start Menu, how different the desktop looks, as compared to the older operating systems.



    from http://www.classicshell.net/
    Robin
    Cape Town, South Africa

  19. #44

    Dunno how big this turns out...but it's a side-by-side comparison of Start10 with the default Win 10. Start10 was specifically intended to restore the perfectly good and familiar GUI interaction found in Win 7, with its origins several versions prior...so everyone knew it...and where to find things.
    Win 10's GUI was 'optimized' [and dumbed-down] for a touch-screen environment which inadvertently [perhaps] caused a longer click-through process to get anywhere compared with the tried-and-true 7 ...
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Start10_SideBySideLG_thumb.png  

  20. #45
    SOH-CM-2020 Mick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenie View Post
    ... Would a purchase of Win7 disc now be ok to install after M$ withdraw support ?

    Sorry for the belated reply.

    My understanding is that when M$ releases a new OS, all sellers' licenses for thew previous system are voided as a condition of getting a license for the new OS. If this is correct, then nobody was licensed to sell Win7 once Win10 was released. And of course M$ won't sell any OS except their current product.

    When my WinXP rig went belly up I wanted to replace it with a new custom built XP rig, but Win7 was the current OS and it was no longer possible to obtain a clean copy of XP. AS the only way to get XP was to buy a black market copy that might be infected with who knows what, I was forced to upgrade to Win7.

    As far as I know, the only way to build a new rig with an older OS is to extract the OS from your old rig, and that only works if your present rig's license isn't keyed to the serial number of your present processor, which most usually are.

    This is what I was told by my friend who is a professional computer techie. When he rebuilt my Win7pro rig, the only way he could do it was by using the same processor, which thankfully is pretty powerful despite its age.

  21. #46
    Add to that, that you are only allowed x amount of re-installs / re-activations due to hardware upgrades before you need to purchase a new license.
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  22. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Mick View Post


    This is what I was told by my friend who is a professional computer techie. When he rebuilt my Win7pro rig, the only way he could do it was by using the same processor, which thankfully is pretty powerful despite its age.
    Hardware replacement using the same OS key can be a pain in the bum but it's doable....done it myself several times. Minor differences such as an added HD are ignored...but biggest 'issue' is when a MoBo is swapped out....had to do that once when one went belly-up and was replaced with an identical one...still needed an ET-phone-home call to MS to accept the new hardware code...

    As for out-of-date OS's ....further you go away from the 'high street' department stores the longer the Older OS can be found still available for sale....

    https://www.ebay.com.au/b/Microsoft-...26/bn_16499590

  23. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by Jafo View Post

    Dunno how big this turns out...but it's a side-by-side comparison of Start10 with the default Win 10. Start10 was specifically intended to restore the perfectly good and familiar GUI interaction found in Win 7, with its origins several versions prior...so everyone knew it...and where to find things.
    Win 10's GUI was 'optimized' [and dumbed-down] for a touch-screen environment which inadvertently [perhaps] caused a longer click-through process to get anywhere compared with the tried-and-true 7 ...
    Is that all ?
    The interface is "dumbed down" because there are icons in it ?
    Do you know you can choose them, rearrange them, and more importantly, choose between "big" and "small" size for each ? (on your screenshot the icons are set to big).
    If anything, the start menu actually looks more usable in the Win10 version, actually :/

  24. #49
    Daube.... I think you're missing a bit. What's gone is those painful 'tiles'....the hunt and seek process to ever find access to a control panel....the 'where T F' is the 'off' button and everything else that is pointless if you are NOT on a Windows Phone.....and that's just about everyone these days.
    Start10 is an identical reconstruction for 10 of the 7 GUI...which is its point/raison d'etre ...

  25. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Mick View Post
    Sorry for the belated reply. My understanding is that when M$ releases a new OS, all sellers' licenses for thew previous system are voided as a condition of getting a license for the new OS. If this is correct, then nobody was licensed to sell Win7 once Win10 was released. And of course M$ won't sell any OS except their current product. When my WinXP rig went belly up I wanted to replace it with a new custom built XP rig, but Win7 was the current OS and it was no longer possible to obtain a clean copy of XP. AS the only way to get XP was to buy a black market copy that might be infected with who knows what, I was forced to upgrade to Win7. As far as I know, the only way to build a new rig with an older OS is to extract the OS from your old rig, and that only works if your present rig's license isn't keyed to the serial number of your present processor, which most usually are. This is what I was told by my friend who is a professional computer techie. When he rebuilt my Win7pro rig, the only way he could do it was by using the same processor, which thankfully is pretty powerful despite its age.
    Thank you Mick - just to be clear the question is - if I buy a copy of Win7 now, to be used in the future . As Priller pointed out, I may run into problems with the drivers and after reading the posts here I think I'll go to win10 with the mods. Can't help thinking that win10 will be just fine with M$FS when it comes out - same company

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