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ndicki
February 5th, 2010, 06:37
If you haven't read this book, then you should. Wellum joined the RAF just before the outbreak of war, and came to No.92 Squadron on Spitfires in time to be the youngest pilot in Fighter Command in the Battle of Britain, serving alongside some of the names of the wartime RAF - Brian Kingcome, Wimpy Wade, Don Kingaby, Bob Tuck, Alan Wright, Titch Havercroft and others.

Unlike many RAF autobiographers, Geoff Wellum can really write. It is a beautifully written evocation of the RAF in those days, and a joy to read quite apart from its historical content.

And so, to my question.

No.92 (East India) Squadron carried the code "QJ" (shared by an administrative error with No.616 Sqn) on its aircraft. Brian Kingcome generally flew MkIb R6908 QJ-F, the subject of my MkIb skin for ETO, although at the time, it was coded QV-F and used by No.19 Sqn.

I would be very glad though if someone could give me the s/n and call letter of the MkIa flown by Geoff Wellum. I'd like to show my respects.

Does anybody have any leads?

mongoose
February 5th, 2010, 08:03
Is this good?

http://www.raf.mod.uk/bbmf/theaircraft/92sqngeoffwellum.cfm

or this

http://www.swafineart.com/images/1.12.08/images/MAIN2.jpg

neither seem to be the same letter

ndicki
February 5th, 2010, 08:30
Cheers, James! You've got it. The text in the first article mentions his second Spit as being QJ-G, so it's right. But it doesn't mention the s/n...

mongoose
February 5th, 2010, 09:54
Have u tried one of the BoB sites/forums?

ndicki
February 5th, 2010, 10:59
Yes. They talk a load of unsubstantiated nonsense. One widely quoted one says he was a Flight Sergeant, and gives K9998 as QJ-G, which was the letter used on its successor.

Meanwhile... I have done my research, too! K9998 was finished in the 'A' scheme, with the undersides painted a rather greenish shade of whatever (do not forget that supplies of the new "Sky" shade did not come through until around September, and will have gone first to factories and MUs) which I see as being BS 381 (1930) No.16 Eau-de-Nil. That corresponds to the shade the BBMF has used on P7350 which has just been redecorated as K9998.

So here is the ETO Spitfire MkI.

hairyspin
February 5th, 2010, 13:04
Lovely, Nigel! That's one of my favourite pilot autobiographies. He also featured in the series Fighter Pilot on Channel 4 in the UK some years ago and pops up on TV from time to time.

Pat Pattle
February 5th, 2010, 22:55
Cracking job Nigel, tis indeed an excellent read too. :applause::applause::applause: Well done on sorting out the S/n.

I find the whole subject of RAF schemes of the period fascinating (I must get out more!)

Looks like we have the same book - Camouflage & Markings no2 May-Dec 1940 which lists the 'greenish shade' as;

"Sky undersurfaces introduced from 6 June 1940. Lack of stocks of the correct Sky Type S led to variations in actual colour and shade, from duck eg green, (BS 381 (1930) No16 Eud-de-Nil) to a rich duck egg blue, (BS 381 (1930) No1 Sky blue)"

I noticed that it also mentions the underwing roundels being removed from June-August 1940.

ndicki
February 5th, 2010, 23:32
Underwing roundels are a PIG to work out... (Haven't got that book!) First they had (Spits, that is) 50 inch roundels from introduction until they introduced the night/white scheme in early 1939. Then they were reintroduced for aircraft flying over the French mainland ONLY, so some squadrons had them, some did not. Then they were dropped again, and Sky undersides introduced... They were reintroduced in mid-August 1940, but many aircraft carried smaller 25 inch roundels on the wing tips. And progressively, they were replaced with standard 50 inch roundels in the usual places. I've got the references of the AMOs and the dates somewhere, but can't be arsed to look. But in September, underwing roundels were back to stay.

dhasdell
February 5th, 2010, 23:47
The size of roundels and squadron letters varied a lot, what with changing regulations and repaints/repairs of in-service a/c. The only way to be sure is from photographs, and even then you might get the squadron letters ahead of the roundel rather than behind it or vice versa because the pic only shows one side. On top of that there are the oddities like the yellow spinner on QV*K, apparently applied when the a/c was at an OTU before moving to 19 Squadron.

ndicki
February 6th, 2010, 02:14
Very valid comment.

Meanwhile:

From late 1938:
Undersurfaces of Home-based fighters to be painted white/night, without underwing roundels.

15 May 1940 (Air Ministry Signal X296): Underwing roundels to be carried on all Home-based day fighters operating over the Channel or French mainland.

4 June 1940 (X479) Thin yellow edge to be added to the above roundel, port (night) wing only.

6 June 1940 (X915) Undersides to be painted "Sky" and underwing roundels removed.

11 August 1940 (a "letter" from the Air Ministry) Reintroduction of underwing roundels. Both 50 inch and 25 inch dimensions are seen at this time.

27 November 1940 (X789) Port wing to be painted with Special Night distemper. Port roundel to have yellow edge. Fighter Command band (18 inch band of "Duck Egg Blue") and "Duck Egg Blue" spinner introduced. "Duck Egg Blue" has usually been interpreted as RAE Sky Blue, not the new "Sky" colour.

22 April 1941 Suppression of the Special night distemper on the port wing.

Confused enough yet?

ndicki
February 6th, 2010, 02:19
Clive - the name "Sky Type S" is actually incorrect. The colour is "Sky" and the "Type S" bit refers to the extreme fineness of the pigment used in the new range of paint types, which gave a far smoother finish than previous types of finish ("S" for "smooth.") Because the two were developed by the RAE at the same time, the names have become linked. Type S finish was available in all the RAE colours then in use.

mongoose
February 6th, 2010, 15:25
Good work Nigel. Do we have much info on his missions??

Pat Pattle
February 6th, 2010, 23:17
Clive - the name "Sky Type S" is actually incorrect. The colour is "Sky" and the "Type S" bit refers to the extreme fineness of the pigment used in the new range of paint types, which gave a far smoother finish than previous types of finish ("S" for "smooth.") Because the two were developed by the RAE at the same time, the names have become linked. Type S finish was available in all the RAE colours then in use.

Thanks Nigel, didn't know that, have learned something new today! :salute:

ndicki
February 7th, 2010, 00:12
Good work Nigel. Do we have much info on his missions??

Not offhand - basically, for the day-to-day stuff, it's typical BoB. 92 Sqn records might have more detailled info, but I don't have it.