New computer with Windows 7... 64 bit question.......

[luckydog]

Computer should arrive anyday now......

AMD Phenom 2.6 GHZ (I think I screwed up there...)
64 bit 6 core processor
8 GB DDR3
1 TB HD
1 GB ATI 5570

my questions are: what will I need to download to get FSX up and running smoothly ??

and anybody have any probs with FSX and W7-64bit ???

Thanx....

LD

[Gdavis101]

I run Windows 7 64bit with a dual core Intel E8500 and it handles it nicely.

[falcon409]

. . . . .AMD Phenom 2.6 GHZ (I think I screwed up there...)
LD
Yep:salute:

[pilottj]

w7 64 pro here since last october, FSX has run fine on it since:jump: just a little glitch with activating scenery that has been documented.

[warchild]

i run fsx fine on a q6600 at 2.6 mhz. you should be fine right out of the box plus a few of jesus' tweaks..

[Paul K]

Win 7 64-bit here, and no problems at all ( other than that scenery activation glitch that Pilottj mentioned ).

[GypsyBaron]

I installed Win7 64 in a dual boot configuration with my existing XP Pro.

FSX runs just fine and the latest nVidea drivers for my video card are smooth with
no need for nHancer or any additional utilities.

Some tips:

Do NOT install FSX in the default location! Install it either directly to the root directory
of your drive or 1 level down at the most. Install the SDK the same way.

Choose "Run as Administrator" when installing those, and any addons for that matter.

The first thing I did was tune UAC OFF! Then I went to the Win7 locations that FSX
puts the various cfg files, etc, and set them to "Full Access" so I do not get any
"not allowed" messages. I like to set bookmarks to those directories on my desktop
or in a desktop folder labeled "FSX Shorcuts" so I can get to them easily without having
to stumble around in the rather obtuse Win7 directory system.

When you start adding your addons, do them 1 or 2 at a time and reboot and run FSX to
insure there are now hidden issues.

Paul

[luckydog]

I installed Win7 64 in a dual boot configuration with my existing XP Pro.

FSX runs just fine and the latest nVidea drivers for my video card are smooth with
no need for nHancer or any additional utilities.

Some tips:

Do NOT install FSX in the default location! Install it either directly to the root directory
of your drive or 1 level down at the most. Install the SDK the same way.

Choose "Run as Administrator" when installing those, and any addons for that matter.

The first thing I did was tune UAC OFF! Then I went to the Win7 locations that FSX
puts the various cfg files, etc, and set them to "Full Access" so I do not get any
"not allowed" messages. I like to set bookmarks to those directories on my desktop
or in a desktop folder labeled "FSX Shorcuts" so I can get to them easily without having
to stumble around in the rather obtuse Win7 directory system.

When you start adding your addons, do them 1 or 2 at a time and reboot and run FSX to
insure there are now hidden issues.

Paul

So the "default" location ISN'T the root directory of the drive ????
Where is the default location?
Thanks for the reminder to add SDK.....I'd forgotten all about that....

UPS tracking shows everything should arrive tomorrow (Sat.)
I hope the "old lady" doesn't have any plans.........................cause she'll be on her own!!

Thanks for the advice and tips !!!!

LD

[Dangerousdave26]

By default he means in the Program Files or Program Files (86)

I created my own folder C:\Flightsim to install FSX and FS9.

It works fine.

A note about Program Files folder and Program Files (86)

Programs which do not require or do not support 64 bit architecture get installed in the Programs Files folder (or any other folder for that matter).

Programs which need or will benefit from 64 bit architecture support must be installed in the Program Files (86) folder. Programs which are launched from this folder use different drivers to allow them to use the 64 bit architecture.

My FSX is running great outside of the (86) folder but some times I wonder if it would be better with in the (86) folder. I am not willing to move it to find out. To install it in the (86) folder you would need to turn off UAC ( I do not suggest this) or learn how to modify files with in that folder. W7 is very picky about letting you do that. Which makes adding paints and editing cfgs a pain.

[Navy Chief]

The first thing I did was tune UAC OFF......... Then I went to the Win7 locations that FSX puts the various cfg files, etc, and set them to "Full Access" so I do not get any
"not allowed" messages.....


Could you please tell me what UAC is?

And please tell me where I can configure "Full Access" for the various FSX files?

Thank you.

NC

[luckydog]

By default he means in the Program Files or Program Files (86)

I created my own folder C:\Flightsim to install FSX and FS9.

It works fine.

A note about Program Files folder and Program Files (86)

Programs which do not require or do not support 64 bit architecture get installed in the Programs Files folder (or any other folder for that matter).

Programs which need or will benefit from 64 bit architecture support must be installed in the Program Files (86) folder. Programs which are launched from this folder use different drivers to allow them to use the 64 bit architecture.

My FSX is running great outside of the (86) folder but some times I wonder if it would be better with in the (86) folder. I am not willing to move it to find out. To install it in the (86) folder you would need to turn off UAC ( I do not suggest this) or learn how to modify files with in that folder. W7 is very picky about letting you do that. Which makes adding paints and editing cfgs a pain.


"I created my own folder C:\Flightsim to install FSX and FS9.".....Dangerousdave.

OK.....I'm catching on here........

Thanks !!!

LD

[Dangerousdave26]

Could you please tell me what UAC is?

And please tell me where I can configure "Full Access" for the various FSX files?

Thank you.

NC

UAC stands for User Account Controls. Its a security feature on the whole OS that prevent or helps prevent Malware and virusus from altering files on your system. It does this by not allowing files in certain locations to be changed with out Admin approval (your user account does not function with Admin privileges they need to be invoked).

If you turn it off any program or malware can change any file without intervention on your part. If you can live with that possibility then you can turn it off. I still don't recommend it.

One of the grips people had for years about the windows OS is that is was insecure. Well this is security. Its very similar to how Linux distributions do it.

If someone does not beat me to it I will post later on how to turn off UAC I don't have my W7 PC running and its time to go to work.

[Javis]

Could you please tell me what UAC is?

User Account Control

Click Start and type UAC in the search window, pull the slider that will be presented all the way down. ( learned this when my Acelleration DVD would not install... )


And please tell me where I can configure "Full Access" for the various FSX files?

F.i. Right click fsx.cfg , select Properties, select Security, here you can control all authorisation settings pertaining to a particular file or folder you have currently no access to.


@Dangerousdave : can we safely assume that FSX does NOT benefit from 64bit architecture ??..... ( i have FSX installed on a seperate drive, running W7/64 for the first time, FSX runs fabulous ( i7 980x,GF 480GTX,12GB Mem) but only *when* it runs.... never encountered so much BSODs/FSX locks with XP.... )

cheers,
jan

[Z-IanMCD]

User Account Control

Click Start and type UAC in the search window, pull the slider that will be presented all the way down. ( learned this when my Acelleration DVD would not install... )



F.i. Right click fsx.cfg , select Properties, select Security, here you can control all authorisation settings pertaining to a particular file or folder you have currently no access to.


@Dangerousdave : can we safely assume that FSX does NOT benefit from 64bit architecture ??..... ( i have FSX installed on a seperate drive, running W7/64 for the first time, FSX runs fabulous ( i7 980x,GF 480GTX,12GB Mem) but only *when* it runs.... never encountered so much BSODs/FSX locks with XP.... )

cheers,
jan

Jan,

FSX DOES benefit from the 64 bit architecture in that it recognizes and uses all of your 12 gig of ram. In 32 bit you would only see and use +/- 3.2 Gigs.

Other than that, W7 is just centuries ahead of WinXP in resources management.

Fine rig you have there!

Cheers,

Ian

[Stratobat]

Hi Luckydog,

What motherboard did you choose?


AMD Phenom 2.6 GHZ (I think I screwed up there...)

I think you can use the Turbo Core feature to boost the speed up to 3.3 GHz.

Regards,
Stratobat

[warchild]

@Dangerousdave : can we safely assume that FSX does NOT benefit from 64bit architecture ??..... ( i have FSX installed on a seperate drive, running W7/64 for the first time, FSX runs fabulous ( i7 980x,GF 480GTX,12GB Mem) but only *when* it runs.... never encountered so much BSODs/FSX locks with XP.... )

cheers,
jan

Hi jan..
Sorry i'm not Dave but i thought i'd take a whack at explaining it..
Theres a lot of things effecting FSX on a 64 bit system that can make it run either slower or faster than it can on a 32 bit system.
you see, on a 32 bit system, the machine grabs a single 32 byte instruction from the program and shoves it through the processor after going through ram ( which is where some of the complications can happen ). A 64 bit machine grabs two 32 byte instructions at once and shoves those through the processor.. So in effect, its doing twice the work in the same amount of time. However, there are possible caveats that need to be looked at and if possible avoided. Among the biggest of these is synching the ram with the cpu. Ram can be in either a synch mode or an asynch mode. usually as delivered, most motherboards are set up for async mode. What this means is that data is read into ram, and sits there for an amount of time which is called a wait state, before going to the cpu. so, for as much as the machine is doing with the cpu, the ram is cutting it in half because the wait state is holding the data in the buffer. Meanwhile, while the data is being held in the buffer, more data from the program is being read in. This can cause a slow machine, or even buffer overruns and BSODs.
Synch mode, reads the data in from the program, and almost instantly feeds it to the cpu. theres no waiting and no data backing up in the buffer. The result is that the machine works more efficiently and the program runs faster, smoother, and with with fewer if any overruns and bsods.

Simply going into your cmos ram and changing the memory mode from asynch to synch can improve things immensely.

another thing to look into is how many cpu's are being used when the syetem starts up. By default, windows 7 only uses on cpu. going into the advanced options boot section of the dydtem control panel and telling it to use all four or however many cpus you have at boot time, greatly increases the efficiency and performance of the machine as well.. Oddly enough, it also helps the machine run cooler..

technically, any 32 bit program should work better on a 64 bit machine, but the two things i've pointed out above can make it and even 64 bit programs crawl a a snails pace..
Turn off bios cacheing, and follow the overclockers guidlines for turning off spread spectrum functions of certain regions of your board to further increase performance. It doesnt matter if your overclocking or not. it will improve the performance.. But please do look it up and read whats recommended first as there are good spread spectrum stuff in there and not so good spread spectrum..
64 bit also allows for multiple cpus with multiple co-processors much more easily than 32 bit did, and with fsx, thats always a boon.. If you can use SLI do it. On a properly set up motherboard, the impact on fsx is phenomenal. Your no longer talking megaherz, your talking teraflops (or trillions of file operations per second ) But the bottom line is you need to do a little research and take notes, then go into cmos ram with those notes and set your machine up on a firmware level, then set windows up to boot on all four processors..
Hope this helps a little..
Pam

[modelr]

F.i. Right click fsx.cfg , select Properties, select Security, here you can control all authorisation settings pertaining to a particular file or folder you have currently no access to.


@Dangerousdave : can we safely assume that FSX does NOT benefit from 64bit architecture ??..... ( i have FSX installed on a seperate drive, running W7/64 for the first time, FSX runs fabulous ( i7 980x,GF 480GTX,12GB Mem) but only *when* it runs.... never encountered so much BSODs/FSX locks with XP.... )

cheers,
jan

I use a little registration key that comes in this "TakeOwnership.zip" that was suggested on another thread here. Don't remember where, but it works great. It bypasses all the UAC problems for that program. It works from the right click menu.

Jan, I've never had the BSOD since going to Win7 64, but I do get occasional lockups, mostly after flying a while, then trying to change a scenery, or location. A reboot always fixes, but it's still frustrating. I do run my FSX from an external HDD, 1.5TB. When mine locks up, it acts like the memory/video memory is not transfering info, as the picture "tears" (as in rips, not cries, lol) and won't refresh.

[jmig]

I don't think I have any problems with Win7 64 and FSX. The only issue I get is occasionally the video freezes for a second or two or three. Usually it just starts again, sometimes FSX dies.

I think the issue is in the video card (ATI 5850) but it doesn't happen enough for me to be willing to tear into the system and start looking for the problem. I just reboot.

[TeaSea]

I use a little registration key that comes in this "TakeOwnership.zip" that was suggested on another thread here. Don't remember where, but it works great. It bypasses all the UAC problems for that program. It works from the right click menu.



This darn thing made my life a lot easier:

http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/1911-take-ownership-shortcut.html

I did not feel comfortable turning UAC completely off.

This is a great thread for me as I'm totally illiterate on the 64 vs 32 bit issues, and I'm going to have to invest in a new machine in the next few months. Maybe this needs to be a sticky because I imagine a number of folks are going to be doing that the next couple years.

I take it that NOT putting FSX into the default is preferred due to the differing ways the OS treats the program?

[modelr]

Pam, your explanation helps me out a bunch, as I see what might be causing my lockups already. (Asynch vs synched ram.) I didn't know about setting windows up to boot on all cpu's, either. Will give those a try.

Does that asynch vs synched ram work on the video board also?? Is that even adjustable??

XFX-ATI HD 4890 1GB DDR5 PCIE
AMD PhenomIIx4 810 2.6GHZ
6GB Ram

[modelr]

This darn thing made my life a lot easier:

http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/1911-take-ownership-shortcut.html



I take it that NOT putting FSX into the default is preferred due to the differing ways the OS treats the program?

Since using the Takeownership thingy, I have zero problems with installations, add-ons, etc. Also using the "run as admin" as a habit has stopped all problems. I spend 98% of my sim time (which isn't much) just doing add-on cfg changing, (ai and scenery combining, I hate having a 1000 ai aircraft folders for one aircraft. Same with scenery.) I combine everything I can. It does slow down my "file-folder" defrags, but seems to speed up searches.

I do let my installs go to the program folders, since the takeownership key stops the UAC from creating the roadblocks.

[warchild]

Does that asynch vs synched ram work on the video board also?? Is that even adjustable??

XFX-ATI HD 4890 1GB DDR5 PCIE
AMD PhenomIIx4 810 2.6GHZ
6GB Ram

afraid not, graphics cards have their own memory controller that acts independently of the motherbord..

at least on an evga 780i, the entry your looking for in their cmos setup is FSB Memory Ratio. set that to sync and you should see an improvement..
anyway :) suns up now.. must be bedtime ::LOL:: hope i can help.. let us know how things go :0
Pam

[IanHenry]

Can someone tell me how I change from asynch to synch on an MSI Motherboard? I've looked in the BIOS but can't find anything bearing those names.

Regards,
Ian.

[warchild]

Can someone tell me how I change from asynch to synch on an MSI Motherboard? I've looked in the BIOS but can't find anything bearing those names.

Regards,
Ian.


Which MSI motherboard do you have Ian?? Some of MSI's stuff uses the bios ( Cmos Ram ) for overclocking ( which for some reason memory ratios get lumped into ), some use software switches and others cant be changed at all. If you can get the model number of your board, we can look up almost anything about it.

[IanHenry]

Hi Warchild,<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
my motherboard is a MSI X58 Platinum SLI. I have looked on the MSI site and can find no information on this subject.
Regards,
Ian.
<o:p> </o:p>
<o:p> </o:p>

[warchild]

MSI is probably going to be the last place you want to look.. only nVidia and its partners openly encourage messing around with the low level settings in the BIOS.. AMD supports it but keeps it real quiet.. I looked around the web but found mostly revues for your motherboard. Accordingly, you have a very nice motherboard. But i couldnt find anything about the BIOS. Since its SLI I'm assuming its an Intel based system as AMD uses Crossfire. and there was a BUIS update offered for your board, but if you arent very familiar with computers, i'd let your local computer shop set that up. it may be a bit expensive, but it beats having to buy a new motherboard with knowing you yourself fried it. Whule there, have them put the fsb memory mode into sync mode. hopefully they'll understand what your talking about and prove themselves to be a bit more knowledgeable than a fudge brownie.. If they dont know, take the machine somewhere else.. i wont kid you or make things look pretty. You'll be changing things that could if changed without knowledge, actually cause more damage than good.
Also look around the overclockers sites.. there may be some clues there that will help you out. Extreme overclocking ( http://forums.extremeoverclocking.com/ ) is one of the better and more knowledgeable groups..
I'll help more as i can, but it may take me some time to do the research..
wish i could have helped more today..
Pam

[luckydog]

Hi Luckydog,

What motherboard did you choose?



I think you can use the Turbo Core feature to boost the speed up to 3.3 GHz.

Regards,
Stratobat

You're right Stratobat !!
.........THANKS for bringing that up !!!!!!
I completely missed that feature ( specs say the Turbo mode will boost it as high as 3.6 ).
UPS is now saying Mon. or Tues., darnit. I can't wait to "fly" this thing !!

LD

[IanHenry]

Thanks Pam.

Ian.

[Javis]

Jan,FSX DOES benefit from the 64 bit architecture in that it recognizes and uses all of your 12 gig of ram. In 32 bit you would only see and use +/- 3.2 Gigs.

Thanks, Ian !

Excuse my ignorance, but, taking Dave's comment about the C:\ Program Files(x86) folder into account, would that mean that i'd be better off with installing FSX in this folder rather than on a seperate drive, especially for FSX, like is the case now ?... I mean, would that possibly stop the BSOD's ??.....

I configured this Alienware Area51ALX monster machine as per the advice of an FS guru ( sadly i seem to have lost the link to the site ) who stated a.o. that installing FSX on its own drive, using *only* about half of its capacity, would be the most preferable thing to do.

So that's what i did.... The first time i ran my freshly installed virgin FSX i got my first BSOD after only 10 minutes of flight..... This couldn't have been more depressing than if a boxing glove would've emerged from the monitor and hit me smack dab in the face....:blind:

Tweaked a lot since then and it's better now, haven't encountered a bsod for some time of flying FSX but a lockup can still easily happen f.i. after switching aircraft, Go to another airport, or changing weather, etc.

Otherwise i'm in Flightsimmer's heaven with this monster machine but that should be clear..:cool:

Cheers,
Jan

[Javis]

Sorry i'm not Dave but i thought i'd take a whack at explaining it..

Thanks a lot for your elaborate explanation, Pam, highly appreciated ! :salute:

Truth is i'm far from a computer expert... compared to my car, i think i'm a good driver, i can change a sparkplug or a wheel, or even oil if need be but that's about it...

With my earlier puters, which often just stopped working, i learned a little bit about the Cmos menu but since i bought my first Dell computer i can't even remember having seen one...

After reading your explanation it's therefore been the first time since years that i hit the F2 key during initial start-up... Been carefully looking around ( still scares the hell out of me...:icon_eek: ) but i simply can't find anything related to ram, let alone changing the memory mode from asynch to synch....

Can you please steer me in the right direction here, Pam ?.... :confused:

Btw, it's 12GB 1600MHz (3x4GB) Tri Channel Memory sitting there in the dungeons of my Alienware Area51ALX monster. Processor is : Intel Core i7-980x(3.33GHz,6.4GT/s 12MB ). Graphics : Single 1.5GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480. Two 600GB Serial ATA HD's plus one 300GB Serial ATA HD, all at 10000 rpm, the latter just for FSX. This all coming to live on a 30" Dell 3008WFP monitor. OS : Dutch Genuine Windows 7 Professional (64 BIT)

Would love to try anything to get rid of the bsod's ( initially each FSX testflight ended with one.... ) although after a lot of tweaking and using nHancer it seems a lot better now. Bsod logs always name 'XTUservice' as the source ( Intel Extreme Tuning Utility ) and error : XMP Initialization Failed. Blue screen mostly says : SYSTEM_SERVICE_EXCEPTION MEMORY MANAGEMENT

Thanks again, Pam !

Cheers,
Jan

[warchild]

Wellllll, I dont know anything about Intels extreme tuning Utility ( XTU ) but there seems to be a lot of people having issues because of it.. if you google XTUservice, it brings up several pages of people having those issues.. Never having had any personal experience with XTU i find myself at a loss of knowledge, and can only recommend that you search those forums where people have reported the problems. If a solution exists, its bound to be in there, somewhere.

[Javis]

Well, yes, that's what i've been doing, Pam. I actually couldn't find much info about it, just mostly complaints, like you say. Absolutely no info to find about it on my system neither, like it doesn't even exists...

It sits at the Services tab on System Config and is always active. I stopped and unchecked it and found FSX to look horrible so one can't do without it.

But i'd still love to try your tip about changing memory mode from asynch to synch ( or wouldn't that help with ironing out these bsod's in the first place... ? ) Could you please explain how exactly to do that, Pam ?

Thanks a lot on forehand! :salute:

Cheers,
Jan

[Javis]

But i'd still love to try your tip about changing memory mode from asynch to synch ( or wouldn't that help with ironing out these bsod's in the first place... ? ) Could you please explain how exactly to do that, Pam ?

Pam ??..... :bump:

[Francois]

Hi Jan,

I've also been searching for you, and the most regularly issue that seems to pop up is people mentioning bad RAM in some way.
Maybe you could switch the RAM chips to another slot? And test the RAM?

Other issues seem to indicate incompatible graphics driver software.... but I guess you already downloaded the latest video drivers from Guru3D.com for your card?

Sorry not to have many more ideas...

Francois

[Javis]

Hi Jan,I've also been searching for you, and the most regularly issue that seems to pop up is people mentioning bad RAM in some way.Maybe you could switch the RAM chips to another slot? And test the RAM?

Certainly worth a try. Thanks Francois !


Other issues seem to indicate incompatible graphics driver software.... but I guess you already downloaded the latest video drivers from Guru3D.com for your card?

Verdomt! THAT's it! I have always downloaded new drivers from Guru3D but i lost the link and couldn't for the live of me remember its name anymore so this time i downloaded the newest drivers for the GTX480 from nVidia ( 8.17.12.5896 ). No change however....

But thanks for the name, mate ! :cool:


Sorry not to have many more ideas..

No, that's perfectly alright, Francois, don't worry. Thanks a lot for your concern ! :salute:

Cheers,
Jan