TrackIR Question for Bill Lionheart, et alia

[HighGround22]

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Hullo, Bill:

I saw your very positive comments regarding TrackIR and thought perhaps you'd be the guy to ask my big question.

I bought TrackIR quite a long while ago -- along with the Track Clip -- and installed it. I just couldn't get accustomed to it. I was spending 95% of my time fussing with TrackIR, with only 5% left for flying. So I tore it out and reverted to "normal", which is mainly a 2D screen and a miniview that's customized to the individual aircraft.

But after a few months, I saw some positive comments on various forums and thought perhaps I'd been too hasty -- y'know, hadn't given it enough time. So I re-installed it and again it only lasted one flight. Same preoccupation necessary with TrackIR and not enough focus available for proper flying. So I tore it out again.

This last event re-played about two or maybe three more times over the intervening months with the same results. So . . .

The Big Question is what the heck am I doing wrong? I'm technically inclined and I want to use TrackIR. But I can't seem to get to the stage where I don't spend most of my time fiddling with TrackIR. And then I see people such as yourself saying it's awesome. I fool so feelish!

So from the vantage of someone who's become accustomed to TrackIR and who very much likes it, what advice would you offer to a hubcap who can't seem to get past first base with it?

Grateful for any reasonable reply,

[tracyq144]

I'd also like to hear Bill's thoughts on this. I had 1 and 2, and never did get where I liked them.

Just ordered iteration #5, and am hoping I can fall in love with it this time!

[dswo]

I've had TrackIR 3 for five for, I think, six years. Here are three things that I do:

1. Start up the software and go to the View menu. Select tracking and move the receiver unit (that sits on your monitor) so that the dots are roughly in the center. Roughly is just fine! You don't have to do this every time; I do it once a month, maybe. It's just a good place to start. Unless you have lots of activity on top of your monitor, you shouldn't need to mess with it.

2. Do you have trouble controlling your view? Does it swing around too much? You do NOT need to keep your head absolutely still. You may need to loosen up your profile so that it's less responsive (i.e., shallower curves, larger dead zone). Make a copy of the default Flight profile and tweak that. After you've used TrackIR for a day or two, you will probably want to go back and make your profile more responsive again (i.e., steeper curves, smaller dead zone).

3. One change that I've made to my profile, on the HotKeys tab, is to uncheck "Trap" for Pause (F9). Why? In FSX, I have assigned mouselook to F9. Result: pressing F9 (or clicking a button that sends F9) deactivates TrackIR and activates mouselook at the same time. If I had "Trap" checked, F9 would deactivate TrackIR but it wouldn't be passed on to FSX afterward.

[Alan_A]

While we're waiting for Bill, I'll jump in. I started with TrackIR 4 about three years ago, and more recently switched to 5. I wouldn't be without it. But at first it took some getting used to. The most difficult thing is the way it exaggerates head movements - a little head movement gets you a big change in viewpoint on screen. Practice helps. So does tweaking the software. The version 4 software was pretty good, and the version 5 is somewhat better. It includes a couple of pre-defined profiles that allow you to change the speed and the movement ratios by resetting curves. It's pretty intuitive and you can try out the different settings in software. I found that my results in FSX improved when I switched from the default profile to "smooth."

The other problem I had with the standard clip is that it's very sensitive to ambient light. For a while I was busy turning off lamps and lowering blinds whenever I wanted to use it. I finally broke down and bought the TrackClip Pro. Worth it, for me at least - much less sensitive to outside light, and it's also easier to mount on a headphone, which works for me at least.

I still sometimes have moments where the view sticks - especially when I'm trying to look downward. Adjusting the clip and "receiver" seems to help, and the switch to the "smooth" profile helped, too. This has been less of a problem since I switched from version 4 to version 5.

Hope this helps.

[djscoo]

I had problems with the TrackIr 5 software. It was too finicky, and I couldn't get it adjusted right, so I downloaded the previous version (v4.1.028) that doesn't have the fancy UI or fine controls. The old version has presets for FSX and those settings worked perfectly so I haven't gone back to v.5.

[HighGround22]

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Many thanks so-far for the clarifying and encouraging advice and information. I'm collecting it all, to be read-through in detail, formalized and printed-out offline. Maybe I'm getting somewhere . . . .

One clarification question: When you refer to version 3, 4 and 5, is this a reference to the hardware, the controlling software, or both? (My foggy memory tells me I have V3).

[delta558]

I hope Bill doesn't mind, but I'll jump in here as someone who probably couldn't use FS any more without TrackIR. Hopefully my comments will help, as well as Bill's when he sees your post.

Firstly, when I initially got TrackIR it almost went in the bin - couldn't get settled with it, didn't do what I wanted, then I decided to work out exactly what I did want from it and try and apply that through the settings screen. I wanted to be seeing over my shoulder when I looked at the edge of the screen. I wanted to be able to look up and see the horizon early when I was looping. They were my two priorities.

I'm using Track Clip Pro, version 5.0 of the software. In my basic settings, I have speed set to 2.2, smoothing set to 19. They're the settings I've found let me move around comfortably and accurately.
In Advanced settings, I spent a fair while making sure that all the axes moved correctly, and to the points I wanted them to go to. I set up my own profile, using "One-to-One" as my template for all 6 groups. This meant that pretty much all adjustment was done via speed and smoothing mentioned above. My profile was then saved, and I have set it as the exclusive (i.e default) load.
Problems I had at this stage included the position "toppling" when it got so far in one direction (usually upwards). If you get that, try making sure that the reflectors / LEDs on your head are positioned correctly. For the LEDs (clip pro), they need to be arranged vertically, longest arm lowermost.

Also related to this, in the large display box (right side of software), use the drop-down Display menu at the top and change the view from 3D view to Camera view. You'll see the LEDs showing as green dots, which turn red if they can't give a clear signal to the receiver. Make sure they're central on the display there by adjuusting the receiver, and that they remain green whilst you move your head around.

There are 3 hotkeys to set up - try and assign them to your joystick (much easier that way). The really important ones are 'Centre' - because it will shift a bit sometimes - and 'Pause', for when you're adjusting an instrument particularly! I found the 3rd hotkey (Precision) not to be much use, but you might like it.

I probably spent the best part of a week flying, fiddling, threatening to throw it in the bin etc. Then I decided to forget the flying side until it was sorted. Make sure it's moving as you want it in the display area of the software display constantly. Took me a couple of hours to get it fully refined - it doesn't just work out of the box! Then, when it's following your movements regularly and accurately, it's time to try the sim again.

Hope that helps a bit.

[Skittles]

I really don't get along with track IR. The problem of course is that is tracks your head movement, not your eyes. Thus, if you shuffle down into your seat you're in trouble, and have to tilt your head up to compensate etc, rather than just glancing up with your eyes like in real life.

I use it as a novelty every so often (I use freetrack and made my own headset) but for regular simming I just use the space bar and mouse to look around, which works well.

[falcon409]

One thing that stands out to me in all the responses thus far is that the majority of the folks speak of "tweaking the profile and adjusting the curves", etc, etc, as though it is something that is simply second nature to anyone. No disrespect intended here but that ain't necessarily so. You can mess trackIR up in a heartbeat and toss it in a drawer real quick if you don't really understand what you're doing. Yea, you can revert back to the original setting, but if that's the reason you decided it needed tweaking, then you haven't really gained anything.

If you purchase TrackIR, be prepared to spend a fair amount of time just reading the "how-to's" of the system, and then an equal amount of time in trial and error, don't expect that one persons ability to tweak precisely on the fly will translate that you'll be as successful. If it was that easy, we wouldn't see folks saying "yea I had it for a while but now I just use it periodically, or yep, it was a waste of money, it's too finicky".

I use it from time to time, usually when I'm flying choppers, but too often in a standard aircraft cockpit, I have to pause it to do just about anything related to adjustments of radios or even reading text because it's too jittery and even beyond that, minute head movements make the viewing less than realistic. . . .if I move my head to look back at the wing of an airplane in real life, I don't have to wait until everything stops moving before I can tell if the flaps are lowered, lol.:salute:

[dswo]

One thing that stands out to me in all the responses thus far is that the majority of the folks speak of "tweaking the profile and adjusting the curves", etc, etc, as though it is something that is simply second nature to anyone. No disrespect intended here but that ain't necessarily so. You can mess trackIR up in a heartbeat and toss it in a drawer real quick if you don't really understand what you're doing. Yea, you can revert back to the original setting, but if that's the reason you decided it needed tweaking, then you haven't really gained anything.

That's a good point. Maybe if you're having trouble, you should not tweak the profile. Just go with the default until you get the hang of it.


I have to pause it to do just about anything related to adjustments of radios

Me too. But if you assign a buttom a button or two -- I've got one on my mouse, one on my HOTAS throttle, and one on my yoke, all three of which do the same thing -- it's not a big deal (for me).

[GT182]

I started with the Tracker IR2 and loved it. It takes getting used to but once you do you might not want to fly with out it again.... I sure can't. Imagine driving your car and looking around using a hatswitch. Yeah I know it should be your eyes doing the movement but the way they have it working is as close as they can get.... for now. You never know and it could be far fetched, but someday they might be using contacts lenses instead of the dlips.

I graduated to the IR4 and like that even more. 6 degress of movement makes it all the more real. Word of caution. Don't use the Natural Point hat and the hat clip together. I've found the dot on the hat messes things up when using the hat clip. Light coming in from a window behind or off to the side will also screw up the Tracker, but with the newer software you can adjust for that.

Don't give up on your Tracker, you've got to try and use the default or tweak the settings. It does take time. Just make sure when you move you head you don't have to move it too far to look back 180 degrees and can still see your monitor. Just make sure a little movement goes a long way. Sounds dumb but that's what makes it work so you enjoy it.

[SirBenn21]

For me. I would not even consider flying without my TrackIR.
The only problem in the begining was with the Track Clip that was too clumsy for me with all the wires dangling off the side of my head, So I reverted to the clip that goes on the baseball cap.
I also needed to fine tune it in the software to suit me, but after that. I have no problems and time wasted. I just put on my cap and start up the program and Bob's your Uncle.

Ben

[Alan_A]

One thing that stands out to me in all the responses thus far is that the majority of the folks speak of "tweaking the profile and adjusting the curves", etc, etc, as though it is something that is simply second nature to anyone. No disrespect intended here but that ain't necessarily so. You can mess trackIR up in a heartbeat and toss it in a drawer real quick if you don't really understand what you're doing. Yea, you can revert back to the original setting, but if that's the reason you decided it needed tweaking, then you haven't really gained anything.

If you purchase TrackIR, be prepared to spend a fair amount of time just reading the "how-to's" of the system, and then an equal amount of time in trial and error, don't expect that one persons ability to tweak precisely on the fly will translate that you'll be as successful. If it was that easy, we wouldn't see folks saying "yea I had it for a while but now I just use it periodically, or yep, it was a waste of money, it's too finicky".

I use it from time to time, usually when I'm flying choppers, but too often in a standard aircraft cockpit, I have to pause it to do just about anything related to adjustments of radios or even reading text because it's too jittery and even beyond that, minute head movements make the viewing less than realistic. . . .if I move my head to look back at the wing of an airplane in real life, I don't have to wait until everything stops moving before I can tell if the flaps are lowered, lol.:salute:

Falcon - good points.

For what it's worth, I never tweaked a profile or adjusted a curve. In version 5, I did swap one profile (default) for another (smooth) but that was about it.

And of course I have to pause it, too, to throw switches or check settings. Doesn't bother me too much because I mostly opt for simple airplanes - the A2A Cub is my ride of choice these days. I also love it in the Lotus L-39 but that's not a systems-intensive airplane either. But another good point - how much you like TrackIR might also depend on what you fly. I can see where it'd be a challenge in a more complex a/c with more systems to look after.

Last week I tried swapping it out in order to test-drive EZdok Camera, which doesn't totally get along with TrackIR. I loved the EZdok head latency effects but wound up returning it and going back to TrackIR because without it, the views were too difficult to manage - I haven't used a hat switch in years and I felt like I'd left my eyeballs in a drawer somewhere and had to fumble for them. A very personal reaction and no slight against EZdok - it just shows how it's possible to get used to a product and have it become second nature, where another one feels bizarre. Your reaction might be the opposite. Best thing for me is just to try and settle on whatever works.

[jmig]

I have used IRTrack4 since it came out. I am not sure which version of the software I am using? Either V4 or V5. Put me in "the wouldn't be without it crowd."

In tweaking I mostly slowed it down, smoothed it, and lowered the graph (made it less sensitive to movement). Since I fly in a real cockpit with switches, I am often looking down. I have the "Center" and "Pause" keys assigned to control stick buttons.

My biggest complaint was the "dumping" that accrued when looking down and/or up too much. I managed to cure that by lowering the graph points.

I use the Track clip that came with it attached to a visor.

[falcon409]

Well, it looks like Bill is the only one who hasn't answered, lol, lol. So HG22, did you get enough info to make an informed decision?:salute:

[nio]

I use the clip (and also the pro clip) with a TrackIR 4 and v5 software.

I use the default profile.

Try hitting F7 once you have started TrackIR or in game.

This simple act made a huge positive difference to my enjoyment.

I would not fly without TrackIR

best

nio

[ryanbatc]

I got TIR 5 + track clip pro (the clip that goes on your headset) for Christmas 2009.

It took about 3 weeks of annoyances to get it set up right. And yes, I did fiddle with it much more than flying, and the first weeks I got headaches from the movement, but now I don't.

I ended up downloading profiles from their forums, I think the one I use is a modified "Seth-flight" should be somewhere on their forums. I definitely disable TIR for certain programming of instruments and sometimes to look around in external cause it controls that too (annoying imho). I also sometimes disable it when I'm IMC shooting an approach, because if your head is moving too much the screen is all over the place.

Also the dead zone when turning to the left and up is REALLY annoying. Like if you're in an open-canopy plane such as RealAir's SF260 or Lotus' L39 and you are making left closed traffic, it's hard to look into the turn if you're in a bank of greater than 30 degrees. And yes, my equipment is setup per the manual. I really wish the camera didn't lose track of the clip while doing what I described above but I'm not sure how else to fix it.

It is really fun for VFR flight, and flight around mountains, and it is good in the pattern for smaller GA/airliners. But with fighter jets I have those issues described above.

All in all TIR 5 is nice to have, but I wouldn't say "I'd never fly without this thing."

[HighGround22]

Well, it looks like Bill is the only one who hasn't answered, lol, lol. So HG22, did you get enough info to make an informed decision?:salute:Yes indeed, Falcon. I'm really impressed with the depth of thought that's gone into these answers!

I really do think I can now give it a go now, and I have a number of solid options to pursue so that I can get to a state of comfort with TrackIR.

Moreover, I see there's another page of replies, so I'll absorb those, as well.