FSSC Texture Problem

[Pen32Win]

Hi Gents;

I was trying to do a simple ground poly textured with a blended 256x256 DXT3 bmp. Basically it is a grass texture that has a black Alpha fringe around it. Much to my displeasure when I applied the texture to the poly it paints from the corners inward. The outside edges of the texture show up in the middle and there is a grass simi-circle extending in from each corner. Please advise on just what I've done wrong here.... Thanks.

[MaskRider]

Hi Pen,

Thats called checkerboarding or tiling.

It shows up that way in the FSSC layout window, and likewise in the game, because of the way the standard polygon in FSSC handles textures. It handles them like one of the those seamless tile filters that does what is called a "half wrap" split of the image.

In any event, the standard FSSC polygon won't properly handle an extended bmp with an alpha channel mask as a texture. You get that half-wrap tiling effect.

What you need to do instead, with this version of FSSC, is use the bmp as your background image and make sure that the visible in flight simulator box is checked.

This creates what is called a texpoly style polygon which will handle the alpha channel mask just fine and won't do that half wrap number on the bmp either.

You will be able to see the image in the FSSC layout window as it is suppose to look- although the alpha channel masking won't show- and you can scale it to size using the zoom factor x box.

The first screenie below shows my carney1 texture in a regular polygon on the right. On the left in the same screenie is the way the same file appears as a background image (visible in game).

The second screenie shows how the same file appears with mask working- as it would be in the game.

Hope this is of help.

Chris

[Pen32Win]

Thanks MR, Perfect!!

Now if I could only figure out how to replace the R8 Grass runway texture with a DXT3 texture all of my problems for the project will be solved. Any Ideas?

Thanks Again!!!:icon29:

[MaskRider]

Not quite sure what it is you are trying to do.

You mean you have scenery that is currently using runway03.r8 and you want to replace that with something else in extended dxt3.bmp format that has a more blended sort of look to it?

Perhaps as the screenies below show: on the bottom is the r8 grass and on the right is a blended grassy runway texture from FS2002. The 1st screenie show what the grassy texture looks like in CFS2.

??

Chris

[Pen32Win]

EXACTLY!!!

I must have corrupted the file I created somehow. Can you attach that file to this thread MR? I'd like to test that one out with my new ETO Runways. I have an updated Steel Mat texture that's just great and I think that texture might make the perfect mate for it. BTW, it's for both new/yet to be created in FSSC and existing runways.

Thanks for the help once again!

[MaskRider]

Hi Pen,

I will do my best. I was playing around with them a while back and created a new set of runway textures and I am sure they are still kicking around on my HD somewhere.

The masks in the originals did not work right in CFS2 so I replaced them with very hastily made masks of my own.

Also, as far as I can make out they will be swap outs and not additions to runway surfacing choices. They have to be named according to what CFS2 is expecting to see.

Anyway, sure, I will be happy to locate and post.

Chris

[Pen32Win]

Thanks MR,

Once again that's exactly what I'm trying to do, swap out the old nasty looking R8 textures for Runway01, 02, 03 and 04. I do have some excellent replacement textures for the 60 Series runways, the Steel Matting, the Coral... But, the first four selections are pour looking by even CFS1 standards.

Since I'm now working hard on the ETO and bringing the CFS1 stock Airfields up to date so they conform to the great mesh from Kghhd and the new textures out there, I want to have equally good looking runways. BTW, I'm also placing them were they belong. I spent most of Saturday on Google World and with the help of several other resources found the field or its original location in about 97% of the cases I looked up. Things like Athis being placed south of Caen instead of East of Paris will be corrected. I will also be adding many of the 2nd TAF Airfields in Normandy, Belgium, Holland and Western Germany. Should make for a very nice collection of GSL bases.

Structures wise I'm going for the right buildings for the right time period. If a good map of the field is readily available I'll use, if not, so be it. If I tried to do every one of them to perfection I'd never get it finished. In those cases I'll probably make 10 or 12 layouts and use them accordingly. If someone wants to go great guns and do restoration level scenery, GSL is very easy to replace. I'll get the runways in place with some simple but functional textures around the field and let others focus on the details of individual airdromes.

Thanks Again for all your help.

[MaskRider]

Hmmm. I see what your saying.

My files are probably not what you want then. Mine are like yours, nothing but replacements for the 64-68 series of surfaces.

I have not yet figured a way to get blended masks into those danged .R8 textures and keep that .r8 file tag on them. What I was dearly hoping to find was a way to get CFS2 to recognize the code for 10-27 series used in FS2002. But CFS2 seem only able to accept 64-68 as codes for those blended runway surface textures.

Chris

[Pen32Win]

OK,

Think about this, MW created a tool for adding CFS1 runways to CFS2. It can handle three of the four original CFS1 Runways, the straight ones, not the triple. Could we take the SCASM from MW's tool (which it does output) and enter/add it into the SCASM of the FSSC project prior to or during the compiling the BGL?

[MaskRider]

Well, that certainly sounds worth trying.

What I tried at one point was changing my FSSC settings so that it was configured for FS2002 scenery.

Then I took that scasm code from the resulting runways where I used the 10-27 series textures- and tried plugging it into the source file for my CFS2 airfield/runways. It didn't work.

CFS2 just kept defaulting to the next, lowest, of the 60 series- 64. And yes, :D, I did have the FS2002 runway texture files present in my CFS2 Texture folder.

But, sure, I am willing to try anything. I didn't know that Martin had such a tool. Might as well see what happens.

Chris

[Pen32Win]

It's call MkAFD2. Great little tool.

I was hoping not to have to use two programs, but....

If that doesn't work then I might just swap out your texture for the Coral runway in the 60 series and put the grass texture into the SceneDB folder so hopefully it'll pick it up from there.

[Pen32Win]

Well placing the texture in the individual scenery texture directory doesn't work for me. It always goes straight to the Main Texture Directory to fetch the texture.

Please post or send me those texture files when you can.

Thanks MR.:icon29:

[MaskRider]

I don't suppose there's any harm in just posting them here.

Like I said the mask was done quickly and is a bit down and dirty so you may wish to clean it up.

You will notice that the names all begin with runway64-**.bmp where ** runs from 10 thru 27 for the runways texture numbers from FS2K2. The 64 just means that the mask is pretty much just the same one used in the runway64 texture.

You can just rename 'em as you see fit.

Cheers,
Chris

[Pen32Win]

HI MR;


I think I may have a solution to putting any texture we want on a runway.
See what you think.

1. Create the runway with the desired width and lenght. Make it Invisible.
2. Create a Taxiway using the same length and width. You Can Select any texture you want. It seems to map the texture from Right to Left instead of Up and Down like the runways do.
3. Lay the Textured Taxiway over the Invisible Runway.

I think we might be able to create blended textures that run right to left with the masking to the top and bottom. Then you could adjust the width of the Taxiway. I'm going to go give it a try and see what comes out.

Thank you again MR..

[Pen32Win]

Well it works but the textures do run vertical.

It has only one problem left. The Background Image is covering up the Taxiways!!! If I set the image not to show everything else shows up.

???

I did a quick check under the Background image by removing the flatten area, everything is showing up, only under the BG image....

Regular runways show up on top just fine but roads, taxiways,,,etc fall under it.

Any clues?

[MaskRider]

I am a bit confused.

You mean that the Background image shows up on top of everything in the game or in the FSSC layout window?

If in the game then, yes, you have discovered the flaw in using the background image visible in game method- the layer call out for the textpoly is incorrect. Under normal conditions- with no additional taxiways or polys around- everything would be almost OK

I don't use the latest version of FSSC and/or the Background Image visible in game for my ground polys. I hand edit the standard polygon from FSSC version 1.2.15 so that it works. But here is what should be a quick fix.

Go to the scasm code for that background image textpoly and find the line that calls out the layer. Delete it. Recompile the thing and see if that gets it to lay down on the ground underneath everything.

Chris

[Pen32Win]

Hi MR,

Sorry about the confusion, in the Sim it covers everything up, in FSSC I have no problem moving it to the back. I'm using the newest version BTW. I'll try deleting that code tonight and recompiling the SCASM. Thanks for the tip, went about half nuts thinking I was doing something wrong last night......

I'll get back to you just as soon as I get a chance to try it out.

BTW, the blended texture works great as a taxiway, you just make it about twice as wide as you want the pathway to be, drop in your points and bingo, instant blended roads, taxiways, runways, etc. Could turn out to be a great time saver.

[MaskRider]

BTW, the blended texture works great as a taxiway, you just make it about twice as wide as you want the pathway to be, drop in your points and bingo, instant blended roads, taxiways, runways, etc. Could turn out to be a great time saver.

Thats cool. Nice work!

Another option.

Chris

[Pen32Win]

Hi MR;


While looking at the SCASM I noticed something very different about the layer call for the background, it had no layer identified! Instead of trying to delete it I assigned it a lower level than any of the other objects. I put it down at layer 8 which is the poly layer and it worked like a charm! Went for a test flight over it and from 5000' to ground roll got absolutly NO flicker of the runway texture!

Here's the original SCASM Code followed by the modification I made.

; Background
Area( B N50:08:35.1531 E001:50:09.3695 40 )
LayerCall( :lblLayer )
Jump( : )
:lblLayer
RefPoint( rel :lblReturn 1.00 N50:08:35.1531 E001:50:09.3695 V1= 0 V2= 0 )
RotatedCall( :lblRotated 0 0 273.0 )
Return
:lblRotated
Points( 0
-1536 0 1536
1536 0 1536
1536 0 -1536
-1536 0 -1536
)
LoadBitmap( 0 5 0 1 1 1 "2taf_afgrs1.bmp" )
Smoothing( 1 )
TexPoly( au 0 0 255 1 255 255 2 255 0 3 0 0 )
Smoothing( 0 )
:lblReturn
Return

; Background
Area( B N50:08:35.1531 E001:50:09.3695 40 )
LayerCall( :lblLayer 8 )
Jump( : )
:lblLayer
RefPoint( rel :lblReturn 1.00 N50:08:35.1531 E001:50:09.3695 V1= 0 V2= 0 )
RotatedCall( :lblRotated 0 0 273.0 )
Return
:lblRotated
Points( 0
-1536 0 1536
1536 0 1536
1536 0 -1536
-1536 0 -1536
)
LoadBitmap( 0 5 0 1 1 1 "2taf_afgrs1.bmp" )
Smoothing( 1 )
TexPoly( au 0 0 255 1 255 255 2 255 0 3 0 0 )
Smoothing( 0 )
:lblReturn
Return
I'll post some screen shots of the texture I used and an in Sim Shot in a few.

[MaskRider]

Hehe, Hi Pen

Ok, thats right, now I recall what the difference is. I knew there was something odd about the layering call out.

However, the true test is how it appears and behaves at ground level. A value of 8 might not be what you need. Go down on the ground with your plane and see how the ground texture is handling the wheels of the plane, the shadow of the plane, the shadows of the scenery objects. Whether there is any shimmering and so forth.

If you notice any problems at ground level try changing the layer call out either to 0 or deleting it and see what happens. The problems should go away.

Otherwise, that sounds great!

Chris

[Pen32Win]

Hi MR;


Like I said, No Flicker from 5000' to ground roll. The shadows work out just fine and there is no excessive ground sinking of the wheels, no more than the stock airfields. I've taxied around T/O and landing, not a twitch. Pulling close to 200FPS over it.

Now don't laugh, I'm a heck of a lot better engineer than I am an Artist and I know my textures need some work but here are three shots of my test field at Abbeville.

Thanks for all of your help and glad to work with ya again!

[MaskRider]

That looks good to me! Very nice!

Those taxiways/runways(?) look terrific.

Sounds and looks like all is well. :icon29:

FYI, the polys I use have no layer call out at all.

Do me a small favor and try changing the layer call out to "0" and then try deleting it. I am just curious to see what if anything changes.

Cheers,
Chris

[Pen32Win]

Hi MR;


Setting it to 0 worked just the same as with 8. Couldn't see any difference. Deleting the line also deleted the background, it doesn't show up at all.

Thanks for the cudos but the runway texture still needs some work in the Sim it looks like the cut and paste job it is. REPEAT!!! When I centered the main track I just copied a section and pasted it in to fill up the BMP. I did the same to the Alpha channel by splitting it and moving it out to the edges.

There are only two small things this method lacks and that's end caps on the runways and if you cross one runway over another the center track doesn't cross, it gets cropped. Nothing real big. Sure beats using the FS98 grass runways. LOL

[Pen32Win]

You can see it better in this shot, Grass Waves!!! LOL:costumes:

[MaskRider]

Hi Pen,

REPEAT!!! When I centered the main track I just copied a section and pasted it in to fill up the BMP. I did the same to the Alpha channel by splitting it and moving it out to the edges.

Understood. Very creative and inventive. :US-flag:

All the rest, just a bunch of minor details!! :D

I sure wish we could figure a way to get CFS2 to read those 10-27 codes from FS2002.

Anyhow, thanks for running those two little experiments for me.

Like I said, my poly is a standard poly edited into a texpoly. There is no specific layer call out line in the code- BUT when you go thru the poly dialogue box in my old version of FSSC the default layer value is "0". Where as in the newer version of FSSC it is unspecified.

I guess that perhaps the "0" layer value may be buried in my texpoly code someplace- but I can't pick it out. Never had to mess with it much since that default "0" layer value has always worked.

Cheers,
Chris

[Pen32Win]

No Problem MR;

At least now we have a method where we can use whatever texture we choose for runways by making them invisible and placing a like shaped taxiway over them. Still get a correct AFD bgl for freeflight. We also know we can do blended Taxiways without masking them, we just need to produce a set of textures with blended vertical edges. And it'll work for both of the FSSC version we use!

I too wish we could get the FS2002 runway textures to show up. The only other thing you could do is replace the 60 Series with 4 or 5 of you favorites for the ETO. Which if you don't use separate installs for the ETO and PTO leaves you with no Coral or Sand Runways, just ETO Dirt, Concrete and Grass. It'll work for those of us that do split our installs completely but there are many people that use the Easy Multi-Install Method and I think it uses a common root Texture directory. Not good for them.

Taking a couple of hints from your tutorial I've gone back and redone the background texture and managed to get rid of the pixilation. I've got a few challenges ahead of me but things are looking pretty good. Mucho Better! Still think I can find a better color though, got some digging to do.

BTW, what have you found to be the best method (FPS wise) of flattening, N16 bgl's or Scernery.cfg enties??

Back to the Paint Booth!

:icon29:

[MaskRider]

Hi Pen,

WRT: Area16N flattens or Scenery.cfg flattens, I have always used the Area16s. Don't ask me why. They work for me- so I use them.

I also always condence the 3 bgl files into one. This is a nice way to rereduce FPS. Below is an example. The Area16N info is right at the top of the file below the header information.

; ************************************************** **********
; Scenery compiled by FSSC 1.2.13 by Derek Leung
; Scenery compiled on 7/15/2005 11:06:55 PM
; Scenery created by Chris Westervelt
; ************************************************** **********

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Set( ppperr 2000 )

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Menu( SI Batuna Aerodrome )

Copyright( © 2001 by Chris Westervelt )

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SetupLoc( S08:33:28.1223 E158:07:06.0498 0.0 350.0 1 N 18 )
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EndC

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NameEntry( COUNTRY 0 "Solomon Islands" )
NameEntry( STATE 0 "New Georgia Group" )
NameEntry( NDB 7 "SI Batuna" )
NameEntry( CITY 0 "Batuna" )
NameEntry( AIRPORT 2 "SI Batuna Aerodrome" )
EndNL

; SI Batuna 35
Area( 5 S08:33:10.8016 E158:07:02.9736 12 )
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Heading 170.0
Length 3700
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ID 36
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Threshold 0
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ExtN 0
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Zbias( 0 )
Smoothing( 0 )
:lblReturn
EndA

; SI Batuna
NDB( 356.0 250 BPF SI_Batuna S08:33:20.1434 E158:06:59.8975 0 )

; SI Batuna FB Dockside
MenuEntry( S08:33:15.2305 E158:07:27.9675 0.0 125.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna FB Dockside )

; SI Batuna Beach
MenuEntry( S08:33:16.0064 E158:07:22.0349 0.0 215.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna Beach )

; SI Batuna Beach 2
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; SI Batuna Taxiway 1
MenuEntry( S08:33:19.2405 E158:07:12.8064 0.0 255.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna Taxiway 1 )

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; SI Batuna Taxiway 6
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; SI Batuna Taxiway 7
MenuEntry( S08:33:08.7005 E158:06:56.7114 0.0 30.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna Taxiway 7 )

; SI Batuna Taxiway 8
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; SI Batuna Taxiway 9
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; SI Batuna Blister 6
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; SI Batuna Control Tower
MenuEntry( S08:33:18.5882 E158:07:00.7764 0.0 110.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna Control Tower )

; SI Batuna Beach 2
MenuEntry( S08:33:26.2855 E158:07:16.5418 0.0 135.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna Beach 2 )

; SI Batuna FB Beach 3
MenuEntry( S08:32:58.0953 E158:07:27.9675 0.0 340.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna FB Beach 3 )

; SI Batuna FB Beach 4
MenuEntry( S08:32:49.7559 E158:07:19.1785 0.0 290.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna FB Beach 4 )

; SI Batuna 17
MenuEntry( S08:32:53.7660 E158:06:59.9524 0.0 170.0 127.30 111.50 360 111.50 360 SI Batuna 17 )

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:lblReturn
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PerspectiveCall( :lblPerspective )
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Jump( : )
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-8 0 -8
-8 0 8
8 0 8
8 0 -8
-8 32 -8
-8 32 8
8 32 8
8 32 -8
)
SurfaceColor( 05 F0 )
Poly( m 0 0 -32767 8 0 4 7 3 )
Poly( m 0 0 32767 8 2 6 5 1 )
Poly( m -32767 0 0 8 1 5 4 0 )
Poly( m 0 32767 0 32 4 5 6 7 )
Bitmap( gaspump1.r8 0 0 0 107 )
IfVarAnd( :CrashDetection 28C FFFE )
Bitmap( gaspump1.r8 0 64 0 107 )
:CrashDetection
Inst_7D
TexPoly( m 32767 0 0 8.00 3 0 0 7 0 74 6 62 74 2 62 0 )
Monitor3D( :lblReturn2 -1 1 -1 1 0 2 )
SetVar( 284 14 )
:lblReturn2
Return
EndA

Cheers,
Chris

[Pen32Win]

Hi MR;


Great idea, now the bad news, while A/C sit on it just fine, buildings do not. They sink or the background floats up. Not sure which. When you're close to the building everything is fine, as you fly away, it sinks, though its shadow stays up. You literaly watch the building sink through its own shadow. I tried deleting the layer calls but something is not right in my SCASM, the background shows up, the 1st Taxiway shows up but not the second one. I think this is the fix because they stopped sinking after I did it but something is amiss.

Could you please look through this and see just what I've done wrong.

; ************************************************** **********
; Scenery compiled by FS Scenery Creator 1.5.11 by Derek Leung
; Scenery compiled on 9/13/2005 10:12:55 PM
; Scenery created by Pen32Win
; ************************************************** **********
Set( buf 100 )
Set( areamx 64 )
Set( linbuf 64 )
Set( ppperr 2000 )
UVar( $FSSCTEMP1 4 )
Header( 1 N50:11:21.2870 N50:05:57.3129 E001:54:33.9475 E001:46:08.4148 )
LatRange( N50:05:57.3129 N50:11:21.2870 )
Copyright( Copyright © 2005 by Pen32Win )
; Background
Area( B N50:08:31.6542 E001:50:21.9067 40 )
RefPoint( rel :lblReturn 1.00 N50:08:31.6542 E001:50:21.9067 V1= 0 V2= 0 )
RotatedCall( :lblRotated 0 0 297.0 )
Return
:lblRotated
Points( 0
-1408 0 1408
1408 0 1408
1408 0 -1408
-1408 0 -1408
)
LoadBitmap( 0 5 0 1 1 1 "2taf_afgrass1.bmp" )
Smoothing( 1 )
TexPoly( au 0 0 255 1 255 255 2 255 0 3 0 0 )
Smoothing( 0 )
:lblReturn
Return
EndA
; Taxiway 1
Area( 5 N50:08:22.0970 E001:50:19.5813 15 )
RefPoint( rel :lblEnd 1.0 N50:08:22.0970 E001:50:19.5813 v1= 15000 v2= 1500 )
LoadBitmap( 0 5 F0 3 0 0 "grasstaxiway.bmp" )
Smoothing( 1 )
TaxiwayStart( -38 -575 0 483 )
TaxiwayCont( 574 0 -482 )
Smoothing( 0 )
Return
EndA
; Taxiway 2
Area( 5 N50:08:37.4534 E001:50:03.7077 15 )
RefPoint( rel :lblEnd 1.0 N50:08:37.4534 E001:50:03.7077 v1= 15000 v2= 1500 )
LoadBitmap( 0 5 F0 3 0 0 "grasstaxiway.bmp" )
Smoothing( 1 )
TaxiwayStart( -38 -256 0 -705 )
TaxiwayCont( 256 0 704 )
Smoothing( 0 )
Return
EndA
; Abbeville20
Area( 5 N50:08:37.4459 E001:50:03.7335 12 )
Runway( N50:08:37.4459 E001:50:03.7335
Altitude 64.0
Heading 20.0
Length 4920
Width 246
ID 36
Surface -1
Markers 0
Threshold 0
Lights 0
)
Return
EndA
; Abbeville31
Area( 5 N50:08:22.0921 E001:50:19.5634 12 )
Runway( N50:08:22.0921 E001:50:19.5634
Altitude 64.0
Heading 310.0
Length 4920
Width 246
ID 36
Surface -1
Markers 0
Threshold 0
Lights 0
)
Return
EndA

Thanks MR.

[MaskRider]

Hmmmm... too bad. This a problem.

You wouldn't believe how long I struggled trying to get all of those weird effects to disappear.

You say that when you delete that layer call out line the background poly disappears, eh?

Try deleting the taxiways first and then see if deleting the layer call out still makes the background poly disappear.

If it does then try getting rid of just the taxiways, leave the layer call out at 8 (0), recompile and see what happens.

Taxiways and other miscelaneous non texpoly polys do not seem to get along well with background image texpolys. I only use them to make the "template" scenery that I then use for making the masks. I never include them in the finished scenery

If the two tests above don't settle things down then you can always try hand editing a regular poly. Its very easy and quickly done- and sure fire.

Sorry, but I can't get you where you want to go from the code of that background texpoly. I don't know enough about it or about the finer points of scasm.

Chris

[Pen32Win]

No MR,

The background shows up fine after deleting the Layercall as does the first taxiway, it's everything after that that's not showing up. The second taxiway and the two runways.

Gotta get some sleep, step back, go at it again tomorrow.

Take Care.

[MaskRider]

Hmmm... hehe.

Well earlier you said that:Deleting the line also deleted the background, it doesn't show up at all. :D

WRT:
Gotta get some sleep, step back, go at it again tomorrow.
Yep, me too. I was going to suggest the same thing.

Talk atcha later,
Chris

[Pen32Win]

OK, we're back.

The first time I deleted the LayerCall for the Background I must have gotten carried away and deleted too much. It's working now. I've now gone back and deleted just the three lines of the LayerCall, I think I also pulled the lblend the first time. Oooops. Anyway, it's all working now. I left in the layerCalls for the Taxiways and Runways and just deleted the LayerCall for the Background. It's working super now.

The only problem left with MB ground infrastructure objects is the start up - pop up issue of when you first start a mission you can't see the buildings and a moment later they're there and sitting just as they should. In the mission code they are all placed at the correct Altitude of 211'. Remember these airfields are built over add-on mesh with a flatten covering the area the size of the field. I don't know if this is the cause. They do it with MB inserted objects but I'm not sure about GSL yet. One thing I've notice is that if a stacic A/C is placed on the field its there right from the beginning.

I'm going to try placing a Platform in the scenery to see if this corrects the problem.

Will get back to you as soon as I have some results.

One other thing I also tried and it works great is taking the SCASM Code generated by MW's MkAFD and putting it into the FSSC SCASM, you get perfect CFS1 and CFS2 runways. I first tried this using two bgls, one from MkAFD and one from FSSC, you got that nasty flickering effect. This way there's no flicker other than the normal flicker associated with CFS1 Runway End Caps. Another option available to us. :D

[Pen32Win]

BTW, I think I've found the perfect texture for ETO Airfield backgrounds. This one blends in much better with the FS9 based texture set I use for the ETO. In some spots it's hard to tell where the background meets the ground textures.

[Pen32Win]

Yea Team!!!!

I added an Area16 platform to the scenery (same altitude as in the scenery setup) that has had some great effects. First off when you start a mission from the field everything is there. Second When you fly up on the field from beyond LOS everything is there. Third is that there is no more flicker of the ground polys used in many of the ground objects damage models.

Just flew my first formation mission off of her, gotta widen the runways a bit but other than that it looks like we've arrived. Here's to you MR.:ernae:

[xavierb]

Haven't discovered this thread till today. Excellent job, Pen32win! You have found a new method of building airfields.
About the objects, it is normal than when starting MB they are late to show. "GSLizing" them will fix it, as they will appear inmediatly or at least sooner in the mission. It is even more true with non multi-resolution objects.
I will read this thread with more detail to learn how you have changed the goddamn simple default CFS1 runways, which I particularly hate. For example, in the Japanese scenery I am building I use coral runways to emulate concrete ones. But a decent grass runway was unexistant until you have found the way.

[Pen32Win]

Thanks Xav;

Always looking to build a better mouse trap, you know me. LOL
The biggest reason I started in on this project is that a large number of the default CFS1 Bases are in the wrong place. Next comes the issue of mesh terrain. I love the stuff, gives the world real depth. There are currently three methods of getting the CFS1 runways into CFS2. Two are add-on packages, the third is to put the CFS1 airfield bgls into CFS2. In all three cases, none of them conforms to the new mesh. SO, I'm out to create then all over again, only better. If you've read this thread you'll see just where I intend to go with this.

I will also be GMaxing a large number of ETO Buildings. There are some really great LOOKING building s out there but a large portion of them where built with programs that CFS2 really doesn't like the code of. If one of these buildings is in your scenery you get strange behavior like not being able to shoot any buildings in the area, it's a scaling issue and it really reaks havoc.

Right now I'm putting together lists of structures and getting together my Texture sets, Alpha Masks, and other items I need to lay down the fields. The buildings should go rather quickly as I have all of the texures for them already. Then I plan to start another project of completely new stuff starting of with AA Weapons of the ETO followed by a huge vehicle set.

But first we've got to get those Airfields laid down... :)

[xavierb]

Yes, even in the Pacific there are some kinds of buildings we don't have enough variants: I am thinking in hangars. When you have them created, please show me them as a mid-1930s or mid-1940s hangar in Japan homeland wasn't much different as one in Europe and perhaps (of course if you agree) I can use them when I begin making the GSL layer of my Japanese runways.
About runway building, I use the "background image" method, instead of a polygon. The .sca file has to be edited, as you well know, to get rid of that extra layer that FSSC puts and makes the runway flicker and objects be sunk. Something that improves somehow runway visibility in the distance is to make the flat area in FSSC 0.1 below the scenery altitude. For example, if you have set scenery altitude to 2 m., then tell the flat area to be 1.9 m high. BTW, beta-testers asked me to make the runways 70-80 m wide. They felt comfortable taking off and landing than in narrower runways.

Best regards and keep up the great work,

Xavier

[Pen32Win]

LOL, you can never have enough types of buildings! I'm even going to take many of the CFS1 buildings and GMax them. All I've got to do is stack the blocks. The skins are already done.

If you look at the last picture I posted you'll see there are two of my new runways and a CFS1 Grass Runway I insterted by importing the SCASM from MR's MkAFD. The stock runway is 80M, mine are set at 75. Hows that for guess work??? LOL.

As far as painting runways on the background I think it's great if you're working on a few bases. I'm doing close to a hundred. It's going to be a bit of an assembly line process. I've picked my base texture for the fields and I'm creating about 6 differently shaped masks to apply. Then I just go to the right spot pick the shape closest to that of the real field and start plopping down runways and such. I have already scouted out the locations of the bases in the first set an noted the best altitude for the area so there's no guess work there.

I've too use the old drop/lower the flatten trick in many cases.

[Pen32Win]

The thing I'm worst at is painting but I'm getting better.
Here's a shot of the blended runway/taxiway/road texture set I'm working on.
Any hints tips and trick you use are always helpful!

This is a shot where I'm about to turn off of a dirt taxiway onto a grass twin track runway. I made this one because paired take-offs were very common.

[xavierb]

The thing I'm worst at is painting but I'm getting better.
Here's a shot of the blended runway/taxiway/road texture set I'm working on.
Any hints tips and trick you use are always helpful!

This is a shot where I'm about to turn off of a dirt taxiway onto a grass twin track runway. I made this one because paired take-offs were very common.

I would say that the point in painting the surfaces is to make a good use the airbrush or spray tool in the alpha channel (8-bit greyscale image). I don't know which graphics software are you using (I use Corel Photo Paint, which is little used elsewhere) but, as any of this kind of programs have the same tools and settings although with different names, I hope you will understand it:

- Playing with the Size, Transparency and Quantity lets you create an alpha channel that improves the look of your runway surface easily and fast.

For example, if you set transparency at 30 and quantity to 50 with a brush size of 15 or 20 you will get a nice dispersion of paint that will make the surface of your runway to appear not so sketchy when seen from short distances. Playing with different values of size, transparency and quantity will give you different blending effects.

I attach a sample alpha channel file in order to make it easier to understand.
Another thing you can do, if brave enough:-), is to use "masks" or "objects" layers to create different surfaces in the texture bitmap part, not in the alpha image. If you are using PSP, MR tutorial describes it perfectly. But if you are creating 100% grass airfields, you may don't need it.

Best regards,

Xavier

[Pen32Win]

Thanks for the tips Xav;

Right now I'm working in PSP and just doing masks for the edges of existing textures. The process I've developed for these masks go like this.

1. Make a copy of the actual texture to be used and open it with MS Paint. Paint around the shape of the airfield and blacken out everything outside of it. Save and close.

2. Open that file with DXTBmp and Select Create Alpha (Black). I then export the Alpha Channel back to the same file name thus overwriting it.

3. Open the Alpha with PSP. Select Gausian Blur and depending on the amount of fading I want and the size of the bmp I use a value around 5. This gives me the nice faded edges. Save and Exit PSP.

4. Open the Actual Texture file, import the Alpha channel and save with the new file name as a DXT3 file. Done.

I ended up making 7 different Airfield base textures last night and I'm really happy them.

[xavierb]

That (more or less) is the technique I used in my SCW airfields. I couldn't tell you why now I don't use the Gaussian blur anymore. In the end, there are many ways to get good results. Keep up the good work.

Best regards,

Xavier

[Pen32Win]

Thanks Xav;


Which do you think is a better Grass Runway, the ones in the previous shots or this one. This is Athis, about 71 miles ENE of Paris. For some reason CFS1 has this field south of Caen. Go figure. I got lucky with this one as the field is still there.

[SdC]

Thanks for the tips Xav;

Right now I'm working in PSP and just doing masks for the edges of existing textures. The process I've developed for these masks go like this.

1. Make a copy of the actual texture to be used and open it with MS Paint. Paint around the shape of the airfield and blacken out everything outside of it. Save and close.

2. Open that file with DXTBmp and Select Create Alpha (Black). I then export the Alpha Channel back to the same file name thus overwriting it.

3. Open the Alpha with PSP. Select Gausian Blur and depending on the amount of fading I want and the size of the bmp I use a value around 5. This gives me the nice faded edges. Save and Exit PSP.

4. Open the Actual Texture file, import the Alpha channel and save with the new file name as a DXT3 file. Done.

I ended up making 7 different Airfield base textures last night and I'm really happy them.

Interesting.
I use Photoshop and do this after completing the runway artwork:
0. Save the image as runway.bmp and runway.psd
1. Create new layer on top.
2. Select a soft black brush (this gives a fading edge).
3. Paint the mask in the new layer
4. Create a new white layer underneath the black mask
5. Save as runway_alpha.bmp and ruway.psd
6. Combine the two in dxtbmp.

[xavierb]

Thanks Xav;


Which do you think is a better Grass Runway, the ones in the previous shots or this one. This is Athis, about 71 miles ENE of Paris. For some reason CFS1 has this field south of Caen. Go figure. I got lucky with this one as the field is still there.

It is a personal opinion: I would vote for the one in the previous screenshots. The second one is too perfect, too defined and too square for my taste:-). I usually prefer more battered surfaces like the first one.

SdC: thanks for sharing your tips. It is a pity we all live in different countries. I have always wondered how fruitful could be to have a CFS2 developer conference, with trainings on Gmax, FSSC, painting, etc.

[Pen32Win]

Thanks Gents;

SdC, We get to the same thing in just slightly different routes. I also like to draw the shape and then use the spray can to "Dirty" it up. BTW, How's things going with your project?

Xav, I think the distance away from the runway gives it a too clean look. I went back and broke up the edges a tad bit more. I like the color of the second one better, the first one just doesn't blend in with the ETO texture colors the way I'd like. Reminds me of a Philippino Runway stuck in the middle of France. LOL. Look at this shot. I may try taking the center line wair track from the other texture and adding to this by using a new layer in PSP.

I think it is best that we do all live in different countries, we all have very different backgrounds and perspectives on things, wounderous variety. Then we come and have our conference here at the SOH to pass our ideas on. It would be nice to get to meet each other face to face but I think our differences of country and culture adds to the depth of the community.

[SdC]

.. BTW, How's things going with your project?

....

Rapidly working towards a burnout in the Real World; just haven't had the energy the last weeks. Trying to find a new job is a bit of a priority now.

[Pen32Win]

I read you 5 x 5 SdC, I went through the same thing the latter part of '04 and first quarter of this year. Hope you land on your feet soon.

[xavierb]

OK, Pen32win, looking closer to your v. 2 runway I like it more than the first. Perhaps I am so much used to build runways in poor (at the time of WW2, at least) far east countries than I have forgotten what a industrial Europe runway should be. :)

SdC, it seems than in this world of today it is a must to shift job every two-three years before burning out. I calculate I still can endure six months or one year before being like you. It will not be the first time... Good luck!

[SdC]

...
SdC, it seems than in this world of today it is a must to shift job every two-three years before burning out. I calculate I still can endure six months or one year before being like you. It will not be the first time... Good luck!

I'm four years in this job now; for an IT job that's extraordinary!
Thanks guys; I'm gonna need some luck.

[Pen32Win]

That’s exactly why I got out of the corporate world. I make a little less money but I put up with about a $50,000.00's a year less B/S. That and here it's an old fashion career, two way dedication. I build and Admin. my servers my way and run my LAN/WAN just the same. No mealy mouth suits trying to micromanage things. No sales manager trying to second guess the IT Dept. BTW, I work for a retirement community full of WWII vets, minimum age to live here is 65. Actually saw a guy with Pearl Harbor Survivor plates on his car the other day. You get a few of the old crabs but most of them are a joy to be around.

[SdC]

I've done volunteer and non-profit work for years in my life. Looking back, I felt a lot better about myself back then.... I still don't find money important at all but over the years, it just becomes harder to take that step back; mortgage etc... I'm in the claws of The System...

[Pen32Win]

I was in the claws too, worked for a major (14 States) Communications Co. Then the hostile takeover on leveraged shinplaster, overblown stock, execs cashing out and crashing the value, raiding of the pension fund, golden parachutes galore, mass layoffs... Which ended up being the best thing since sliced bread.

Now I enjoy going to work again. It took awhile to find but good jobs in small/medium sized companies are out there. If you want an old fashion life long career they're the best place to look.

[Sarg Willy]

First off Thanks Guys ,, The North African Airfields ,,will look much better now ,, I had a flicker on the base texture for all the runways after stripping out the scenery objects ,, Reading this thread proved to be just the ticket ,, Old file"" LayerCall( :L000020 24 )"" New one""LayerCall( :L000020 00)"""" Even threw in the shadows and all was perfect ,,No sink on aircraft and perfect shadow,, I,m one happy camper with the result,,

[Sarg Willy]

Playing with DXT-3 I came out with this ,, I hope Mask Rider lets me use his altered base texture ??

[Sarg Willy]

Just a note for Pen ,, Xp -Pro is too smart it remembers the texture name inside Scene DB no matter what the folder ,,, But the work around is to place it out side CFS-2 as an add on scenery / texture file ,, It will pull the correct same name ,, different texture from here,,,

[Pen32Win]

Sarg I didn't have any problems with texture names but that's a good thing to know. Thank You.

On your LayerCall( :L000020 00), have you tried putting buildings on these texpolys? Have you tried using stacked/multiple textpolys?

The scenery looks great. I have a good collection of blended edged Runway and Taxiway textures I need to send you. I think you'll like them.

[Sarg Willy]

Hi Pen ,, On the Layer call ,, not tested yet for objects placement ,, Am I in for more fun ? I noticed a few different layer heights on some BGL,s ,, But if they displayed the runway Ok I left them alone ,, Two problems showed up on the wee Processer 450 ,, Both involved trying to use an effects placeholder ,, small fire and burning oil barrel ,, Used as a mission setup to lay file was Ok ,, But GSL format version produced a CTD on both ,, No warning post,, or error file ,, That was even after fresh reboot on 786 ram ,, The RCAF EL Agheila used 4 burning drums for nite time use and in the mission work OK but Installed on GSL cause an instant crash ,, Removal was the fix ,, I thought perhaps the same mission overlaying the GSL file was the problem ,, But No the crash occured as well from Free Flight !! Could you double check the result ?? File fix is on other form ,,

[Pen32Win]

Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner SW. I haven't been over here for awhile.
I didn't get any CDT's with the scenery you sent me but I have a GMax burning Oildrum, not the old FSDS one, I know that object like the original Nibbio ?Ground troops had some CDT issues.

[Cees Donker]

I've done volunteer and non-profit work for years in my life. Looking back, I felt a lot better about myself back then.... I still don't find money important at all but over the years, it just becomes harder to take that step back; mortgage etc... I'm in the claws of The System...

Take care Sander! I've been there. Costed me six years to really get back, and even then...........

:icon29:

Cees