Aeroplaneheaven Helldiver Released!

[txnetcop]

Baz I truly hope you will reconsider your decision to leave. All of us realize that our gripes belong on your email not a public forum but we tend to forget because this is home to us and to you developers. Please reconsider. You and all the developers, repainters, etc are our family and it would be tragic to lose you over this misunderstanding.
Ted

[big-mike]

Baz I truly hope you will reconsider your decision to leave. All of us realize that our gripes belong on your email not a public forum but we tend to forget because this is home to us and to you developers. Please reconsider. You and all the developers, repainters, etc are our family and it would be tragic to lose you over this misunderstanding.
Ted

+1!
Don`t leave us alone here,Bazz!
We all appreciate your work.
Mike

[hairyspin]

...you're letting the good guys suffer over the actions of a few that don't understand how things work, that can't be right surely?

I am deeply disappointed that after knowing each other for so many years, you all feel unable to talk to me directly. Only one person, who will remain nameless has done so and we are resolving the issue. All you had to do was contact us at our help desk or email me personally. A fix will be available this coming week after working on the effect issue.

As a result...

Baz makes an important point which has not been answered: those who have problems or complaints with the Helldiver have apparently been unwilling to contact him in person. This is Sim-Outhouse and we welcome users and developers alike who wish to talk about our hobby, but this is not anyone's official support forum, especially for developers who already provide a way to contact them and raise support issues directly.

We're not a bunch of noobs who arrived last week, and I include those who have issues with this model. Please continue to treat users and developers with courtesy and respect. At least Baz was prepared to discuss his model here: other developers deliberately ignore all complaints in these pages and only deal with those which come through their own support channel (whatever that might be). Or ignore them entirely. Their decisions are outwith this site's control.

The answer is in your hands, gentlemen: treat people with courtesy so they'll stay part of our hobby, or give 'em hell and watch them walk.

[Duckie]

First, let me point out that I rarely comment on issues such as these and I probably should abstain here, but... I (and possible others) have been placed into (in my opinion) an undeserving category of "...a few that don't understand how things work," and "...a bunch of noobs who arrived last week." Furthermore, there is no intent in the following to insult, run down, disrespect or otherwise inflame any individual, group, company, or product.

I truly do not understand the dust up here. Members of this forum were discussing an issue concerning a bit of the hobby, even though a recently released commercial bit, nonetheless a bit. I visit this forum several times a day for information and relaxation. I don't know how many of you have actually visited a commercial support forum/facebook or e-mail, out of necessity, only to have to wait days, if not weeks, for a response, if one comes at all. I have. I do not visit commercial vendor web sites regularly, and when I do it is usually to review or purchase one of their products.

Hence, this forum is my "GO TO" place to, among other things, see if there are any issues being experienced by others that I may also have. For me, my first thought is that I, that's ME, MYSELF and I, may have done something wrong (installed incorrectly or incompletely, omitted or committed an operational error, etc). Members here are very generous with their help, with a wide range of topics and experience, and I almost always can count on at least being pointed in the right direction if not given an out right FIX on the spot. And, to be sure, sometimes the answer from an SOH member is to contact the product support forum! It beats the heck out of waiting days for a support forum answer, that may or may not come, for what I could have received in hours, oft times in minutes, from an experienced and knowledgeable fellow forum member.

Originally posted by bazzar 4/20/2017, 17:19

To get the other effects would probably need another set of models. We have chosen to build for DX10 and P3D as we believe most people, with the advanced add-ons, especially in scenery, are using DX10. All that is required is to turn on the preview before flying.

Originally posted by bazzar 4/20/2017, 17:53

Well, it's been the same since we launched version 1. A note to our help desk often is a good idea.

Now to me, and only me, it is my perception that bazzar's comments after these statements are contradictory, although he does suggest in his second comment to drop a note to support. These comments say to me that that's the way we built the model. It is intentional and meant to meet their perception of what our state of technology should be. I personally do not have a problem at all with the developer's choice or right to do this, other than to say I wish my system would run it but it won't, so why would I buy it? This would not be the first product, or the last, that fit that description for me and my system.

Also, I'm not sure I would have reacted in the exact manner as a couple members did, but I saw nothing disrespectful to bazzar or the product in their responses. If anything, it demonstrated their disappointment in not being able to use the product with their system. They already demonstrated their acceptance of the subject with their wallets. It was only after they shelled out for the product did they find out, via THIS FORUM, that the product was not produced for their setup.

I would also respectfully disagree (if that's OK?) with Tom that anyone was treating anyone else disrespectfully or giving anyone else HELL in this instance. If we are not adult enough to be able to respectfully discuss, share an opinion, disagree or be disagreed with, and if we can't come to this place to get information and assistance from like minded folks who enjoy the same hobby, then what's the point to any of this. Are we to become one large mutual admiration society who gather once a day to sing KUMBAYA at the appointed time?

A sad state of affairs is all of this. I'm sorry bazzar felt he had to leave, I hope he rejoins us. I'm sorry that at least one member has decided to withhold his talent on this subject, I hope he will reconsider. They will be missed. However, I don't think SOH or the hobby will fold without them. It maybe poorer, for their absence of their experience, but only for a while.

With all due respect, I think it's time we put on our "Big Boy" pants and got on with enjoying our HOBBY!

Personally, with the announcement that a DX9 update to be forth coming for the product at hand, I plan on keeping the Aeroplane Heaven model, and I will not withhold any of my repaints. I will be repainting it for my own personal enjoyment and sharing them with anyone else who would like a copy of whatever I decide to paint.

Respectfully,

Steve

[Roger]

Steve, a thoughtful and interesting read and I thank you for your post. I am hopeful that normal service will be resumed as soon as possible. In the meanwhile please post as soon as the Dx9 models are available and let's see some screenshots

[edakridge]

Duckie, Wow that is about as long winded as I have ever seen you get. LOL But, I agree with your sentiments wholeheartedly! We all need to remember that this Hobby and that developers need to continuously "Push the Envelope" with their products or nothing improves. We have all (Me,Myself,I) become spoiled by the excellent quality of Flight Sim addons available. I do agree with one post that it would have been proper to announce in the "System Requirement" that the product was incompatible with DX9. This forum has for me always been a place to come for information or news and possibly to pass some on. Maybe Baz was a little defensive or flippant with his posts, but we all must realize that developers are proud of their work and are bound to be defensive when criticized. The most important thing is that they will produce a patch or hotfix for those customers who are running "Stock" FSX.

[Roger]

Ok let's let this lie now. When Baz releases the Dx9 models let's have renewed enthusiasm and plenty more screenshots and repaints. I don't want to close the thread but I will if we keep scratching the itch. Tempers and ill feeling need to subside asap.

[THibben]

"I would also respectfully disagree (if that's OK?) with Tom that anyone was treating anyone else disrespectfully or giving anyone else HELL in this instance. If we are not adult enough to be able to respectfully discuss, share an opinion, disagree or be disagreed with, and if we can't come to this place to get information and assistance from like minded folks who enjoy the same hobby, then what's the point to any of this. Are we to become one large mutual admiration society who gather once a day to sing KUMBAYA at the appointed time?"

Steve,

I have no problem with you disagreeing. But if you are going to disagree please don't quote me as saying something that I didn't. I didn't use the word disrespectfully or HELL.

Tom

[Roger]

"I would also respectfully disagree (if that's OK?) with Tom that anyone was treating anyone else disrespectfully or giving anyone else HELL in this instance. If we are not adult enough to be able to respectfully discuss, share an opinion, disagree or be disagreed with, and if we can't come to this place to get information and assistance from like minded folks who enjoy the same hobby, then what's the point to any of this. Are we to become one large mutual admiration society who gather once a day to sing KUMBAYA at the appointed time?"

Steve,

I have no problem with you disagreeing. But if you are going to disagree please don't quote me as saying something that I didn't. I didn't use the word disrespectfully or HELL.

Tom

Tom, let's leave it now, please.

[jankees]

Tell you what, it will be my last

..for now, I'm leaving on a fieldtrip tomorrow with a bus full of students..

[Roger]

..for now, I'm leaving on a fieldtrip tomorrow with a bus full of students..

Have a good trip Jan Kees and hopefully there will be more repaints when you return!

[heywooood]

these idiotic conflicts are discouraging. There is a proper way to address issues with a developer. Let the record show that this was not it...again.

[DaveB]

A good post Steve and one I prescribe 100% to.

With the entire content of that post to the fore.. I actually didn't 'pull the refund trigger' immediately. I got in touch with JF (my vendor) explaining the situation with the 2C asking if they could ascertain if a DX9 version was on the cards and if not.. I'd be asking for a refund. I don't see anything wrong with that. They got back sharpish saying that they didn't know so under the circumstances, gave me an immediate refund adding that should one ever appear, then I could buy it again. Fairy snuff. There was no suggestion at that time that a DX9 version 'might' be on the cards.. not even a hint. What has pee'd me off more are the remarks made on this thread since but that's something for another day

ATB
DaveB

[spotlope]

I guess that I'm the only one that flew in SB2C's in the forum
I'm now 88 years old. I'm blind in one eye and have only 35% in the other eye. So reluctantly I had to give up FSX.
About 17 years ago, I sent everything I had on Helldivers to some guy in South America. I guess he was too busy o make the model. I never heard from him again.
Now I saw some of the pictures taken of the Airplane Heavens aircraft. I know that they were taken from my pictures I sent the guy. There is something missing. I'm the only one that can know what it is cause I removed it.
The only criticism is the armor setting on the guns. They were chucked out right away. he stenciling is pretty heavy. It looks like it just came from A&R Other than that it looks like a Helldiver to me. I'd love to see one made up aboard the USS Leyte. my old ship.
Sorry for the poor spelling. But it's the best I can do.

Great to hear you're still kicking, Bob! I was wondering how long it would take for "Helldiver" to weigh in on the Helldiver. I have nothing of any substance to add, other than howdy!

-Bill Womack

[SSI01]

First, let me point out that I rarely comment on issues such as these and I probably should abstain here, but... I (and possible others) have been placed into (in my opinion) an undeserving category of "...a few that don't understand how things work," and "...a bunch of noobs who arrived last week." Furthermore, there is no intent in the following to insult, run down, disrespect or otherwise inflame any individual, group, company, or product.

I truly do not understand the dust up here. Members of this forum were discussing an issue concerning a bit of the hobby, even though a recently released commercial bit, nonetheless a bit. I visit this forum several times a day for information and relaxation. I don't know how many of you have actually visited a commercial support forum/facebook or e-mail, out of necessity, only to have to wait days, if not weeks, for a response, if one comes at all. I have. I do not visit commercial vendor web sites regularly, and when I do it is usually to review or purchase one of their products.

Hence, this forum is my "GO TO" place to, among other things, see if there are any issues being experienced by others that I may also have. For me, my first thought is that I, that's ME, MYSELF and I, may have done something wrong (installed incorrectly or incompletely, omitted or committed an operational error, etc). Members here are very generous with their help, with a wide range of topics and experience, and I almost always can count on at least being pointed in the right direction if not given an out right FIX on the spot. And, to be sure, sometimes the answer from an SOH member is to contact the product support forum! It beats the heck out of waiting days for a support forum answer, that may or may not come, for what I could have received in hours, oft times in minutes, from an experienced and knowledgeable fellow forum member.

Originally posted by bazzar 4/20/2017, 17:19

To get the other effects would probably need another set of models. We have chosen to build for DX10 and P3D as we believe most people, with the advanced add-ons, especially in scenery, are using DX10. All that is required is to turn on the preview before flying.

Originally posted by bazzar 4/20/2017, 17:53

Well, it's been the same since we launched version 1. A note to our help desk often is a good idea.

Now to me, and only me, it is my perception that bazzar's comments after these statements are contradictory, although he does suggest in his second comment to drop a note to support. These comments say to me that that's the way we built the model. It is intentional and meant to meet their perception of what our state of technology should be. I personally do not have a problem at all with the developer's choice or right to do this, other than to say I wish my system would run it but it won't, so why would I buy it? This would not be the first product, or the last, that fit that description for me and my system.

Also, I'm not sure I would have reacted in the exact manner as a couple members did, but I saw nothing disrespectful to bazzar or the product in their responses. If anything, it demonstrated their disappointment in not being able to use the product with their system. They already demonstrated their acceptance of the subject with their wallets. It was only after they shelled out for the product did they find out, via THIS FORUM, that the product was not produced for their setup.

I would also respectfully disagree (if that's OK?) with Tom that anyone was treating anyone else disrespectfully or giving anyone else HELL in this instance. If we are not adult enough to be able to respectfully discuss, share an opinion, disagree or be disagreed with, and if we can't come to this place to get information and assistance from like minded folks who enjoy the same hobby, then what's the point to any of this. Are we to become one large mutual admiration society who gather once a day to sing KUMBAYA at the appointed time?

A sad state of affairs is all of this. I'm sorry bazzar felt he had to leave, I hope he rejoins us. I'm sorry that at least one member has decided to withhold his talent on this subject, I hope he will reconsider. They will be missed. However, I don't think SOH or the hobby will fold without them. It maybe poorer, for their absence of their experience, but only for a while.

With all due respect, I think it's time we put on our "Big Boy" pants and got on with enjoying our HOBBY!

Personally, with the announcement that a DX9 update to be forth coming for the product at hand, I plan on keeping the Aeroplane Heaven model, and I will not withhold any of my repaints. I will be repainting it for my own personal enjoyment and sharing them with anyone else who would like a copy of whatever I decide to paint.

Respectfully,

Steve

Whew! Never seen you post so many words all at once!!

Just letting you know I for one will be watching for the repaints when you're ready to release. Developers, painters, all of you - I am in awe of your efforts, I can't draw a straight line - essential tremor makes me a great drink mixer but a lousy painter. Thanks for your efforts, Duckie!

[Duckie]

Whew! Never seen you post so many words all at once!!

Just letting you know I for one will be watching for the repaints when you're ready to release. Developers, painters, all of you - I am in awe of your efforts, I can't draw a straight line - essential tremor makes me a great drink mixer but a lousy painter. Thanks for your efforts, Duckie!

LOL! I've now retreated back to my cave. Thanks for your kind words, SSI01. Already back to having fun with my HOBBY!

Cheers,

Steve

[roger-wilco-66]

[...]

Developers, painters, all of you - I am in awe of your efforts, I can't draw a straight line - essential tremor makes me a great drink mixer but a lousy painter.

[...]

Cheers to that. I had the urge to chime in on the ongoings here and then. At the end - let's move on. And to Baz: please stay. I think your presence here is highly welcomed.



Cheers,
Mark

[TuFun]

Wow! And here I had a great day at the aircraft and car show today! And look what I see back there.

[Duckie]

Wow! And here I had a great day at the aircraft and car show today! And look what I see back there.

Now that's the way to host a car show!

[AussieMan]

A lot of the complaining and acrimony could have been avoided if people had gone into their FSX settings and turned on the DX10 Preview. Yes I know it only works for native FSX aircraft but isn't that what the Helldiver is?

[TuFun]

Now that's the way to host a car show!

Yep, and saw the C-46 thinking about AH's model.

[Paul K]

A lot of the complaining and acrimony could have been avoided if people had gone into their FSX settings and turned on the DX10 Preview. Yes I know it only works for native FSX aircraft but isn't that what the Helldiver is?

Do you not think that 'a lot of complaining and acrimony could have been avoided' if A.H. had mentioned DX10 in the system requirements at the point of sale, as is customary ? DX10 preview can cause severe flickering in some scenery add-ons, as mentioned earlier in this thread. From personal experience, one example is VFR London, which suffers the problem around the Millennium Dome in Greenwich.

To others reading this thread - Just for the record, I really like the Helldiver, but I'm flying it in P3D v3 and so no glass problem. I hope A.H. fix the DX9 issue soon, because this is a fine model of a very interesting aircraft, and deserves to be a success for them.

[YoYo]

FYI:

For those having problems with DX9, Rescue is on the way!A free livery comes with the SPV1.2 which we will uploading tomorrow. This is an SB2C-4 out of the NAS Kaneohe Rescue Unit in Hawaii.
The SP contains the fix for DX9 glass issues, revised textures for RN4L and NAMU schemes and this new livery. It is a full build and will require a re-install. There will be a separate installer for DX9 models which those users will need to overwrite the relevant models once the base FSX installer has done its job. Full instructions will come with the installers.

[Paul K]

Well, the real Helldiver got off to a difficult start in life, so A.H. are to be congratulated for adding that aspect into their model. Call it immersion.

Nice to see the problem fixed so quickly - which is not something you can say of every payware developer.

[jeansy]

A lot of the complaining and acrimony could have been avoided if people had gone into their FSX settings and turned on the DX10 Preview. Yes I know it only works for native FSX aircraft but isn't that what the Helldiver is?

Its not that easy for some

Pat it all depends on the GPU, not all GPUs support DX10, however some cant afford the upgrades

its a double edge sword, I still recall the the numbers of upset developers regarding the lack of backwards ability when FSX started, its a bit ironic some developers are doing the same now

anyway I do feel for the DX9 guys, it took me a long time to upgrade my PC to support greater than DX9

however developers pick and choose what they want to do, however they should stand by their convictions if it back fires, some do some dont, some stay and learn while some run away

at the end of the consumers have a great memory