Horst Petzschler's Bf109 G10 Yellow 5

[mrogers]

Has anyone made a skin for the Flight Replicas Messerschmitt Bf109 G-10 of Horst Petzschler's G-10 that he flew from Germany to neutral Sweden in 1945? He literally ran out of fuel just as he was coming in to land at Bulltofta airfield and made a deadstick landing.

Link here to a color profile of his 109 and short story
http://luftwaffeinprofile.se/Petzschler.html

[huub vink]

Not that I'm aware off. Its a reasonable standard paint scheme however in one of my PC crashes I have lost the paintkit fot FR Bf109G.

Cheers,
Huub

[SteveB]

I did a copy of 0297, although the colour profiles I worked from where somewhat different too the picture on your link.
Here's the link too download it. https://www.dropbox.com/s/9ru8cbjv29..._0297.zip?dl=0

Steve

[huub vink]

Here you can find the profile again AND the pictures on which the profile was based:

http://www.forcedlandingcollection.s...136-Bf109.html

Cheers,
Huub

[mrogers]

Hey Steve, many thanks for the repaint! Much appreciated. That will do, but should you decide to do another new skin based on my information (and Huub's) , that would be much appreciated too.

Many thanks Huub for the extra link to a profile and photos of the pilot and his Messerschmitt. Shame that you lost the FR paintkit for the G. I'm sure you would have done a great repaint if you still had it.

[SteveB]

I am busy working on some 109 K paint jobs at the moment, I do still have a couple of G10/14's and a bare metal G6 in the shop.
Here is the profile I had for 0297, it was sent me from a friend in Sweden a few years ago.

Steve

[mrogers]

The profile you have is a grey/green camo scheme while other profiles show a dark grey and light grey camo scheme. The rudder is the same across all the profiles though, being grey with green blotches.
Look forward to more of your G/K repaints when they come out SteveB.

[huub vink]

Hi Mark,

Colours are always a good subject for discussions. During the air war over Europe a lot of aircraft crashed over the Netherlands where I live and the are quite some museums where you can find parts form these aircraft which are still in the original colour. However I have noticed that pait changes a lot over the years and I'm convinced that the colours as we see them now are differ quite a bit from the original colours in 1945. There is a Bf109 G6 which has been excavated in two different period. The wings were recovered first and the fuselage nearly 50 years later. The wings are at least 5 shades darker than the paint on the fuselage, which has turned nearly white during the years underground.....

Based on the real painted parts I have seen, I have chosen to use the Classic Hangars paint charts. The grey shades are a but blueish, which seem to come closest to the original parts I have seen. But as said its a choice I made, not based on scientific research, but just on parts I saw, from which I was already certain that the colours had aged for nearly 60 - 70 years already.

At the end of the war the Germans ran out of resources. Therefore you can wonder how close the colours actually used we to the RLM standards. There are a lot of examples where primer (RLM02) was used instead of the standard colour and there are many examples where aircraft were only partially painted, or not painted at all.

So far about the colour. But there is a whole chapter to write about external effects and how they can change the look of colours. Colours look brighter in the sun and darker in the shadow. The material under the paint has an effect on reflection. How glossy is the paint etc.......... There are plenty of examples where shadow ended up as a different shade in a profile.

Profiles from this period are normally based on black and white photos or on early colour pictures. In both cases not very reliable.

Cheers,
Huub

[huub vink]

Steve has offer me his templates, but I also found an nearly 4 year old back-up of the "improved" G6 paintkit I made. I will start on the Petzschler's G10 soonish. But please do not expect very fast results. Real life currently needs a fair bit of time as well.

Cheers,
huub

[mrogers]

Huub, that's great! No hurry, good things take time...thank you. Real life is more important, only when you have time.

I have a book here called Luftwaffe Fighter Aircraft in Profile, by Claes Sundin and Christer Bergstrom, the color profiles were based on the black and white photos they had and they did extensive research on the different shades of dark and grey in the B/w photos to work out/interpret what the colors would have been, or was. In the book the Petzschler G-10 may have been a dark grey/light grey scheme, with a grey/green rudder.

The Australian War Museum has a preserved late war G-6 that still has it's original paint scheme, here's a link to a website that has pictures of it; http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/aircra...morial-487589/

[huub vink]

Weather was not very good in the Netherlands this weekend, so I ended up behind the computer. Which is why I have done more than I expected.

Work in progress as the weathering still need to be applied. (Once airborne its really a nice flyer!)

[txnetcop]

Wow that is one gorgeous 109 Huub! Looking forward to the finished paint product!
Ted

[vonernsk]

Huub,

That is a lovely skin for a late-war 109. You have done a lot of work to get the colours to feel right. Notoriously tricky when there was little colour photography around at that time.

Like you, I really feel that Flight Replicas produced a really accurate and also enjoyable flt model for these 109s.

Look fwd to flying your excellent looking skin.

Weather in N Wales also liquid . . .

Mal

[Desert Rat]

Here you can find the profile again AND the pictures on which the profile was based:

http://www.forcedlandingcollection.s...136-Bf109.html

Cheers,
Huub

By my eyes it still looks green and greyish. The areas just under the windscreen on above the horizontal stabilizers definitely look green. Grabbing the colours from these areas gives RGB @ approx 88,89,75 (taken from under the windscreen). A similar ratio to RLM 71 or 82 depending on how much you darken them. I think the profile shows one of these colours faded out. IMHO of coarse. And the paint looks great BTW.

kind regards,
Jamie

[huub vink]

And a few more. I've made the repaint after the photos as good as I could. Obviously the aircraft received the tail section from another aircraft in a different scheme. The pictures are high contrast as most pictures from that period, therefore I toned the colours down a bit. After all its just a hobby and not scientific research.....

BTW the profile shows the aircraft with a 300 liter drop tank. With the available amount of fuel and due to the fact the battles were fought over Germany, I don't think these droptanks were very often used.

Cheers,
Huub

[Desert Rat]

My thoughts on the colours aside, that looks great Huub, really suits the greys. And I agree, she's a beautiful rendition of the Bf-109.

[Desert Rat]

My only thoughts on the drop tank are that maybe they mounted CAPs of a sort, keep a patrol airborne longer awaiting the enemy, uses less fuel than sending up more aircraft more often?

[mrogers]

That is just gorgeous Huub, great work. The greys does look faded as compared to the high contrast B/W photos of that period...

Meanwhile, the weather here is blue skies....ideal weather for flying on the computer!

Edit; I am just wondering if the fuselage sides were a RLM 02 color underneath the mottling? Just looked at the profile for it in your link from an earlier post and there seems to be a slight greenish tinge.

Edit#2; I think you've got it just right....just looked at the repaint and it's there. Again, looks superb.

[huub vink]

Thanks for the nice comments guys, appreciated! So far I'm pleased with the result as well.

Jamie, there are just too many posibilities. Here you will find a "small" explanation why I came to this choice. The profile issue by Steve is completely different from the profile by Claes Sundin. Nevertheless they are most likely based on the same photographs.....

As the request was more or less to do a repaint similar to the profile by Claes Sundin, I originally thought I would do a standard grey RLM 74/75/76 scheme. Than I decided to change the RLM 75 to a less blue-ish shade of RLM 74 you saw more often in last period of the war (1944/1945). Like on the profile done by Claes Sundin the sides and lower surfaces of the fuselage were painted RLM02 (primer)/alternative RLM76. I left the lower surfaces of the wings and stabilisers mid-war blue RLM 76, although the shade of 76 has changed quite a bit over the years, at least according the experts, most likely due the lack of blue pigment (?) (The same reason is given for the change of RLM 76).

When I look at the original photos from the it could also be that the aircraft was painted RLM74 or RLM75 in combination with RLM82 (grass green) or RLM83 (Dark green) as contrast colour.

As I already said before, I expect the tail section was taken from another aircraft as it is painted in a completely diffrent style. Therefore I painted a part of this section in (a sort of) RLM02 (primer)/alternative RLM76. Claes Sundin uses RLM76 as base colour for the tail section and lower part of the ruddder and so did I. I painted spots of RLM82 over grey shades. Solid RLM74 for the rudder, bit a mixture of RLM74 and RLM75 at the tail as I though they look different on the photo's.

While writing this I'm looking at a RLM colour chart..... it provides me one shade for RLM74, two for RLM75, six for RLM76 (excluding the additional 5 for the unofficial RLM84). There are 3 shades given for RLM81 and the same amount of variations is given for RLM82 and RLM83..... when I see the differences in shades of RLM74 supplied in peace time by Revell, Humbrol (authentic colours!) and Tamiya I can imagine that in wartime Germany, which was short on supplies, the variations in shades was one of their smallest problems.

BTW I always understood that the USAF's olive drab was quite bright green when applied, but became quite brownish after a while.

I can't say which profile is correct and I'm one of the last to say that my repaint is historical correct. But its a mixture of the profile by Claes Sundin and what I thought it could possibly look like.

Cheers,
Huub

[huub vink]

Virtual paint is quite cheap, so I decided to make a green/grey version as well

[mrogers]

That is superb!

This is just a small detail, but I often wonder why the Flight Replicas G-10 doesn't have the morane antenna under the port wing, as most if not all G-10s did.

[huub vink]

Sorry it took this long to finish it, but I hope it is worth the wait.... (at least it is free )

The repaint is available here:
http://www.sim-outhouse.com/sohforum...rst-Petzschler

Enjoy,
Huub

[rgatkinson]

Superb repaint Thanks for sharing your hard work with us - much appreciated.

Taff

[vonernsk]

Huub,

Great work, thanks a lot for your work and effort. As you say, this model has very nice flying characteristics, as well as being the best models of mid to late Me-109s around. Certainly, after almost a decade it is still up there with the rest of the more recent outstanding models for FS2004.

Because of the paucity of good accurate colour photographs of that period and because of the chaos slowly but surely strangling the 3rd Reich in early '45, one can only do what you have done (so well), which is to take an educated guess based on what facts you know.

Thanks again.

Mal

[vonernsk]

Huub,

Just looked at your skin from the outside before t/o and the switch panel on the right side of the cockpit is unpainted. Rob pinpointed the problem in his Me-109 skins, as being within the fuselage 3.bmp texture.

Mal