P-47 Progress Thread

[Frosty]

https://www.aviationart.com/collecti...47-thunderbolt

Yep, that's one of the photos I used - I take it that's a vote for the prop on the left?

[gecko]

While you're at it, could you also deliver a -26, -27, -28, -30 and perhaps a -40 if it's not too much trouble? Although the differences are mostly minor, I really can't promise accurate work without them. When I am done, I am willing to lend you one - but only on Sundays

Sounds reasonable to me. I'll keep my eye out for an M-1 too. And a D-1, -2, -5, -10, -15, -20, -23, -24, C-1, -2 -5 etc....

[NachtPiloten]

Have you tried

Aircraft of World War II - WW2Aircraft.net Forums Never had a question go without an answer. I found several threads about the prop on P47s. Don't know if they are what you need but....

[Frosty]

Have you tried

Aircraft of World War II - WW2Aircraft.net Forums Never had a question go without an answer. I found several threads about the prop on P47s. Don't know if they are what you need but....

Thanks Ted,

I lurk there regularly (encountering your name every now and then ) and I think I have read most threads on P-47 props. A lot of my info comes from that website!

[Frosty]

Sounds reasonable to me. I'll keep my eye out for an M-1 too. And a D-1, -2, -5, -10, -15, -20, -23, -24, C-1, -2 -5 etc....

You're a decent fellow indeed!! While doing so, I am not keeping you from any other stuff, am I?

(I still have to see if I can get your latest - well, maybe not so latest by now - thingie to work but I am up to my neck in P-47 stuff. With the new HD, I had to reinstall some stuff so maybe it does work this time...)

[NachtPiloten]

Do you have the information on the prop pitch range for the P47? Found a document at ww2 that had numerous props and this type of data.

[Frosty]

Do you have the information on the prop pitch range for the P47? Found a document at ww2 that had numerous props and this type of data.

Thanks, I think I got that document - and the pitch range is stencilled in yellow on most blades. You haven't found a way to animate props using the cockpit controls, have you? Otherwise I am not sure how to use that data other than rotating the blades to a position somewhere in that range. In the end, it isn't all that important other than that I would like to have found a decent drawing of basic lengt/width dimensions of the different blades so I could approximate their different shapes as best as possible. You'll only see 'em with the engine turned off anyway...
(And I do have various smallish drawings of the different P-47 blades but how can I trust such sketchy work?)

[gecko]

We have animated prop pitch in the SJ Spitfires, but it requires the RSM code to make them move correctly. Though I'm guessing the Curtiss Electric props had a manual mode, which could perhaps be managed by stock animations, but the operation of the prop will not match the animation. Alternatively, you could set them at the lowest setting, because that is the position the rpm governor will move them to at low RPM or when the engine isn't running.

(I still have to see if I can get your latest - well, maybe not so latest by now - thingie to work but I am up to my neck in P-47 stuff. With the new HD, I had to reinstall some stuff so maybe it does work this time...)

I realized not long ago why that thingie wasn't working. I've not been able to do any work on CFS3 proper lately, but hopefully soon that will change.

[NachtPiloten]

Have you been able to get the turbosuperchrager to work? Or has anyone. What is this RSM code?

[Frosty]

Have you been able to get the turbosuperchrager to work? Or has anyone. What is this RSM code?

@ Q1: I'll quote myself here :

I haven't tried, sorry.

And I don't think I will. I'll stick to modeling only because at the present that is what I do best. With the aid of Daniel I'm sure I can get the additional animation parts working (clickable cockpit) but doing the airfile etc. is way beyond my capabilities. ...

@ Q2: RSM is Real Systems Module, the extra code that makes the additional animations and functions possible and is 'injected' into the game while running it (or something to that effect). It came with the latest SJ Spits - if you have those installed, look into the CFS3 'systems' folder for all those extra 'Systems.*.exe' scripts. You'll have to ask Daniel and Steve about the specifics because I don't have the faintest clue how to implement that myself...

[Frosty]

We have animated prop pitch in the SJ Spitfires, but it requires the RSM code to make them move correctly. Though I'm guessing the Curtiss Electric props had a manual mode, which could perhaps be managed by stock animations, but the operation of the prop will not match the animation. Alternatively, you could set them at the lowest setting, because that is the position the rpm governor will move them to at low RPM or when the engine isn't running.



I realized not long ago why that thingie wasn't working. I've not been able to do any work on CFS3 proper lately, but hopefully soon that will change.

Did I miss that?? . I am not sure I understand you correctly; Should the prop blades of the aircraft model change pitch when I move the appropriate lever in the VC? The lever itself, of course, is animated but I have not seen the blades move on the Mk.II, Mk.VA and Mk.VB models (I just tried) when manipulating it in the VC or using the rotary I have assigned that function to. The rest of the RSM action seems to work, so please tell me what I am doing wrong!



But the thingie worked for you, didn't it? But if you have found why it didn't work for me, I wasn't a certain long-eared member of the Equidae familiy after all!

[gecko]

I don't think you are missing anything, since the movement of the blades is not directly tied to the movement of the prop control lever. I'll explain.

There are basically three type of propellers - fixed pitch, variable pitch, and constant speed. CFS3 doesn't have the ability to model a variable pitch, but I can make one with the RSM.

With a fixed pitch prop, RPM is a function of engine power setting, and airspeed (mainly). Go faster, or increase throttle, and you get higher RPM. There is nothing to keep it from getting too high or too low.

A variable pitch propeller can change the pitch of its blades, adding a third factor to RPM. Here, the pilot directly controls the blade pitch, and can use that to adjust RPM manually. There is still no automatic system to keep RPM within safe limits, but the pilot does have greater control over RPM than with a fixed pitch prop. As far as I know, all variable pitch propellers are electrically operated, usually by an inker-dinker (increase-decrease) switch, so blade pitch can be adjusted at any time, including when the engine is off.

Constant speed propellers have a governor between the pilot's propeller control and the propeller itself. Instead of setting a blade pitch to try to control RPM indirectly, the pilot sets the desired RPM with the cockpit control and the governor sets the blade angle to maintain that RPM. In most conditions it does this quite precisely. Most constant speed propellers are hydraulically operated. Don't think about the aircraft's hydraulic system though, hydraulic here simply means fluid, and that fluid in this case is oil from the engine. This means that when the engine is not running, or you are losing oil pressure, the blade pitch cannot be controlled by the pilot. Other constant speed props are electrically operated, and usually still have a manual control mode which allows them to function as a variable pitch prop, using a separate control, as desired. With either type of constant speed prop, the governor will do whatever it can to maintain the pilot's chosen RPM, but eventually extremes of airspeed and engine power will cause the blades reach their rotational limit, at which point the governor just holds them there until airspeed and engine power allow for normal operation to resume. This means that when the engine is idling on the ground, airspeed and engine power are very low, not enough for the governor to maintain the pilot's selected RPM, so the propellers blades are held at their smallest angle by the governor.

The SJ Spits and your Hamilton Standard P-47 have hydraulically operated constant speed props, so direct control of prop pitch isn't correct for them. But if you look carefully at the Spitfire, you will see that the thickness of the prop disk is animated and reflects the actual pitch of the propeller blades. It is also possible in certain conditions to get the prop to stop in a position other than fully fine pitch. Is suspect your Curtiss Electric P-47 has a manual mode the pilot can select, in which case direct control of the blade angle would be possible. But none of it is going to be truly correct without external code. CFS3 just doesn't have that capability on its own.

And yep! The thingie failed through no fault of your own. Which I guess gives me the long ears and stubborn temperament!

[Frosty]

I don't think you are missing anything, since the movement of the blades is not directly tied to the movement of the prop control lever. I'll explain. ...

Thanks for the explanation, mate!!
This all came up because I remember a Spit (I think it was) in a civvie sim (FSX, I guess) where one could see the blades rotate when the prop lever was moved (sitting in the VC with the engine off).

[gecko]

Ah, yeah, the real airplane doesn't work like that.