Aircraft using PBR?

[odourboy]

I know Dino has provided updates for his F-35 and Eurofighter, but I'm not aware of any others. Anyone else?

[bazzar]

Sure thing. Here's some of ours.

[blanston12]

Sure thing. Here's some of ours.

Those look great Bazz! Am looking forward to all three.

Don't forget the Phoenix which I believe is also PBR.

[cavaricooper]

Funny you ask... I just posted this... https://forum.pmdg.com/forum/main-fo...e-desert-sands

Best- C

[odourboy]

Funny you ask... I just posted this... https://forum.pmdg.com/forum/main-fo...e-desert-sands

Best- C

Nice.. I guess. But not being a member of the PMDG forum I have no idea what you posted there because I don't have access.

[blanston12]

Nice.. I guess. But not being a member of the PMDG forum I have no idea what you posted there because I don't have access.

Dito.

PMDG is too rich for my budget.

[cavaricooper]

Nice.. I guess. But not being a member of the PMDG forum I have no idea what you posted there because I don't have access.

Sorry, I didn’t realize that-

[odourboy]

No worries! Thanks. Is that released yet? (Or what's the schedule )

[gaab]

You have also the new Flysimware Falcon 50.

A beauty.

[Daube]

I know the FlySimWare Falcon received some dramatic texture improvements from a new texture artist they recently hired, but are these new textures already distributed to customers ? I thought they were still under development ?

[greenie]

I know the FlySimWare Falcon received some dramatic texture improvements from a new texture artist they recently hired, but are these new textures already distributed to customers ? I thought they were still under development ?

I hope they update their previous models. That would be the cherry on top .

[Daube]

From what I saw on the FlySimWare support forum on Avsim, the texture artist said he wanted to update the Mu-2 next... if I understood correctly

[odourboy]

I know the FlySimWare Falcon received some dramatic texture improvements from a new texture artist they recently hired, but are these new textures already distributed to customers ? I thought they were still under development ?

Did you all notice the screenshot contest FSW is running over on AVSIM ?

https://www.avsim.com/forums/topic/5...t%C2%A0contest

[cavaricooper]

No worries! Thanks. Is that released yet? (Or what's the schedule )

These are BETA images... "soon" I'm told...



C

[cavaricooper]

Out now! Just download the latest installer or use OC.

C

[Javis]

Say Carl,

Re your 747 piccies ( somehow reply won't let me quote your post... ), what sim are we looking at here ?

It's not XP11 is it ?.. To me the 747 here looks remarkably plasticky.... Quite unrealistic if you ask me.. ( much like aircraft models in XP10 when it didn't support reflection maps yet. Just specular lighting (or probabely PBR in this case) without reflection can generate this 'plastick' effect to quite some extend)

cheers,
jan

[cavaricooper]

Jan- those were BETA images from P3D v4.4... these are some images from yesterday's RELEASED version... better, nicht?







In sim with the reflections moving it is pretty great. Waiting on LM to release 4.5 to fix some residual issues... still VERY NEW TECH.

How's my VVC update coming ??

C

[Javis]

Jan- those were BETA images from P3D v4.4... these are some images from yesterday's RELEASED version... better, nicht?

Certainly! (still think the 747 in the mid screenie has a bit of a 'plasticky' appearance.. )

Still thinking though if this whole PBR thing is something i have been waiting for with bated breath for so long....something i really can't live without anymore now that it has finally arrived in our precious flightsim world. Can't help having mixed feeling about it to be honest. For certain 'normal games' there's no doubt that it will enhance the visual experience to great extent, particularly re unpainted surfaces, bare metal, and small gadgets and objects like this (yes, i have been investigating.. ;-) :











But with large, high gloss painted surfaces like that of airliners or even smaller aircraft, and, on top of that, usually bathing in the brightest sunlight, i keep wondering if PBR is really something 'for us simflyers'.... I.e. will the tremendous amount of extra work warrant the 'extra visual experience' ? Maybe it'll turn out that it will be the best since sliced bread for a VC rather than the external model.. if anything atleast that's packed with small objects and gadgets... ;-)

How's my VVC update coming ??

You'd want that with or without PBR ??..... ;-)

cheers,
jan

P.S. I certainly don't want to rain on anyone's PBR parade, just my thoughts about it atm after having seen the PBR/P3D related screenies here and there and taken AH's Phoenix for a PBR spin. (i'll put some screenies up of it next)

[cavaricooper]

Jan-

I am in agreement. There is a lot of fuss about PBR atm, and it definitely shows promise, however, there are miles to go before we sleep. ATM developers are waiting for fixes from LM (hopefully in v4.5). Yes, I am all for PBR in the VC where I would actually enjoy it throughout my flight. Not just when capturing screenies. The pictures from "modern" games with current graphics engines are truly incredible. For me, the closest I get is DCS- and that too is leaps and bounds ahead of P3D. Perhaps one day...

On a much more important topic, I will take your update with PBR or without PBR, with lettuce and pickles or without, with ketchup and mustard, or not.... you get the idea, nicht?



C

[Javis]

Granted, AH's PBR infested 'Phoenix' looks great and these sunglint effects can never be generated by good ol' specular lighting of course but there's hardly any 'paint' left on this poor mutulated and dismembered flying contraption and that's exactly where PBR comes into play and literally shines :









And on top of almost no paint left and the fact that, despite the passengers, this certainly is no airliner, check it out against Carl's screenies of the factory fresh PMDG 747....

[Javis]

Jan-

I am in agreement. There is a lot of fuss about PBR atm, and it definitely shows promise, however, there are miles to go before we sleep. ATM developers are waiting for fixes from LM (hopefully in v4.5). Yes, I am all for PBR in the VC where I would actually enjoy it throughout my flight.

Actually i can't wait to see a screenshot or video of a PBR textured VC. It might be that vintage and/or fighterplane VC's will make better use of PBR than modern airliners will.. Imagine f.i. all these little glints on gauge bezels, knobs and switches..

Not just when capturing screenies. The pictures from "modern" games with current graphics engines are truly incredible. For me, the closest I get is DCS- and that too is leaps and bounds ahead of P3D. Perhaps one day...

Is DCS using PBR too you think, Carl ?... I bought it thru Steam (actually just for the F-86) but haven't activated it for a loong time. The cockpits certainly look the beez kneez.

On a much more important topic, I will take your update with PBR or without PBR, with lettuce and pickles or without, with ketchup and mustard, or not.... you get the idea, nicht?

Selbstverständlich. We'll have to see first to transfer the external model from Gmax to Max too so it can be turned into a proper DC-3. We'll see about PBR... In any case lots of bare metal, that's true... ;-)

Tschüss!,
jan

[TuFun]

PBR seem to dark to me so far in the pics I've seen. Don't know why a blue sky reflects black with PBR. I like how PBR looks in War Thunder, looks natural.

[cavaricooper]

Ted-

Re. BOTH items in your signature- Edel und Wundebar! Simply stunning mate!

C

[bazzar]

As modellers and texture artists get used to PBR workflow, things will improve. The great temptation with anything "new" is to slap it all on and hope for the best. There are multiple channels to deal with that must be tuned to get the results you want. Just having a channel handling reflectivity is not enough. Each channel has its own set of parameters like roughness, height and specularity, density and hue. Unless all of these are in correct balance with each other, one can get somewhat surprising results! Time is the problem. It will remain to be seen whether the end user can tolerate the timeframes required for PBR development over conventional processes. Believe me, the extra time allowance is more than considerable.

Lighting plays a massive role in all of this. Remember that true PBR has been around a long time in AAA gaming. And if you look at the majority of those games, they all exhibit a "darkness" . This is because of the way PBR materials need to react with the environment in which they are displayed. Bright lighting can wash out subtle reflective effects and create havoc with normal (bump) effects. So, HDR lighting in P3D really needs to be on and that means a darker, more drab appearance to the world. Maybe V5 will be different.

Developers will eventually come to the conclusion that PBR is not always the solution for a given style they want to achieve. A mix of the two is often a good way to go and sometimes a fresh look at the conventional techniques as used in FSX can produce effects which are just as good. Dynamic reflections is a case in point. You don't need PBR to achieve those.