Thrust Problem with Dino's F14

[martin88]

Hi,

I have a weird problem with Dino´s F14. Yesterday I flew about M 1.5 at 50.000 ft for half an hour. Autothrottle was never activated. When I started descending, I could not lower the thrust anymore. Only thing I was able to switch on and off were my Afterburners. Throttle lever was moving but I could not reduce speed.
This happens to me all the time whne I use the F14. I could not find a solution.

So anybody has an idea? I love this plane and this is the only thing I cant handle

Greetings

[hschuit]

Looks like an AIR file problem with record 1504 (Turbine HiMach CN2 vs throttle & IAP ratio). If Max CN2 >108%, making N2 >108%, engine RPM will hang when throttling back. In the F-14D AIR file, rec 1504 max CN2 is 130%.

[martin88]

Looks like an AIR file problem with record 1504 (Turbine HiMach CN2 vs throttle & IAP ratio). If Max CN2 >108%, making N2 >108%, engine RPM will hang when throttling back. In the F-14D AIR file, rec 1504 max CN2 is 130%.

So what exactly do I have to do?

I did not change anything in the air.file. It has to be a brought error. I am wondering why nobody realized it. Seems I am the first :(

[hschuit]

If you understand AIR files you could try to fix it but engine records are interdependent so changing rec 1504 means you most likely also need to change recs 1502/1503/1506 in order to make sure the thrust envelope/throttle settings in the sim do not get messed up.

[martin88]

If you understand AIR files you could try to fix it but engine records are interdependent so changing rec 1504 means you most likely also need to change recs 1502/1503/1506 in order to make sure the thrust envelope/throttle settings in the sim do not get messed up.

Mh I don´t think I understand enough of that stuff. It´s a bit strange I asked in three other forums. And it looks like nobody is flying this plane or I am the only one with this issue

[StormILM]

I will have a look at this later this afternoon & evening as I have both this model and the Aerosoft version. I will run a in depth check and comparison based on the same and similar envelope parameters to see if I can recreate the issue and post back here with the results. Depending on what I find, we'll see if there's a way to help fix the issue & if necessary, also run it past Dino.

[henrystreet]

Martin,

Do we know each other? I know a fellow named Martin who has the same sense of accuracy.

[StormILM]

I can confirm this bug. Not sure what to make of it but it appears that if you keep the throttles in AB for too long, the engine RPM sliders will become stuck. Retarding the throttles cuts the burner animation & sound but the thrust output remains at Max. After I shut down and restarted the engines to clear the stuck engine RPM, I ran several speed runs in full AB and moved the throttles in and out of ranges from AB, MIL, and Flight Idle with no issues. I still agree there is a bug which is causing the Engine RPM to become stuck under certain conditions (ie: high altitude, possibly even at low & medium altitudes) while at AB or MIL power settings. This needs to be looked into further.

[Bjoern]

Could be bugged coding on Dino's part if he tampers with throttle settings for some reason.

[hschuit]

As I said earlier, it is the engine recs in the AIR file which need some tuning. I did a test using alternative engine recs and the problem was solved - I attached the updated AIR file.

[martin88]

@hschuit:Thank you very much! But now the plane is able to fly M 1.6 at 50.000ft without AB. Is this normal? Seems like AB thrust is not so effective compared to non AB thrust than it was before.
Oh man this is difficult...

[hschuit]

@hschuit:Thank you very much! But now the plane is able to fly M 1.6 at 50.000ft without AB. Is this normal? Seems like AB thrust is not so effective compared to non AB thrust than it was before.
Oh man this is difficult...

I only did a quick & dirty fix to solve the RPM freeze, thrust should be roughly right for low/med altitudes. If I can find time I will try to improve the AIR file.

[Dino Cattaneo]

Gentlemen,

sorry for the late reply to this thread... and sorry for not having replied to the private message on this topic on facebook... my "real life" job is killing me lately, hence I do not have much time for simming...and the heat wave in Italy is not helping.

Situation is as follows:
as hscuit pointed, there are some "weird" values in the engine parameters in the .AIR model.... THIS WAS DONE ON PURPOSE to have a more realistic thrust vs. altitude vs. Mach No. performance. It is a design trick (I think I learned it on FSDeveloper) that allows to overcome some engine performance limitations for fast jets in FSX
*BUT* there is a drawback... which is the bug reported: keeping the throttles in A/B for too long makes engine "hang" at high N2...
Given that, in reality, it does not happen very often that engines are kept at full A/B for very long, I have decided to leave the situation as is - indeed it took months for users to report it. :-)

Hopefully it does not detract too much from the experience.

Regards

Dino

[martin88]

Thanks Dino for your report. In deed I am one of the few users who like to fly long routes, also with military stuff :a1310: Now with hschuit changes the F14D is able to supercruise very high fast.

Myself started to have closer looks to the air file just one week ago. Because I got some Military Jets free or bought some. Nearly every plane has the problem to get is max speed at high altitude. It seems very difficult to get this work like in real life in FS.
For example I bought the Aerosoft F16 and I am just disappointed. So I am way not an expert like you guys.
If someone could make working the air.file correct it would be great. I tried but not with success.

What I also want to say that Dino´s jets are just fantastic... They outperform every Military stuff I have ever tried in FS. Even payware cant duel with his planes. Keep on doing this Dino but enjoy your private life and give your projects time! :wavey:

[hschuit]

Martin, attached another AIR file version which should improve hi alt dry thrust somewhat but like Dino said, FSX has its limitations. Personally I prefer Dino's file because 99% of my flights are low alt and below Mach 1.

[martin88]

Thank you I will try it

[Dino Cattaneo]

Thanks for the appreciation guys.

BR

Dino

[martin88]

Martin, attached another AIR file version which should improve hi alt dry thrust somewhat but like Dino said, FSX has its limitations. Personally I prefer Dino's file because 99% of my flights are low alt and below Mach 1.

Ty again but the plane is still able to fly M 1.6 without AB at about 50.000ft. Its ok, this seems really difficult and nearly impossible to make like it´s in real life.

I love FS:jump::jump:

[Bjoern]

Get AAM and edit table 430 or 154a. These will scale the drag at various speeds.