PDA

View Full Version : Just Bought the Razbam Harrier=Observations



StormILM
December 22nd, 2014, 16:49
Just Bought the Razbam Harrier over at Flightsim.com and now having flown the model, I wanted to make my own separate observations regarding previous concerns regarding the V/STOL capability. First and foremost, I know this has all been brought up before and with respect to the authors of both current FSX Harriers, I make no jabs at either regarding quality or "what should be" in regards to either model nor do I wish to fan old flames here. The purpose being as an end user who regularly tweaks my payware and freeware models, I simply wish to improve on what I think is an excellent rendition of the Harrier and hope some shared knowledge can help not just myself but other users.

That being said, I generally like the Razbam AV-8B FDE and sounds but there's no question that the Hover capability could be greatly improved. As a reference, I fell back on my experience with my old Iris AV-8 in FS9 and Rob B's Hover Gauge for that as well as using Dino's F-35B and getting input from a friend who has both the Wilco Harrier and the Razbam Harrier. The general hover and hover transition behavior of the Razbam Harrier is the heart of the issue and from studying the model and gauges, it appears that the method used to get a hover/transition is considerably different from Rob's method and is accomplished via an XML gauge coding (The XML coding is in the RAV8BP_UFC file within the RAZBAM_AV-8B_Plus.CAB file (in the main panel folder). and additional engine entries in the aircraft config file. The other issue is that there is XML coding which controls the engine RPM & spool rate which in turns controls the engine sound. I noticed that during transition and hovering, the engine RPM & spool rate (& sound) are "limited" by the XML coding which during hovering the engine sounds as if it is at high idle on the ramp when it should should be quite loud. The other issue aside from the rough transition & hover behavior is that there is significant RPM & Thrust lag which IMO makes precise control in transitions, hover, and power cut very difficult. From all that I have been able to ascertain, the current gauge & config method would be nearly impossible to tweak to the point of being able to get around the known limitations of FSX to smooth out the transition & hover performance. This being noted, my friend and myself tried a couple of variations of the RCB gauges with the Razbam Harrier which if the RAV8BP_UFC file was commented out and the engine section of the config file being editied, the RCB gauge influenced hover & transition worked perfectly but with the RAV8BP_UFC file disabled, many systems were disabled as well. My question is, does anyone with good XML knowledge as well as the RCB gauges know of a way to easily disable the Razbam XML hover coding (within RAV8BP_UFC file) which will allow the RCB hover gauge to work properly while allowing the other gauges & systems to also work properly?

Again, this post is intended towards finding a workable solution to enhance the hover experience of the end users of this nice model. Any ideas, knowledge, or research would be greatly appreciated.

gray eagle
December 22nd, 2014, 17:13
Just Bought the Razbam Harrier over at Flightsim.com and now having flown the model, I wanted to make my own separate observations regarding previous concerns regarding the V/STOL capability. First and foremost, I know this has all been brought up before and with respect to the authors of both current FSX Harriers, I make no jabs at either regarding quality or "what should be" in regards to either model nor do I wish to fan old flames here. The purpose being as an end user who regularly tweaks my payware and freeware models, I simply wish to improve on what I think is an excellent rendition of the Harrier and hope some shared knowledge can help not just myself but other users.

That being said, I generally like the Razbam AV-8B FDE and sounds but there's no question that the Hover capability could be greatly improved. As a reference, I fell back on my experience with my old Iris AV-8 in FS9 and Rob B's Hover Gauge for that as well as using Dino's F-35B and getting input from a friend who has both the Wilco Harrier and the Razbam Harrier. The general hover and hover transition behavior of the Razbam Harrier is the heart of the issue and from studying the model and gauges, it appears that the method used to get a hover/transition is considerably different from Rob's method and is accomplished via an XML gauge coding (The XML coding is in the RAV8BP_UFC file within the RAZBAM_AV-8B_Plus.CAB file (in the main panel folder). and additional engine entries in the aircraft config file. The other issue is that there is XML coding which controls the engine RPM & spool rate which in turns controls the engine sound. I noticed that during transition and hovering, the engine RPM & spool rate (& sound) are "limited" by the XML coding which during hovering the engine sounds as if it is at high idle on the ramp when it should should be quite loud. The other issue aside from the rough transition & hover behavior is that there is significant RPM & Thrust lag which IMO makes precise control in transitions, hover, and power cut very difficult. From all that I have been able to ascertain, the current gauge & config method would be nearly impossible to tweak to the point of being able to get around the known limitations of FSX to smooth out the transition & hover performance. This being noted, my friend and myself tried a couple of variations of the RCB gauges with the Razbam Harrier which if the RAV8BP_UFC file was commented out and the engine section of the config file being editied, the RCB gauge influenced hover & transition worked perfectly but with the RAV8BP_UFC file disabled, many systems were disabled as well. My question is, does anyone with good XML knowledge as well as the RCB gauges know of a way to easily disable the Razbam XML hover coding (within RAV8BP_UFC file) which will allow the RCB hover gauge to work properly while allowing the other gauges & systems to also work properly?

Again, this post is intended towards finding a workable solution to enhance the hover experience of the end users of this nice model. Any ideas, knowledge, or research would be greatly appreciated.



I too just bought this plane. I will be having a heck of a time getting my joystick set up to work two axis that control the nozzle and fwd thrust.
I have a logitech extreme 3d pro



From the manual:......
The aircraft makes use of a special configuration to control
both the engine throttle and the nozzles. To configure a
throttle lever in a joystick you must use the: Throttle Axis
(which moves ALL throttles) instead of the Engine 1 Throttle
Axis. The Aircraft Control Module seeks and traps the movement
of the general throttle lever instead of the engine 1.


I can make the plane take off in a conventional manner but when I want it to hover, I'd have to configure the joystick lever or something to make the nozzle
rotate down.

StormILM
December 22nd, 2014, 21:12
I forgot to note that with the RAV8BP_UFC gauge and the RCB gauges enabled together, there is cross interference between the two gauge systems which makes the model more or less INOP. The bottom line is that from very rudimentary testing, it is obvious there is a way to get the RCB gauages to work without massive hassles but just a few missing pieces of the puzzle that need to be addressed to make this happen.

Victory103
December 23rd, 2014, 05:27
StormILM, applaud the effort and I wish I could help as the RCB gauges work "good enough" for another VSTOL aircraft, the Virt V-22. Despite being a RW workhorse, doesn't get much thought in the sim world. Always a fan of the Harrier, but with the current FDE, I found myself limited to rolling t/o's and landings, which at the time was accurate for simulating shore based "max gross" flights. Since the model has been out for some time now, and not to start another Raz vs. SSW Harrier thread, you might get some RW info from Deacon211, with a post explaining both FDE's. This problematic FDE flight regime is the whole reason for military sim fans to have the Harrier after all!