TAF German FlaK PaK 2

[Pen32Win]

Three German Light AA Guns and their Crews for CFS2. Flakvierling 38 Early ETO, Flakvierling 38 Late ETO and Flakvierling 38 DAK. Also included is an update to the FlaK 38 DAK models and texture updates.

[PomBee]

Beautiful work, Pen.

Thank you so much.

PomBee.:salute::salute::salute:

[Pen32Win]

You're Welcome PomBee.

Another small piece of the void filled in.

I cut down the firing rate on this one trying to find a better ballance between the Cyclical Rate and the Low End Sustained firing rate. If you fly around it and not in a straght line you're pretty safe. You fly at it... It'll hurt you.

I'm glad I've gotten the Light AA done and am really enjoying working on the 3.7cm FlaK 37.
It's such a good looking piece with the Triangular Frame, Low Profile and Long Barrel. The engineering behind it, as with most German Pre-War designs, is elegant and over complicated but that's the fun of the challenge, to recreate it, triangle by triangle. The FlaK 37 also has some interesting twist in that it was not a symetrical mount. The Left and Right sides are different, even in the placemant of the supporting Feet and the Gun Mount actually sits off-center on the Base. something different, something interesting.

More to come in the near future.

[tobob]

You fly at it... It'll hurt you.
Yikes! :eek:


More to come in the near future.
Lookin forward to all your work! Beautiful stuff! Almost a shame to drop a bomb on it!

tobob

[Ravenna]

A work of art....thanks Pen!

[Pen32Win]

Thanks Tobob and Rav;

"Almost a shame to drop a bomb on it!"

That's funny you should say that as I was thinking about it the other night while doing some testing. I do build these things just to do that, Bomb, Rocket, strafe them and most of all to make it a challenge to be around them. I spend most of my time in the ETO flying Typhoons and Tempests. To the real pilots of these aircraft their worst threat came from German FlaK, not the Luftwaffe's aircraft. I've done a lot of reading about the Coastal FlaK Belts and No Ball V-1 Sites, Airfields and the other High Priority Targets they attacked on their Ranger and Rhubarb Missions. In almost every account they talked about the deluge of AA Fire in all sizes. So without these weapons to shoot back at you it seems to me really hard to create realistic Ground Attack Missions for the ETO. To me it's like trying to do the "Falaise Pocket" without German AFV's and Trucks. Sure you can substitute the existing IJA/N weapons but to me it's just not the same. It's a personal thing, that's all.

Thanks Again Gents.

[Seagull V]

Hello Pen32Win

Superb work, looking forward to the new additions. :ernae: :applause:
Have found a few things on the 88 as well as the SdKfz 6/2 Flak 36 if you need them.

[Pen32Win]

Thanks Seagull;

Sure I'd love to see them. You can never seem to have enough good info on them. I'll send you a PM so you can e-mail them to me. Thank You.

[bearcat241]

Hmmm....looks like about a 60 to 70 degree max elevation. That about right Pen? For the player, this could make for a vunerable dive bombing target from an 80 degree angle - even with a straight on approach. Forget the AI, they're toast. They just don't have the programming to approach anything from that angle even when designated as dive bombers in the dp MISC.

[Pen32Win]

Hey BC,

The Flakvierling 38 could actually elevate past 90* to 110*. The DP I created reflects this. They're really not that deadly. Being a 20mm weapon they'll put a good dent in you but unless you fly down the barrels for 30 seconds while it's hitting you they'll have a hard time putting you down. As Yul Brynner put it to Steve McQueen "I didn't get elected but I got nominated real good".

I've been flying missions around them and haven't lost a exceptionally high number of AI wingmen either. I've been hit a few times and nursed my Tiffie back to Manston. At one Noball site I put in 25 of them covering it and very seldom will I loose a wingman if we get in drop our loads and get out. Now if you loiter around all day, well, then you're just asking for it...LOL When I get the 3.7cm FlaK 36/37 and FlaK 43 done then you can really worry. If you get hit by them you'll really know it; but then again they had much lower rates of fire....

[Skipsan]

With hat in hand I ask is there any plans for a naval version? I would like to try and install one on Sully's Trawlers :wiggle: As a payload :bump:

Skipsan:kilroy:

[Pen32Win]

Hi Skipsan;

I don't have any plans for a naval mount but I have seen one picture of the the naval pedistal mount you're thinking of.

I tell ya' what. I've got a lot on my plate right now but if you can show me that you can attach one of the three existing versions to a ship as a payload and it shows up I'll do it when I get the 3.7cm FlaK 36/37 completed.

[Discus]

Thanks Tobob and Rav;

So without these weapons to shoot back at you it seems to me really hard to create realistic Ground Attack Missions for the ETO. To me it's like trying to do the "Falaise Pocket" without German AFV's and Trucks. Sure you can substitute the existing IJA/N weapons but to me it's just not the same. It's a personal thing, that's all.

Thanks Again Gents.

Thank you very much Pen! I´ll second you on that. Now with your additions we are going to have a complete set of AA, and we are going to weave all through the airfields/radar sites/No ball sites.

I´ve searched but couldn´t find the standard or average amount of light flack mounts were per objective defended. Does any one have an idea or a good source of info?

Pen: Have you thought of making a mount above a tower. I´m not talking about heavy flak concrete towers but light flak wood towers used in defense of airfields. As you say I´ve read many books in wich pilots talk about the dreadfull flak and specifically this flak towers.

Thanks again for this really good additions!!

Cheers

[Seagull V]

Have to head off to work today, will send you some ship-stuff tonight.

Trust you are not being overloaded !!!!!!!

Crashaz was looking for someone to do some upgrades on hhis ships, which was the main reason I was getting involved, once everything was sorted out was going to do naval variants of your items with your permission of course.

[Pen32Win]

Discus;

Do a Google search for "Luftwaffe Anti-Aircraft Battalions". They were in charge of defending Airfields and most stationary installations. The Wehrmacht Heer had its own formations for mobile AA Defense of its units in the field.

Yes, I've thought about FlaK Towers, in fact, both of the types you mentioned. All in good time. I've still got a huge list ahead of me just to get the guns done and their mobile AFV versions. When that's done I'll take a look at the elevated platforms.

Seagull;

Hang on to the ship stuff until we know if it can be done. I don't think it can but won't say "never" at this point. If it comes to pass I'll let you know.:ernae:

[sc7500]

...Hang on to the ship stuff until we know if it can be done. I don't think it can but won't say "never" at this point. If it comes to pass I'll let you know....

Wouldn't this fall under the aspect of adding a platform / vertex group to make a small "deck" for the gun to sit on ?

Example taken from Usio's plethora of ships:

[platform.1]
vertex.0=9.68,7.19,101.44
vertex.1=15.32,7.19,56.48
vertex.2=-15.32,7.19,56.48
vertex.3=-9.68,7.19,101.44

SC
:kilroy:

[Pen32Win]

SC;

I think, I say I think, that' only work for Aircraft. I've never been able to put static infrastructure on a CV Deck. If it's been done I never heard about it. Same with attaching P/L's, once again, as far as I know that dog won't hunt.

[Rami]

Pen32Win,

If I didn't say it already, thank you so much for uploading yet another pack of toys for me to play with! :jump:

[Discus]

Discus;
Yes, I've thought about FlaK Towers, in fact, both of the types you mentioned. All in good time. I've still got a huge list ahead of me just to get the guns done and their mobile AFV versions. When that's done I'll take a look at the elevated platforms.

Pen32Win

Thanks for the info.

¿Can an infrastructure object be "mounted" over another infrastructure object?

This way we could mount any AA cannon above any already modelled tower or building.

I know CFS2 is not very precise placing objects. And I would need contact points for the cannon to play with in order to give it long invisible legs to reach the platform´s altitude.
As long as I know this can only be acomplished by configuring the infrastructure object as an aircraft, and in this way the tactical display would be foulished.
It´s only an idea to combine already made modells to obtain a richier context for missions.

Cheers, Discus

[Pen32Win]

Static Ground objects Always go to ground level. Unfortunatly you can't stack them like building blocks.

Feel free to try but I'm going to stay focused on creating new stuff. With the list of new builds I have and bringing 3 new installs up to date I can't get side tracked right now.

We been 10 years without them, what's a couple of months?

[Discus]

Static Ground objects Always go to ground level. Unfortunatly you can't stack them like building blocks.

Feel free to try but I'm going to stay focused on creating new stuff. With the list of new builds I have and bringing 3 new installs up to date I can't get side tracked right now.

We been 10 years without them, what's a couple of months?

Ok. What a shame CFS2 objects can´t be combined.

I wasn´t trying to hurry you, increase or steal your scope of work. On the contrarie, I was trying to increase the variables we have for our sceneries, building upon the work shared by the gifted ones, and thus reducing the increadibly huge amount of excelent work they already do.

Thanks, Discus

[Pen32Win]

Howdy Discus;

I know and I wasn't trying to be a jerk, just to the point. No worries.

Objects can be combined but it's a matter of doing something like putting a tall tower "into" a short building. Both are sitting on the ground just one is much taller than the other so it looks like the tower is standing on the roof of the building.

A lot of people spent a lot of time on this several years ago trying to get static aircraft to sit on flight decks and trying to add trucks, tanks and jeeps as payloads to LST's. Unfortunately the Sim Engine just wasn't up to the task, and really we were trying to do things that it wasn't designed to do.

I was digging around and found someone had made one of the Wooden FlaK Towers for CFS3. I don't know if you can convert them but it's something you might want to look into in the interim.

[kelticheart]

Wonderful objects, Pen!
:applause: :jump: :applause: :jump: :applause:


Although I am starting to get tired of being shot out of the sky.........damn', this flak is accurate!

I need Italian Air Force Tornado ECRs with their AA countermeasures........eheheheheheh!

Cheers!
KH :ernae:

[Pen32Win]

KH;

If you think those little 20mm's are nasty wait until you get a taste of this....

The ultimate "Erector Set" AA Gun, the 3.7cm FlaK 37 .... and I thought the FlaK 38 was nasty piece of engineering.... silly me.

[Seagull V]

Hello Pen

Looking diabolically awesome !!!!!!!!! :ernae:
Hope you are getting some sleep in amoungst all of these add-ons as well as setting up CFS2 for dog-fighting and ground-pounding. :kilroy:

[Discus]

Magnificent! No other words!! You are getting into such details that one would think that you will give it different sets of sights. Will you make a spare tool box too?

Bravo!!:jump::jump::jump:

[Skipsan]

My God Man that is some awesome work, detail's are wonderful :salute:

So you telling me there is; "MAY-be" it could be done maybe being the key word :wiggle:
I'll give it a go :wiggle:

Skipsan :kilroy:

[Pen32Win]

Thanks Guys;

It's almost a shame to add the shields to it...LOL.

Discus,

Unless I totally misunderstood what you're saying. This is a different sight from the 20mm FlaK 38's. The only part of it that is not new is the "Rifle Scope" portion which was only used to engage ground targets. The 3.7 FlaK 36 used the sight you see on the 20mm FlaK 38's (Flakvisier 35 or 36) and Early Version of the Flakvierling 38. This is a FlaK 37 thus the later Flakvisier 37. It's not as good looking as the earlier Flakvisier 35/36 but it is the right one.

No tool box, but I think if I look in the back I've got a Spare Barrel Box!!! LOL:ernae:

[kelticheart]

:jawdrop:

...that's all....

Cheers!
KH :ernae:

[Pen32Win]

A few more from the days work. I did something a little different with the AG/Loader and gave him a Range Finder. At this point I'm not sure if I want to add the big front shields. I've mostly seen them on vehicle mounts. Maybe I'll do both. Undicided at this point. Any who, here's more fun with FlaK.

[Discus]

A few more from the days work. I did something a little different with the AG/Loader and gave him a Range Finder. At this point I'm not sure if I want to add the big front shields. I've mostly seen them on vehicle mounts. Maybe I'll do both. Undicided at this point. Any who, here's more fun with FlaK.
34312
I´d vote for no shield. Lesser triangles, more FPS, more ingeneering beauty to see. Althoug if you see it close enough to see the magnificent details you are probably in big troubles!

Thanks again for this work.

[Pen32Win]

Thanks D;

and thanks for posting that picture. I don't think I've seen that one before.

I'm taking my time enjoying this one, it's easy on the eyes. Now that I've had some sleep I'm thinking both for Early and Late War and only without shields for DAK as I've never seen one in the MTO with them. Of course they will all have my standard 5 LOD's so they'll all be good on the FPS. I can take a 7500 Poly object in LOD 100 and have it down to 11-1500 by LOD 10 and that all happen in well under a Klick (1000M).

The next one I have to do is quite the opposite of the FlaK 37 and is probably one of the ugliest objects I've ever even thought about working on, the FlaK 43. That hardest part about that one will be staying interested.... BUT, it was a huge part of the Germans Later War AA Defenses and despite its grotesque looks was quite effective and easy to produce.

[Jagdflieger]

Here's a You Tube link to the FLAK 43:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AdENAL4AkoU

[Captain Kurt]

And a link for a 101 photo walkaround

http://www.primeportal.net/artillery/yuri_pasholok/3.7_cm_flak_43/

[Pen32Win]

Thanks Gents;

The video is one I haven't seen, very good stuff.

CK, I saved that whole series.

Just got back in town, got a ton to do, just didn't want you to think I didn't see this.

Thanks Again!!

[Rami]

Pen32Win,

I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings, but I am having a problem with installing these second batch of flak guns. When the .bgl is included in the VEH folder, I get a CTD error which will not allow me to open up mission builder. This only occurs with the second pack of guns, not the first, and I double-checked just to be sure.

I'm at a loss as to what it is...should I remove the old model files for the DAK flak guns since you have a model update for them in this package? Could that be the problem? :isadizzy:

[Pen32Win]

Rami;

It sure is the problem. I had a sequencing problem with the bgl ID numbers. That's why I included the updated BGL's. Two BGL's with the same ID is Bad Mojo. I didn't catch it right away because I run three different installs, thus I've never had ALL of them in the same Veh/Scenedb folder. Just drop the new ones in and overwrite the old. I swear I'm getting Old Timers...

[Rami]

Rami;

It sure is the problem. I had a sequencing problem with the bgl ID numbers. That's why I included the updated BGL's. Two BGL's with the same ID is Bad Mojo. I didn't catch it right away because I run three different installs, thus I've never had ALL of them in the same Veh/Scenedb folder. Just drop the new ones in and overwrite the old. I swear I'm getting Old Timers...

Pen32Win,

I have close to 1,550 objects in my objects_dp folder, so I had to cherry-pick to make a little room. It wasn't you, it was me.

[Pen32Win]

AH, yes, I remember it well, it just a few weeks ago I ran smack dab into the very wall myself.

But you really should put the new ones in to prevent the duplicate ID issue from tossing you a fit.