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Thread: Martin Marauder on the Burner

  1. #101
    Okay, finally got all the tweaks done and ready to move forward ....
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails HOMEUNIT-2017-feb-16-012.jpg  
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  2. #102
    I am seriously excited to see the amazing progress, and to imagine just how far this "Marvelous Marauder" is going to go?!?!?!?!

  3. #103
    Quote Originally Posted by MustangL2W View Post
    I am seriously excited to see the amazing progress, and to imagine just how far this "Marvelous Marauder" is going to go?!?!?!?!
    Me too Mustang :-) Thanks

    Just finished building the prop blades, hub, and collars from scratch to get the perfect shapes this aircraft requires. Looks sweet in the sim and gmax.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails HOMEUNIT-2017-feb-16-002.jpg   HOMEUNIT-2017-feb-16-001.jpg  
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  4. #104
    Looks great with the new props. Looks a bit funny floating in mid air with no gear though!

    I found some more Marauder performance information, don't know if you have seen this. http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/B-26/B-26.html

    I noticed in the photo of the Marauder in the link above that the engines and nacelles are streamlined a bit more and are angled up a little more than what you've modelled. The side on profile photo gives a good view.
    Mark

  5. #105
    Looks amazing Milton!

  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by mrogers View Post
    Looks great with the new props. Looks a bit funny floating in mid air with no gear though!

    I found some more Marauder performance information, don't know if you have seen this. http://www.wwiiaircraftperformance.org/B-26/B-26.html

    I noticed in the photo of the Marauder in the link above that the engines and nacelles are streamlined a bit more and are angled up a little more than what you've modelled. The side on profile photo gives a good view.
    mrogers, that's a great site with performance information; I had not seen that. Ever who does the flight model, no excuses now for not getting it right. :-) Thank you.

    RE: engines - dang! I have around 55-60 hours in those engines so far trying to get them right. Your side view is a little mis-leading as is the one I posted above. I attach here my 3-view and picture references and since you have a good eye for these things, tell me specifically how far off I am and what needs to change.

    Re: Floating in mid-air? Sir, I assure you that there are gear beneath those nacelles. You can see the evidence of that as you taxi across the ground, land a little hard, or clip a taxiway sign. That's my new stealth gear. :-)
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails volet_refroi_moteur.jpg   Martin_B-26G_in_Dayton.jpg   slider_img3.jpg   B_26.jpg   b-26.jpg   B-261.jpg  

    B-262.jpg   b26-05a.jpg  
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  7. #107

    Wing incidence

    The picture of the b-26 on the ground looks like one of the later ones with the 3.5' increase in wing incidence. So I guess it all depends on which one you're doing. It still looks very good to me, even with stealth gear.
    BUD

  8. #108
    Quote Originally Posted by BUDSCH View Post
    The picture of the b-26 on the ground looks like one of the later ones with the 3.5' increase in wing incidence. So I guess it all depends on which one you're doing. It still looks very good to me, even with stealth gear.
    BUD
    Hi Bud,

    Actually the aircraft shown is a B-26B-50-MA serial # 4-295897 built in Baltimore. The wing incidence changed with the F model B-26F-1-MA starting serial # 4-296229.

    I think mrogers is correct in that the engine seems maybe 2-3" low on the wing leading edge or the nacelle shape is a little low.

    EDIT: Also, the engine is canted up 1.3 degrees per the specs but I have not yet done that as it makes modeling more difficult. I usually do that after everything is done.
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  9. #109
    Hi,
    The stealth gear adds that little je-ne-sais-quoi to this wonderful aircraft. It looks to be coming along beautifully.........what we can see of it , anyway.

    Andy.

  10. #110
    From what I can see the two upper intakes on the cowls are further back on your model than the photos of r/l you show. In the photos the intakes come as far forward as the front of the cowl ring with a more pronounced inward curve at the front end?

    looking amazing btw.

    Jamie

  11. #111
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
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    The model looks really great so far Milton! Did I understand you correctly that the external model from the versions B-26B-55 thru B-26C 45/55 and the Marauder II is the same? Is this also applicable for the panels and riveting?

    I'm trying to find some good drawings. Panel lines isn't an issue bit most drawing I have do not show much details on rivering.

    Cheers,
    Huub

  12. #112
    Senior Administrator Willy's Avatar
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    Huub, for me at least it's hard to find good references on the rivets on large aircraft. When I was painting those B307 Stratoliners a few months back, I used what I could find and made "educated guesses" on the rest. I had to do something to give the rivet counters something to do!
    ENC(SW) US Navy Retired.

  13. #113
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post
    The model looks really great so far Milton! Did I understand you correctly that the external model from the versions B-26B-55 thru B-26C 45/55 and the Marauder II is the same? Is this also applicable for the panels and riveting?

    I'm trying to find some good drawings. Panel lines isn't an issue bit most drawing I have do not show much details on rivering.

    Cheers,
    Huub
    Huub, I have these drawings that show rivets. If you would like them, Pm me your email address and I will send them to you in their original size.


    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Osprey - Combat Aircraft 002 - B-26 Marauder Units of the Eighth and Ninth Air Forces-91.jpg   Osprey - Combat Aircraft 002 - B-26 Marauder Units of the Eighth and Ninth Air Forces-92.jpg  

  14. #114
    Quote Originally Posted by Willy View Post
    Huub, for me at least it's hard to find good references on the rivets on large aircraft. When I was painting those B307 Stratoliners a few months back, I used what I could find and made "educated guesses" on the rest. I had to do something to give the rivet counters something to do!
    FWIW most aeroplanes are riveted with 1/8" or 5/32" diameter (D) rivets pitched at 4xD in the row and 2.5xD from a panel edge. IE 1/2" apart for 1/8 rivets... correctly formed the 4 x D spacing gives a watertight joint... ( I have to know all this stuff for work )

    ttfn

    Pete

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by huub vink View Post
    The model looks really great so far Milton! Did I understand you correctly that the external model from the versions B-26B-55 thru B-26C 45/55 and the Marauder II is the same? Is this also applicable for the panels and riveting?

    I'm trying to find some good drawings. Panel lines isn't an issue bit most drawing I have do not show much details on rivering.

    Cheers,
    Huub
    Huub, basically, any model after either the A-26B-10 or C-10 (longer wings, larger tail) and same general rear gunner's position design (after b/c-20). This would include the Marauder II.

    See HERE

    The changes really started at this model:

    B-26C-5-MO

    (175 built)

    41-34673 to 41-34847
    To decrease wing loading, Martin was directed to increase wing area to 713 sq. ft. by broadening the chord and lengthening span to 71 feet. This reduced wing loading to a safer 51.5 lbs./sq. ft. However, increased weight and drag reduced the "long wing" Marauder's maximum speed to about 282 mph at 15,000, and cruising speed to 214 mph. With a load of 4,000 lbs. of bombs and 962 gallons of fuel (no bomb bay tanks), the "long wing" had an operating range of about 550 miles.

    Marauders built at Omaha were now to have the suffix "MO", and the original B-26Cs from the Nebraska plant were subsequently redesignated B -26C-05-MOs. Other significant modifications included:

    • A larger vertical larger tail;
    • Overall, the plane was increased to 58 feet,3 inches long, and height to 21 feet, 6 inches;
    • Due to the larger and heavier wing and tail assembly, and additional armament and armor, weight increased by 1,500 lbs. to 26,300 pounds basic, 31,200 lbs. normal (DGW) and 37,000 lbs. loaded;
    • The 47 inch main gear tires were reaplaced with 50-inch versions on a larger wheel, requiring the addition of a streamlined bulge to the gear doors for clearance;
    • An improved hydraulic system;
    • Exhaust stack flame dampers;
    • 200 amp generators (up from 100);
    • Shorter co-pilot's seat to provide easier access to the nose compartment;
    • B-26B-1 gunnery armament and B-26B-4 forward-firing, blister-mounted guns made standard;
    • The waist gun doors were enlarged and moved one station aft to improve downward and forward angle of fire. They were slid up and locked open before firing;
    • A large circular window, replacing the two previous smaller ones, was added above each waist door to provide better visibility for the gunners;
    • The bomb bay racks and hoisting equipment were improved;
    • The Bombardiers' station was improved and the optically flat glass In the lower nose enlarged and elongated to provide a better view during the target run.
    • From the 61st aircraft of this model onwards, the nose and main gear doors closed when the gear was fully extended (to reduce drag).
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails profiles.jpg  
    Milton Shupe
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    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  16. #116
    I will be focused on the annual RTWR until Monday so no updates till then. :-)

    I now have all the still, slow, blurred props functioning well in FS with all newly created parts, 54 parts in total.

    The main gear is next ...
    Milton Shupe
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  17. #117
    Senior Administrator huub vink's Avatar
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    Good luck in the race Milton and I hope that the virtual winds be with your and the whole SOH team!

    RobH, you have a PM. The permission to use these drawings will be highly appreciated.

    Cheers,
    Huub

  18. #118
    I found a story about an aviator being reunited with the plane he flew 70 years before.... a B-26 Marauder. I think it is worth a look for everyone. My only regret is that they didn't and perhaps couldn't take him flying in the aircraft, but he at least got to climb into the cockpit and tell his story. It is amazing to think of all that those folks went through in that war... those experiences should be remembered, and told to future generations. Take a look...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sro3IdjB1Q0

    It is also amazing that, thanks to a man named Milton Shupe and his tireless tenacity for 3-D modeling, we can get to relive those fantastic aircraft in a flight simulator.

    Thank you Milton. Thank you for your countless hours of time that you put into these virtual aircraft, which give us a chance to relive a part of history that might otherwise only be a drawing, and a footnote in a book on a shelf somewhere.

    I had contacted you a few years ago about learning Gmax so I could create a modified A-26 Invader (the OnMark aircraft) and have found that, now you are now posting many wonderful How-To videos on youtube on learning Gmax. With some time and effort, thanks to your videos and your inspiration, I may be able to do just that. To share your hard earned knowledge for free is incredibly selfless and an inspiration to us all. A man's time is finite, and limited. He must decide on how to best use it, and the results usually speak for those efforts. Thank you for all your time and effort, and keep up the great work!

  19. #119
    Quote Originally Posted by mazdarodi View Post
    I found a story about an aviator being reunited with the plane he flew 70 years before.... a B-26 Marauder. I think it is worth a look for everyone. My only regret is that they didn't and perhaps couldn't take him flying in the aircraft, but he at least got to climb into the cockpit and tell his story. It is amazing to think of all that those folks went through in that war... those experiences should be remembered, and told to future generations. Take a look...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sro3IdjB1Q0

    It is also amazing that, thanks to a man named Milton Shupe and his tireless tenacity for 3-D modeling, we can get to relive those fantastic aircraft in a flight simulator.

    Thank you Milton. Thank you for your countless hours of time that you put into these virtual aircraft, which give us a chance to relive a part of history that might otherwise only be a drawing, and a footnote in a book on a shelf somewhere.

    I had contacted you a few years ago about learning Gmax so I could create a modified A-26 Invader (the OnMark aircraft) and have found that, now you are now posting many wonderful How-To videos on youtube on learning Gmax. With some time and effort, thanks to your videos and your inspiration, I may be able to do just that. To share your hard earned knowledge for free is incredibly selfless and an inspiration to us all. A man's time is finite, and limited. He must decide on how to best use it, and the results usually speak for those efforts. Thank you for all your time and effort, and keep up the great work!
    That was a great video Sir; thank you for sharing that.

    As always, thank you for you kind comments. If I can help in any way with your quest, let me know. I will be happy to send to you the gmax source code for any of the A-26B/C variants I have. John Turrell did the B26K variant so I do not have that source. And Real_Old_Salt did the On Mark civvie conversion I think, so I do not have that source.
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  20. #120
    Is this useful?

  21. #121
    Thank you Maty; yes, I have that cut-a-way and refer to it often.

    Now with the annual RTWRace completed, I am easing back into the Marauder. I think before I address the issues/observations above, I will start putting together the components of the flight model and get that ready for the gear build process.
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  22. #122
    Here is a PDF of diagram plans for the Marauder, it's for the earlier B-26/B-26A, but some of it might be applicable to the later B-26B. I found it on B26.com
    Hopefully that may be helpful.

    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails martin.b26.marauder.plans.diagrams.pdf  
    Mark

  23. #123
    Quote Originally Posted by mrogers View Post
    Here is a PDF of diagram plans for the Marauder, it's for the earlier B-26/B-26A, but some of it might be applicable to the later B-26B. I found it on B26.com
    Hopefully that may be helpful.
    Ah yes; I have that one and it has a number I need, the wing root measurement. Problem is the clarity is poor and not sure if it is 160" or 168". I am using 160" or 13.33' as that is what my calcs came up with in gmax when modeling the wing.

    Thanks; I appreciate your help.
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  24. #124
    Well, I am about recovered from the RTWR expedition and have been focused on the Flight Model for the B-26B/C. Got a reasonable starting point in place now after about 35 iterations so I am back to modeling.

    Next up: tweak/adjust cowling/nacelle height, tweak the air intakes, then on to constructing the gear. After that, map the exterior aircraft for textures, then work on the VC.

    Once I have the exterior mapped, I will release a base package for painters to work with (give me about 7-10 days) while I work on the VC and 2D panel/gauges (basic gauge population). After the basic VC and 2D panel is done, I will release my part of the completed project (about 3-4 weeks).

    Remember that my intention is for you to have a hand in completing this project in a community project spirit. That way, you get your hands on it early and evolve it to its completion. Exterior, interior, and panel textures will be yours to evolve, along with sounds, effects, and flight model if you wish.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails WIP.jpg  
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

  25. #125
    Okay, I am finally back into the mesh here and got the air intakes moved forward and blended into the nacelles. I will cant the nacelle up after mapping for textures to address the comment about it the nacelle being low.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails airintakes.jpg  
    Milton Shupe
    FS9 Modeler Hack

    Video Tutorials - Gmax for Beginners My Uploads on SOH

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