Maryadi's MV22B Osprey Rel2.0 released

[PhantomTweak]

Mark,
I just had a thought, and it gave me a splitting head-ache. Thoughts do that to me. Anywho, You ARE opening the door before you hit CTRL-U, yes? I didn't see where you specified you did or not...
Just a small thought I had.

I agree with Rob totally. The weight should add on to the aircraft the instant it's lifted from the ground on the cable. It doesn't add until you put it into the plane, which, with some of the bigger loads, like the Tesla Coil, for example, is problematic. They don't fit through the door into the plane. Their weight is never added. As long as the cable can take the weight, it picks up, which isn't the way it should be. Sadly, in this case, should be and is, aren't...


I still enjoy hoisting up loads, carrying them someplace, and setting them down. Especially on a moving ship. Carrier, destroyer, cruise ship (some have helipads), just about anything. Even an Unrep setup can be a blast, especially if they're properly spread out, and there's some AI traffic, interesting weather, fun stuff like that, added in.

Bill, if it say's Marines on the side, and is realistically filthy...errr...maintained in a good Marine fashion... I'm more than interested!

Have fun, all!
Pat☺

[kalong]

I never did sling/hoist. the question for Pat/Rob: when pick up load, the weight not added?

I can add weight to aircraft from dll gauge, things I didn't know is model weight for parameter.

[rcbarend]

I never did sling/hoist. the question for Pat/Rob: when pick up load, the weight not added?

Correct.
The weight is only added when you load the object into the aircraft, NOT when it's still on the hook (and in the air of course).

As to Mark's problem with the Hoist not working with the MV22B Rel2 on P3Dv3.4:
Yes, we tested this and it IS a functional problem (so: not a cable-not-visible) display problem.
Cause: CTRL-U has no effect. (Yes, it's assigned to the correct event, and Yes: the hoist doors are open.

Only two possible causes are left now:
1. It's a bug in P3Dv3.4
OR
2. It's problem in the MV22B code, somehow causing the CTRL-U still to blocked even when the hoistdoors are open. (Maryadi, I sent you a mail on that).

So ... Will be continued ....

Rob

[kalong]

Yes Rob, I remember that email.

is there any way to know what weight attached?

[rcbarend]

is there any way to know what weight attached?

Not directly, since there is no externally-available sim var for that.

There are only two ways I know of, to get the weight an the attached object (as defined in it's sim.cfg file).
1. In a C program, read the sim.cfg file and get the weight from its definition line.
That's how the AI Carriers program does it (for the Title definition).
But then you should know which object is attached; and I don't have a clue if you can retrieve that info (don't think that's possible)

2. Read the weight via the iTraffic module.
When an object is spawned, it shows up in the AI list (with the proper filter), and you can read the weight with
(C:ITrafficInfo:S:TOTAL WEIGHT,pounds)
I tried that in my Radar addon gauge, and that works ...
However, that means that the user has to manually select the to-be-hoisted object from the iTraffic list, since you cannot distinguish such objects from other AI on the ground (like airport vehicles and ships); there are simply no handles for that.
So not worth the effort to add this small "realisme" function IMO

Rob

[freded]

Hi Mark,

I just Emailed you the Test gauge with instructions.
Please try it and let me know what happens with you ....

And in general, as to my remarks about the Hoist system implementation in FSX/P3D (apart from the cable-display problem).
I find it's implementation rather buggy resp. limited (as if the Aces team suddenly had to stop implementation because of release time-pressure) , for a number of reasons:

1. In the [Sling] section of the aircraft.cfg, you can define which Exit should be opened automatically if you extend the Hoist arm (with CTRL-U).
Which is fine.
But if you don't specify an Exit, it uses Exit-0 as default.
Meaning that it always requires one door to be opened, otherwise the Hoist system won't work.

2. The fixed concept using a Hoist arm.
This is probably correct for a Helicopter, where you should extend an Hoist arm through a sidedoor .
But makes no sense for an aircraft (like the V22) with a hoist system through bottom doors ...

3. After the Hoist arm is extended with CTRL-U, you need to give one J command (Lower cable) to set the cable to it's initial position (length becomes 0)
Which makes the cable visibly extended (1 feet or meter ?).
However, when you now retract the Hoist arm, the cable stays extended and always visible.
There is no way to visibly hide the cable again whilst in that flight ....

4. In the aircraft.cfg, you can define a payload station to which the weight of a hoisted object is added, increasing the total weight of the aircraft.
By itself, that works fine.
However, adding the object's weight shouldn't be done when

you load an attached object "into" the aircraft, but when it's attached to the hook and lifted off the ground.
So: quite unrealistic now wrt. adding weigth.

5. Definition of cable forces that will break the cable when exceeded.
Very unrealistic now.
Maybe the algoritm that calculates the cable forces works Ok by itself, but it's strongly influenced by the internal scheduling of FSX/P3D.
Meaning that if you have a sudden drop in framerate "(spyke) for whatever reason (scenery loading, opening a new window, or whatever cause), the cable might break.
EVEN if the weight of the attached object (as defined in it's sim.cfg) is only a few pounds.
What's missing: a way to disable the cable breaking; like with disabling "CrashDetection" in FSX/P3D.


In short:
Am I blaming MS for such a crummy implementation of a Hoist system in FSX (and therewith: P3D) ?
NO, it's just what it is. And I have had (and still have) a lot of fun with it, as long as one realises these "limitations" and accept them.

It's just a matter of "expectations", and that's where I am disappointed.
Because the "quality" of realisme of this Hoist system implementation is nowhere near the quality of the sim in most other aspects.
And worse: there's no way of programming around these limitations , because it's all hard-coded in the sim (FSX/P3D).

Cheers, Rob

Hi Rob,

I can appreciate your frustration with the limitations imposed by the hard-coded Hoist system in FSX/P3D.

I have noticed that other manufacturers of add-ons for the sims have said they were able to circumvent the FSX/P3D code for their own purposes,e.g. PMDG for their B777 and VRS in their FA-18E. But it must have been a lot of difficult work!

At any rate, I and others on this forum are very grateful to you and Maryadi for the results of all the hard work - even if it was fun! - that you continue to provide for the MV-22B.

Here's hoping you will be able to crack at least some of the 'nuts' involved.

[freded]

They are uploaded , under FSX Aircraft/FSX Military Props. Its probably not the right category ? Enjoy and let me know how you guys and gals like them

Bill

Hi Bill,

Where do I look for 'FSX Aircraft/FSX Military Props'? I tried Googling it but no luck...

Is it in SOH? Because I can't find it there either!

[flewpastu]

Mark take a look at warbirds library/military skins /post cold war. or go to main page in "whats new" here at simouthouse. its 1 or 2 from the top

Bill

[freded]

Mark,
I just had a thought, and it gave me a splitting head-ache. Thoughts do that to me. Anywho, You ARE opening the door before you hit CTRL-U, yes? I didn't see where you specified you did or not...
Just a small thought I had.

I agree with Rob totally. The weight should add on to the aircraft the instant it's lifted from the ground on the cable. It doesn't add until you put it into the plane, which, with some of the bigger loads, like the Tesla Coil, for example, is problematic. They don't fit through the door into the plane. Their weight is never added. As long as the cable can take the weight, it picks up, which isn't the way it should be. Sadly, in this case, should be and is, aren't...


I still enjoy hoisting up loads, carrying them someplace, and setting them down. Especially on a moving ship. Carrier, destroyer, cruise ship (some have helipads), just about anything. Even an Unrep setup can be a blast, especially if they're properly spread out, and there's some AI traffic, interesting weather, fun stuff like that, added in.

Bill, if it say's Marines on the side, and is realistically filthy...errr...maintained in a good Marine fashion... I'm more than interested!

Have fun, all!
Pat☺

Hi Pat,

Hope your headache's better!, Yes, I am opening the hoist door before Ctrl-U.

Rob and I are exchanging PMs about the Rel2/P3D Hoist problem. Seems it's endemic to P3D and he is trying to sort it out...

Glad you're having fun! That's what it's all about after all - though sometimes I wonder when I'm struggling with recalcitrant passwords that keep popping up!!

[freded]

Mark take a look at warbirds library/military skins /post cold war. or go to main page in "whats new" here at simouthouse. its 1 or 2 from the top

Bill

Thanks Bill! Got them now.

[rcbarend]

Ok, problem with the non-working Hoist system on P3Dv3.4 is explained.
Not a MV22B Rel2 or P3Dv3.4 bug, by the way.

With that issue gone, I'll probably upload my Addon for Rel2 tomorrow...

Rob

[freded]

Ok, problem with the non-working Hoist system on P3Dv3.4 is explained.
Not a MV22B Rel2 or P3Dv3.4 bug, by the way.

With that issue gone, I'll probably upload my Addon for Rel2 tomorrow...

Rob

in case anyone is wondering what the 'issue' was, it was my fault!

The reason I could not make the Hoist system work for Rel.2 in P3Dv3.4 was all due to one incorrect digit. Mistakenly, in Aircraft.cfg, I had substituted the section '[Sling.0]' from Rob's version for Rel.1 for the section that came with Rel.2. I had assumed that a) it would work as well as it had, and b) it must be better because Rob had made it!

What I hadn't noticed and didn't appreciate, was that this caused the value of 'hoist_door' to change from 3 to 4. Resulting in failure of the Hoist Door to open.

And if the Hoist Door didn't open, then Ctrl-U, J, and K were blocked. Hence, no sling appeared.

Let this be a warning not to edit (read: meddle) with config files unless you know exactly what you're doing...

[rcbarend]

Hi,

I just uploaded my Addon for this MV-22B Rel2.
Should be available soon .....

Cheers, Rob

*edit* : available now in the P3D section

[flewpastu]

I must apologize , I found some faults in the VMM365 Blue Knights repaint. I got the Marines color wrong and the 00 numbers on the fuselage wrong. The colors are supposed to Blue not Black. Im making the changes now and will up load the new files this week .

Bill

[PhantomP]

Hi,

I just uploaded my Addon for this MV-22B Rel2.
Should be available soon .....

Cheers, Rob

*edit* : available now in the P3D section

Thanks Rob for the new hoist gauge,and Thanks flewpastu for the new repaints.

[PhantomTweak]

Cheers, Rob

+1!
Cheers to Rob!


Thanks for this so much, Rob. It expands the wonderful MV-22, which only makes it better.
Many thanks to Maryadi, as well, for the fantastic aircraft in the first place.

Pat☺

[kalong]

your welcome sir, I'm glad if you happy with it.

[gray eagle]

Hi,

I just uploaded my Addon for this MV-22B Rel2.
Should be available soon .....

Cheers, Rob

*edit* : available now in the P3D section

Just so I understand the purpose of this addon, it allows a hoist mechanism to function. Other then that, and if I don't use the hoist mechanism then would I still need this "addon"?
I read the readme contained in this addon. I'm so afraid that if I use this addon, that things will not be the same as they are now and that something will be amiss for one reason or
another. I like the basic Rel 2 and was never aware that is does have hoist capabilities.

[rcbarend]

Just so I understand the purpose of this addon, it allows a hoist mechanism to function. Other then that, and if I don't use the hoist mechanism then would I still need this "addon"?
I read the readme contained in this addon. I'm so afraid that if I use this addon, that things will not be the same as they are now and that something will be amiss for one reason or
another. I like the basic Rel 2 and was never aware that is does have hoist capabilities.

Hi,

Installing this addon won't change anything in the current operation , other then a few minor improvements on the VSTOL.
Like the decelleration when converting from APLN to VTOL config. (see post 272), and more realistic behavior when you try to fly inverted in VTOL configuration.

Basic Rel.2 included hoist operation allready; that is: the aircraft.cfg already contained a Sling section, needed to use hoisting.
My hoist gauge just makes all hoist system data (like the status, object attached or not, cable extension, etc) visible in a seperate 2Dwindow, which is auto-open/closed when you open/close the hoist doors.
Plus: when opening the hoist doors, a new camera view is opened automatically (this camera view itself was also defined already in basic Rel2)

As to the Radar/Fuel/etc. gauge: its just an aid that that lets you auto-track AI aircraft (incl. a tanker aircraft for inflight refuelling) or AI carriers.
But if you don't use it, it doesn't change the behavior of basic Rel2.

Rob

PS: It's just a rework of the addon I made for Rel1 of this MV22B, which many people seem to like...

[menef]

In FSX Gold everything works ( CTRL+U / double J ) and the rope is deploied, for sure I've lost some steps along the way of this thread, but WHAT OBJECTS LIFT??? Are there some loads to download ?
Can someone explain me how it works? Thanks in advice

[gray eagle]

Interesting Video, watching the plane transform from full folded to start up mode.

[gray eagle]

I must apologize , I found some faults in the VMM365 Blue Knights repaint. I got the Marines color wrong and the 00 numbers on the fuselage wrong. The colors are supposed to Blue not Black. Im making the changes now and will up load the new files this week .

Bill

Like this one?




Bill,
There is link to some low rez paints of VMM-365
https://www.flickr.com/photos/sonica...80350046/?rb=1

[PhantomTweak]

In FSX Gold everything works ( CTRL+U / double J ) and the rope is deploied, for sure I've lost some steps along the way of this thread, but WHAT OBJECTS LIFT??? Are there some loads to download ?
Can someone explain me how it works? Thanks in advice

Do a search in this thread for Sling Loads, or Hoist loads. I know I've put up links on where to download them, mostly from Hovercontrol.com .
Also, I'm sure I've done rundowns on how-to pick up, place, and so on.

I'm not going over it again, unless I have to
If you can't find what's already been posted, let me know, I'll walk you through it.
Pat☺

[gray eagle]

I installed the change (Addons) and now I am unable to do a vtol. It will zoom forward and eventually, will have lift. But for some reason, I can't seem to get the thing to do a vtol.
I have in the past. I'll keep trying to see if I can get lucky and manage a vtol.


Edit: the nacelles are at full 90 degrees up. I can only get a forward movement and no lift TO like I use to.

[menef]

Do a search in this thread for Sling Loads, or Hoist loads. I know I've put up links on where to download them, mostly from Hovercontrol.com .
Also, I'm sure I've done rundowns on how-to pick up, place, and so on.

I'm not going over it again, unless I have to
If you can't find what's already been posted, let me know, I'll walk you through it.
Pat☺

THANK YOU, Pat, I'll do