F-94B Starfire

[jamminjames]

I flew this last night and it flies alright to me. Would love to see some paints!

[Mick]

Well, if it comes to that, I think we can make some decent looking bare metal textures without a reflective model.

But the original T-33 model is reflective and the VC is not, so that must mean that there's hope of making the F-94 reflective too.
I'll be able to use those most excellent reflective base textures.

[l'iguane]

Hello Allen,

Thanks or this update

One thought :

"The collision bubble is what is used to know if you crashed into an object or aircraft. The smaller the collision bubble is the closer you can get to something"

The "This file cannot be run in DOS mode" is done as I adjusted the collision bubble with Ivan Hsu MDLC.


As far as I understand, would it be possible to go back to the original "collision bubble" set up, or no collision at all. Should this be done, I think the MDL could be read on MDLMAT (We would not get the "this programm is unable to run on DOS mode") and that would solve our issue


L'iguane

[Mach3DS]

I DEFINITELY would like the source and will give all credit to piglet! Thank you!

I worked the T-33X package with 2 other guys and made it native P3D. This would be on the same scale I think. And we would include tacpack as well.

[Desert Rat]

The interior of the VC glass shares a material with the rest of the VC model, this is not the case with the glass on the rest of the models, it has it's own transparent material. I'm sure you knew this though. You thus cannot add reflection to the VC model as the Alpha channel used for that is actually needed to provide the transparency instead.

Options are:

1. remove the reflection from the VC only. trial and error hex editing/scasm editing, long winded and time consuming.
2. Ask Allen nicely to assign the same glass material to the interior of the VC glass as the rest of the models glass. Easiest option.
3. Ask me to try and hex edit the model to do the same as above, considerably more complicated and you'd have to wait as I'm not set up entirely on my new computer.

regards,
Jamie

[Allen]

L'iguane
The model I put in my last post I did NOT use Ivan Hsu MDLC to adjusted the collision.

000rick000
Can you PM me and email and I will send you the model.

JDTinballs
The VC glass is to its own texture. Why it when white I have no idea check the model I put in my last post. Maybe a older model slipped got into the F-94B I uploaded by mistake. The one I attached dose have 1% transparent by Material settings.

[Desert Rat]

Okay, what is needed is to apply reflection to all the textures used in the VC bar the panel gauge planes and the glass bitmap (t33_glass.bmp?).

Thanks Allen.

L'iguane, are you able to do this? I do not have the relevant tools installed at the moment and not even sure if they work on W10 yet.

If not I'll look into it over the next few days.

Jamie

[l'iguane]

Thanks for the update.

I'll ask Mick to turn reflective the updated MDL Allen put on a few post ago, we'll see what comes up when opening it with MDLMAT and I'll keep you posted about the results.

I did a trial livery on the "old" model...starting to look good still have a few adjustment to do, but the bare metal template are almost ready !



Thanks again JDTinballs & Allen for your attentive help !

L'iguane

[Allen]

JDTinballs
No idea how to add reflection or shine in gMax. I'm from CFS2. True reflection maps are not supported and the need for shine in CFS2 is low and if needed was done in Mk MDLC. I'm still rebuilding my self. My XP is all but dead by failing HDD. Not sure if I can afford a new HDD and if it is really worth it as I have all of my needed tools working on Win7. Got MDLC back up with DOSBox.

l'iguane
I think the model that is currently in the Warbirds Library for download may have a VC canopy missing 1% transparent by material settings. I fought with this a half a dozen times when building the model. I know the one I posted in the thread has the 1% transparent by material settings.

[Thudman]

Allen

I had the same issue with VC canopy in the source model that you sent me. I just swapped it out with an external canopy and everything worked.

[Allen]

Thudman
Most of the time I don't use glass in the VC and never have had glass that uses an alpha layer. I have no prob dumping it my self as the VC glass is a pain in the . Was trying to stay true to the T-33A model.

[Scale Dail]

Sorry it's an IPhone pic of the screen. Sure it flies just like a T-33! Which it is not. I'm making progress but testing in real time. Making small changes, shooting for F-94B. I just saved my flight Edwards AFB to Kirtland AFB. Tanks should be nearing empty if I have the fuel draw right. Should be able to hit upper 40,000's when I get light. Back to it! FSX is the dark side won't touch it!

[Allen]

I tried messing with the shine with in gMax. I can not find any docs from MS on how this really works. All I found was a pic in the gmaxAircraftCreation.doc with no text on how the setting work.

[Mick]

Allen, Please pardon me if I'm being too pedantic here, but I know you're mostly a CFS2 guy...

You may already know this, but in case you don't, there are two fundamentally different kinds of "shiny" in FS9.

One is specular gloss. It gives the plane a glossy surface that can be adjusted to anywhere from dead flat up through super glossy. This produces the kind of shine seen in glossy paint like you'd see on a car. It looks shiny but not metallic at all.

The other is reflection, and it produces a very different-looking metallic shine like the shine seen on natural metal surfaces. This can be adjusted too, to produce looks ranging from a slightly weathered but still metallic sheen to a highly polished mirror-like finish. Metallic reflectivity is what we need for those natural metal nifty fifties Air Force planes.

A model can have specular gloss and have reflections enabled at the same time, but for the present project all we need is reflection. In fact, the presence of more than a little specular gloss can spoil the effect of reflectivity.

Specular gloss doesn't affect anything else. Whether or not reflection is enabled does affect something else, the textures. When reflection is enabled, the alpha channel in the textures controls how shiny the finish will be, from no shine at all through a mirror finish. When reflection is not enabled, the alpha channel controls transparency, ranging from totally opaque through completely transparent.

The issue we have here happens when reflection is enabled and the VC becomes reflective as well as the external parts of the model. It doesn't happen with all models. Since the original T-33 is reflective and the VC isn't affected, it would seem that it must be possible to make the F-94 reflective without affecting the VC. It just takes someone much smarter than me to figure out how to do it.

I mention all this because I have the idea that CFS-2 doesn't present you with these choices, so I thought you might not be up to speed on them. I hope this helps.

[Mick]

Thanks for the update.

I'll ask Mick to turn reflective the updated MDL ...

Done, and sent to you a little while ago.

Great paint job! I recognize the 59th FIS livery that graces the box top of the Heller 1/72 plastic kit and the built up model on my shelf. I was hoping you'd paint that one because I really like it, and it might be a bit beyond my skill level to do it so well.

[l'iguane]

The CFS2 model turned reflective by Mick is now FIXED !

I fixed the VC following the usual process then reworked the canopy with MDLMAT to make it transparent on VC view.

New MDL attached


Cheers

L'iguane

[Mick]

Woo-HOOO !!!!!

[l'iguane]

Hi everyone,

I just uploaded a starter pack for the F-94, including one livery from the 59th FIS, USAF as well as a set of templates/Alpha so more liveries can be done.
FS2004 military skin - cold war repertory

I may paint some more but I'm already on a schedule for completing the L-29 pack asap.

Cheers
L'iguane

[Mick]

We now have a model with reflections enabled and a beautiful skin for it, plus a bare metal texture set for us to paint on.

A little bird tells me that there's an updated flight model almost ready, and a new panel.cfg that will add an automatic afterburner gauge.

When all the bits are ready, they should all be put together to make an F-94B Version 2.

[Allen]

Glad to see things are making since and working out now.

Mick
The lack of doc about the material settings to add shine is not funny. Us CFS2er have always used MK MDLC for this. I do know about shine being done by texture but never done it as it isn't supported in CFS2.

Yes a F-94B Version 2 would be good!

[Mach3DS]

Thanks Allen!

exported to P3D...skin is placeholder for testing purposes only...a real one will be developed...bumps added and specular.

[Mick]

...Mick, The lack of doc about the material settings to add shine is not funny. Us CFS2er have always used MK MDLC for this. I do know about shine being done by texture but never done it as it isn't supported in CFS2...

Well, I just think it's great to see folks from the CFS2 and FS9 communities working together. As for reflectivity in the textures, it's easy enough for a painter once they know how. All the FS9 modeler has to know is how to enable reflections, which isn't a CFS2 feature, and let the painters go at it from there. It's possible to depict silver finishes without reflection, though it has given me fits trying to depict silver paint, but for shiny natural metal, reflection can't be beat.

I can't wait to get my hands on l'Iguane's bare metal template, and his beautiful 59th FIS skin!

I know that there's a flight model being finished up that makes the plane faster than a T-33 and 'struggles to reach 42,000 feet" which sounds just about right for a plane with a nominal service ceiling of 42,750 feet. We should see that flight model posted soon if I can encourage the person who enhanced it that it's worth posting.

I'm told that someone else has been recruited to work on an automatic afterburner effect that will turn on when the throttle is fully opened and shut off when it's pulled back. If that can't be arranged, there is a manually triggered effect available.

I don't know anywhere but SOH where something could come together like this!

[l'iguane]

I don't know anywhere but SOH where something could come together like this!

I couldn't agree more many thanks to Allen and ScaleDail, seems this project got bigger than expected
Rick's plans about a portover and full P3D reworking sound like high potential too !

L'iguane

[Mick]

One done, many more to go!

61st FIS, Selfridge AFB, 1951

Opinions please - should it be shinier?

[Scale Dail]

The wheels of progress are turning! Slipping in the mud that is! I've been quietly tweeking air files for years and never uploaded anything before, but us old school simmers have to stick together!
I have a flight model that pretty much matches the real world numbers. But I'm still trying to get the takeoff and landing characteristics a little closer. The most challenging is to slow the take off acceleration and still get the top speed and altitude numbers. My afterburner light effect is borrowed from the old Alphasim F11F Tiger and it is taxi light activated.