Flight1 Aviation Technologies Licenses Microsoft ESP v1.0 Object Code

[Pepere]

Will this effect us hobbiest?

http://www.flightsim.com/main/notams09/esp1217.htm

David

[Francois]

Hardly.....

[FelixFFDS]

I suspect that these ESP licensing agreements include a specific prohibition on creating an entertainment simulator out of it, the same as the agreemetn with Lockheed Martin.

[JamesChams]

Gents,
Not to be critical but rather realistic; somehow I doubt that you are correct on this.... Flight1, has been a "big" developer of authentic models for the FS gaming environment and they plan on continuing to do so, now also to the professionals. And, ESP will allow them the environment to do it more for the professionals that need Certification, as well. The only primary difference is the platform (ESP vs. FSX) and NOT necessarily the models they would need to develop, which BTW function 100% in both environments and may need only minor changes for certification. One thing for sure is that Microsoft is definitely OUT of the Simulation market now. Sad to see them go but, i wish them good luck for their future plans; I'm glad that they brought FS to this point, which is far better than I ever thought possible, and allowing for other skilled developers to improve on it futher. :salute:

Good going, Flight1. Now, perhaps, I can get my certified FTD Mustang for ESP. :jump:


Hebrews 11:6 "But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him." (http://www.lionheartcreations.com/Spiritual_Journey.html)

Thank you very much.
Sincerely,
From,
James F. Chams

[spotlope]

Given the price they pay for ESP seats, it'd be prohibitively expensive for an entertainment title anyway.

[Francois]

We ALL have that code and 'could' make 'add-ons' for it/with it, so I really don't see the news worthiness in this topic for the FS communities. Call me Grumpy :sleep:

[FelixFFDS]

To my understandiing, the license is to develop from the ESP 1,0 code, essentially the "core" engine common to both FS-X and ESP, and much more "open" to change and modification than FS-X already is. I understand it has a lot more of the core variables available than FSX, the air files are much more 'open'.

Example - right now, FSX cannot simulate more than 4 engines of ONE type. With the ESP object code, Flight1 could reengineer those limitations and create a environment to accurately simulate that. (Granted, this is somewhat unrealistic situation, because there aren't that many aircraft nowadays with more than four engines of miuxed type.) FLight1 can develop that environment, but then cannot offer a "Flight1 Flight Simulator" to the general entertainment community.

They can probably develop content for their modified ESP world, and offer it to the general public, but then again, modified to the current limitations of FS_X. (That fully functional ESP B-36 would still only be a glorified four engined piston OR jet engined model in FS-X).

[Francois]

ESP was exactly the same source code as FSX. Again, we all have that already. I still doubt very much that any associated cost could be recouped to developing for the hobby market. They could've done so long time ago, and without any further license.

If MS's licensing scheme is still in place (and I think it is), then anyone 'benefitting' from any changes in the software will need a ESP Client 'seat' ad $ 800 to run the software on.

[ananda]

Flight1 have purchased only the run-time code for ESP, not the source code.

[Francois]

......... Flight1 Tech took a license for the Microsoft® ESP™ v1.0 object code.......

The whole thing and wording is extremely vague and sounds like really nothing more than F1 offering an add-on product based on ESP (=FSX) and charging the customers a bundle for it .... :icon_lol: ... Not a bad idea really. :ernae:

But again, nothing to do with the 'simmers' as gathered on this forum.

[jrhoads]

......... Flight1 Tech took a license for the Microsoft® ESP™ v1.0 object code.......

The whole thing and wording is extremely vague and sounds like really nothing more than F1 offering an add-on product based on ESP (=FSX) and charging the customers a bundle for it .... :icon_lol: ... Not a bad idea really. :ernae:

But again, nothing to do with the 'simmers' as gathered on this forum.

You assume way too much Francois, despite whether you deem it news worthy or not. One thing you are right about, it is for commercial use and not for entertainment. Again, don't assume what you do not understand.
By the way...being a "grumpy old man" isnt really an attribute. And FSX does not = ESP. There are indeed some differences and the licensing mechanism is completely different.
The fact that you said that tells me you have never fired up ESP.

Jim

[crashaz]

Nice to see you drop in Jim! :wavey:

[wombat666]

You assume way too much Francois, despite whether you deem it news worthy or not. One thing you are right about, it is for commercial use and not for entertainment. Again, don't assume what you do not understand.
By the way...being a "grumpy old man" isnt really an attribute. And FSX does not = ESP. There are indeed some differences and the licensing mechanism is completely different.
The fact that you said that tells me you have never fired up ESP.
Jim

Play nice people. There are a few 'grumpy old men' keeping an eye on this one.
:173go1:

[6297J]

Sometimes I get the impression that all the joy has gone out of FS for you Francois. I'm not sure why you bother any more. Just about every post I see of yours these days, here and elsewhere is negative. It's a shame.

[Lionheart]

Francois is fine. I'll stick up for him. He's not always negative. I feel the same way about ISP or ESP or what ever it was called. It fractioned the FS people when it came out. Many flight schools that wanted to use it couldnt afford it.

But its in the past. :d

I hope Flight1 do good with it. Glad to see they are working closely with Cessna. That might be the direction they are going with the ESP program.


Bill

[Francois]

You assume way too much Francois, despite whether you deem it news worthy or not. One thing you are right about, it is for commercial use and not for entertainment. Again, don't assume what you do not understand.
By the way...being a "grumpy old man" isnt really an attribute. And FSX does not = ESP. There are indeed some differences and the licensing mechanism is completely different.
The fact that you said that tells me you have never fired up ESP.

Jim

It worked....... the OP finally got his answer ..... talking about assuming... *cough*.... ROFL !!! :wavey:

[Francois]

Sometimes I get the impression that all the joy has gone out of FS for you Francois. I'm not sure why you bother any more. Just about every post I see of yours these days, here and elsewhere is negative. It's a shame.


You ought to know, ALL of your posts have always been negative.

Merry Christmas nonetheless ;-)

[Pepere]

......... Flight1 Tech took a license for the Microsoft® ESP™ v1.0 object code.......

The whole thing and wording is extremely vague and sounds like really nothing more than F1 offering an add-on product based on ESP (=FSX) and charging the customers a bundle for it .... :icon_lol: ... Not a bad idea really. :ernae:

But again, nothing to do with the 'simmers' as gathered on this forum.


If this is the case why put the information on a FS community download/shopping site?:isadizzy:

David

[vstudios]

publicity, then let word of mouth take over and run riot :-)

[Francois]

If this is the case why put the information on a FS community download/shopping site?:isadizzy:

David

That's exactly why I did NOT publish it.... and why Jim is now 'grumpy' with me :salute:

[jrhoads]

Microsoft did the press release Francois not us. We just linked it.
And it is obviously your choice to do selective journalism if you so choose.

My point was not to assume or speak an opinion about what we are doing and what our intentions are if you really do not know, and especially if you are another commercial vendor, which you are.
I would not do that to you.

[Francois]

Since I didn't write ONE word that wasn't exactly correct, I don't feel challenged in any way.

But since we're 'off topic', my recent Grumpy columns are triggered by a growing dissatisfaction by me AND many simmers/users/customers about the stuff being offered 'for the hobby' these days. About often hype-ish talk on products that really don't deserve any attention and about 'FS journalism' that really is more like 'marketing'.

Not aimed at Flight1, we actually DO business together. But the vague wording and out-of-place press release, whoever wrote it, didn't make things any better.
Nor did your reaction ;-)

Since I've been doing MS licensing deals for the past, oh, 23 year or so, I have a little knowledge of what goes on.
If you have a good deal for whatever on ESP with MS, good for you.

But these are hobbyists forums and a hobby community and the question of OP was about 'does this mean anything for the hobby'.
If it would, the PR should have clearly said so. It didn't. So it is not for this community, or whichever FS community. Maybe interesting for a blurb in the AOPA magazine.

I feel yet another Grumpy column coming up..........

[wombat666]

Repeat: Play nice people.:173go1:

[Francois]

What's not nice I wonder? Didn't you see me smile ???? :ernae:

[6297J]

But since we're 'off topic', my recent Grumpy columns are triggered by a growing dissatisfaction by me AND many simmers/users/customers about the stuff being offered 'for the hobby' these days. About often hype-ish talk on products that really don't deserve any attention and about 'FS journalism' that really is more like 'marketing'.





Yes, you are right, the L-39, the A2A Cub, GEX Europe, the upcoming Bird Dog, the upcoming FTX Pacific Northwest - the stuff being offered 'for the hobby' these days is poor indeed.
Or is it just that you didn't publish any of it and the FS world has moved on from what you can offer? Sounds like sour grapes to me.

And as for hype-ish talk and 'FS journalism' that really is more like 'marketing' you are more guilty of that than most - I've lost count of the number of posts you've hijacked recently to insert a not so subliminal plug for an FS-Addon product. You do it with a wink to try and make it look innocent and 'amusing' but your motives are transparent to all.
And we'll see just how blurry that line gets between journalism and marketing when that Lysander is released shall we?
:ernae:

[Milton Shupe]

This thread has zigzagged enough me thinks ... and is still searching for the OP topic.

:kilroy: