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View Full Version : Round 1 of the 2011 F1 Circus is upon us!!



wombat666
March 23rd, 2011, 07:42
Well, at least the season begins in the right country!!
I'm not that fussed about the whole nine yards but the Classic Car lot have finally convinced me to take the 911RS along for their show.
Free 'everything' and at least I'll catch up with some old friends again.

We might even have a look at the new F1 Devices (I can't really call them 'cars') just for a laugh!!
All joking aside, I will be interested to see the latest (mis) interpretation of the regulations.

I have to take the car down to the 'Park' this Friday morning (early!) but we get a straight run into the circuit and there won't be too much traffic around at that time of the day.

One of the 'Classics' I'm really looking forward to having a good look at is a 'scratch built' 1959 Fantuzi bodied Ferrari 246 'Dino', one of the last and the better looking front engined GP cars.
The crazed enthusiast built it around a 246 Dino block, modified almost to Grand Prix levels, then built almost everything else himself.
I say almost because several specialist helped out, things like wheels, a replica drive train and some beautiful body panels, but in essence, the car started of as a bundle of Chrome Moly tube and a welding torch!!
:jump::jump::jump:

Ferry_vO
March 23rd, 2011, 12:06
Can't wait for the 2011 season to begin! :jump:

Enough talk, time for some action and at a great track I might add!

wombat666
March 24th, 2011, 01:36
Looking damp to wet Friday and Saturday, but fine and dry (but cool) on Sunday.
Of course, Monday and Tuesday should be warm, sunny and around 25C.
:173go1:

Weather update:02:00 Friday and it is raining steadily. I don't really care who gets annoyed but I'm not driving my 911 in it. Too much time (and $$$) invested and I'm not really finished.

Ferry_vO
March 25th, 2011, 06:23
Results of the second practice session of Friday (First session was wet):

<TABLE class=raceResults cellSpacing=0 summary="" cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR><TH>Pos</TH><TH>No</TH><TH>Driver</TH><TH>Team</TH><TH>Time/Retired</TH><TH>Gap</TH><TH>Laps</TH></TR><TR><TD>1</TD><TD>4</TD><TD noWrap>Jenson Button (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/6.html)</TD><TD noWrap>McLaren-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2960.html)</TD><TD>1:25.854</TD><TD></TD><TD>32</TD></TR><TR><TD>2</TD><TD>3</TD><TD noWrap>Lewis Hamilton (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/828.html)</TD><TD noWrap>McLaren-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2960.html)</TD><TD>1:25.986</TD><TD>0.132 </TD><TD>31</TD></TR><TR><TD>3</TD><TD>5</TD><TD noWrap>Fernando Alonso (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/30.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2961.html)</TD><TD>1:26.001</TD><TD>0.147</TD><TD>28</TD></TR><TR><TD>4</TD><TD>1</TD><TD noWrap>Sebastian Vettel (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/822.html)</TD><TD noWrap>RBR-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2959.html)</TD><TD>1:26.014</TD><TD>0.160</TD><TD>35</TD></TR><TR><TD>5</TD><TD>2</TD><TD noWrap>Mark Webber (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/21.html)</TD><TD noWrap>RBR-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2959.html)</TD><TD>1:26.283</TD><TD>0.429</TD><TD>33</TD></TR><TR><TD>6</TD><TD>7</TD><TD noWrap>Michael Schumacher (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/7.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Mercedes GP (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2962.html)</TD><TD>1:26.590</TD><TD>0.736</TD><TD>31</TD></TR><TR><TD>7</TD><TD>6</TD><TD noWrap>Felipe Massa (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/18.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2961.html)</TD><TD>1:26.789</TD><TD>0.935</TD><TD>34</TD></TR><TR><TD>8</TD><TD>17</TD><TD noWrap>Sergio Perez (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/867.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Sauber-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2966.html)</TD><TD>1:27.101</TD><TD>1.247</TD><TD>39</TD></TR><TR><TD>9</TD><TD>11</TD><TD noWrap>Rubens Barrichello (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/8.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Williams-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2964.html)</TD><TD>1:27.280</TD><TD>1.426</TD><TD>34</TD></TR><TR><TD>10</TD><TD>8</TD><TD noWrap>Nico Rosberg (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/809.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Mercedes GP (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2962.html)</TD><TD>1:27.448</TD><TD>1.594</TD><TD>23</TD></TR><TR><TD>11</TD><TD>19</TD><TD noWrap>Jaime Alguersuari (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/847.html)</TD><TD noWrap>STR-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2967.html)</TD><TD>1:27.525</TD><TD>1.671</TD><TD>31</TD></TR><TR><TD>12</TD><TD>10</TD><TD noWrap>Vitaly Petrov (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/864.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2963.html)</TD><TD>1:27.528</TD><TD>1.674</TD><TD>29</TD></TR><TR><TD>13</TD><TD>9</TD><TD noWrap>Nick Heidfeld (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/16.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2963.html)</TD><TD>1:27.536</TD><TD>1.682</TD><TD>22</TD></TR><TR><TD>14</TD><TD>18</TD><TD noWrap>Sebastien Buemi (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/842.html)</TD><TD noWrap>STR-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2967.html)</TD><TD>1:27.697</TD><TD>1.843</TD><TD>30</TD></TR><TR><TD>15</TD><TD>16</TD><TD noWrap>Kamui Kobayashi (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/837.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Sauber-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2966.html)</TD><TD>1:28.095</TD><TD>2.241</TD><TD>35</TD></TR><TR><TD>16</TD><TD>15</TD><TD noWrap>Paul di Resta (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/851.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Force India-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2965.html)</TD><TD>1:28.376</TD><TD>2.522</TD><TD>33</TD></TR><TR><TD>17</TD><TD>14</TD><TD noWrap>Adrian Sutil (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/818.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Force India-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2965.html)</TD><TD>1:28.583</TD><TD>2.729</TD><TD>31</TD></TR><TR><TD>18</TD><TD>12</TD><TD noWrap>Pastor Maldonado (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/869.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Williams-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2964.html)</TD><TD>1:29.386</TD><TD>3.532</TD><TD>29</TD></TR><TR><TD>19</TD><TD>20</TD><TD noWrap>Heikki Kovalainen (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/813.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Lotus-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2968.html)</TD><TD>1:30.829</TD><TD>4.975</TD><TD>22</TD></TR><TR><TD>20</TD><TD>21</TD><TD noWrap>Jarno Trulli (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/14.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Lotus-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2968.html)</TD><TD>1:30.912</TD><TD>5.058</TD><TD>23</TD></TR><TR><TD>21</TD><TD>25</TD><TD noWrap>Jerome d'Ambrosio (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/866.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Virgin-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2969.html)</TD><TD>1:32.106</TD><TD>6.252</TD><TD>36</TD></TR><TR><TD>22</TD><TD>24</TD><TD noWrap>Timo Glock (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/791.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Virgin-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2969.html)</TD><TD>1:32.135</TD><TD>6.281</TD><TD>30</TD></TR><TR><TD>23</TD><TD>23</TD><TD noWrap>Vitantonio Liuzzi (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/802.html)</TD><TD noWrap>HRT-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2970.html)</TD><TD>No time</TD><TD></TD><TD>1</TD></TR><TR><TD>24</TD><TD>22</TD><TD noWrap>Narain Karthikeyan (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/805.html)</TD><TD noWrap>HRT-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2970.html)</TD><TD>No time</TD><TD></TD><TD>0</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Wing_Z
March 25th, 2011, 23:55
Well if Vettel looked strong last year, this year he seems in a world of his own.
Pole position by 0.8 of a second off Hamilton, 0.9 over #3 Webber, 1.2 over Button, and a second and a half over #5 Alonso.
Tragic that Kubica is injured; the Renault has never looked stronger, with Petrov in sixth!
Sauber also looking strong with Kobayashi a creditable 9th.

Also-rans: Schumacher, Barrichello and Sutil.
I liked the look of newcomers Paul di Resta and Sergio Perez, though.

There will be lots of overtaking presumably, with tyres that only last a few laps, and lots of pit stops.
Plus rear wings that can flatten by the most complicated electronic trickery, and in only certain conditions...this is right on the edge of rigging the sport as a spectacle.
I guess the fans demand it.
Not sure what the return to KERS is all about though, there's no advantage to any individual, really, and it's not all that Green either.

Naismith
March 26th, 2011, 01:01
Thank heavens, Nascar is just so much less interesting, unless you live circles.......
Uh oh now I'm in trouble. :wiggle:

demorier
March 26th, 2011, 01:38
I'd love to just shove one in Burnie's ear at the moment....."you know all that whinging you do about the Aussie GP each year, well we are way past civil wars in this country and the F1 show can continue. You know what TV recorders are for...well we use them all the time."

Ferry_vO
March 26th, 2011, 03:05
Full results:

<TABLE class=raceResults cellSpacing=0 summary="" cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR><TH>Pos</TH><TH>No</TH><TH>Driver</TH><TH>Team</TH><TH>Q1</TH><TH>Q2</TH><TH>Q3</TH><TH>Laps</TH></TR><TR><TD>1</TD><TD>1</TD><TD noWrap>Sebastian Vettel (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/822.html)</TD><TD noWrap>RBR-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2959.html)</TD><TD>1:25.296 </TD><TD>1:24.090 </TD><TD>1:23.529 </TD><TD>16</TD></TR><TR><TD>2</TD><TD>3</TD><TD noWrap>Lewis Hamilton (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/828.html)</TD><TD noWrap>McLaren-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2960.html)</TD><TD>1:25.384</TD><TD>1:24.595</TD><TD>1:24.307</TD><TD>19</TD></TR><TR><TD>3</TD><TD>2</TD><TD noWrap>Mark Webber (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/21.html)</TD><TD noWrap>RBR-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2959.html)</TD><TD>1:25.900</TD><TD>1:24.658</TD><TD>1:24.395</TD><TD>15</TD></TR><TR><TD>4</TD><TD>4</TD><TD noWrap>Jenson Button (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/6.html)</TD><TD noWrap>McLaren-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2960.html)</TD><TD>1:25.886</TD><TD>1:24.957</TD><TD>1:24.779</TD><TD>18</TD></TR><TR><TD>5</TD><TD>5</TD><TD noWrap>Fernando Alonso (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/30.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2961.html)</TD><TD>1:25.707</TD><TD>1:25.242</TD><TD>1:24.974</TD><TD>19</TD></TR><TR><TD>6</TD><TD>10</TD><TD noWrap>Vitaly Petrov (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/864.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2963.html)</TD><TD>1:25.543</TD><TD>1:25.582</TD><TD>1:25.247</TD><TD>18</TD></TR><TR><TD>7</TD><TD>8</TD><TD noWrap>Nico Rosberg (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/809.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Mercedes GP (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2962.html)</TD><TD>1:25.856</TD><TD>1:25.606</TD><TD>1:25.421</TD><TD>17</TD></TR><TR><TD>8</TD><TD>6</TD><TD noWrap>Felipe Massa (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/18.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2961.html)</TD><TD>1:26.031</TD><TD>1:25.611</TD><TD>1:25.599</TD><TD>18</TD></TR><TR><TD>9</TD><TD>16</TD><TD noWrap>Kamui Kobayashi (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/837.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Sauber-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2966.html)</TD><TD>1:25.717</TD><TD>1:25.405</TD><TD>1:25.626</TD><TD>17</TD></TR><TR><TD>10</TD><TD>18</TD><TD noWrap>Sebastien Buemi (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/842.html)</TD><TD noWrap>STR-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2967.html)</TD><TD>1:26.232</TD><TD>1:25.882</TD><TD>1:27.066</TD><TD>15</TD></TR><TR><TD>11</TD><TD>7</TD><TD noWrap>Michael Schumacher (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/7.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Mercedes GP (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2962.html)</TD><TD>1:25.962</TD><TD>1:25.971</TD><TD></TD><TD>13</TD></TR><TR><TD>12</TD><TD>19</TD><TD noWrap>Jaime Alguersuari (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/847.html)</TD><TD noWrap>STR-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2967.html)</TD><TD>1:26.620</TD><TD>1:26.103</TD><TD></TD><TD>11</TD></TR><TR><TD>13</TD><TD>17</TD><TD noWrap>Sergio Perez (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/867.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Sauber-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2966.html)</TD><TD>1:25.812</TD><TD>1:26.108</TD><TD></TD><TD>9</TD></TR><TR><TD>14</TD><TD>15</TD><TD noWrap>Paul di Resta (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/851.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Force India-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2965.html)</TD><TD>1:27.222</TD><TD>1:26.739</TD><TD></TD><TD>16</TD></TR><TR><TD>15</TD><TD>12</TD><TD noWrap>Pastor Maldonado (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/869.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Williams-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2964.html)</TD><TD>1:26.298</TD><TD>1:26.768</TD><TD></TD><TD>17</TD></TR><TR><TD>16</TD><TD>14</TD><TD noWrap>Adrian Sutil (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/818.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Force India-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2965.html)</TD><TD>1:26.245</TD><TD>1:31.407</TD><TD></TD><TD>15</TD></TR><TR><TD>17</TD><TD>11</TD><TD noWrap>Rubens Barrichello (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/8.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Williams-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2964.html)</TD><TD>1:26.270</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD>12</TD></TR><TR><TD>18</TD><TD>9</TD><TD noWrap>Nick Heidfeld (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/16.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2963.html)</TD><TD>1:27.239</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD>10</TD></TR><TR><TD>19</TD><TD>20</TD><TD noWrap>Heikki Kovalainen (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/813.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Lotus-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2968.html)</TD><TD>1:29.254</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD>10</TD></TR><TR><TD>20</TD><TD>21</TD><TD noWrap>Jarno Trulli (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/14.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Lotus-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2968.html)</TD><TD>1:29.342</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD>12</TD></TR><TR><TD>21</TD><TD>24</TD><TD noWrap>Timo Glock (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/791.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Virgin-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2969.html)</TD><TD>1:29.858</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD>10</TD></TR><TR><TD>22</TD><TD>25</TD><TD noWrap>Jerome d'Ambrosio (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/866.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Virgin-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2969.html)</TD><TD>1:30.822</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD>8</TD></TR><TR><TD>23</TD><TD>23</TD><TD noWrap>Vitantonio Liuzzi (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/802.html)</TD><TD noWrap>HRT-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2970.html)</TD><TD>1:32.978</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD>11</TD></TR><TR><TD>24</TD><TD>22</TD><TD noWrap>Narain Karthikeyan (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/805.html)</TD><TD noWrap>HRT-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2970.html)</TD><TD>1:34.293</TD><TD></TD><TD></TD><TD>11</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Liuzzi and Karthikeyan did not qualify after failing to meet the Q1 107 percent time of 1:31.266.

Panther_99FS
March 26th, 2011, 03:58
Thank heavens, Nascar is just so much less interesting, unless you live circles.......
Uh oh now I'm in trouble. :wiggle:

F1 is getting less interesting each year as the ruling body bans anything to do with power....

Panther_99FS
March 26th, 2011, 03:59
Good to see young Nico ahead of Michael yet again.....

Ferry_vO
March 26th, 2011, 04:09
F1 is getting less interesting each year as the ruling body bans anything to do with power....

Which is why Vettel was 0.4 seconds faster than last year..? :wiggle:

Panther_99FS
March 26th, 2011, 04:44
Which is why Vettel was 0.4 seconds faster than last year..? :wiggle:

I'm talking horsepower and engine size.....but I know you like to mock me at every opportunity that you can ;)

Ferry_vO
March 26th, 2011, 05:12
They been trying to slow down F1 cars for decades now, and from a safety point I can understand why, but the engines have been cut down from the Turbo's of the eighties to the 3.5 liters, 3.0 liter V10 and now to the 2.4 liter V8, but the cars keep going faster almost every season!

Of course this year we have the movable rear wing, KERS and the new Pirelli tires. The tires wear faster, giving more grip for the first few laps. Tomorrow we'll see a lot more pitstops compared to last year and probably a few different stategies.

As for Vettel: Yes he was quick, but he never finished a race in Australia!

Panther_99FS
March 26th, 2011, 07:43
Slowing down the cars is in part, why INDYCAR is so boring now....When they were 900hp turbocharged monsters, they began to rival F1 in popularity...Now, Indycar is 650hp laughing stock....

I'd hate to see F1 get to the point where drivers are just flat-footing it around the track...

Cazzie
March 26th, 2011, 09:13
Looked a bit like last year, Deja Vu.

Panther_99FS
March 26th, 2011, 09:27
I'd like to see a couple of the Cosworth's up there but oh well....

Wing_Z
March 27th, 2011, 00:17
Cosworths...not any time soon.
Nice to see the Lotus name on the podium though - what a stunning drive into third by Petrov!
Hamilton a creditable second.

But that young man in the front Red Bull made it look all too easy...lapped the 10th-place car.
He looks every inch the World Champion, very relaxed, very in control of the situation.
The car just dances for him.

Bit surprised the fancy "overtaking aids" didn't really feature, maybe other tracks are more suited.

Ferry_vO
March 27th, 2011, 03:31
Full results:

<TABLE class=raceResults cellSpacing=0 summary="" cellPadding=0><TBODY><TR><TH>Pos</TH><TH>No</TH><TH>Driver</TH><TH>Team</TH><TH> Laps</TH><TH>Time/Retired</TH><TH> Grid </TH><TH title=Points>Pts</TH></TR><TR><TD>1</TD><TD>1</TD><TD noWrap>Sebastian Vettel (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/822.html)</TD><TD noWrap>RBR-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2959.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>1:29:30.259</TD><TD>1</TD><TD>25</TD></TR><TR><TD>2</TD><TD>3</TD><TD noWrap>Lewis Hamilton (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/828.html)</TD><TD noWrap>McLaren-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2960.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>+22.2 secs</TD><TD>2</TD><TD>18</TD></TR><TR><TD>3</TD><TD>10</TD><TD noWrap>Vitaly Petrov (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/864.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2963.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>+30.5 secs</TD><TD>6</TD><TD>15</TD></TR><TR><TD>4</TD><TD>5</TD><TD noWrap>Fernando Alonso (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/30.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2961.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>+31.7 secs</TD><TD>5</TD><TD>12</TD></TR><TR><TD>5</TD><TD>2</TD><TD noWrap>Mark Webber (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/21.html)</TD><TD noWrap>RBR-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2959.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>+38.1 secs</TD><TD>3</TD><TD>10</TD></TR><TR><TD>6</TD><TD>4</TD><TD noWrap>Jenson Button (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/6.html)</TD><TD noWrap>McLaren-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2960.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>+54.3 secs</TD><TD>4</TD><TD>8</TD></TR><TR><TD>7</TD><TD>17</TD><TD noWrap>Sergio Perez (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/867.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Sauber-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2966.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>+65.8 secs</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>6</TD></TR><TR><TD>8</TD><TD>16</TD><TD noWrap>Kamui Kobayashi (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/837.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Sauber-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2966.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>+76.8 secs</TD><TD>9</TD><TD>4</TD></TR><TR><TD>9</TD><TD>6</TD><TD noWrap>Felipe Massa (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/18.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2961.html)</TD><TD>58</TD><TD>+85.1 secs</TD><TD>8</TD><TD>2</TD></TR><TR><TD>10</TD><TD>18</TD><TD noWrap>Sebastien Buemi (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/842.html)</TD><TD noWrap>STR-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2967.html)</TD><TD>57</TD><TD>+1 Lap</TD><TD>10</TD><TD>1</TD></TR><TR><TD>11</TD><TD>14</TD><TD noWrap>Adrian Sutil (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/818.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Force India-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2965.html)</TD><TD>57</TD><TD>+1 Lap</TD><TD>16</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>12</TD><TD>15</TD><TD noWrap>Paul di Resta (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/851.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Force India-Mercedes (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2965.html)</TD><TD>57</TD><TD>+1 Lap</TD><TD>14</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>13</TD><TD>19</TD><TD noWrap>Jaime Alguersuari (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/847.html)</TD><TD noWrap>STR-Ferrari (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2967.html)</TD><TD>57</TD><TD>+1 Lap</TD><TD>12</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>14</TD><TD>9</TD><TD noWrap>Nick Heidfeld (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/16.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2963.html)</TD><TD>57</TD><TD>+1 Lap</TD><TD>18</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>15</TD><TD>21</TD><TD noWrap>Jarno Trulli (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/14.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Lotus-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2968.html)</TD><TD>56</TD><TD>+2 Laps</TD><TD>20</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>16</TD><TD>25</TD><TD noWrap>Jerome d'Ambrosio (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/866.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Virgin-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2969.html)</TD><TD>54</TD><TD>+4 Laps</TD><TD>22</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>Ret</TD><TD>24</TD><TD noWrap>Timo Glock (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/791.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Virgin-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2969.html)</TD><TD>49</TD><TD>Mechanical</TD><TD>21</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>Ret</TD><TD>11</TD><TD noWrap>Rubens Barrichello (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/8.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Williams-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2964.html)</TD><TD>48</TD><TD>Transmission</TD><TD>17</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>Ret</TD><TD>8</TD><TD noWrap>Nico Rosberg (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/809.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Mercedes GP (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2962.html)</TD><TD>22</TD><TD>Accident damage</TD><TD>7</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>Ret</TD><TD>20</TD><TD noWrap>Heikki Kovalainen (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/813.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Lotus-Renault (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2968.html)</TD><TD>19</TD><TD>Water leak</TD><TD>19</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>Ret</TD><TD>7</TD><TD noWrap>Michael Schumacher (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/7.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Mercedes GP (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2962.html)</TD><TD>19</TD><TD>Puncture damage</TD><TD>11</TD><TD></TD></TR><TR><TD>Ret</TD><TD>12</TD><TD noWrap>Pastor Maldonado (http://www.formula1.com/results/driver/2011/869.html)</TD><TD noWrap>Williams-Cosworth (http://www.formula1.com/results/team/2011/2964.html)</TD><TD>9</TD><TD>Transmission</TD><TD>15</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Ferry_vO
March 27th, 2011, 03:39
Cosworths...not any time soon..

The only team that could score some points would be Williams, but their tiny new gearbox seems way too fragile at the moment.


Nice to see the Lotus name on the podium though - what a stunning drive into third by Petrov!
Hamilton a creditable second.

Good drive by Petrov; makes you wonder what Kubica could have done? Not sure if the Pirelli tires would fit his agressive driving style though.
Hamilton and Button did well; after some bad tests they tossed some 'too revolutionary' stuff overboard, and with a more conventional car they've gained a lot of time.


But that young man in the front Red Bull made it look all too easy...lapped the 10th-place car.

..And they didn't even use the KERS system! :monkies:


Bit surprised the fancy "overtaking aids" didn't really feature, maybe other tracks are more suited.

It was fun to watch Button and Massa; Jenson trying to overtake with his rear wing, and Massa defending with his KERS system.

Mercedes was quite unlucky with both cars suffering damage and retiring.
Great job by Sauber; how they've managed to get Perez to the finish with only one pitstop is beyond me! Overall the rookies left quite a good impression this weekend.

wombat666
March 27th, 2011, 03:39
Driver of the weekend in F1, Vitaly Petrov, even if his car is a Faux Lotus!!
Smooth and consistently fast all weekend.
Sergio Perez and Paul di Resta might be 'new boys' but they look like the real deal, di Resta reminded me of Dario Franchitti.
And while it is sad that Kubica is out of it, let us not forget Petrov finished last year ahead of the Fonz and started this season in the same way.

Epic Fails: KERS, DRS, Nick Heidfeld, Rubens Barrichello and Pastor Maldonado.

Driver of the weekend in V8 Supercars, Jason Richards, despite undergoing intensive chemotherapy for Stomach Cancer ( Jason has six months I believe) he drove with all his usual commitment.
:ernae:
Time has just gone 22:40 and I'm rooted, off to get a solid nights sleep.

Ferry_vO
March 27th, 2011, 03:49
di Resta reminded me of Dario Franchitti.

They are related IIRC..

wombat666
March 27th, 2011, 03:57
Just in!!!

"Saubers disqualified due to rear wing infringement
27 March 2011
2011 Australian Formula 1 Grand Prix: Sunday race results

The Sauber driver pairing of Kamui Kobayashi and Sergio Pérez have been disqualified from the Australian Grand Prix due to a technical infringement with ‘the uppermost rear wing element’ of the C31. Both drivers will now lose their points finishes, with Massa, Buemi and both Force India drivers moving up places.

A section from the FIA Technical Report reads:

'Except for the uppermost rear wing element of car numbers 16 and 17 (see previous technical report), all car weights and the items checked were found to be in conformity with the 2011 FIA Formula One Technical Regulations.' "

And we all know who benefits from this!!!
:censored:

Panther_99FS
March 27th, 2011, 08:06
Just in!!!

"Saubers disqualified due to rear wing infringement


--> http://formula-one.speedtv.com/article/f1-sergio-perez-kamui-kobayashi-disqualified-from-australian-gp/

stiz
March 27th, 2011, 12:02
in a way i kinda wish they'd get rid of electric gadets and a gazzlion buttons around the place .... just give em the bare min needed to drive a car and allow free reign on body parts so long as the car didnt go over a certain width or height and they could only spend X amount of money on it.

Also why dont they just check the cars out before the race ... then rule them illeagle or not at the start .. its not like they dont have the access!!!!

Naismith
March 27th, 2011, 13:05
[QUOTE=stiz;566247]in a way i kinda wish they'd get rid of electric gadets and a gazzlion buttons around the place .... just give em the bare min needed to drive a car.....QUOTE]

Like a clutch and gear shift..... that would separate them men from the boys.... I like it :jump:

EasyEd
March 27th, 2011, 16:41
Hey All,

Naismith you got it right!

NASCAR men have cars with clutches, gearshifts, working reverse and even carburetors not like them F1 boys. Not only that NASCAR drivers know how to turn left and right and compete against 42 other cars not a measly 23. Not only that NASCAR tracks feature a huge variety of driving conditions and real opportunities to pass combined with no team orders to pull over and park. Turning left isn't so boring when you have to drive the car in a crowd and contact is a part of the strategy of the race.

Ferry do you still have that link for how much Red Bull NASCAR teams spend and how many cars they use? I need to bookmark that. BTW the Red Bull teams were good today - in my opinion with the drivers Red Bull has right now in Vickers and Kahne they should easily become one of the Tier one NASCAR teams.

-Ed-

wombat666
March 27th, 2011, 18:55
NASCAR men have cars with clutches, gearshifts, working reverse and even carburetors not like them F1 boys. Not only that NASCAR drivers know how to turn left and right and compete against 42 other cars not a measly 23. Not only that NASCAR tracks feature a huge variety of driving conditions and real opportunities to pass combined with no team orders to pull over and park. Turning left isn't so boring when you have to drive the car in a crowd and contact is a part of the strategy of the race.
-Ed-

One stone age 'carburettor' on a pushrod iron block with an archaic four speed gearbox driving a beam axle???

I suppose you could say 'turning left and right' is true, as most need to 'turn right' after crashing into the infield.
Of course, the only two proper road circuits these 'men' run on are dominated by sporty car 'boys'.

Driving in a series where driving into your opposition is encouraged???
IIRC that goes under the heading of 'Saturday Night Demolition Derby'.

No start and park orders???
What just happened with Jennifer Jo Cobb a couple of weeks ago????

I notice the 'huge variety of driving conditions' doesn't include wet weather, not even damp weather, come to think of it, spit on a NASCAR oval and out comes the pace car.

:sleep::sleep::sleep::sleep::sleep::sleep:

Ed, as far as I'm concerned 'Formula 1' has been dead and buried for over 25 years at least.
I'm really pissed about the idiotic 'high technology cutting edge' gadgets and other such stupidity.
Mean minded 'regulations' such as those applied in this case are to be expected these days.
I'm with stitz in spirit, a racing car should be a 'car', not an electronic aerodynamic abomination.
But, and there's always one, I believe that anything available on a street legal production car should be allowed in F1............and don't get me started on the so-called 'Aerodynamics'!!

However, the fact remains that Formula One is an 'International' series, like it or not, while NASCAR is just a 'Domestic' series tailored to suit a certain audience in a single country.
Indeed, NASCAR 'administration' is just as bad as F1, so maybe the pot calling the kettle black is not very clever.
:173go1:

EasyEd
March 27th, 2011, 20:32
Hey All,

Wombat you should look at the history of winners at Watkins Glen and Infineon some time.

Watkins Glen
http://www.nascar.com/kyn/nbtn/cup/data/tracks/wgi_winners.html

Infineon
http://www.nascar.com/kyn/nbtn/cup/data/tracks/spr_winners.html

I do not see where either of these tracks have been dominated by any other than NASCAR "regulars" who know how to handle a gearshift and a clutch.

Bump and run is a legitimate tactic in racing - it beats the heck out of just watching the who can out-brake who in a corner contest - that is boring. In addition in NASCAR you've got highline versus lowline meaning more than one groove racing - you never see that in F1.

Start and Park should be outlawed in NASCAR but it is more honest than pull over so the other driver can win. To this day F1 will not simply totally outlaw team orders. Why?

Racing should be about individual car teams and drivers not about self centered egotistical snob owners who actually think the racing is about them. If they want it to be about them why don't they get into cars and settle it among themselves? When I go to F1 sites I see polls asking which driver is going to win the championship not which owner.

People go to a race to see a driver and his team win not the owner. I couldn't careless whether Childress cars beat Hendrick cars or Gibbs cars or Roush cars - nor do I worry about which brand wins (although I like to see Dodge win) but I do enjoy watching Jimmie Johnson beat Denny Hamlin. On the other hand I do like to see Joey Logano do well and both Hamlin and Logano are Gibbs Toyota drivers.

Do F1 fans go to a race to see if Lewis Hamilton can beat Sebastion Vettel or do they care the most deeply about whether or not a McLaren can beat a Red Bull? What I see is ever increasing interest in the drivers over the brands. This is fundamentally the way it should be as people are most interested in people.

A series based on the idea of technological innovation and run what ya brung might be interesting but that is not the concept behind F1 today or any series that I know of. They are all very strictly rule based - in the interest of evening out the competition and safety. So the idea behind F1 is no different than NASCAR - keep the cars relatively equal and slow them down and keep it safe. This owner based stuff is increasingly becoming nothing but an anachronism.

I would also suggest that NASCAR short tracks, restrictor plate races, road races and then the different layouts of the other tracks provides more variety than you get in F1 tracks and styles of racing.

43 cars on a half mile track at Bristol in the rain? that is just nuts. Unlike F1 in NASCAR cars tend to run in groups and not be strung out all over the track as much - rain would be nothing but havoc under those conditions. That said I think a rain race might be workable under some conditions in NASCAR - be an interesting experiment.

Your last point about international versus domestic as if domestic is in some way inferior is just baffling. There is absolutely no legitimacy to the concept that international is automatically superior to domestic simply by virtue of being international. I'll take good hard domestic driver and his team (driver, cc, and pit crew) against driver and his team racing over team orders to benefit an owner any day.

-Ed-

An edit: I think for this year just because my favorite food is Mexican I'll cheer for Sergio Perez and Sauber Ferrari. I believe the third driver for Sauber is Mexican as well.

stiz
March 27th, 2011, 21:53
Bump and run is a legitimate tactic in racing - it beats the heck out of just watching the who can out-brake who in a corner contest - that is boring. In addition in NASCAR you've got highline versus lowline meaning more than one groove racing - you never see that in F1.

I personaly dont mind it .. it can get pretty hairy and if you overdo it in an f1 car and go either in the gravel or into the wall then its pretty much race over, when cars are always doing it it just becomes normanl


Start and Park should be outlawed in NASCAR but it is more honest than pull over so the other driver can win. To this day F1 will not simply totally outlaw team orders. Why?Because its unforceable really .. as last year kinda prooves, allthough it is obvious!


Racing should be about individual car teams and drivers not about self centered egotistical snob owners who actually think the racing is about them.

People go to a race to see a driver and his team win not the owner. I couldn't careless whether Childress cars beat Hendrick cars or Gibbs cars or Roush cars - nor do I worry about which brand wins (although I like to see Dodge win) but I do enjoy watching Jimmie Johnson beat Denny Hamlin. On the other hand I do like to see Joey Logano do well and both Hamlin and Logano are Gibbs Toyota drivers.

Do F1 fans go to a race to see if Lewis Hamilton can beat Sebastion Vettel or do they care the most deeply about whether or not a McLaren can beat a Red Bull? What I see is ever increasing interest in the drivers over the brands. This is fundamentally the way it should be as people are most interested in people.I've never heard the team owners say its all about them .. infact most of the time its centred on the drivers, the team and car is 2nd. The drivers make the car .. which nick heidfeld showed to perfection ...



I would also suggest that NASCAR short tracks, restrictor plate races, road races and then the different layouts of the other tracks provides more variety than you get in F1 tracks and styles of racing.Tottally disagree with that .... its all oval apart from road american, watkins glen and circuit gilles villeneuve. Yes i know they have low and high lines, but their still ovals with no variation. Also .... wasnt watkins glen and f1 circuit way back :rolleyes:

wombat666
March 28th, 2011, 01:05
Ed,
Most of the winners on the road circuits are either 'open wheel' drivers like Tony Stewart and Robbie Gordon, or drivers who are/were extremely talented all rounders, Jeff Gordon, Tim Richmond, Mark Martin for example, along with a few who I always regarded as being wasted (more or less) in restricting their outings to ovals.

The only reason I'm tolerating what passes as F1 today is because I support Mark Webber, having known him from way back when he started in FF1600.
I'll admit to thoroughly liking Jenson Button and 'The Fonz' (Alonso) simply because they race and use their brains.
As for following 'Teams', like I said, that died about 20 years ago.

I use EXACTLY the same rationale when spotty youths rave on about our V8 Supercar Series being the 'Best Racing in the World' .................. it is 'entertaining' but it is an Australian Series.
Much to my disgust, these cars are heading down the chute, tube frames are being worked into the regulations a couple of years down the track, along with more regulations for supposed parity.

I've said it before, there is NO such thing as 'Parity' in car racing.

And you miss my point regarding F1 regulations, I can walk into a showroom today and buy an all wheel drive, turbo charged, automatic road car fitted with ABS, and in most engine configurations, inline 4, inline 6, flat 4, flat 6, V4, V6, V8 and v12, as well as a choice of diesel or petrol in whatever capacity I desire.

So F1, with a 'spec' engine design that includes such idiotic rules like crankshafts being the same length, V8 only configuration with the angle of the 'V' being fixed, no ABS, no T/C and an arbitrary number of engines and transmissions allowed over a year is hardly cutting edge technology.
From the ridiculous aerodynamics and the constant radio 'coaching', plus the continued use of carbon/carbon braking systems, the old 'Racing Improves the Breed' philosophy means nothing.
I'm not saying 'Production Based' components or even 'Run What Yer Brung' is the way to go, my view is that Formula One should be going back to the concept of developing and innovating really practical technical advances, while not banning equipment (such as ABS) that is commonly available.
It is either the real cutting edge of Automotive Technology or it takes the path of 'Entertainment' and becomes as dumb as IRL ...... the motorsport equivalent of a bag of hammers.
I KNOW ovals are different, being a devoted CART fan up to the advent of IRL I understand the difference between Nazareth, Phoenix, Fontana and Michigan, but CART had the sense to run ovals, street circuits and 'proper' road racing circuits.

Regarding those who control F1 today, most are the sort of people who I wouldn't urinate on if they were on fire.
Equally, the NASCAR and V8 Supercars hierarchy are much the same, nothing to do with 'Motorsport', everything is about money.
No 'Team Orders' in NASCAR eh??
Ed, as you insist on repeating, didn't Mark Martin 'blow his engine' to allow his team mate to 'win' the title one year???
:icon_eek:


Must be time for my medication!!!

:ernae:

Ferry_vO
March 28th, 2011, 12:01
I'm not saying 'Production Based' components or even 'Run What Yer Brung' is the way to go, my view is that Formula One should be going back to the concept of developing and innovating really practical technical advances, while not banning equipment (such as ABS) that is commonly available.


The main problem is the money needed to develop such cars; give Adrian Newey an open set of rules and he'll create something 20 seconds a lap faster than the current cars, but who's going to pay for it? Costs in F1 were rising out of control, which is why we lost BMW, Toyota, Honda and a lot of smaller teams the last years. They are trying to find a balance between cost and show at the moment, starting with standard components and limiting freedom of the designers/engineers.


Do F1 fans go to a race to see if Lewis Hamilton can beat Sebastion Vettel or do they care the most deeply about whether or not a McLaren can beat a Red Bull? What I see is ever increasing interest in the drivers over the brands. This is fundamentally the way it should be as people are most interested in people.

Ask the Italians who they favor: Ferrari or the Ferrari drivers. No driver has ever been bigger than the team to the 'Tifosi'.



Ferry do you still have that link for how much Red Bull NASCAR teams spend and how many cars they use? I need to bookmark that.


??

Ed, the 'F1 vs. Nascar' discussion is pointless; it's pretty much the same as 'Boeing vs. Airbus' or others like that. You like one or the other and it's impossible to change the other guy's mind.

wombat666
March 28th, 2011, 19:27
Ed, the 'F1 vs. Nascar' discussion is pointless; it's pretty much the same as 'Boeing vs. Airbus' or others like that. You like one or the other and it's impossible to change the other guy's mind.

'Bench Racing' at its best!
At least we can agree to disagree without being obnoxious.
Shame we can't be sitting around face to face and having our discussions over a nice cold beer!!
:ernae:

EasyEd
March 28th, 2011, 20:48
Hey All,

OK a cold beer it is but I believe we can agree that it'll have to be Canadian beer cause that is the best! :bump:

In all honesty F1 could be good racing if more than about 6 cars (Red Bull, McLaren and Ferrari) were competitive there was some passing and team orders were flat out outlawed. The Canadian race last year was actually pretty good.

-Ed-

PS I can never forget Schumacher and Barrichello in 2001 AND 2002 Austria. How F1 and Ferrari could EVER claim any honor after those two displays is absolutely, utterly and totally beyond me. Schumacher's 5 Championships in a row are an absolute sham - at least he did hand Barrichello the 1st place trophy on the podium in 2002 - cost Ferrari $1,000,000 a pittance to them - it should have been $1,000,000,000 and make it hurt. I knew right then and there everything F1 stood for. Jimmie Johnson got his honest.

Ferry_vO
March 29th, 2011, 04:30
I notice the 'huge variety of driving conditions' doesn't include wet weather, not even damp weather, come to think of it, spit on a NASCAR oval and out comes the pace car.


I would love to see a NASCAR in the wet on an oval! Start spinning at Talledega and you won't stop until you slide into either the Pacific or Atlantic ocean.. :icon_lol: ;)

Panther_99FS
March 29th, 2011, 09:28
PS I can never forget Schumacher and Barrichello in 2001 AND 2002 Austria.

Worst Schumacher "offense" IMHO was Adelaide, 1994.....

wombat666
March 29th, 2011, 14:46
Agree 110% Ed, and that was just the beginning!
:173go1:

Wing_Z
March 29th, 2011, 19:49
Ooh let's get the boot in: Darkest Deed, or perhaps Most Regretted, May 2006, Monaco.
"Parking your car on the final corner in qualifying so no-one can better your time."
He was stripped of pole, and so Alonso was able to win.