Prepar3D V4.4 with PBR Engine Released

[Javis]

...no Quixel, nor Substance - ....

Grazie mille, Dino ! Valuable info for any PBR dilettante

And thanks, Rick ! Those DCS models look fantastic but i suppose it will never be my fav flightsim (in fact i only bought it for the F-86...;-)

[Javis]

The Phoenix is our first "dedicated" model for V4.4 with full PBR materials and textures. Here are some pics of the exterior...

and here are some previews, less people, of the interior VC. We are getting good results in dynamic reflections but are still at work on finessing glasswork.

Absolutely first class, Baz !

[Javis]

Curious if anyone has seen these updates to the sound system? Saw this over at Avsim......

I was reading this comment about the sound issues and possible fix if one has sound issues in P3Dv4.4
Also a video showing P3Dv4.4 PBR texture primer.

Thanks Ted !

I don't think i hear anything noteworthy new re engine sounds inside or out in v4.4. I also don't seem to have any problem with sounds all together in v4.4. The C-47 Pratt & Whitney concert for two R-1830-S1C3G Twin Wasp 1200hp 14 cylinder air-cooled two row radial piston engines still sounds as gorgeous as you have created it many moons ago, inside and out !

Nope, for the time being i have no issues with sound in v4.4.

And thanks for the PBR video !

[gman5250]

Thanks TF...I used the fix for the sound and it solved the "spooling up" anomaly. Sound is correct when switching P3D cameras, and ChasePlane cameras. Good tip.

Update:
I'm successfully exporting scenery and aircraft models into V4.4 from the SDK. PBR textures are functioning on aircraft and ground models, but not yet on ground polys. Right now I'm working with the new texture format using Quixel and non Quixel textures. Once I have anything the comes remotely close to the above posted models, I'll share those.

Thx to Dino for his contributions and TF for that great video.
Baz, those pics of the Phoenix are downright inspiring.
Rick...your work shows how far you have come in a year and a half. Kudos sir!!
This is a steep learning curve and all input is extremely helpful and appreciated.

[Javis]

Update:
I'm successfully exporting scenery and aircraft models into V4.4 from the SDK. PBR textures are functioning on aircraft and ground models, but not yet on ground polys. Right now I'm working with the new texture format using Quixel and non Quixel textures. Once I have anything the comes remotely close to the above posted models, I'll share those.

Thanks Gordon, look forward to it !

Say, i just paged thru that Substance site ( https://www.allegorithmic.com/substance ) My gawd...... Did you see that ?....

This is a steep learning curve and all input is extremely helpful and appreciated.

+1 !

[gman5250]

Thanks Gordon, look forward to it !

Say, i just paged thru that Substance site ( https://www.allegorithmic.com/substance ) My gawd...... Did you see that ?

I sure did. Spent a lot of time there and on Unigene and others. Bottom line is that we have tools to take us anywhere we want to go. The only question is going to be how far LM wishes to take P3D.

I'm leaning towards Substance Painter for my production work. I think Quixel is a fine, affordable interface that is very user friendly and perfectly suited for skinners and devs who are looking for a point and click approach. SP is going to be a more comprehensive and flexible tool in my view, so that will be on my priorities list.

BTW...I re-constructed the 3DS Max PBR Tutorial that Ted posted. It's really handy as a tool to determine what values are needed to produce different PBR reflective levels. The process of actually building the model and materials was a great way to get a hands on feel for the new workflow.

[lagaffe]

Happy to know that you choses also SP for your workflow, I feel less alone with my choices, not that I don't like PSP but SP seems more flexible and consumes less memory.

[TuFun]

Thanks Ted !

I don't think i hear anything noteworthy new re engine sounds inside or out in v4.4. I also don't seem to have any problem with sounds all together in v4.4. The C-47 Pratt & Whitney concert for two R-1830-S1C3G Twin Wasp 1200hp 14 cylinder air-cooled two row radial piston engines still sounds as gorgeous as you have created it many moons ago, inside and out !

Nope, for the time being i have no issues with sound in v4.4.

And thanks for the PBR video !

Just curious what LM was talking about changes to the sound system. Rob has built a monter PC, but mention he's testing P3V.5 on his old system.

I almost have all the parts to my system build just waiting on SAMSUNG 970 EVO M.2 SSD to arrive. Will be ready for P3V.5!
In the mean time I can get back on the C-47 for FSXSE.

Leak test video, but you see its massive cooling.

[roger-wilco-66]

What a rig ! ! !


Cheers,
Mark

[Dino Cattaneo]

Has anyone found a good PBR recipe for the canopy glass?

[gman5250]

Has anyone found a good PBR recipe for the canopy glass?

I'm working through my setups for metals, dull and shiny, painted surfaces, glass/canopy and various surfaces like asphalt, concrete and organics.
Glass and transparent plastics are at the top of my to do list. I'll post up as I work out the settings.

[bazzar]

I guess you need to ask yourself why you need PBR for glass. We are getting dynamics and a good reflectivity/colour by using "FSX"style materials. Unless you are going to have a canopy with deep gouging in it or something, I see little point. The normal mapping for glass in PBR can produce a very unrealistic "orange-peel" effect that I certainly don't like. I stand to be corrected but I don't think LM use PBR for the glass on the F-16. Probably for similar reasons.

[Sundog]

I guess you need to ask yourself why you need PBR for glass. We are getting dynamics and a good reflectivity/colour by using "FSX"style materials. Unless you are going to have a canopy with deep gouging in it or something, I see little point. The normal mapping for glass in PBR can produce a very unrealistic "orange-peel" effect that I certainly don't like. I stand to be corrected but I don't think LM use PBR for the glass on the F-16. Probably for similar reasons.

The only thing I can think of is he wants to simulate the metal glint of the actual gold material in the F-35. All U.S. stealth planes, F-35, B-2, and the F-22 have an actual layer of gold in the canopy/windscreen to shield the cockpit from radar.

[bazzar]

Understood but that can be done via traditional materials with manipulation of the spec layer. I really do not think that PBR will give the right results as it makes use of the normal channel and it is very hard to get that subtle enough. Time experimenting will see.

[Dino Cattaneo]

Well,

thing is that PBR material seem to have a slightly different reflections at certain angles (e.g. sky and ground reflections look a little different and arguably more realistic than on non-pbr materials)... so my current glass settings look a little "odd" - but just a little. Very very little to be honest. Currently the models with PBR fuselage and non-PBR glass look OK - I was just wondering if they could be better. It may well turn out that "traditional" materials do a better job for the glass: as usual, the important thing is the result.

[bazzar]

Absolutely Dino, trial and error is really the only way forward.

[gman5250]

Another thing that I am interested in is the interior reflections on the canopy material. I'm having good results with the interior canopy reflecting ground polys, runway lines etc. using the traditional setup. I'm curious to see how those reflections will work with a PBR setup.

For me the entire process will be an ongoing exploration of what tools may be needed as the platform develops.

FYI:
I'm sure you gentlemen check, but Arno has just updated MCX for V4.4. It's on the Development Releases page. I noted that it looks for V4.4, but I triple checked all of my addresses to make sure everything was directed to the correct file.

Below:
I ran across this. The GP is similar to what can be constructed in Quixel or Substance Painter. The same reflective values seen in the water could also be modified for grimy or worn canopy material. This would be especially effective with enhanced rain effects i.e. TrueGlass or future LM iterations of rain effects in V5.

Of course, these PBR effects are also going to radically improve what we can offer in GP. I am currently experimenting with terrain textures for grass/brush in areas between runways or on the periphery of airport taxiways etc. So far they are working extremely well with my vegetation and volumetric grasses.

[Mach3DS]

Gordon, that video is incredible. If this is what is in store, you've sumited that PBR mountain!

[Mach3DS]

As for the question regarding why new glass materials? v5 will likely bring a completely new graphics engine. PBR based but not backwards compatible. LM has already hinted at this in many interviews this year. Adam Breed said it him self that v5 would be a block point that is appropriate to introduce something completely new. So it's kind of a do it now or do it later....my thought is, if you're doing everything else other than glass....why not just do it al? Then you don't have to do it again! Unless you're like me and are never satisfied...then you do things over and over....LOL

[gman5250]

Gordon, that video is incredible. If this is what is in store, you've sumited that PBR mountain!

The video is from the Fly Tampa team, but I am definitely working on similar. Arno just released the new MCX with V4.4 compatibility, so today I'm able to place ground polys using the tool. At the moment I am updating KBIH Eastern Sierra Regional...my testbed.

I'm just hoping I am anticipating the V.5 engine correctly and won't need to go back and re-invent all my stuff...….again. lol

[Dimus]

Well that sure looks inspiring Gordon! I have lots of homework to do.

[Dino Cattaneo]

Like for like comparison...

[Daube]

Very nice comparison.
The one on the right looks like an excellent model for a sim.
The other one, on the left, looks like a real world picture.

[Mach3DS]

Oh man....PBR is such a refreshing and needed aspect in P3D. I'm so excited about these developers who are jumping in. Great work.

[gary20]

I agree it's refreshing and well worth the learning curve.


The SDK indicated that emmisive maps (nightime textures) need a lua script:
"Emissive Map= Map that defines areas of the textured material that will illuminate. Intensity of the illumination can be adjusted through scripting."
I've been experimenting with different metallic and albedo textures and modified the F-16C scripts for emmisive maps that work on lights being toggled to emmisive maps that show up at night.
I've included it below if it's of any use to anyone. I dont know if the lua syntax is correct, but it's working.
The emmisive scale needs to be adjusted from 0.0 t0 1.0 to suit your texture and model and it is added in the normal manner.


<-------------------------------------------------------------->
!lua
if varget("E:TIME OF DAY", "enum") == 3 then
varset("T:EmissiveTexture", "string", "Wings_LM.dds")
varset("T:EmissiveScale", "number", 0.03)
else
varset("T:EmissiveTexture", "string", "")
end
<-------------------------------------------------------------->


Where I am struggling is with glass, especially cockpit glass.
I'm wondering if a lua script might also be a way to go.


Dino's glass on his PBR model shown above looks to have preety good cockpit glass.
Could you share your recipe Dino?


Best wishes