People Never Cease To Amaze Me

[Old Crow]

I shall say no more..................:mixedsmi:

http://secure.simmarket.com/blackrose-cd-drinks-coasters.phtml

[N2056]

"Tourist Trap" comes to mind :icon_lol:

[DB93]

Apparently someone took the term 'coaster' too literally when it comes to disks lol. Doesn't the hole in the middle actually make it less effective as an actual drink coaster? Eh, not something I'd buy, but there's probably people who would (after all, remember the Pet Rock? lol).

[thisizma]

Everyone needs to make a buck somehow. My father still says ,"All it takes is a good idea." I wish this guy the best...I guess.:salute:

[spotlope]

But... they're a collector's item!

(By the way, so are those plastic bags you get from the grocery, if the "collection" in my kitchen is any indication. ;))

[CodyValkyrie]

I wonder if a few of those companies that he is doing those coasters of might have something to say....

I know UPS for damn sure would, if he did it.

[MCDesigns]

Everyone needs to make a buck somehow. My father still says ,"All it takes is a good idea." I wish this guy the best...I guess.:salute:

the problem is, this is not a good idea, LOL.

I dunno what's worse, the actual product the guy is trying to sell or the fact that simmarket are actually selling it. Do they not check what is being sold before posting it?

Maybe we should plaster thr SOH logo on a bunch of household items and sell them off, any takers for SOH trashbags? SOH shampoo? ahhh, I know, SOH underwear!!! :applause::pop4:

[Tylerb59]

I wonder if a few of those companies that he is doing those coasters of might have something to say....

I know UPS for damn sure would, if he did it.

Yea, and/or copyrighted images.

[CodyValkyrie]

It is a risky thing, to be sure. A fine line we walk in this community.

I know UPS shut down a videographer who was selling some DVD's where he went to the airport, filmed a bunch of their planes and was trying to sell them (DVDs). They issued a cease and desist order.

I'm also curious where he gets the images.... especially since he says he can get anything.

Anyways, I digress. I'm making a big deal out of something rather small.

[N2056]

How about an out-house scenery object? We could sell it there as a source of income for SOH :d
An authentic sim-outhouse!

[thisizma]

the problem is, this is not a good idea, LOL.

I dunno what's worse, the actual product the guy is trying to sell or the fact that simmarket are actually selling it. Do they not check what is being sold before posting it?

Maybe we should plaster thr SOH logo on a bunch of household items and sell them off, any takers for SOH trashbags? SOH shampoo? ahhh, I know, SOH underwear!!! :applause::pop4:
I got some old underware.

[MCDesigns]

I got some old underware.

Like these?? :173go1:

[Tako_Kichi]

I think those need some maintenance Michael....the bomb bay door's looking a bit flappy! :toilet:

[CBris]

Ah yes - the "black rose livery designs" guy who is also "selling" his services as painter. Here we have someone possibly taking money with the use of proprietary brand trade marks and logos. Not even the big M put commercial logos in FS without permission. That's why we have "Orbit" as airline.

I reckon even Airliners.net might have a word to say here too.

[tigisfat]

There was a guy a while back who said that he was willing to "give away" some old expired charts of his if someone would just pay him "50 dollars" for his time. I couldn't believe it. If anyone wants my expired charts, they can have them. A handful of expired aviation charts are worth absolutely nothing. Pilots around the world throw them away all the time.

[anthony31]

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Oneworld-(British-Airways)/Boeing-747-436/1606671/L/&sid=96b63b59db446f03b1d06003d61e8dd9

Above is a link to the 747 that appears in the background of the BA drinks coaster. Notice how you can still see AKBAR in the drinks coaster version. In the bottom left you can clearly see the name AKBAR in the exact same font used by airliners.net. A quick search on airliners.net for AKBAR, British Airways and 747 brings up the above picture.

I have contact Josh Akbar via airliners.net to inform him and ask if he is the one producing the cd's or has given permission for his pics to be used.

We'll wait and see what he says :)

[hobofat]

"a fool and his money..." as my old man always said. one valuable purpose for communities such as this though is quality control.

[Francois]

You may remember that I 'blogged' about exactly issues (and 'products') like these very recently...... being 'employed' by simMarket I can't just print 'Lookie here folks, we've managed to put up yet another totally useless and crappy product in our on-line shop! Come and get it... we just KNOW you have too many Dollars burning in your pocket!', now can I?

:icon_lol::icon_lol::icon_lol:

Truth of the matter is, as I wrote before, that more and more people are trying to jump on the FS bandwagon with all sorts of crap. Whether that be totally useless 'satellite' images of small areas that are perfect without them, printed old CD's or t-shirts with someone else's (!!) logos on it.....

simMarket is trying to make a living of course, as we all do, and is just selling the stuff. As is your drugstore around the corner... I am pretty damn sure the owner (or even worse, franchiser) is not TESTING all the shampoos and other weird things he's selling personally. :ernae:

So, vigilance is key, forums such as these are too, and the main thing is to use your own common sense, assuming such is present. :wavey:

[SpaceWeevil]

I have no problem with anything you say Francois - of course buyers should be careful. That said, once customers tell the drug store about a potentially illegal product and they still choose to sell it (the link is still live) doesn't that change things a bit? Just a thought.

[Francois]

Not for me it doesn't, because it is basically none of my business.... literally.

[cheezyflier]

Maybe we should plaster thr SOH logo on a bunch of household items and sell them off, any takers for SOH trashbags? SOH shampoo? ahhh, I know, SOH underwear!!! :applause::pop4:

well, if there was a sim-outhouse lingerie line , i might get some for the wife.
you know, maybe something with invasion stripes or camo. :monkies:

[JoeW]

$18.00 USD for a coaster? Mus be a dadgum great coaster. I remember when Coors was allowed in Florida and most bars had Coors coasters. I'd pick them up in a beat ....... ashtrays too.

[JoeW]

well, if there was a sim-outhouse lingerie line , i might get some for the wife.
you know, maybe something with invasion stripes or camo. :monkies:

Yea .. but them had the skid marks still in em!

[CBris]

I just ran a CD label through my printer and stuck it on a freebie magazine DVD (one of the thousands that litter my home - and yours probably). Then I wrapped it in cling-film. One waterproof coaster for the cost of the laser toner and one label. With the added advantage that the cling-film makes it anti-skid...

I also regularly run a mini CD label through the printer and stick it directly onto my desk - that's where my teacup lives, and when the "coaster" is stained enough, I simply paste a new one over...

Anyway, who needs a coaster, when there's an automatic cup holder on most PCs... press the little rectangular button and out she pops, complete with drain hole...

[Henry]

Yea .. but them had the skid marks still in em!
Yup Admin test them for quality:icon_lol:
H

[DB93]

Anyway, who needs a coaster, when there's an automatic cup holder on most PCs... press the little rectangular button and out she pops, complete with drain hole...

Lol! Yeah, that's why I have a black case now. The old beige one just showed the coffee stains way too much. :icon_lol:

[Francois]

I just ran a CD label through my printer and stuck it on a freebie magazine DVD (one of the thousands that litter my home - and yours probably). Then I wrapped it in cling-film. One waterproof coaster for the cost of the laser toner and one label. With the added advantage that the cling-film makes it anti-skid...

..

Why, Chris, excellent idea. You should MARKET it !!!!



:icon_lol::icon_lol::icon_lol:

It so happens, I know JUST the place !

[CBris]

:d:d

[euroastar350]

Anyway, who needs a coaster, when there's an automatic cup holder on most PCs... press the little rectangular button and out she pops, complete with drain hole...

I got to get me one of these, where can I find one:monkies::icon_lol:

[n4gix]

Anyway, who needs a coaster, when there's an automatic cup holder on most PCs... press the little rectangular button and out she pops, complete with drain hole...

I actually had a customer try to get his computer fixed under warranty because his "cupholder" broke, back in the days when I was working for Radio Shack as a store manager... :eek:

[anthony31]

The simmarket product page for the drinks coaster has now removed the preview pic of the BA aircraft. The only pic now is a small thumbnail of the Qantas A380 which, incidentally looks a lot like this pic by Michael Nikel posted on airliners.net. Maybe the guy behind these coasters was there taking pics as well.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Qantas/Airbus-A380-842/1597303/M/

I wonder if Michael Nikel is the one behind this product or whether he knows if his images are being reused.

Haven't heard from Josh Akbar yet.

Here is a small quote from the copyright information from airliner.net



<CENTER>All photos on this site are protected by international copyright laws. </CENTER>
You have limited rights to personally view the images with your web browser and to use them as your personal computer wallpaper (or background image) on your own computer. These photos may not otherwise be reproduced, distributed, cropped, resized, or otherwise altered without the written permission of the photographer. No commercial use of these photos may be made in any way. All rights are reserved.


Now, I don't want to start a bunfight here and I'm not too sure of Francois's relationship with simmarket but it seems odd to me that here is someone (Francois) who recently published a plea to software pirates to stop illegally downloading their products now appears to be saying that simmarket has no responsibility to stop selling products that may be made with copyrighted photos.
Perhaps I have misunderstand what Francois has said in which case I apologise in advance.

[jeansy]

im going to print screen shots on cds and flog them of for half the price

here comes my quick million

[Francois]

You'll be hard pressed to get into ANY fights with me, and should you succeed anyway, you'd wish you wouldn't :icon_lol::icon_lol:

But yes, you misinterpreted what I have been writing here (and elsewhere).

But first of all, lets establish that the product has been taken off the sales list already as far as I can see. The old links are still there, in articles and forums, but I don't think you can still order the coasters.

So ChrisB's and my remarks have 'helped'.

As to the other points you raise:
no secrets anywahere, but since you appear to be relatively 'new', let me elaborate: I am not on the 'employee payroll' of simMarket, instead having my own publishing and marketing company. But I am a freelancer and have a contract with them for designing and publishing their newsletters and magazine ads, for running simFlight.com's news service and for running the simFlight forums.

No less, but no more either.
I am NOT calling the shots as to what gets and doesn't get posted on simMarket, nor what gets sold or not, or how products are being screened, or not.

Nowhere have I said that simMarket would sell products that are in any way subject to copyright infringements. If they would knowingly, I wouldn't work for them. Actually, every month there are products being drawn from the shop after copyright holders object and products are also refused regularly for that same reason.

What I AM saying is that it is totally impossible for ANYONE to find these infringements up front, unless they are totally and blatantly obvious.
The coasters pictures were put up by the 'author' of the product and checked by a simMarket employee, not readily recognized as being subject to problems. Yes, I had my doubts, but the product was already in the shop.

Again, decisions to put it there and possibly leave it there are for and by the owner of simMarket ONLY.
But he will NOT condone stolen or copied material to be sold through the shop.... assuming, once again, it is found to be such. That's not always clear.
BA may or may not protest to have a picture of their livery on a model aircraft, in a screenshot, in a VA or on a coaster (there are shades of grey I'm afraid).

What I AM saying is that simMarket is not interested in the contents of products. If a developer thinks he can sell an add-on or other product, simMarket will market it for him. There is no quality control.... that's 'up to us' via forums such as these, really, and the odd review.
Whereas 'competitors' like JustFlight, Flight1 and Aerosoft are a 'mix' of retailer and publisher, simMarket is ONLY a retailer. They are NOT involved in the design and manufacturing of any of the products they sell.

Now you and I may not agree with everything that gets sold or put on the market, but we're not being asked, are we? ;-)

In fact, the abysmal quality of some of the FS add-on products over the years was the reason that I decided to set up my own publishing company years ago. :wavey:

[djscoo]

Based on post #18, I thought Francois was an employee of SimMarket...
Also, is it a wise decision to advertise your company, then take such a combative tone with a potential customer in a public forum full of other potential customers, all in one post?

[Francois]

Read above, if that's not too much to ask?

[N2056]

But I am a freelancer and have a contract with them for designing and publishing their newsletters and magazine ads, for running simFlight.com's news service and for running the simFlight forums.


Based on the above I think that Francois has clarified his remark made in post #18 in which he labeled himself an "employee"...to me at least :)

[Francois]

Thank you.

The irony of the whole thing is that I was the first to object to the product, and am now the one being attacked over it...... :pop4:

[Ian Warren]

anyone recall the BBC/ITV television series GROT !
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[Francois]

Nope.

[anthony31]

Thank you so much for clearing that up for me Francois. It does seem that as a newbie I got the wrong end of the stick and I apologise for any aspersions I may have made to your character. Your explanation has certainly made the situation clearer to understand.

As in post 18 you used quotes around the employee statement I wasn't too sure what that meant and the full extent of your relationship with simmarket and whether you had any control over what was offered for sale or not. Thank you for clearing that up that ambiguity I now know that you had nothing to do with the coasters.

It is good to see that simmarket has removed this product from their list as there did seem to be some question over whether the images being printed belonged to the person creating the coasters.

I have no problem with people trying to sell crap. Just that they make sure it is their own crap that they are selling and not someone else's :)

thank you

[CBris]

Looks like there has been a lot of sleep lost over this subject (looking at the posting times)... now where's that teapot gone? I am getting ready to go to work... I work at a (proprietary brand name) aircraft manufacturer in Hamburg.

I have just spent an hour beta testing another (propriatary brand name) (propriatary brand name) plane over Plum Island (by an authorised modeller - Bill W)

So it's time for a cup of (proprietary trademark) tips tea...

See you all later, after work

__________________________________________________ ______________


No trademarks, brandnames or copyrights were hurt in the production of this forum posting

[Francois]

Glad we got things cleared up ;-)

@Chris: Heheh.... I was burning midnight oil on our next project anyway, trying to get it out before the Holidays.... still looks like I'm going to make it. After that I need a LONG time away from FS for a change.... yeah, ya'll believe me, eh?

Francois,
Bizzie with Lizzie

[IanP]

It's quite interesting to me, reading this, following an experience I had when a company downloaded 600Mb of files from Avsim, burned them to CDs, stuck them in a DVD box and sold them to major high street retailers for onward sale.

When I went in to three stores with plenty of paperwork confirming the product was highly illegal, the question came down to "are you the Copyright Holder whose rights have been breached?" - at the time I wasn't. Although there were repaints from my VA on the CD, none of mine were included. Several friends' files were and their statements saying so were in my paperwork. I was told that unless my copyrighted material was on the CD, it was none of my business. Even when one person whose files were on the CD went into a store and complained, he was told that he had to take it up with head office.

It did eventually get pulled, or the stores sold out and didn't order more, but at least this one wasn't on sale for months before the store responded to complaints about breach of copyright!