Convair 580 v2

[Bjoern]

Doodeedooo...

(Couldn't find any old thread about the improved model.)


http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o183/t3h_3vil/FS%20Development/580_1.jpg


http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o183/t3h_3vil/FS%20Development/580_2.jpg


For those wondering...mostly cockpit windows on the outside, basically anything else on the inside.

[mgchrist5]

Looking great, Bjoern. And in my favorite livery, too!

[strikehawk]

There a down load link?

[wombat666]

One of my favorite 'Classic' propliners.
Very stylish!!!!!
:encouragement:

[yankeeromeo]

Yes, i'm dreaming of a CV-580 by, let's see, A2A or ...
Anyway, this plane is really missing on FSXA.
Thanks for your work.
Cheers.

[Bjoern]

Thanks, guys.




There a down load link?

Previous version ("FSX SP2 ..."):
http://calclassic.com/580.htm




Yes, i'm dreaming of a CV-580 by, let's see, A2A or ...
Anyway, this plane is really missing on FSXA.
Thanks for your work.


Thanks for the "thank you", but the other comment is a straight kick in the balls.

[stansdds]

Bjoern, will you be making the overhead panel area, currently just a static image, a functioning area?

[Bjoern]

I'm not too keen on redoing the starter and engine logic from the Calclassic bird for now, so the 2D starter panel will be retained. These are C++gauges which I can't decompile to see if they do any magic regarding other gauges or the flight dynamics.

As for the other subpanels, if I could decypher the stuff written on the currently used textures or find any other real world reference for them, my motivation to do them in 3D would be 200-fold. I've actually already created most of the 3D objects for the left deice panel, but the texture and labelling work has stopped me dead cold.

If I do the subpanels in 3D I can't avoid doing the rest of the gauges in 3D as well and that is something I wish to avoid for as long as possible.

Complicating it all is the fact that no two Convairs look alike...*Groan*




- Edit:

Just checked. I already have 180 drawcalls for the VC and I don't really want any more...


- Edit2:

Don't be sad though, you'll get something to play around with in the cockpit anyway. Like a working clipboard for charts or novels or similar. Or side windows that can be opened. Or...

[stansdds]

Sounds good! :applause:

The Convairliners, like the majority of commercial aircraft of the piston era, were pretty much custom built to the purchaser's specifications. Add to that the secondary market and the upgrades that many Convairliners underwent in order to keep them usable and it can become a real headache trying to decide on what to model. I think modern commercial aircraft are fairly well standardized when it comes to cockpit layout.

I guess you could take the easy way out, just make flat panels upon which the end user can place 2D switches, gauges, radios, etc. Not the pretty way to make a VC, but oh so adaptable.

[Bjoern]

I guess you could take the easy way out, just make flat panels upon which the end user can place 2D switches, gauges, radios, etc. Not the pretty way to make a VC, but oh so adaptable.

A gauge poly there can't hurt, but the question is what people are going to place there...

[stansdds]

A gauge poly there can't hurt, but the question is what people are going to place there...

One might have to be creative. I liked MilViz's approach with their Cessna 310R. A nice, fully 3D cockpit, but with a model that had a blank radio/avionics section in which the user could place whatever radios, GPS, or weather radar they wanted.

[Bjoern]

The model comes along at a glacial pace, by the way. Had to redo much of the side panels and window frames in the cockpit and GMax is really uncooperative every once in a while.

[Bjoern]

Oh well...

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o183/t3h_3vil/FS%20Development/render_OH.jpg


Lost half a day to convert the model for 3ds Max, but less crahsing should make for higher productivity.

[Firekitten]

Already looking a lot better! Keep at it :D I love these old birds.

[Bjoern]

Does anyone have an A.net premium account to get this pic in higher resolution?
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Contract-Air-Cargo/Convair-5800/0766732/L/&sid=1451c44712b72af1dd31360a92f647e1

I have a really hard time decyphering some of the labels on the left deice panel.

Below "DEICE SEQUENCE LIGHTS":
"Inlet 1"?, "Inlet 2"?, "Spinner", "CxxxS" ("Cowls"?), "Bright" and the other way around. The only thing I'm sure of is "Spinner".

Below "DEICE TIMER OVERRIDE SEL":
"DE-ICE CONTROL"
"Engine xxx x/x", "PROP & Wxxx"

This is the electrical de-ice panel powered by the 110V AC system. Structural (with bleed air), pitot and windows are covered by the one on the right side.

Also, how many amperes does each of this deice stuff normally pull? The ammeter on the alternator panel shows 110A max.



- Edit:

Figured it out.
"Inlet 1", "Inlet 2", "Spinner", "Cuffs", "Bright", etc...

"Engine Hot Air", "Prop & Inlet"

[Bjoern]

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o183/t3h_3vil/FS%20Development/render_OH2.jpg

*ZZzzzzZZZ*

[stansdds]

Yep, that's what I was talking about! Wonder if we can talk Bjoern into fixing up the piston powered Convairliners too?

[Bjoern]

They are not my era, so no, no way.

[falcon409]

Excellent work there Bjoern. Coming along nicely.:applause:

[stansdds]

They are not my era, so no, no way.

I tried, I tried. :biggrin-new:

[wombat666]

The model comes along at a glacial pace, by the way. Had to redo much of the side panels and window frames in the cockpit and GMax is really uncooperative every once in a while.

'Glacial pace' is still progress and we can wait.
:encouragement:

[StormILM]

Bjoern, that is excellent work! Keep up the good job!:applause::applause::applause:

[Bjoern]

Thanks, guys. I've been away and busy for the last few days, so no progress since the left OH panel.

One thing that's been bugging me about the exterior model is a low-complexity solution to the retention bracket for the front window panes. I'm not too keen on doing extensive mesh work and thus having to remap the entire fuselage, but I want to get that characteristic look right.

Also, as usual, help in decyphering the labels on the overhead panels is much appreciated.
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Contract-Air-Cargo/Convair-5800/0766732/L/&sid=1451c44712b72af1dd31360a92f647e1

[Bjoern]

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o183/t3h_3vil/FS%20Development/render_ext.png

Finally got the freaking cockpit windows look more like the real thing. It's amazing how complicated the window arrangement on this thing is, just as if Convair wanted to mess with modelers.
To make matters worse, the old layout was so far off that I needed to adapt most of the cockpit to fit it.
Other improvements to the exterior model are a better vertical stabilizer, engines that got moved upward a bit (more legs!), larger props (see difference to the old prop disks) and a thicker nose area.

Also, the exterior model is in 3ds Max now (the interior model had been done before). Which means that I need to redo all animations and reapply all visibility tags as these things get messed up in the conversion process (joy, oh joy!). But that's kind of okay as I wanted to move some texture stuff to other textures, etc...
I'll remap the wings so that you have a texture for each side. Which should help with registrations or roundels on one of the two wings. Same with the engines if I can fit them on the texture sheet.

This, however, brings me to a new issue: I need painters later on as neither the old Calclassic liveries nor Bill Howland's paints for the first rework (never published) won't work on the new fuselage. And I don't think that I've got Bill's source files anymore.

[Bjoern]

Looks like I've got some help for the texturing department. This makes things a bit easier for me.


In other news, I will modify and retexture the wings and horizontal stabilizer.
I am also working on completely new engine nacelles, but it's tedious work because Allison just had to do them extra, extra complicated. :dizzy:

[yankeeromeo]

Hello Bjoern,

Congrats for you work, this is almost a complete overhaul:running:
Thanks for your time and work.
:ernaehrung004:

[Hanimichal]

:ernaehrung004::applause::applause::jump:

[Bjoern]

Bernward Bockheim (the guy with the Fokkers) announced a rework of the Calclassic Convair pistons a few months back, so I've sent him my WIP source files as a part reposotory. Last I've heard from him was that he was trying to port the 3ds Max meshes into FSDS2 (or 3), but nothing more after that.

My own attempt to recruit assistance via FSDev ended up with the guy disappearing after two commits, so no success there either.


The remaining overhead panels still require modeling, mapping, texturing and coding and a lot of other areas are also still unmapped and untextured. With lower 3D overheads, you'd also have to convert the original panels into 3D gauges and switches to obtain a uniform look. Add systems coding and a sound environment and you're basically talking about a workload worth a few hundred hours at best.
The exterior model also poses a huge issue as it basically needs a complete rework with more polies, more accurate door placement, completely new engine nacelles, landing gear, etc... pile that on top of the VC stuff. A new model also means that none of the old repaints will work anymore which means a lot of empty paint buckets.

All of this plus other, more attractive projects, a 40-60 hour/week job far away from my desktop PC and having to measure up against other recent releases versus a handful of paints, thank you's and a release thread vanished from the front pages after a week. That equation just doesn't work out for me.
So it's Bernward's model or bust.

[hairyspin]

.. All of this plus other, more attractive projects, a 40-60 hour/week job far away from my desktop PC ...

My dear chap you are rather letting the side down, I fear you may have sold out! A job??? Employment? Hewing of wood, drawing water or suchlike? You'll be claiming someone is actually paying you money next! You must excuse me, this has come as quite a shock. :dizzy:

[stansdds]

Bernward Bockheim (the guy with the Fokkers) announced a rework of the Calclassic Convair pistons a few months back, so I've sent him my WIP source files as a part reposotory. Last I've heard from him was that he was trying to port the 3ds Max meshes into FSDS2 (or 3), but nothing more after that.

My own attempt to recruit assistance via FSDev ended up with the guy disappearing after two commits, so no success there either.


The remaining overhead panels still require modeling, mapping, texturing and coding and a lot of other areas are also still unmapped and untextured. With lower 3D overheads, you'd also have to convert the original panels into 3D gauges and switches to obtain a uniform look. Add systems coding and a sound environment and you're basically talking about a workload worth a few hundred hours at best.
The exterior model also poses a huge issue as it basically needs a complete rework with more polies, more accurate door placement, completely new engine nacelles, landing gear, etc... pile that on top of the VC stuff. A new model also means that none of the old repaints will work anymore which means a lot of empty paint buckets.

All of this plus other, more attractive projects, a 40-60 hour/week job far away from my desktop PC and having to measure up against other recent releases versus a handful of paints, thank you's and a release thread vanished from the front pages after a week. That equation just doesn't work out for me.
So it's Bernward's model or bust.

And that's how it goes when the real world collides with the sim world. Thanks for the update, Bjoern, hopefully Bernward will be able to complete this project.

[Bjoern]

My dear chap you are rather letting the side down, I fear you may have sold out! A job??? Employment? Hewing of wood, drawing water or suchlike? You'll be claiming someone is actually paying you money next! You must excuse me, this has come as quite a shock. :dizzy:

Don't worry, it's a real job (not payware) and limited term, so unemployment and FSX will have me back sooner or later.

[Jafo]

Don't worry, it's a real job (not payware) and limited term, so unemployment and FSX will have me back sooner or later.
That's good to know....
...or maybe not....
...or maybe....;)